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<p class="MsoNormal" style="text-align: center;" align="center"><span style="font-family: Arial;">===============================================<span style="color: rgb(102, 102, 102);"><br>
L O W L A N D S - L - 28 March 2010 - Volume 01<br>
<a href="mailto:lowlands.list@gmail.com">lowlands.list@gmail.com</a> - <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/">http://lowlands-l.net/</a><br>
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From: <span class="gd"><span style="color: rgb(91, 16, 148);">Sandy
Fleming</span></span><span class="gi"> </span><span class="go"><<a href="mailto:sandy@fleimin.demon.co.uk">sandy@fleimin.demon.co.uk</a>></span><br>
Subject: <span class="gi">LL-L "Language varieties" 2010.03.26 (01)
[DE]</span><br>
<br>
> From: jmtait <<a href="mailto:jmtait@wirhoose.co.uk">jmtait@wirhoose.co.uk</a>><br>
><br>
> Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2010.03.23 (03) [EN]<br>
><br>
> The first is the real aversion to the word Shetlandic among many<br>
> ordinary Shetlanders. This can probably be put down to simple lack of<br>
> familiarity, owing to it not being used in print, and ridiculed when<br>
> it is (see below.)<br>
<br>
Which doesn't stop us from using it, at least until Shetlanders make up<br>
their minds. You were originally talking in terms of not calling<br>
Shetlandic anything at all on this list.<br>
<br>
> >>When I was learning Icelandic and Czech, the usual remark from<br>
> people<br>
> was, "What? Is there such a language?" (this was back in the
1980's).<br>
> It<br>
> just means it's time to educate them about it. I would have no trouble<br>
> with using "Shetlandic" and then discussing it with whoever
inquires.<br>
> If<br>
> they didn't accept the term then I would put the onus on them to<br>
> suggest<br>
> a better one, because it's something I want to be able to talk<br>
> about.<<<br>
><br>
> That's not really the same situation, though, because there were large<br>
> amounts of Icelanders and Czechs in Iceland
and the Czech republic
who<br>
> recognised these.<br>
<br>
I'm beginning to wonder if you aren't doing Shetland attitudes an<br>
injustice here. Are these highly vocal book, magazine and letter writers<br>
really representative of the native Shetland-speaking populace?<br>
<br>
> Well, yes - but to use a term outside Shetland which is disowned by<br>
> Shetlanders is self-defeating.<br>
<br>
Why? We need a term for the language here, we can use it whether<br>
Shetlanders acknowledge it or not. Perhaps we can put them to shame :)<br>
<br>
> >>I'd put it to you that this is a problem created by people who
don't<br>
> want a solution. There's no actual problem.<<<br>
><br>
> Well, yes and no. Firstly yes, it is a problem created by people who<br>
> don't want a solution. I would put it more strongly - if clumsily -<br>
> and say that it is a problem created by people who want there to be no<br>
> solution. That is because they are happy with the status quo (token<br>
> gestures towards a dying speech form which has no application for<br>
> serious purposes) and therefore don't see a problem as long as said<br>
> speech form doesn't intrude into any area reserved for serious<br>
> language. However, as these people are decisively influential in<br>
> Shetland, and both reflect and influence popular opinion, there is<br>
> therefore a problem.<br>
<br>
Yes, well, history will remember them for what they did, and others for<br>
what they didn't.<br>
<br>
> "Please note all the underlined words are the ones my computer<br>
> underlined in red as it didn't know them - maybe a new _Shetlandic_<br>
> version of Microsoft Office could be comisioned by the SIC allowing us<br>
> to write our letters to The Shetland Times in local dialect.<br>
><br>
> "Instead of defragging our hard drive we could have a _Muckle Redd
Up_<br>
> icon. I'm sure that would make for an interesting meeting for all the<br>
> local councillors. Maybe a trip to Microsoft head office in Seattle on<br>
> expenses is required?"<br>
><br>
> The tone suggests that the writer can assume a readership that will<br>
> share his view that the 'reductio ad absurdum' which he is attempting<br>
> proves the use of the term to be ridiculous, derisable and<br>
> objectionable. The fact that this 'non-local, local' (sic) felt the<br>
> urge to write such a comment on the appearance of a single letter<br>
> containing the word 'Shetlandic' in the press demonstrates the<br>
> aversion - one might almost say, fear - which it engenders, and<br>
> suggests why it is not more widely used.<br>
<br>
Did he sign it "Sarcastic of Tunbridge Wells"? :)<br>
<br>
Just very typical newspaper letter-writing, as sure as the discussion<br>
cut-off is very typical internet dialogue.<br>
<br>
I think these are simply psychological phenomena and that the real<br>
problem here is in the science, or lack thereof. Psychology and<br>
linguistics are sciences, and all this sort of thing is governed by<br>
their laws, which although they're now crawling out of their dark ages<br>
are still not widely understood by those not actually working in these<br>
fields.<br>
<br>
How do you get to a point where people understand things well enough to<br>
do the right thing for a language instead of clinging to destructive<br>
beliefs? Language change is pretty much inevitable because that's how<br>
things work. If we want to have more control we need better science but<br>
the relevant sciences are still poorly understood outside of the<br>
disciplines themselves.<br>
<br>
In the future I think people will say that we destroyed many languages<br>
because we didn't have the necessary scientific understanding of<br>
language change and psychological attitudes to language, or how to<br>
snapshot a language, or what the consequences were of losing a language,<br>
and other such technology and understanding.<br>
<span style="color: rgb(136, 136, 136);"><br>
Sandy Fleming<br>
<a href="http://scotstext.org/" target="_blank">http://scotstext.org/</a></span><br style="">
<br style="">
</span></p>
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