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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" align="center"><span style="font-size: 11pt;">===========================================<br>
L O W L A N D S - L - 14 April 2009 - Volume 03<br>
===========================================</span></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt;">Â </span></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt;">From: <span class="gd"><span style="color: rgb(121, 6, 25);">jmtait</span></span></span><span class="gi">
</span><span class="go"><<a href="mailto:jmtait@wirhoose.co.uk">jmtait@wirhoose.co.uk</a>></span><br>
Subject: <span class="gi">LL-L "Language varieties" 2009.04.12 (01) [E]<br>
<br>
</span></p><div style="margin-left: 40px; color: rgb(0, 0, 153); font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Andy Wrote</div>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; margin-left: 40px; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt;"><br>
<<<br>
John wrote:<br>
I think the main point is - what do the people who speak it think it is?<br>
<br>
I think it is probably safe to say that the majority of Scots speakers will
consider themselves speakers of a dialect of English.</span></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; margin-left: 40px; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt;">As you say,
there are many who talk about the Scots language but their actions seems to
indicate what they really mean is Scottish dialects (of English). Standard
English being the roof variety under which the Scottish dialects are to found.
In that scheme of things dialects have their place and should stay there.
Exactly the kind of marginalisation that leads to dialect decay in the first
place. Decay you may say. "Language has always evolved and changed".
Yes, but replacing Scots dialects with standard English is something different.
More akin to language death. Though I suspect that some are of the belief that
if standard English is  spoken with a Scottish accent and the Scots word of
the day is used then they consider it to be a variety of the Scots language. So
now with my best Highland accent, and my
Gaelic word of the day, I am proud to announce that I am a glay vah Gaelic
speaker. Now don't come at me about spelling glay vah wrong. This Gaelic thing
is a developing language there's no 'standard spelling', I'm going for the
authentic voice.</span></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; margin-left: 40px; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt;">>><br></span></p><p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" class="MsoNormal">
<span style="font-size: 11pt;">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><br></span></span></p><p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">This also extends to writing - when some people say that Lewis Grassic Gibbon
wrote Scots. By that criterion, Agatha Christie was writing French when she
gave Hercule Poirot a form of English influenced by French syntax, with the odd
Mon Dieu or whatever thrown in.</span></span></p>
<p style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
<<<br style="">
<br style="">
</span></p>
<div style="margin-left: 40px; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Shetland
Fudge Advert:</span><br><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">
</span><br><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_1lCZaPWHM" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w_1lCZaPWHM</a></span><br></div><div style="margin-left: 80px; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"></span></div>
<p style="margin-left: 40px;" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">
<br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
This one shows how the word 'Shaetlan' is pronounced.</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
<br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
I just heard a little Scots speaking girl saying 'Shetland' in a Shetland
accent. What does that <ae> in 'Shaetlan' represent that I can't hear to
be adequately represented by <e>. Simplification of <nd> to /d/ is
fairly common in many varieties of Scots.</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
>></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">You mean
simplification of <nd> to <n>? Actually, this isn't very common in
Shetland. In my own accent, it occurs only in 'Shaetlan' and one or two other
words such as 'fin' (find). I pronounce words like 'roond' and 'Scotland' with
a final 'd'. Some people pronounce 'Shaetland' with a 'd', but I think the
variant ending in 'n' is more usual. I notice from writing - although I haven't
noticed it in speech - that some people drop more 'd's than I do, but it still
seems to be sporadic - I'm not aware that anyone does it consistently, as they
do in the Doric accent of the North East of Scotland where I live.<br>
<br>
The 'ae' sound can't be adequately represented by written <e> because
it's a different phoneme. In other words, it's not just the Scots or English E
said with a different accent, it's actually the phoneme which in Scots more
often becomes EI (in words like breid, deid) which is realised as [e] rather
than [i] in some Scots dialects. However, Shetland has a short-long
phonological contrast between, eg: 'gaet' (BEAT words) and 'gate' (MATE and
BAIT words) which has disappeared - or is realised differently - in most
mainland Scots dialects, and so the distinction of 'ae' from both 'e' and 'i'
is probably quite difficult for mainland Scots speakers to hear. For example,
in North East Scots 'haet', meaning heat, rhymes with 'hate' as [he:t] but in
Shetland it doesn't, one being /het/ realised typically as something like
[hIt], and the other /he:t/ realised typically as [he@t], or in some regions as
[hE:t].<br>
<br>
So the difference between the pronunciations 'Shaet-' and 'Shet-' is not just a
difference of accent (as it would be if E in this environment was always
pronounced this way.) It is a difference which can potentially carry meaning.
The fact that it is the BEAT rather than the BET phoneme is illustrated by the
fact that Scots speakers in the North East of Scotland pronounce the word
'Sheitan' rather than 'Shetlan' - in other words, the underlying 'ae' is Scots,
whereas the official <e> is an approximation to English spelling. <br>
<br>
Listening to the video again, I've noticed something rather interesting. The
first pronunciations of the word - right at the start of the song - seem to
sound less like the traditional pronunciation of AE than the ones further
through the song, where the singer is getting more into the 'swing'. I suspect
that, right at the beginning, she's thinking of a written 'Shetland' which is
conflicting with the natural pronunciation. She pronounces an <e> sound
in the words 'perfect' and 'plenty'. There is a contrast between these two
sounds in her, as in general Shetland, pronunciation.<br>
<br>
To me, the actual sound in a word like 'Shaetlan' is more like the Scots or
Scottish Standard English (SSE) [I] <i> than like the SSE [E] <e>.
(In the linguistic atlas of Scotland,
I think it's often represented as [e+] - ie, closer than cardinal [e].) It's
often represented in casual dialect writing as 'Shitland'! This is how one
English girl I met, who had learned to speak Shaetlan very well, naturally
perceived and wrote it. However, the phoneme [I], in a wird like 'sit', isn't
pronounced like that in this environment either. <br>
<br>
To hear the quality of the 'ae' sound, listen to the word 'laeks' (likes) in
the Rabbit Lullaby at 1:17. Here, the singers pronounce the sound longer than
usual to suit the metre of the song, which gives a better opportunity to hear
it than in normal speech, where it is usually much shorter. You can hear the
normal - short - pronunciation in the word 'naething' in Lowrie sells his Oo at
about 0:15, and also in the word 'kaese' (case) at 1:08.<br>
<br>
In Shetland there is a phonological contrast between the following groups of
words. I've given <my spelling>, /phoneme/, [some phonetic realisations -
regional - in this environment], (Sampa)<br>
<br>
AEÂ Â Â Â <ae> /e/ [I] - Shaetlan, paet, maet, haet,
gaet, haep, glaep, laek (like), daek (dyke), etc. <br>
</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;" lang="DE">EÂ Â Â Â Â Â <e> /E/ [E] - set, met, net,
kep, lep, seck, jeck, etc.<br>
</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">IÂ Â Â Â Â Â Â Â
<i> /I/ [3] (I hope - my SAMPA is rusty) - sit, hit, flit, hip, tip,
pick, stick, strick, etc.<br>
AIÂ Â Â Â Â <ai,a-e> /e:/ [e@], E:] - fate, hate,
bait, gape, rape, rake, bake, cake, laik (leak), etc.<br>
</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;" lang="NL">EEÂ Â Â Â <ee, ie> /i/ [i] - feet, street, weet,
greet, pleep, steep, neep, reek, steek, seek, etc.<br>
<br>
</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Some minimum pairs:<br>
<br>
AE/E: paet/pet; saet/set<br>
AE/AI(A-E): haet/hate, gaet/gate, laek (like), laik (leak)<br>
AE/I: saet/sit, haep/hip<br>
AE/EE: laet/leet, laek/leek<br>
<br>
In another type of phonetic environment (usually before voiced consonants) all
of these vowels except EE are fronted and/or raised, so the pronunciations are
different. In this case, AE merges with E in some Shetland dialects and with EE
in others. In others - such as my own - it remains distinct.<br>
<br>
AEÂ <ae> /e/ [e, EI, i] - haed, laed, daed, laeg (leg), baeg (beg),
haem, baen (bone), etc. </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;" lang="DE">(BEAT words)<br>
EÂ Â Â <e> /E/, [EI] - bed, led, sed, ben, hen, dem, men,
etc. </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">(BET words)<br>
IÂ Â Â Â <i> /I/ [I] - sid, did, lid, rig, big, sig,
lib, sib, etc. (BIT words)<br>
AIÂ <ai, a-e> /e:/ [e:] - saide (saithe), maide (maggot), caib,
fable, stravaig, whaig, staig, etc. (BAIT and MATE words)<br>
EE <ee> /i/ [i] - need, dreed, treed, green, dastreen, heem, seem, etc.
(BEET words)<br>
<br>
Any Norn words, although they are not strictly speaking BEAT words or such, are
incorporated into the same phonological system. Before /k/, some words with the
/@I/ diphthong in Scots have the 'ae' sound.<br>
<br>
(Again, listening to the Shetland Fudge advert, I've noticed that the girl
doesn't pronounce <i> before voiceless consonants as [3] but as [I]. This
may create a potential conflict with the pronunciation of AE in the same
environment, possibly destroying a distinction. I don't know whether this is a
Lerwick thing - I'd have to find out who the girl was and when and where it was
recorded. The more usual pronunciation - which I have represented as [3] - can
be heard in the words 'lift' and 'winter' in the Cradle Song. (In 'winter',
although the following consonant - n - is voiced, the quality of the sound is
determined by the following voiceless 't'))<br>
<br>
Shetland writing conventions have partly evolved to suit these contrasts - but
only partly. The <ae> spelling is common in words like 'paet' and 'haet',
where English has <ea> and any Shetland speaker can see that to write
'pet' or 'hate' would represent the wrong sound.. But there is a reluctance to
use it in the word 'Shaetlan', perhaps because the English spelling doesn't
have an <ea> that you can simply swap around, and it's felt to be too
much of an innovation. Also, perhaps, the word 'Shetland' is felt to be too
'official' to have a 'dialect' spelling. This is an example of how
approximations to English orthography can disguise the underlying phonology.<br>
<br>
Notice these excerpts from the Scots and English versions of the Shetland
article on the Scots Language Centre website:<br>
<br>
"We might say 'Shetland dialect' or 'the dialect' when spaekin English.
'Shetlandic' is an English wird, aa right for usin in written or spokken
English. But for wis
at spaeks it, among wirsels, da wird for da spokken tongue is 'Shaetlan', sam
as da name o da plaece. "<br>
<br>
"When using English, we say 'Shetland dialect' or just 'the dialect'.
'Shetlandic' is an English word, acceptable when speaking or writing English.
But, for dialect speakers among dialect speakers, the word is 'Shetland'
(pronounced 'Shaetlan'). The name of the speech and the name of the islands are
the same. "<br>
<br>
Notice how the writer uses ae in words like 'plaece' and 'spaek' as well as
'Shaetlan', recognising a common sound. In the English version, she uses this
spelling to indicate the sound (although, of course, non-Shetlanders wouldn't
know what sound she was trying to convey!)<br>
<br>
Actually, what the writer says above is no longer true in my experience.
Shetland speakers increasingly use the word 'dialect' rather than 'Shaetlan'
even when they're speaking Shaetlan. I've even heard one person say
'Shaet....dialect' - that is, beginning with 'Shaetlan' which is what he would
naturally say, and then changing it to 'dialect' in mid-word, presumably owing
to some perception that this is (now) more acceptable.<br>
<br>
I've suggested elsewhere that this is owing to a shift of perception - that
whereas the tongue used to be a mark of Shetland identity, this is no longer
felt to be acceptable, and it is more acceptable to emphasise its dialect
status.<br>
<br>
Before voiced consonants, where the dialect realisations differ, the AE phoneme
is not normally recognised and varying dialect spellings are the rule even
where English does have an <ae> - ie, even habitual dialect writers (such
as poets) will often write 'hed', 'heyd' or 'heed' rather than 'haed' (for Eng.
head).<br>
<br>
<<<br style="">
<br style="">
</span></p>
<p style="margin-left: 40px; color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Some
countries have dialect policies. For example Bavaria <a href="http://www.isb.bayern.de/isb/download.aspx?DownloadFileID=75639926d839284f848ae3084c6d5bd4" target="_blank">http://www.isb.bayern.de/isb/download.aspx?DownloadFileID=75639926d839284f848ae3084c6d5bd4</a>
(In German) I haven't read the whole thing but apparently: "Ihr Ziel ist
es, den bayerischen Mundarten den ihnen gebührenden Stellenwert einzuräumen
und die Verbundenheit der Schülerinnen und Schüler mit ihrer bayerischen
Heimat zu stärken gemäß Artikel 131 der Bayerischen Verfassung." which
translates roughly as "The aim is to give the Bavarian dialects their due
weight and to strengthen the pupils' bond with their Bavarian homeland
according to article 131 of the Bavarian constitution."</span></p>
<p style="margin-left: 40px;" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
I'm not sure if there's a policy for Swiss German dialects but Wikipedia tells
us "The reason "Swiss German" dialects constitute a special
group is their almost unrestricted use as a spoken language in practically all
situations of daily life, whereas the use of the Alemannic dialects in the
other countries is restricted or even endangered.</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
<br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
The dialects of Swiss German must not be confused with Swiss Standard German,
the variety of Standard German used in </span>Switzerland<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">."</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
>><br>
<br>
I think there's a difference between a dialect policy in a country, and a
policy for a given dialect. It's only too easy for a country to declare that
dialects should be valued; it's quite another to put measures in place which
can 'preserve' forms of speech which have no stable written form that can act
as a phonological, grammatical and lexical reference to contrast with that of
the dominant language or standard variety. It's the latter that I'm saying is
doubtful as to its possible efficacy - a policy for a specific dialect rather
than an overall national policy on 'dialect' which is probably merely a box-ticking
exercise.<br>
<br>
It seems to me that Scotland
has a dialect policy which masquerades as a language policy, in the case of
Scots. A case in point might be the demand of Tavish Scott - MSP for Shetland -
that Scots should not be given a standard form, as that would threaten local
dialects. I don't recollect the MP for Shetland ever demanding that standard
English should be abandoned because of its effect on local dialects!</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
<<<br style="">
<br style="">
</span></p>
<p style="margin-left: 40px;" class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">A
'standard' form need not be as prescriptive as those of English or French. </span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Â </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">>>
Quite so. Another point is that most languages have registers - Welsh, for
example, has a formal register which is (said to be - I don't know enough Welsh
to judge) much further from spoken Welsh than formal English is from colloquial
English. Modern Welsh speakers are prone to despair of this; but it is almost
certainly largely this formal register which saved Welsh from extinction. But,
as the Welsh example shows, just because a language has a formal register
doesn't mean you have to use it. Scots, on the other hand, is increasingly
identified only with the lower registers which it has occupied by default.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
----------<br>
<br>
From: R. F. Hahn <</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;" lang="IT"><a href="mailto:sassisch@yahoo.com" target="_blank"><span style="" lang="EN-US">sassisch@yahoo.com</span></a></span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">> <br>
Subject: Language varieties<br>
<br>
Thanks for all of that, John.<br>
<br>
You wrote:</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Â </span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">It seems to
me that Scotland
has a dialect policy which masquerades as a language policy, in the case of
Scots. A case in point might be the demand of Tavish Scott - MSP for Shetland -
that Scots should not be given a standard form, as that would threaten local
dialects.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
It's precisely the same situation and attitude in the case of Low Saxon. In
other words, it's officially recognized as a regional language but is treated
as a group of dialects. In other words, people are really talking on both sides
of their mouths. But they can't wrap their heads around the basic concept.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
Regards,<br>
Reinhard/Ron</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Seattle</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">, USA</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"></span></p>
•
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