<div style="text-align: center; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">===========================================<br>L O W L A N D S - L - 27 May 2009 - Volume 01<br style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><span style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">Encoding: Unicode (UTF-08)</span><br style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">
<span style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102);">Language Codes: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/codes.php">lowlands-l.net/codes.php</a></span><br>===========================================<br></div><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From: R. F. Hahn <<a href="mailto:sassisch@yahoo.com" target="_blank"><span lang="EN-US">sassisch@yahoo.com</span></a>> </span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
Subject: Grammar<br><br>Hello, Lowlanders!<br><br>Here's something for you English teachers and other types of grammarians to chew on.<br><br>This morning someone said to me, "The air conditioner is broke." Using "broke" in the same sense as "broken" is not uncommon in the US. I believe it goes back to the Southern States. (The speaker was African American, and even in the north many African Americans </span><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">retain a lot of Southern speech habits.)</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">As probably most of you know, "broke" means "out of money" in most English dialects around the world. I have never come across "broke" as also meaning the same as "broken" except in the US. "Broken" is used otherwise; e.g. "</span><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">The air conditioner is <u>broken</u>, but I can't have it fixed because I'm <u>broke</u>".<br>
<br>Please correct me if I'm wrong.<br><br>I'm wondering about the grammatical limitations of this.<br><br>I believe that "broke" is rarely if at all used to modify nouns; e.g.<br><br>The guy is <u>broke</u>.<br>
*The <u>broke</u> guy (?)<br><br>(*)The air conditioner is <u>broke</u>.<br>The air conditioner is <u>broken</u>.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">*The </span><u style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">broke</u><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">air conditioner (?)</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">The </span><u style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">broken</u><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </span><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">air conditioner<br>
<br>Similarly:<br><br>The sailor is <u>drunk</u>.<br>*The sailor is <u>drunken</u>. (?)<br>*What shall we do with the <u>drunk</u> sailor? (?)<br>What shall we do with the <u>drunken</u> sailor?</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">So it seems to me that the "extended" forms (with -en) at least </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">used to</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> be used only to precede and thus modify nouns.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">And ...</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">*The floor in the middle of the room is </span><u style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">sunk</u><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">. (?)</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">The floor in the middle of the room is </span><u style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">sunken</u><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">. </span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">The floor in the middle of the room has </span><u style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">sunk</u><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">. (verb)</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">*The floor in the middle of the room has </span><u style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">sunken</u><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">. (verb) (?)</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">*The room has a </span><u style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">sunk</u><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> floor.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">The room has a </span><u style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">sunken</u><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> floor.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Any comments?</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Regards,</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Reinhard/Ron</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Seattle, USA</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
•
<p>
==============================END===================================
<p>
* Please submit postings to lowlands-l@listserv.linguistlist.org.
<p>
* Postings will be displayed unedited in digest form.
<p>
* Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.
<p>
* Commands for automated functions (including "signoff lowlands-l")
<p>
are to be sent to listserv@listserv.linguistlist.org or at
<p>
http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html.
<p>
*********************************************************************