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L O W L A N D S - L - 18 April 2013 - Volume 02<br></font></font><a href="mailto:lowlands.list@gmail.com" target="_blank"><font color="#000000" face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">lowlands.list@gmail.com</font></a></span><font color="#000000" face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> </font><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000" face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> - </font><a href="http://lowlands-l.net/" target="_blank"><font color="#000000" face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">http://lowlands-l.net/</font></a><br>
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<span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><div style="margin:0in 0in 0pt"><div style="margin:0in 0in 0pt"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">From: <span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Mark and Ruth Dreyer"><span name="Paul Baronowsky"><span name="Mark Brooks"><span name="Pat Barrett"><span name="Mark and Ruth Dreyer">Mark and Ruth Dreyer</span> <span><<a href="mailto:mrdreyer@telkomsa.net">mrdreyer@telkomsa.net</a>></span></span></span></span></span> </span></span></span></span></span></span></font><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> </font></font></div>
<font color="#000000"><div style="margin:0in 0in 0pt"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Subject: LL-L "Phonology" 2013.04.17 (02) [EN]</font></div><div style="margin:0in 0in 0pt"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> </font></div>
<div style="margin:0in 0in 0pt"><div><div><div><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000" face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Mark and Ruth Dreyer"><span name="Paul Baronowsky">Paul & Ron:</span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000" face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Mark and Ruth Dreyer"><span name="Paul Baronowsky"></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></font></span> </div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000" face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Jonny Meibohm"><span name="Roger Thijs"><span name="Mark and Ruth Dreyer"><span name="Paul Baronowsky"></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></span></font><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Subject: LL-L "Phonology"</font></font></span></div>
<div class="im"><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"></font></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">On 4/17/2013 6:35 PM, Ron F. Hahn wrote:</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"></font></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">What seems like a large percentage of American English speakers<br>
pronounces the word "beyond" like "be-ond" ([biˈʔɔnd], instead of<br>like [biˈjɔnd]).</font></font></span></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"></font></span> </div>
</div><div class="im"><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Paul wrote:<br><br>It seems to me that [biˈʔɔnd] would be more difficult to pronounce than [biˈjɔnd], and therefore less frequent. In progressing from the "i" sound, with the back of tongue against the roof of the mouth, to the "o" sound, with the tongue against the floor of the mouth, would not the "y" sound be made automatically in the absence of a glottal stop? (Try saying "ia-ia-ia" and see how the tongue moves.) Tightening the muscles of the throat to stop the flow of air between "i" and "o" would take more energy.</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></font></font></span> </div></div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Mark here:</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></font></font></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">May I suggest that the question may be more satisfactorily answered philologically rather than phonologically?</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></font></font></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">For example in the English of our grandfathers of old (who learned it in school), there is the word 'yonder' - meaning 'over that way', & the word 'thither' meaning something similar, or 'over in that place' as opposed to 'there' by which they but not we would have meant merely 'that place' with no implication of distance.</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Then again, the 'be-' may be a prefix modifier belonging to a hard-used group of the same in all West Netherfrankish languages including Anglian & Old English (Quirk & Wrenn) & beyond, along with 'ge-', 'her-', 'er-', 'ont-' & 'ver-'.</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif">In Afrikaans for example we have</span><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> 'besonder' - 'singular', 'gesonder' - 'separated' & 'sonder' - 'without'.</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></font></font></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">English still has 'bewitched', 'bebothered' & 'bewildered'... Also 'beyond'; all old words with dangling ends & histories, but then that is one of the charms of English.</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></font></font></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Ron, greetings from an old lurker, if you can forgive that & my ungraceful advent, after so long. It is only because of the general level of erudition that I so seldom have any mite to contribute to the common pool myself, but I sup shamelessly.</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></font></font></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Paul, you will have fun here. I guarantee it.</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"></font></font></span> </div><div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Love to all, & the same from my Ruth,</font></font></span></div>
<div><span style="font-family:arial,helvetica,sans-serif"><font color="#000000"><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif">Mark & Ruth.</font></font></span></div></font></div><div><font face="arial,helvetica,sans-serif"> </font></div>
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