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L O W L A N D S - L - 27 December 2010 - Volume 01<br>
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<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From:
<span class="gd"><span style="color: rgb(121, 6, 25);">Mark Dreyer</span></span><span class="gi"> </span><span class="go"><<a href="mailto:mrdreyer@lantic.net">mrdreyer@lantic.net</a>></span></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Subject: <span class="gi">LL-L
"Resources" 2010.12.26 (01) [EN]</span></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"><br>
Dear All:</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Subject: Resources: LL-L
"Resources"</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Opgeda aan onse Ron:</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">JOBBEWOK</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Dis brillig en die slederige
towe</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">brentel en boggel in die
waab.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Heel mimserig die borogrowe</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">en die gemome ratjies
uitgraab.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Pasop die Jobbewok, my seun:</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Die tande kners, die kake
knyp!</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Bewaar jou van die jipjip
voël,</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">en vermy die vromiese
bandersnyp!</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Hy neem sy worpel swaard te
hande</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">en, die minktige vyand lank
gesogde,</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">rus hy hom langs 'n tintin
boom,</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">en staan 'n rukkie
ingedagte.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">En wyls hy effig staan en
dink,</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">die jobbeok, met oë van vlam</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">dryf die tulgerige bosse
deur</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">en is burmelend aangekom</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Een, twee! Een twee! En deur
en deur,</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">die worpellem gaan
snikersneg.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Hy los die dop en met sy kop</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">kom hy lompelend terrug.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Het jy die jobbewok gedood?</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Kom in my arms, my stroolse
ding!</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">O bekker dag, kaloo kalag</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">het hy jubelend gesing.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Dis brillig, en die
snederige towe</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">brentel en boogel in die
waab.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Heel mimserig die borogrowe,</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">en die gemome ratjies
uitgraab.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">& the best of the season
to you too, Dear Ron (yours & ours). As for your charity work, pearls in
your crown.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Harp away, my good fellow,
on Alice. It's
well worth the pleasure. You're right: It's not a kiddy's book. I got one in
the original edition with the plates & all (not a first printing alas), for
being able to read well (school prize) but at that age I missed the point
commmpletely. It sat in the shelf though, & at age thirteen I drifted back
to it, I can't imagine why - I was electrified! When I shared this with my
grandmother she just said, "Yes, well you're growing up."</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">You might have added (to the
problems of translation) the complexities of parsing nonsense, logical
teases & mathematical tricks that Lewis Carrol sneaked into the tale. What
did you think of the cat's 'tale', "I'll be judge, I'll be jury, said
cunning old Fury. I'll try the whole case & condemn you to death..."</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Ron, I know very well I'm
not up to translating it, but I can still enjoy it, can't I? I'm sure you
did - both.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Groete,</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Mark</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">----------</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From:
Hannelore Hinz <a href="mailto:hannehinz@t-online.de" target="_blank"><hannehinz@t-online.de></a><br>
Subject: Resources<br>
<br>
Liebe Lowlanders.<br>
<br>
1. Ich freue mich über den gewählten
niederdeutschen Wortschatz "Alice
ehr Eventuurn in't Wunnerland" und ging der Sache nach:<br>
Lit.: Wossidlo/Teuchert:<br>
<b>Äbentür </b>n. Abenteuer, Wagnis, aus mnd. <i>eventur; </i>vorwiegend in
älterer Sprache bezeugt: 'de mochte ydt up
en eventur (auf eigene Gefahr) doen' (Ende des
15. Jahrh.) Rost. Veide 18: Van der Rostocker Veide 1487 bis 1491, hg. von K.
E. H. Krause. Gymn.-Programm Rostock
1880. K. E. Krause, Eine Kinderlehre des 15. Jh. Progr. Rostock 1873.<br>
<b>äbentüren, </b>auch <i>näbentüren; </i>sich auf seltsame Weise ereignen: <i>dat
áventhůrt sick wol </i>MANTZ: Ernst Johann Friedrich Mantzel.<br>
<br>
2. Plattdeutsch-hochdeutsches Wörterbuch R. Herrmann-Winter: kein Eintrag
?<br>
<br>
3. Was ich so denke: Ron hat den sprachlich richtigen Weg vom Urtext bis in den
gewünschten Text zu übertragen gefunden. Eine nackte Übersetzung kann
noch kein literarisches Werk sein, ihr würde immer der <b>Atem</b> einer
gelungenen Übertragung fehlen. Ron is 'n echten Plattdüütschen. Nu hett't mal
'knallt', un dat is nienich tau
oewerhüren un oewerseihn. Dieses Werk belebt in jeder Hinsicht die
Niederdeutsche Sprache.<br>
<br>
<b><i>Ick gratelier di Ron tau dit Wark!</i></b><br>
<br>
Hartlich Gräuten an jug all'.<br>
<br>
Hanne</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">----------</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Am 27.12.2010 03:51, schrieb
Lowlands-L List:</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">2. Versuch</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"><br>
From: Hannelore Hinz <<a href="mailto:hannehinz@t-online.de" target="_blank">hannehinz@t-online.de</a><br>
Subject: Resources<br>
<br>
Liebe Lowlanders.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">1. Ich freute mich über den gewählten niederdeutschen Wortschatz "Alice ehr Eventuurn in't
Wunnerland"</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"><br>
und ging der Sache nach. Lit. Wossidlo/Teuchert:</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"><b>Äbentür </b>n. Abenteuer, Wagnis, aus mnd. <i>eventur; </i>in
älterer Sprache bezeugt: 'de mochte ydt up en eventur (auf eigene Gefahr) doen'
(Ende des 15. Jahrh.); du machst wol ein seỉtzam ebentheur (ein wunderliches
Ding) sein'.<br>
<br>
<b>äbentüren, </b>auch <i>näbentüren</i>; sich auf seltsame Weise ereignen: <i>dat
äventhürt sick wol.</i></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"><br>
2. Plattdeutsch-hochdeutsches Wörterbuch R. Herrmann-Winter: kein Eintrag.</p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal"> </p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">3.
Was ich so denke. Ron hat den sprachlich besten Weg gefunden, vom Urtext in den
angestrebten Text zu übertragen. Eine nackte Übersetzung hätte niemals den <b>Atem</b>
der Nd. Sprache. Ron hat mit diesem Werk Plattdeutsch belebt und literarisch
bereichert. Nu hett dat wohrhaftig <b>'knallt'</b>, un dat is nich tau
oewerhüren un tau oewerseihn. <b>Dor möten doch gratelieren! </b><br>
<br>
Un dat von Harten.<br>
<br>
Hanne</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">----------</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;">From:
R. F. Hahn <<a href="mailto:sassisch@yahoo.com" target="_blank">sassisch@yahoo.com</a>></p>
<p style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" class="MsoNormal">Subject: Resources</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"><br>
Thank you very much, Mark and Hanne!<br>
<br>
Hanne, your post bridges “Resources” to “Etymology”.<br>
<br>
I believe that late Middle Saxon <i>eventur</i> (which goes back to French <i>aventure</i>,
perhaps via Dutch) is the origin of the equivalents (which may also denote ‘fairytale’)
in the Nordic languages:<br>
<br>
Danish: eventyr<br>
Norwegian: eventyr<br>
Swedish: äventyr<br>
Faeroese: ævintýr<br>
Icelandic: ævintýri<br>
<br>
If anyone wishes to discuss this particular topic further, please do so under “Etymology”.<br>
<br>
Regards,<br>
Reinhard/Ron<br>
Seattle, USA</p>
<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;"> </p>
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