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L O W L A N D S - L - 03 June 2011 - Volume 02<br><a href="mailto:lowlands.list@gmail.com" target="_blank">lowlands.list@gmail.com</a>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><font size="2"> </font></p><p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt;"><font size="2">From: <span class="gI"><span class="gD" style="color: rgb(91, 16, 148);"></span></span><span class="gI"><span class="gD" style="color: rgb(0, 104, 28);">Hellinckx Luc</span> <span class="go"><a href="mailto:luc.hellinckx@gmail.com">luc.hellinckx@gmail.com</a></span></span></font></p>
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Subject: <span class="gI"></span><span class="gI">LL-L "Etymology"<br><br></span>Beste Ron,</font><div><font size="2"><br></font><div><div><font size="2">You wrote:</font></div><blockquote type="cite"><div><div>
<div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><font size="2">
Estonian: <span lang="et"><span title="Click for alternate translations">karpkala ("karp fish")</span></span><br>Finnish: karppi<br>Romanian: crap<br>
Albanian: krap<br>Chuvash: karp (<span lang="ru"><span title="Click for alternate translations">карп)</span></span><br>Azerbaijani: karp<br>Georgian: kobre (</font><font size="2"><span>კობრი</span>)<br>
Persian: kapūr (<span lang="fa"><span title="Click for alternate translations">کپور</span></span>)<br>
Maltese: <span lang="mt"><span title="Click for alternate translations">karpjun</span></span><span lang="et"><span title="Click for alternate translations"></span></span><br>
Hebrew: karpiyyōn (קַרְפִּיּוֹן)<br><br>Any information, ideas, thoughts?<br></font></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></blockquote><div><font size="2">Add Sanskrit "śaphara" to that...and...maybe, maybe...コイ, Japanese "koi", generic name for carp.</font></div>
<div><font size="2"><br></font></div><div><font size="2">It's
a far stretch, I know, but we're dealing here with an animal that is
somewhat more native to Eurasia...than...say...a colibri ;=) Starostin
does find cognates on a higher (Mongolian, Manchu, Japanese) level:</font></div><div><font size="2"><br></font></div><div><font size="2"><span><a href="http://tinyurl.com/5te74qp" target="_blank">http://tinyurl.com/5te74qp</a></span></font></div>
<div><font size="2"><br></font></div><div><font size="2">Brabantish has "kelper" for the fish.</font></div><div><font size="2"><br></font></div><div><font size="2">Oh
yes, in case you'd like to know what sets English apart from
Continental Germanic (the Semitic substrate!), there's Vennemann:</font></div><div><font size="2"><br></font></div><div><font size="2"><a href="http://www.scribd.com/doc/8670/Languages-in-prehistoric-Europe-north-of-the-Alps" target="_blank">Languages in prehistoric Europe north of the Alps</a></font></div>
<div><font size="2"><br></font></div><div><font size="2">Kind greetings,</font></div><div><font size="2"><br></font></div><font color="#888888" size="2"><div>Luc Hellinckx, Halle, Belgium<br>
<br><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">----------</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
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<p style="margin: 0in 0in 0.0001pt; color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">From: <span class="gI"><span class="gD"></span></span><span class="gI"><span class="gD">Ed Alexander</span> <span class="go"><a href="mailto:edsells@cogeco.ca">edsells@cogeco.ca</a></span></span></p>
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Subject: <span class="gI"></span></font><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="gI">LL-L "Etymology" 2011.06.02 (05) [EN]</span><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);" class="gI"></span><br>
</div></font></div></div><font size="2"><br></font><div class="im"><font size="2">At 11:47 PM 02/06/2011, Ron wrote:<br><br></font>
</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding-left: 1ex;"><div class="im"><font size="2">
The origin of the etymon represented by English "carp" is a bit of a
mystery, and I wonder if together we can shed some more light on it.<br><br></font>
</div><font size="2">
Any information, ideas, thoughts?<br></font>
</blockquote><font size="2">
<br>
A Ostrogoth went fishing in the Danube one day, and his wallet fell
overboard. He jumped in the water to retrieve it, but a fish grabbed
it. Just as he grabbed that fish, it passed the wallet off to another
fish. He grabbed the second fish, and the same thing happened. It was
the first example of carp to carp walleting.<br></font><font color="#888888" size="2">
<br>
Ed Alexander <br><br></font><font size="2">----------<br>
<br>
From: Hannelore Hinz <a href="mailto:hannehinz@t-online.de" target="_blank"><hannehinz@t-online.de></a><br>
Subject: LL-L "Etymology" 2011.06.02 (05) [EN]<br>
<br>
CARPE DIEM<br>
<br>
dat wünsch ick di Ron un all' Lowlanners.<br>
<br>
Nu grien man, liekers, as ick <i>"carp" </i>läsen ded, müßt' ick
gliek an <i>Karpen (Karpfen) </i>denken.<br>
<i>Carpe </i>hett je ok wat mit <i>plücken (pflücken) </i>to
daun. Un dat Schuppen is je binah sowat as ein Plücken.<br>
<br>
MITTELHOCHDEUTSCHES TASCHENWÖRTERBUCH<br>
MATTHIAS LEXERS<br>
S. HIRZEL VERLAG LEIPZIG 1962 :<br>
karpfe, karp, swm. (schwaches masc) karpfen,<br>
mlat. (mittellateinisch) <i>carpa, carpo</i>.<br>
<br>
DUDEN 7 (künn je sien, mien DUDEN is bäter as dien):<br>
<b>Karpfen: </b>Der Name des Süßwasserfisches (<i>mhd. </i>karpfe,
<i>mitteld. </i>karpe, <i>ahd</i>. karpho)<br>
stammt wahrscheinlich aus einer unbekannten Sprache des Alpen- und
Donaugebiets. In den Gewässern dieses Gebiets war der Karpfen,
bevor er als gezüchteter Teichfisch Verbreitung fand, seit alters
heimisch. Der von südgermanischen Stämmen übernommene Name drang
später in die meisten europäischen Sprachen.<br>
<br>
Wossidlo/Teuchert:<br>
<b>Karp, </b>Karpfen, auch Karw m. Karpfen, cyprinus carpio:
'ein Karpe' CHYTR. 387:<br>
(Nathan Chytraeus) Nomenclator latino-saxonicus denuo editus.
Rostock 1613;<br>
<i>de Kaarp </i>SIEMSS. (Adolph Christian Siemssen; Fische: Die
Fische Medcklenburgs, Rostock und Leipzig 1794.<br>
<i>Karpen; </i>von den Zss. bezeichnen <i>Basterkarp </i>einen
besonders großen Karpfen, <i>Schauster-, See-, Snider-,
Tunnenkarpen </i>scherzweise den Hering; <i>Schausterkarpen </i>heißen
auch Dorsch und Rotauge, die Karausche <i>Buerkarpen; </i>sprw.
Abfertigung: <i>lihr mi doch kein Karpen kennen, min Vadder wir
'n Fischer </i>RAABE ( H. F. W. Raabe; Allgemeines
plattdeutsches Volksbuch. Wismar und Ludwigslust 1854); <i>dei
Karw laikt, wenn dei Roggen bläuht </i>(Parchim,Goldberg); von
jem., der in der Lotterie gewonnen hat, heißt es: <i>bi em hett
de Karpen leekt </i>STAFeldb. (Kreis Stargard Feldberg); der
Volksglaube rät,man solle sich am Silvesterabend getrocknete
Karpfenschullen in die Geldtasche stecken; dann komme man im
neuen Jahre in keinerlei Geldverlegenheit.<br>
<i>Karpendik, -kul, -soll; </i>'Karpfenloch'. - Mnd. <i>karpe.</i><br>
<br>
Männig Lüüd seggen ok <i>Karben. </i>(<i>karben : </i>kerben,
auch würgen <i>kar(w)en</i>.<br>
<br>
De Sünn lacht un ick ok.<br>
<br>
Best Gräuten.<br>
<br>
Hanne<br></font><font size="2">
<br>
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