<div style="text-align: center; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">===========================================<br>L O W L A N D S - L - 02 May 2009 - Volume 04<br>Encoding: Unicode (UTF-08)<br>===========================================<br>
</div><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From: </span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="gI"><span class="gD" style="color: rgb(0, 104, 28);">Hellinckx Luc</span> <span class="go"><<a href="mailto:luc.hellinckx@gmail.com">luc.hellinckx@gmail.com</a>></span></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Subject: </span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="gI">LL-L "Idiomatica"<br><br></span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Beste Ron,</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><div><br></div><div><div><div>On 02/05/09, at 20:38, Lowlands-L List wrote:</div><blockquote type="cite">Many
Americans eat out all the time. Many do not even know how to cook. (If
they don't eat out they'll heat store-bought frozen dinners in their
microwave ovens.) So eating out casually is similar to eating at home.
That's in a different class from the occasional visit to a fancy
restaurant.<br></blockquote><div>When
I was working in China, I also had dinner in incredibly small eateries,
every single day, just like many other Chinese. Everything was so
small, that the kitchen was actually inside the dining room, so the
atmosphere was even more than casual (Chinese eating styles can be a
bit different from ours, putting it mildly). Everything was happening
within eyesight and no formality whatsoever. Yet, I never met a waiter
or waitress who would ask me if she could take my plate or bowl away.
Not even after I had finished. And believe me, these places were
crowded: jostling business. When a guest has left the place, that's
when you take it away. This is not a matter of being casual or not,
it's a matter of imposing yourself or not.</div><div><br></div><div>It's no coincidence that a waiter is called a wait-er. If a waiter can't wait, he's no waiter in my opinion.</div><div><br></div><div>Kind greetings,</div>
<div><br></div><font color="#888888"><div>Luc Hellinckx</div></font></div></div></div><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">----------</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From: </span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="gI"><span class="gD" style="color: rgb(0, 104, 28);">Hellinckx Luc</span> <span class="go"><<a href="mailto:luc.hellinckx@gmail.com">luc.hellinckx@gmail.com</a>></span></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
Subject: </span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="gI">LL-L "Idiomatica"<br>
<br>
</span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Beste Karl,</span><div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br></div><div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><div><div>You wrote:</div>
<br><blockquote type="cite"><font style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" color="#000000" size="2"><div><font size="4"><span style="font-size: 14px;">
I find it amazing that anybody attempts to analyze an entire culture
based on the fact that "I am still working (say), my salad" means that
I have not finished eating it, but intend to.  Could it be a leftover
discussion from April Fool's Day?  Or maybe a leftover salad?</span></font></div></font></blockquote><div><br></div><div>It's
not only the blunt use of the verb "to work" in what should be a
customer-friendly environment (probably many languages know this
meaning, but only use it if they want to describe the mechanical act of
processing food), but also the very fact that a waiter dares to address
you this way. Such behavior makes me think of a restaurant where
"Arbeit macht frei" was written at the entrance.</div><div><br></div><div>There's
actually more to it than this single phrase. I read it in a fine
article ("Of Loos and Language") that Roger Cohen (New York Times
columnist) wrote a couple of days ago:</div><div><br></div><div><span><a href="http://tinyurl.com/cz6xhz" target="_blank">http://tinyurl.com/cz6xhz</a></span></div><div><br></div><div>about differences between British and American English these days. See for yourself, what else Mr. Cohen writes:</div>
<div><br></div></div></div><blockquote style="border: medium none ; margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 40px; padding: 0px; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-style: italic; line-height: 22px;">...I was miffed. I was gutted. (Look that up, Richard.)</span><br>
<span style="font-style: italic; line-height: 22px;">“Well
done, love,” I told my 14-year-old son the other day. “Well done,
love!” he parroted in that scorn-dripping tone teenagers reserve for
their Paleolithic parents, weaving an English patter into his
Brooklynese. “You mean: Good job!”</span><br><span style="font-style: italic; line-height: 22px;">Quite.</span><br><span style="font-style: italic; line-height: 22px;">Jobs,
the work ethic — no escape from them in the United States, where
finishing a meal in a restaurant prompts the death-penalty-meriting:
“Are you still working on that?” When I took an English test to become
a U.S. citizen a few years back, one of the three sentences in my
dictation was: “I plan to work very hard every day.”</span><br><span style="font-style: italic; line-height: 22px;">Quite.</span><br><span style="font-style: italic; line-height: 22px;">America
works, every day, its youthful ambition still boundless. England,
having seen everything go pear-shaped, relieved of the burden of
running a ropey world, boozes and says it’s sorry and prefers a
lie-in...</span></blockquote><div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><div><br></div><div>Of course, 3
examples is definitely not enough to draw any solid conclusions, but
the fact that within less than 12 hours, 204 comments were made, may
show that Mr. Cohen hit a sensitive spot somewhere.</div><div><br></div><div>Kind greetings,</div><div><br></div><div>Luc Hellinckx</div></div><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">----------</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From: R. F. Hahn <</span><a style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" href="mailto:sassisch@yahoo.com" target="_blank">sassisch@yahoo.com</a><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
Subject: Idiomatica</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Hey, Luc!</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">As far as I am concerned, the only thing at issue here is that an American waiter uses an American expression in a different country in which it can be misconstrued the way I feel you are misconstruing and over-analyzing it. I also agree that he should not be allowed to ask if people had finished eating since this is not done in the country in which he works. All this seems to point to insufficient or absent training on the part of the management of the restaurant. This is unless that restaurant is supposed to have an authentic American ambiance, come hell or high water.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Of course you are quite within your rights to apply Belgian standards, or even general European standards, since all this took place in Belgium, Europe. Again, this is unless the restaurant is </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">supposed</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> to be an American island, "insults" and all.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">However, I don't think you can judge the rest of the world by Belgian, European or Chinese standards. As I said before, </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Andere Länder, andere Sitten</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> (Different countries, different customs). During my travels I have come in contact with some customs I found very, very strange at first, even very rude or disgusting, and I had to learn not to analyze those by using the yardstick I brought from home.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Indeed, some Americans hate being rushed in restaurants, and they'll just say "Yes" if they are asked if they are still "working on it", even if they are not. Or they give the waiter other signs to tell him or her to leave them alone. But the vast majority of people don't mind at all. To them it's like being in a private setting and a friend or family member asking that question. Your association with Nazi treatment would seem extremely strange to them. They would ask you, "Gosh! Where did </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">that</i> come from?!"<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Andere Länder, andere Sitten</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">. In this country, wait staff is usually instructed to keep guests' tables neat at all times, especially if a table is small and would be cluttered with too many unused dishes on it. Plates and dishes with cold, leftover food on them are considered unsightly in this country, which is why waiters are supposed to remove them as soon as their status is clear. This is so especially if dessert and/or coffee is next. So you are dealing with a different way of thinking, different esthetic standards and so forth. Furthermore, the "working on it" phrase is perceived as casual and non-offensive in most contexts, as I mentioned earlier.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">I have been able to visit my native Europe through American eyes, and I noticed many things that are off-putting to American tourists, things that most Europeans take for granted, such as widespread snootiness and surliness of service personnel. None of that comes from ill intent. It is just part and parcel of customary packages. </span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Besides, in Chinese eateries waiters snatched my dishes away plenty of times, </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">without even asking</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">. In Croatia and Montenegro I found owners and waiters in restaurants behaving in very familiar ways, cracking jokes, tying napkins around my neck, and joining me at my table without even asking, even when I had company. I accepted that as local custom in that sort of casual restaurant. I had similar experiences in more casual Turkish and Arabic eateries. In fact, I happened to like it, certainly preferred it to "servile creepiness and arrogance" I encountered in many expensive European retaurants. In the meantime I have accepted that serving does not </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">have</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> to be done in the servile manner that were developed in times of more defined class consciousness.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Your faithful servant</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Reinhard/Ron</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Seattle, USA</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
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