<div style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif;" id=":12l" class="ii gt"><div id=":12k"><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div><div style="text-align: center;"><font size="2">==============================</font><font size="2">======================<br>
L O W L A N D S - L - 09 July 2011 - Volume 02<br>
<a href="mailto:lowlands.list@gmail.com" target="_blank">lowlands.list@gmail.com</a></font>
<font size="2"> - <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/" target="_blank">http://lowlands-l.net/</a><br>
Posting: <a href="mailto:lowlands-l@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">lowlands-l@listserv.linguistlist.org</a><br>
Archive: <a href="http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html" target="_blank">http://listserv.linguistlist.org/archives/lowlands-l.html</a><br>
Encoding: Unicode (UTF-08)<br>
Language Codes: <a href="http://lowlands-l.net/codes.php" target="_blank">lowlands-l.net/codes.php</a><br>
</font>
</div><div style="text-align: center;"><font size="2">==============================</font><font size="2">=======================<br>
</font></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);"><font size="2"><br>
</font>
</div><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">From: </span>Ingmar Roerdinkholder <<a href="mailto:roerd096@PLANET.NL">roerd096@PLANET.NL</a>><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Subject: </span>LL-L "Language varieties" 2011.07.08 (07) [EN]<br><span class="gI">
<br></span>Than you'd best also show them this clip: traditional dancing of the
Maroons. Africans will find the similarities in dances maybe just as
important than those in languages.<br>
<br>
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXjpQNNh9_o&feature=related" target="_blank">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xXjpQNNh9_o&feature=related</a><br>
<br>
Btw the West African slaves transported to Surinam came from:<br>
<br>
13,5% from Gambia to Eastern Ivory Coast (so Gambia, S Senegal, Guinea Bissau, Guinea, Sierra Leone, Liberia, IC)<br>
18,5% from the Eastern Ivory Coast and Ghana.<br>
37 % from Togo to Gabon (Togo, Benin, Nigeria, Cameroon, Equitorial Guinea, Gabon)<br>
31 % from Congo and Angola (Congo Brazzaville, DRC, Angola), these slaves were called "Loandas" and had a bad name<br>
<br>
Slaves from those four macroregions had contacts and friendships mostly
in their own group and were often hostile towards people from other
groups.<br>
<br>
The people in the clips I sent the other day reminded me the most of Congolese people<br>
<br><div style="margin-left: 40px;">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">From: Pat Barrett </span><a style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" href="mailto:pbarrett@cox.net">pbarrett@cox.net</a><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" 2011.07.08 (04) [EN]</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
<br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
As I recall, these maroon (escaped slaves) communities were peopled
principally by Ashanti people of the Akan culture group in today's
Ghana. Their language was Twi (I ran into a couple of Twi speakers at
the gym a few weeks ago).</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
<br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
In order to check this before sending it, I googled Bush Negroes and
found nothing about the origin of these people other than "West Africa".
The Akan culture is distinctive and Akan music can be easily
distinguished from other West African traditions. The reason I'm saying
all this is to indicate the failure of "the google" to give us
essentials. It's as if Afrikaans speakers were to be described with no
reference to their Dutch origins.</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
<br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
Just to get a taste of how disjointed all this "information" is, note the various origins given for the word "maroon".</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
<br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
Thanks for introducing us to these wonderful clips.</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
I'll pass them on to the Ashanti boys at the gym; they will be amazed.
Decades ago I did the same for a Yoruba friend who could not believe the
Cuban recordings in his language e.g. Babalu Aye.</span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
Pat Barrett </span><a style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" href="mailto:pbarrett@cox.net">pbarrett@cox.net</a><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);">
</span><a style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);" href="http://ideas.lang-learn.us/barrett.php" target="_blank">http://ideas.lang-learn.us/barrett.php</a><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 153);"></div>
<br>
----------<br>
<br>
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">From: </span><span class="gI"><span class="gD" style="color:#5b1094">M.-L. Lessing</span> <span class="go"><a href="mailto:marless@gmx.de">marless@gmx.de</a></span></span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Subject: </span><span class="gI">LL-L "Language varieties" 2011.07.08 (01) [EN]</span><br><span class="gI">
<br></span><div><font size="4">Hello Ingmar, now don't you fancy that so sounding a name like
your's, so full of character, could be easily forgot! (Character, not
characters!) :-)))</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font size="4">I like that Surinam Dutch and seem to understand it better
than European Dutch. The videos gave me an "Aha-Erlebnis", because I have a
Dutch friend who is a native of Surinam, and I always thought her Dutch more
clear that that of other Dutch speakers and even her German less accent-ridden,
although I only rarely see her (only when she visits the Evangelische
Kirchentag in Germany, and that is rare, because she depends on a wheelchair, so
we only write letters, old fashioned paper letters). Thank you for the
links!</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font size="4">Marlou</font><br></div>
<span class="gI"><br>
----------<br>
<br>
</span><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">From: </span><span class="gI"><span class="gD" style="color:#790619">Paul Finlow-Bates</span> <span class="go"><a href="mailto:wolf_thunder51@yahoo.co.uk">wolf_thunder51@yahoo.co.uk</a></span></span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Subject: </span><span class="gI">LL-L "Language varieties" 2011.07.08 (01) [EN]</span><br>
<br>
<div>Hi Ingmar,</div><div> </div><div>I certainly remember you! In fact I
brought your name up a few weeks ago in connection with the
Middelsprake language (I still have the link you posted).</div><div> </div><div>Paul</div><div>Derby</div>England<br><br>----------<br><br><span class="gI">
</span><span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">From: </span><span class="gI"><span class="gD" style="color:#5b1094">Mark and Ruth Dreyer</span> <span class="go"><a href="mailto:mrdreyer@lantic.net">mrdreyer@lantic.net</a></span></span><br style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
<span style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0);">
Subject: </span><span class="gI">LL-L "Language varieties" 2011.07.08 (01) [EN]</span><br><br><div><font size="2">Hello Ingmar!</font></div><div class="im">
<div> </div>
<div><font size="2">Subject: LL-L "Language varieties" </font></div>
<div> </div>
</div><div><font size="2">No, I remember you well, & also your
Middelsprake.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font size="2">Mind you I have a sneaky advantage, in Afrikaans.
With the Taal I can read it for the most part glibly & fluently, with
passing note taken of orthography & sound-changes. I suppose the same
applies to most of the dialects of Littoral Norwestern Europe. Going back to my
childhood pursuits I find it particularly satisfying that it seems to draw in
Teutonic tongues east of West-Netherfrankish (German 'knacked' my efforts in
that direction).</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font size="2">Just for my personal deluctation I shall assay a
parallel translation of your Middelsprake into Afrikaans:</font> </div><div class="im">
<div>Middelspraak (kort: MS) is een kunstlig maked spraak dat is basered up de
wichtigest levend Germanisch sprake.</div>
</div><div><font size="2">'Middelspraak' (afkorting MS) is 'n kunstaal
gegrond op die meerderheid lewendige Dietse tale. </font></div><div class="im">
<div>De grammatika is simpel on regelmatig, wat make dat licht to lerne.</div>
</div><div><font size="2">Die grammatika is eenvoudig en reëlmatig, sodoende
maklik om te leer.</font></div><div class="im">
<div>Man kan forgelike Middelspraak mid Interlingua, de kunstlig spraak basered
up Latin/Romanisch,</div>
</div><div><font size="2">'n Mens kan Middelspraak met Interlingua vergelyk,
die kunstaal gegrond op Latyns/Romanch,</font></div><div class="im">
<div>in dat for de meest sprekers af een oller meer Germanisch sprake, mennig af
een MS tekst schal wese forstaan direkt,</div>
</div><div><font size="2">deurdat die meerderheid sprekers van een of meer
Dietse tale sal menige MS teks direk verstaan</font></div><div class="im">
<div>uter enig to lerne fyrst. De levend Germanisch sprake, uter Engelisch, have
rund 170 miljon sprekers.</div>
</div><div><font size="2">sonder om dit vooraf te studeer. Die lewendige
Dietse tale, Engels uitgesonder, het rondom 170 million
sprekers. </font><div class="im"><br>For Engelisch sprekers MS is okso mennig lichter to
lerne dan, saege, Duetisch, Nederlandisch oller Swedisch.</div></div>
<div><font size="2">Vir die Engelssprekendes is MS ook baie makliker om
te leer as byvoorbeeld Duits, Nederlands of Sweeds.<br></font><div class="im">MS have een
regelmatig spelling, aleen regelmatig wirk-worde, aleen een enig kyn on een enig
fal,</div></div>
<div><font size="2">MS het reëlmatige spelling, uitsluitlik reëmatige
werkwoorde, uitsluitlik een grammatikale casus,</font></div><div class="im">
<div>regelmatig meertal on kenne nik een "umlaut".</div>
</div><div><font size="2">reëlmatige meervoud en geen 'umlaut'.<br></font><div class="im">Du
kan finde uut meer af de spraak's grammatika, wordschat, tekste, luud-dokuments
etc. in de "Files" afdeling.</div></div>
<div><font size="2">u Kan nog meer oor die taal se grammatika,
woordeskat, tekste, klankleërs ens. opspoor in die 'Files'
afdeling.<br></font><div class="im">Middelspraak is een af de variants af Folkspraak</div></div>
<div><font size="2">Middelspraak is maar een uit 'n verskeidenheid van
Volkspraak.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font size="2">I could push the Afrikaans even closer, but then it
would sound clumsy and awkward, which Middelspraak does not, and Afrikaans need
not.</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font size="2">Alas, Ingmar, James, Ingmar has it right. One can't
do the same with the same ease in (Modern) English, it has gone too far its own
way. But I'd like to see it done in German!</font></div>
<div> </div>
<div><font size="2">Totsiens, Ingmar!</font></div>
<div><font size="2">Mark</font><br></div>
<br>
<br>
<div style="text-align: center;"><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2">
=========================================================</font><font size="2"><br>
</font>
<font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2">
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2">Send posting submissions to <a href="mailto:lowlands-l@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">lowlands-l@listserv.linguistlist.org</a>.</font><font size="2"><br>
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2">
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2"> Please display only the relevant parts of quotes in your replies.</font><font size="2"><br>
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2"> Send commands (including "signoff lowlands-l") to</font><font size="2"><br>
</font>
<font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2">
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2"><a href="mailto:listserv@listserv.linguistlist.org" target="_blank">listserv@listserv.linguistlist.org</a> or <a href="mailto:lowlands.list@gmail.com" target="_blank">lowlands.list@gmail.com</a></font><font size="2"><br>
</font>
<font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2">
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2"><a href="http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html" target="_blank">http://linguistlist.org/subscribing/sub-lowlands-l.html</a> .</font><font size="2"><br>
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2">
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2"><a href="http://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#%21/group.php?gid=118916521473498" target="_blank">http://www.facebook.com/?ref=logo#!/group.php?gid=118916521473498</a> </font><font size="2"><br>
</font>
<font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2">
</font><font style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif" size="2"> =========================================================</font></div>
</div></div>
</div></div>
</div></div>
</div></div>
</div></div>
</div></div>
</div></div>