<div style="text-align: center; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">===========================================<br>L O W L A N D S - L - 22 August 2009 - Volume 01<br style="color: rgb(153, 153, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(153, 153, 153);"><a href="mailto:lowlands@lowlands-l.net">lowlands@lowlands-l.net</a> - <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/">http://lowlands-l.net/</a></span><br style="color: rgb(153, 153, 153);">
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===========================================<br></div><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From: Heinrich Becker <<a href="mailto:heinrich.becker@gmx.net">heinrich.becker@gmx.net</a>></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2009.08.20 (06) [EN]</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Dear all,</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Â </span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">since a very long interuption filled with deep cuts in my personal life, I would like to add some on that topic , I agree with:</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">An interesting item is: This "fake saxon" was the cradle of Standard "High" German, that we use currently. It was last but not least Martin Luther himself, whose "Meissner Kanzleideutsch" was taken as basic language for translating the Holy Bible into a common German language, which has prevailed later on to its nowadays mode. As Lowlanders we are supposed to complain about!</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Â </span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From Berlin (Germany)</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Â </span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Heinrich Becker</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">----------</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From: R. F. Hahn <<a href="mailto:sassisch@yahoo.com">sassisch@yahoo.com</a>></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Subject: Language varieties</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Hello, dear Heinrich!</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">I am so sorry you have gone through a difficult time! At any rate, it is wonderful to hear from you again. Thanks for participating.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Thanks also for adding the important information above. I would like to add to it that </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Meißner Kanzleideutsch</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> (Meissen "Chancellery German", i.e. administrative German of the city of Meissen) gave rise to the Low Saxon name </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Missingsch</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> ("Meissen-ish"). At first this meant the same thing as </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Meißner Kanzleideutsch</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">. However, as the name </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Meißner Kanzleideutsch</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> for "Standard German" fell into disuse, the Low Saxon version </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Missingsch</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> came to denote "bad (High) German spoken by Low Saxon speakers". In further developments, Missingsch came to be spoken as a native language variety, and its speakers did not necessarily know Low Saxon. In other words, </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Missingsch</i> now simply means "German language variety with a strongly noticeable Low Saxon substratum." And there are or used to be many local varieties; e.g.:<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Bremen: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/missingsch-bremen1.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/missingsch-bremen1.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Hamburg: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/missingsch-hamburg1.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/missingsch-hamburg1.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Wilhelmshaven: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/missingsch-wilhelmshaven.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/missingsch-wilhelmshaven.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Introduction: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/missingsch-info.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/missingsch-info.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Northern varieties of German, i.e. "High" German used in the original Low-Saxon-speaking region, are to varying degrees influenced by Missingsch. Perhaps it is more accurate to say that they are Missingsch varieties that have been "cleaned up" to varying degrees. An example:</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/deutsch-nord.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/deutsch-nord.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Introduction: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/deutsch-nord-info.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/deutsch-nord-info.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Ruhr German is a type of Missingsch also, although it is not normally referred to as such:</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/ruhrdeutsch.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/ruhrdeutsch.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Introduction: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/ruhrdeutsch-info.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/ruhrdeutsch-info.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">The same goes for homegrown varieties of Berlin German (where the local Brandenburg Low Saxon varieties have been extinct for a while). Unfortunately, we do not have a Wren translation into any of these Berlin varieties as yet.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">(And, talking about such, I would absolutely </span><b style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">love</b><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> to have a Wren translation in "fake Saxon", i.e. in a German variety of the Free State of Saxony, especially with a sound file. Unlike apparently the majority of Germans, I love listening to these German varieties. Well, then again, I'm "weird" in that there is no language variety I dislike.)</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">In my estimation, the Missingsch situation is very similar to that of </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Stadsfrys</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> ("City Frisian") varieties of the Northern Netherlands. These are city varieties of Dutch with more of less strong West (Westerlauwer) Frisian substrata. These grew among Frisian-speaking townsfolk as Dutch came to be imposed in their communities. Nowadays, most of their speakers do not speak Frisian. As in the case of Missingsch, these varieties are fading away, or are at least being "cleaned up," as a result of Dutch language formal education and mass media. An example of </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Stadsfrys</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">:</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Ljouwert (Leeuwarden): <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/stadsfrys-liwwarders.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/stadsfrys-liwwarders.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Introduction: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/stadsfrys-info.php">http://lowlands-l.net/anniversary/stadsfrys-info.php</a></span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">I have a feeling that there is an equivalent situation in Scotland, involving an array and a range of Scottish English varieties with Scots substrata. However, I imagine that it is far more difficult to distinguish Scottish English from Scots, because (1) English and Scots are perhaps more closely related than are Low Saxon to German and Frisian to Dutch, and (2) it may be impossible to draw a dividing line between the two. Furthermore, let me go out on a limb here and propose that Scottish English itself is a type of "advanced" Scottish Missingsch when seen within the context of English globally. More precisely, I propose that "Standard" Scottish English is the English equivalent of "Standard" Northern German. (See above.) I would be very interested to hear what others think about this, especially our Scottish friends.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Regards,</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Reinhard/Ron</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Seattle, USA</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">P.S.: By the way, about the city of Meissen (famous for its porcelain) ... Its name began as a Slavic-Germanic blend, as its Latin equivalent </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Misena </i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">still suggests. It comes from Late Old German or Early Middle German Misenaha ("*</span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Mi</i><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">s’a</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"></span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">brook/rivulet") containing German </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">aha</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> > </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Ach</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> (related to Romance *</span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">agwa</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> > </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">aqua ~ agua</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> 'water'). The name of the "brook" itself is Slavic, more precisely Old Sorbian. The "brook" itself is </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Meisa</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> in German, which I consider based on Slavic *</span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">Mi</i><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">s’a</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> (my reconstruction). Other names of the city: Upper Sorbian </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">MiÅ¡no</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">, Lower Sorbian </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">MiÅ¡njo</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">, Czech </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">MÃÅ¡eň</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">, Polish </span><i style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">MiÅ›nia</i><span style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">.</span><br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
<br style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">
•
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