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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;" align="center"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">===============================================<br>
L O W L A N D S - L - 07 February 2010 - Volume 02<span style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><br>
<a href="mailto:lowlands.list@gmail.com">lowlands.list@gmail.com</a> - <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/">http://lowlands-l.net/</a><br>
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===============================================</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
From: <span class="gd"><span><span style="color: rgb(121, 6, 25);">Sandy Fleming</span></span></span><span class="gi"> </span><span class="go"><<a href="mailto:sandy@fleimin.demon.co.uk">sandy@fleimin.demon.co.uk</a>></span><br>
Subject: <span class="gi">LL-L "Language varieties" 2010.02.06 (06)
[EN]</span></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">> From:
Hellinckx Luc <<a href="mailto:luc.hellinckx@gmail.com">luc.hellinckx@gmail.com</a>><br>
> Subject: LL-L "Projects"<br>
></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">> Please tell me which kind of logics Lojban is based on.
Classical<br>
> two-valued logics or fuzzy logic? Considering the inherent vagueness<br>
> of words (what does "cold" mean?), I would expect the fuzzy
variant.<br>
> Given the age of (its ancestor) Loglan however, I guess the<br>
> theoretical framework predates the birth of fuzzy logic.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">The short
answer is, you're right, classical logic.<br>
<br>
The long answer would be me explaining why I don't consider fuzzy logic<br>
to be logic, maybe not appropriate for the list. To state why, briefly:<br>
fuzzy logic is logic extended with the principles of fuzzy set theory,<br>
and doesn't replace classical logic any more than adding a flash plugin<br>
to your browser replaces your browser.<br>
<br>
But yes, I'd say classical logic, since when we say something in Lojban,<br>
for example:<br>
<br>
mi klama le zdani  ("I go to-the-place-I-describe-as home.")<br>
<br>
we really mean to say that the statement we are making is member of the<br>
set of true statements.<br>
<br>
It seems easy enough to add fuzziness to this if you want to, without<br>
stepping outside the language.</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;"><br>
> Do you think that, quantum entanglement for instance, could be better<br>
> explained in Lojban terms than in English?</span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size: 11pt; font-family: Arial;">Quantum
entanglement is easy enough to explain in English (to someone<br>
who is used to the jargon!), so perhaps it's a moot point:<br>
<br>
"An electron and a positron collide, creating two photons which are now<br>
travelling apart in an indeterminate state. When we measure, say, the<br>
spin of one of the photons, spin is changed to either spin up or spin<br>
down. The other photon's spin is at the moment of measurement changed to<br>
the opposite state: spin down or spin up. Einstein was wrong!"<br>
<br>
This all seems clear enough, although you do have to be conversant with<br>
elementary quantum physics jargon. But suppose we consider the opening<br>
event:<br>
<br>
"An electron and a positron collide..."<br>
<br>
It's typical physics-writers' English but let's translate it word for<br>
word into Lojban (this results in something called 'malglico' -<br>
anglicised rubbish!):<br>
<br>
"lo lektoni .e lo to'e lektoni cu janli"<br>
<br>
In the first place this is rather better as it's clear that we're<br>
talking about a particle-antiparticle pair (lo to'e lektoni: "a<br>
polar-opposite-of electron").<br>
<br>
Now let's look up 'collide' in a Lojban dictionary:<br>
<br>
"janli 'collide': x1 collides with/crashes/bumps/runs into x2"<br>
<br>
Suddenly we see that the translation is all wrong! It's actually saying:<br>
<br>
"An electron and a positron collide with whatever."<br>
<br>
It should be:<br>
<br>
"lo lektoni janli lo to'e lektoni"<br>
<br>
in other words:<br>
<br>
"An electron collides with a positron."<br>
<br>
Whether you would want to write this in English or just fall back on<br>
assumptions about the readers' assumptions, it has to be said that the<br>
Lojban is automatically much less ambiguous.<br>
<br>
Now you might want to consider whether the translation is too asymmetric<br>
(is it different from saying 'a positron collides with an electron'?)<br>
and so on. It makes you think about what you're really saying. In<br>
reading the English text, someone conversant with popular physics<br>
writing will naturally make some assumptions ("The electron and positron<br>
are destroyed, or converted into photons"), but what about readers who<br>
aren't conversant with popular physics writing? Expressing it, even if<br>
only to yourself, in Lojban may help you to make your writing clearer to<br>
more readers.<br>
<br>
What might strike you as strange is that even emotion can be better<br>
translated into Lojban:<br>
<br>
la einstein. na drani ko'a<br>
<br>
"Einstein was wrong about quantum entanglement"<br>
<br>
(You can't just say 'Einstein was wrong', that's more malglico and far<br>
too sweeping! To keep the example simple, I'm assuming I've previously<br>
defined the whole concept of quantum entanglement as "ko'a");<br>
<br>
or:<br>
<br>
.uunai la einstein. .iocai na drani ko'a<br>
<br>
"Sadly, Einstein, whom I respect greatly, was wrong about quantum<br>
entanglement."<br>
<span style="color: rgb(136, 136, 136);"><br>
Sandy Fleming<br>
<a href="http://scotstext.org/" target="_blank">http://scotstext.org/</a><br>
<br>
</span><br style="">
<br style="">
</span></p>
•
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