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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;" align="center"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">===========================================<br>
L O W L A N D S - L - 23 September 2008 - Volume 05<span style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><br>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
From: <span class="ep8xu"><span><span style="color: rgb(121, 6, 25);">Andy Eagle</span></span></span><span class="hccdpe"> </span><span class="ldacoc"><<a href="mailto:andy@scots-online.org">andy@scots-online.org</a>></span><br>
Subject: <span class="hccdpe">LL-L "Orthography" 2008.09.21 (02) [E]</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Ron Wrote:<br>
Subject: Orthography</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br></span></p><div style="margin-left: 40px;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">Thanks a lot for clarifying all that, Andy. I found this helpful in better</span></span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
appreciating the problem and comparable problems in other minority languages</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
without fixed spelling rules.</span></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Scots
spelling may not have 'fixed rules' as such but does have widely used
conventions. To me mostly all that is necessary is to identify the conventions
and then apply them more consistently. Traditional Scots spelling is like a
slightly buckled bicycle wheel, the spokes just need tightening, there is no
need to try and reinvent the bicycle wheel. <br><br></span></p>
<div style="margin-left: 40px;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">Obviously,
I was misinformed or rather assumed incorrectly on the basis of</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
the current orthographies floating around, that the /l/ after back vowel</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
does surface in inflected forms. Wherever it does not surface -- and</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
according to your information that's pretty much in all cases, except some</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
doublets -- I see no reason to write it.</span><br></div><div style="margin-left: 40px;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"></span></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">
<br></span></p><div style="margin-left: 40px;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">If I may as an outsider, I suggest that in such instances historical /l/ be</span></span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
consistently written <w>. Consistency seems advisable to me for various</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
reasons. Among the more important reasons are that, usually standing for a</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
glide ("semi-vowel"), <w> best represents the
"vocalization" of /l/, <w></span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
would break up strings of vowel letters, and consistent correspondence of</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
historical /l/ and written <w> would facilitate reading from an English</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
angle as well, making the representation look neither particularly English</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
nor particularly foreign. Granted, the sequence <uw> may look odd at
first.</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
But I put it to you that it looks no less odd than do examples like *caain*and</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
*pouin*. I believe you are on the same general path, Andy, but I don't know</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
what you think about the consistency argument.</span><br></div><div style="margin-left: 40px;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"></span></div><p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">
<br></span></p><div style="margin-left: 40px;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">*all > aw [**</span></span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: SimSun; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">ɑ</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">**:]*</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
aw</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
caw, cawin, cawer, caws*, cawd</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
baw, baws</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
faw ~ fawin ~ faws</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
haw, haws</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
smaw, smawer</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
staw, stawin, staws, stawd</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
waw, wawin, waws, wawd</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
*oll > ow [**</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "MS Mincho"; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">ʌʊ</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">**]*</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
<span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
row, rowin, rows, rowd</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
trow, trowin, trows, trowd</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
*ull > uw [u:]*</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
buw, buws</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
fuw</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
guw, guws</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
puw, puwin, puws, puwd</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
* *caws* 'calls' versus *caw's* (< *caw us* 'call me/us')</span></span></div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">The
literary cannon certainly includes aw, caw etc. though <a'> was by far
the most frequent, <aa> occured and was probably more frequent than
<aw>. The SND under the letter A (II 1)commenting that the letter
<a> "...is joined with itself to indicate a long vowel [</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: SimSun;">ɑ</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">:]. This spelling is common in I.Sc., n.Sc. and s.Arg. as a substitute
for a and au. Ex. aa (all), aave (scummer), faar (where), taapie (a soft,
stupid, gawky person)." Under <a> the SND also adding that the
letter W (II 4) "...is joined with w to represent (1) [</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: SimSun;">ɑ</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">:] (see II. 1) and (2) [Q] (See II. 3) generally in final position. Ex.
blaw, caw, maw, raw (row of houses, etc.)." The latter being the solution
I prefer in such cases.<br>
<br>
Under the letter <o> the SND comments that it occurs "with u
or w to form the diphthong [</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "MS Mincho";">ʌ</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">u] ([</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "MS Mincho";">ɔ</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">u] in Ork.),
... written ou or ow deriving from various sources..." later commenting
that the "ow spelling is preferred in this dictionary to distinguish ..it
from ow ... = [u] ... e.g. dow (doo) , drowth (drouth) fow (fou) ..."
later adding that the spelling <ou> for /u/ is " gen. preferred in
this dictionary..."<br>
<br>
<uw> as you suggest above is nowhere to be found in the traditional
cannon, I think conventions should be a regularisation of those found, and
preferably fairly common, in the traditional cannon, here <ou> is readily
available and overwhelmingly applied in the SND entries for fou and pou, but
goo [gu:; g</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "MS Mincho";">ʌ</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">u (in coastal areas)] . Why fix it
if it ain't broke? <br><br></span></p>
<p style="margin-left: 40px;" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">For what
it's worth, I rather like the idea of sticking to <ui> in words</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
like *muin*, *abuin* and *cuil*. It seems "phonetically evocative"
enough to</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
me for covering the dialectical range. It would be less "evocative"
and</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
would be in favor of the round vowel varieties if you reserved <oo> for
it.</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
Within an "Anglic" context, it stands alone, thus does not suggest
other</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
sounds.</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Under the
letter <u> the SND comments that "This spelling [ui] has become a
literary standard also in n.Sc. where the actual pronunciation is [i]."
but when final <ae> in dae, shae, tae prep., adv., adding under letter
<e> that "eu derives mainly from O.E. o, esp. before -k, -ch, e.g.
beuk, eneuch, heuk, teuch, varying in pronunciation from [ju, j</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: "MS Mincho";">ʌ</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">] to [ø] according to dialect ... and alternating with the spelling ui
to represent [ø];" so the practice of <ui> and <eu> before /k/
and /x/ is firmly grounded in tradition. <br><br></span></p>
<p style="margin-left: 40px;" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">The use of
the apostrophe for anything other than language-internal omission</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
(and for distinguishing genitive marking from plural marking if you must</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
follow this tradition) seems inadvisable to me in that it is basically</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
misleading and confusing. Assigning more than one purpose to one symbol is</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
rarely a really good idea, unless the contexts are clearly separated, and</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
generally understandably so.</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"> </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">I agree
here with use of the apostrophe including for genitive and plural marking,
after all that is the tradition. Some symbols do have more than one purpose but
the intended pronunciations are generally marked by adjacent letters eg. <ei>
in for example heid is either /i/ or /e/ depending on dialect but before
<ch> is usually always /i/.<br>
<span style="color: rgb(136, 136, 136);"><br>
Andy <br>
</span><br>
<br style="">
<br style="">
</span></p>
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