From karttu at nantucket.net Sun Apr 6 19:48:39 2003 From: karttu at nantucket.net (Frances Karttunen) Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 15:48:39 -0400 Subject: paleography Message-ID: A while ago there was a query--originating, as I recall, from the Newberry Library--about available paleography guides. I had something pertinent in mind, but I couldn't at the moment lay my hand on the publication I was thinking of. Now I have it at hand, but in the meantime the query received one or more useful responses. Nonetheless, let me bring this to the attention of anyone who might find it helpful. Back in 1981 the University of Arizona Press put out a work-book style publication (plastic ring binder) titled Northern New Spain: A Research Guide. The compilers were Thomas C. Barnes, Thomas H. Naylor, and Chalres W. Polzer. It contains a seven-page chapter "Paleography" with a long list of standard abbreviations and samples of how they appear in texts. Since notarial abbreviations are a particular obstacle to reading, this list of examples is particularly useful. Other helpful chapters are "Money and Currency," which shows Spanish units of currency and their relative value, "Weights and Measures," and "The Structure of Colonial Government." Although this guide was published a long time ago, it may still be available from Arizona. I think I acquired the copy I have in the 1990s. Fran Karttunen From rla2 at humboldt.edu Tue Apr 15 01:18:36 2003 From: rla2 at humboldt.edu (Ron Anderson) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2003 18:18:36 -0700 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Message-ID: Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there are some classes available nearby El Paso. -Thanks for your help, -Ron Anderson From Ixpolmeh14 at aol.com Tue Apr 15 03:03:00 2003 From: Ixpolmeh14 at aol.com (Ixpolmeh14 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:03:00 EDT Subject: Nahuatl course Message-ID: I am seeking a college which teaches Nahuatl here in the US preferably, CA. I will be transfering in about a year and want to make sure i have the requirements to get in to that school. Does anyone know of such a school? Tlazcamati, Francisco Cardenas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From schwallr at mrs.umn.edu Tue Apr 15 14:58:49 2003 From: schwallr at mrs.umn.edu (John F. Schwaller) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:58:49 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl course In-Reply-To: <14b.1e350634.2bccd064@aol.com> Message-ID: At 11:03 PM 4/14/03 -0400, you wrote: >I am seeking a college which teaches Nahuatl here in the US preferably, CA. Several places regularly offer Nahuatl. The one in California is UCLA, but frequently it is offered on an informal basis. Indiana University and Yale have offered the course, as has Vanderbilt. I'll be teaching a class next academic year. John F. Schwaller Vice Chancellor for Academic Affairs and Dean 315 Behmler Hall University of Minnesota, Morris 600 E 4th Street Morris, MN 56267 320-589-6015 FAX 320-589-6399 schwallr at mrs.umn.edu From mmccaffe at indiana.edu Tue Apr 15 17:45:55 2003 From: mmccaffe at indiana.edu (Michael Mccafferty) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 12:45:55 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl course In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030415095726.03041ec0@cda.mrs.umn.edu> Message-ID: We, I.U., hope to have it in the fall semester, grant Gods willing. Michael McCafferty On Tue, 15 Apr 2003, John F. Schwaller wrote: > At 11:03 PM 4/14/03 -0400, you wrote: > >I am seeking a college which teaches Nahuatl here in the US preferably, CA. > > > Several places regularly offer Nahuatl. The one in California is UCLA, but > frequently it is offered on an informal basis. Indiana University and Yale > have offered the course, as has Vanderbilt. I'll be teaching a class next > academic year. > > > > > John F. Schwaller > Vice Chancellor for Academic Affairs and Dean > 315 Behmler Hall > University of Minnesota, Morris > 600 E 4th Street > Morris, MN 56267 > 320-589-6015 > FAX 320-589-6399 > schwallr at mrs.umn.edu > > > Michael McCafferty 307 Memorial Hall Indiana University Bloomington, Indiana 47405 mmccaffe at indiana.edu "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought it was". --Rumi From schwallr at mrs.umn.edu Thu Apr 17 15:49:01 2003 From: schwallr at mrs.umn.edu (John F. Schwaller) Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:49:01 -0500 Subject: Fwd: Az: 1519: Wonders of Aztec Mexico exhibition Message-ID: >For a website highlighting the upcoming exhibition "1519 / the One >Reed Year: Wonders of Aztec Mexico: Paintings and Drawings by >Scott and Stuart Gentling and Aztec Art from their Collection" > >Please visit: > >www.buddyhollycenter.org/htm/Press%20releases/pr_aztec.htm > >Or just www.buddyhollycenter.org and navigate to "Special Events >and Exhibitions" then "1519 / One Reed Year." > >You will be able to read a description of the exhibition and see >a number of the paintings and objects that will be included. > >Hope to see you this Fall in Lubbock! > >Carolyn Tate >Associate Professor, Art History, >School of Art, Box 42081,Texas Tech University >Lubbock, TX 79409-2081 >(806) 742-3825 x 236 From anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk Thu Apr 17 22:36:54 2003 From: anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk (anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk) Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 23:36:54 +0100 Subject: attempts to pronounce Nahuatl names Message-ID: I don't know how far this is within topic, but:- On British TV there is running a program called Treasure Hunt. This is a chase-around in a helicopter and on the ground following clues. One episode was set in Mexico City. The participants were English. Some of their attempts at pronouncing Nahuatl names (Tlalpan, Quetzalcoatl, Teotihuacan, Xochimilco) were unbelievable. Teotihuacan defeated the competitors completely and they spelt it out every time or called it "The City of the Gods". Xochimilco became "Zokkimilko". Tlalpan got away with merely an extra vowel after the T. From awallace at rwsoft-online.com Fri Apr 18 14:31:19 2003 From: awallace at rwsoft-online.com (Alexander Wallace) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 09:31:19 -0500 Subject: translating a name to nahuatl. Message-ID: Quizas los expertos en la lista me pudieran ayudar a encontrar la traduccion a nahuatl de mis nombres. Encontre los siguientes significados: Alexander del Griego significa: Asistente y defensor de la humanidad. Owen de la lengua Celta significa: Joven guerrero. Aunque no creo ser ninguna de esas cosas, seria bueno encontrar una version nahuatl para poder llamarme en mexicano, puesto que lo soy... Saludos de antemano. ---English version below---------------------------------- Maybe some of the experts here would be kind and help me translate my name into nahuatl. I found the following meannings: Alexander from the greek Alexandros means: Helper and defender of man kind Owen from a celtic origin means: Young fighter. Though I'm no such things, It would be nice to have a nahuatl equivalence. Thanks in advance. From zorrah at att.net Fri Apr 18 20:20:58 2003 From: zorrah at att.net (zorrah at att.net) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 20:20:58 +0000 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Message-ID: Courtesy of http://ethnologue.com, I have maps of Nahuatl speaking communities posted at my message board link listed below. As one can see, the nearest Nahuatl speaking region is quite some distance from El paso. http://www.nahuatl.info/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=2776051131&f=7316061131&m=5096007602 citlalin xochime http://nahuatl.info/nahuatl.htm > Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking > communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there > are some classes available nearby El Paso. > > -Thanks for your help, > -Ron Anderson From mmccaffe at indiana.edu Sat Apr 19 13:23:03 2003 From: mmccaffe at indiana.edu (Michael Mccafferty) Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 08:23:03 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? In-Reply-To: <200304182021.h3IKL5fG237417@cda.mrs.umn.edu> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Apr 2003 zorrah at att.net wrote: > Courtesy of http://ethnologue.com, I have maps of Nahuatl speaking communities > posted at my message board link listed below. As one can see, the nearest > Nahuatl speaking region is quite some distance from El paso. > > http://www.nahuatl.info/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=2776051131&f=7316061131&m=5096007602 Is anyone having trouble accessing this site? The computers don't seem to be able to read it. > > citlalin xochime > http://nahuatl.info/nahuatl.htm > > Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking > > communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there > > are some classes available nearby El Paso. > > > > -Thanks for your help, > > -Ron Anderson > > > Michael McCafferty 307 Memorial Hall Indiana University Bloomington, Indiana 47405 mmccaffe at indiana.edu "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought it was". --Rumi From mmccaffe at indiana.edu Sat Apr 19 13:55:51 2003 From: mmccaffe at indiana.edu (Michael Mccafferty) Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 08:55:51 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ok. I got it. Thanks! On Sat, 19 Apr 2003, Michael Mccafferty wrote: > > > On Fri, 18 Apr 2003 zorrah at att.net wrote: > > > Courtesy of http://ethnologue.com, I have maps of Nahuatl speaking communities > > posted at my message board link listed below. As one can see, the nearest > > Nahuatl speaking region is quite some distance from El paso. > > > > http://www.nahuatl.info/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=2776051131&f=7316061131&m=5096007602 > > Is anyone having trouble accessing this site? The computers don't seem to > be able to read it. > > > > > citlalin xochime > > http://nahuatl.info/nahuatl.htm > > > Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking > > > communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there > > > are some classes available nearby El Paso. > > > > > > -Thanks for your help, > > > -Ron Anderson > > > > > > > > > Michael McCafferty > 307 Memorial Hall > Indiana University > Bloomington, Indiana > 47405 > mmccaffe at indiana.edu > > "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you > will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought > it was". > > --Rumi > > > > Michael McCafferty 307 Memorial Hall Indiana University Bloomington, Indiana 47405 mmccaffe at indiana.edu "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought it was". --Rumi From cipactonal at starmedia.com Sun Apr 20 06:14:01 2003 From: cipactonal at starmedia.com (Ignacio Silva) Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 02:14:01 -0400 Subject: Paleografia y Diplomatica. Message-ID: Listeros, dentro de muy poco tiempo van a estar listos dos cursos: 1) Lengua nahuatl. Nahuatl de Milpa Alta, el profesor va a ser el maestro Librado Silva Galeana quien actualmente esta traduciendo los Cantares Mexicanos bajo la batuta de Miguel Leon-Portilla. 2) Paleografia y Diplomatica de textos coloniales. Los profesores van a ser la maestra Clotilde Martinez Ibanez (Paleografia), experta en paleografia de documentos coloniales; y el maestro Jorge Nacif Mina (Diplomatica) experto en autentificacion de documentos. Estos cursos los esta organizando la Consultoria CGPC-Consultoria y Gestoria Patrimonial Cultural S.C. Estos dos cursos van a impartirse en Mexico. Es la informacion que tengo, posteriormente les hago llegar la demas informacion como el costo de cada uno de los cursos y el sitio en donde se van a realizar. Saludos. PD. Estamos realizando una lista previa de esos cursos, si estan interesados favor de hacernos llegar sus comentarios. Rafael Roura Director de Historia de CGPC _______________________________________________________________________________________________________ Obt�n gratis tu cuenta de correo en StarMedia Email. �Reg�strate hoy mismo!. http://www.starmedia.com/email From awallace at rwsoft-online.com Sun Apr 20 15:21:42 2003 From: awallace at rwsoft-online.com (Alexander Wallace) Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 10:21:42 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: No, it works fine. On Saturday 19 April 2003 08:23 am, Michael Mccafferty wrote: > On Fri, 18 Apr 2003 zorrah at att.net wrote: > > Courtesy of http://ethnologue.com, I have maps of Nahuatl speaking > > communities posted at my message board link listed below. As one can > > see, the nearest Nahuatl speaking region is quite some distance from El > > paso. > > > > http://www.nahuatl.info/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=2776051131&f=7316061131&m=5096007 > >602 > > Is anyone having trouble accessing this site? The computers don't seem to > be able to read it. > > > citlalin xochime > > http://nahuatl.info/nahuatl.htm > > > > > Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking > > > communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there > > > are some classes available nearby El Paso. > > > > > > -Thanks for your help, > > > -Ron Anderson > > Michael McCafferty > 307 Memorial Hall > Indiana University > Bloomington, Indiana > 47405 > mmccaffe at indiana.edu > > "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you > will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought > it was". > > --Rumi From schwallr at mrs.umn.edu Thu Apr 24 18:30:57 2003 From: schwallr at mrs.umn.edu (John F. Schwaller) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:30:57 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Message-ID: Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:25:16 -0500 (CDT) From: maestas at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu To: Michael Mccafferty cc: zorrah at att.net, Ron Anderson , Subject: Re: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Houston has a sizable undocumented Nahuatl speaking community. However, to find them you may have to go find areas where Mexican immigrants are looking for work. This may be the case in other major cities and would certainly not be included in linguistic maps of which I am aware. Enrique Maestas maestas at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu From zorrah at att.net Thu Apr 24 21:51:56 2003 From: zorrah at att.net (zorrah at att.net) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 21:51:56 +0000 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Message-ID: A member of the Mexika Eagle Society (Albuquerque, New Mexico) reported last summer after visiting Nahuatl speaking villages in Anahuac, that a Virginia (U.S.) contractor recruits Nahuatl speakers for three months out of the year to work the tobacco fields. Another Mexihcayotl student tells me that he knows of Nahuatl speakers in the Phoenix, Arizona area that recently migrated to South Carolina for more work. Citlalin Xochime > Houston has a sizable undocumented Nahuatl speaking community. However, > to find them you may have to go find areas where Mexican immigrants are > looking for work. This may be the case in other major cities and would > certainly not be included in linguistic mapsof which I am aware. > > Enrique Maestas From anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk Fri Apr 25 06:57:45 2003 From: anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk (anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk) Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:57:45 +0100 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? In-Reply-To: <200304242152.h3OLq3fG225547@cda.mrs.umn.edu> Message-ID: On 24 Apr 2003, at 21:51, zorrah at att.net wrote: > ... that a Virginia (U.S.) contractor recruits Nahuatl speakers for > three months out of the year to work the tobacco fields. > Another Mexihcayotl student tells me that he knows of Nahuatl speakers in the > Phoenix, Arizona area that recently migrated to South Carolina for more work. How likely is this to result in them or their descendants losing their language? How much are they literate in their own language? I don't know how far within topic this is, but recently on the email group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/alternate-history there has been discussion about what might have happened if the USA had annexed more of, or even all of, Mexico after the last big war between the two. Mexico was expecting to lose Coahuila and Chihuahua and Sonora etc and preparing to lose everything up to Mexico City. At the time the population of Mexico had not built up again very far from the post-Conquest population crash which was caused largely by white man's diseases, and Mexicans both Spanish-speaking and Nahuatl / Mayan / etc speaking would likely have been swamped by Anglos fron the north. Or, what would have happened if Cortez's army had been wiped out on the Noche Triste and the Aztec Empire managed to arm itself European fashion in time to stave off the next attack. It might have been, nowadays USA schoolboys routinely being taught high- school Nahuatl instead of high-school Spanish. Citlalyani From schwallr at mrs.umn.edu Fri Apr 25 13:33:58 2003 From: schwallr at mrs.umn.edu (John F. Schwaller) Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:33:58 -0500 Subject: research query Message-ID: From: "Brigid & Nick Nichols" To: Subject: research query I am a graduate student and my thesis concerns mid-19th century saddlery. In the course of my research, I have encountered references to horse brushes being made with "Okatka" bristles. I do not know whether these bristles were of animal (hair) or vegetable origin, as both materials were (and continue to be) used in horse brushes. The Okatka bristles were said to come in three colors: gray, black and yellow, with the gray being the best quality for brushes. The reason I'm writing you regarding this esoteric subject is that although I've searched through many period dictionaries, the only reference I've been able to find for the word "okatka" is in the Nahuatl language! I think it would be entirely possible that these bristles were being imported from Mexico, hence the use of a Nahuatl word (I'm assuming that it is a colloquial term in this context). Can you please circulate my query within the Nahuatl language studies community (or direct me to appropriate sources)? Please be assured that any assistance you may be able to provide will be most appreciated! Regards, Nick Nichols neocelt at earthlink.net From lemcia at uclink.berkeley.edu Mon Apr 28 15:15:04 2003 From: lemcia at uclink.berkeley.edu (Monika Jarosz) Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 08:15:04 -0700 Subject: Nahuatl course Message-ID: Hello, I am also seeking a place that offers a course on Nahuatl. I was wondering if there is such a place in the Bay Area. Thanks a lot, Monika Jarosz ----- Original Message ----- From: "John F. Schwaller" To: ; Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2003 7:58 AM Subject: Re: Nahuatl course > At 11:03 PM 4/14/03 -0400, you wrote: > >I am seeking a college which teaches Nahuatl here in the US preferably, CA. > > > Several places regularly offer Nahuatl. The one in California is UCLA, but > frequently it is offered on an informal basis. Indiana University and Yale > have offered the course, as has Vanderbilt. I'll be teaching a class next > academic year. > > > > > John F. Schwaller > Vice Chancellor for Academic Affairs and Dean > 315 Behmler Hall > University of Minnesota, Morris > 600 E 4th Street > Morris, MN 56267 > 320-589-6015 > FAX 320-589-6399 > schwallr at mrs.umn.edu > > From awallace at rwsoft-online.com Wed Apr 30 14:11:19 2003 From: awallace at rwsoft-online.com (Alexander Wallace) Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:11:19 -0500 Subject: Origen de Eya. Message-ID: Falto de estudio en el origen del lenguaje, pero con algo de curiosidad, he observado como algunas palabras en nahuatl tienen similaridad, a veces en su escritura o a veces en su sonido, al castellando y me pregunto si tienen relacion real o es solo mi paranoya :) Solicito entonces me iluminen, en palabras como: anozo (Me pregunto si es adaptacion de la conjuncion _o_ del espanyol) ihuan (Me pregunto si es adaptacion de la conjuncion _y_ ) eya (pasado imperfecto ser/estar, me pregunto si es adaptacion del verbo conjugado _era_) Agradezco de antemano su atencion. -- ¡Ma'titla'tocan Nahualla'tolli! From karttu at nantucket.net Sun Apr 6 19:48:39 2003 From: karttu at nantucket.net (Frances Karttunen) Date: Sun, 6 Apr 2003 15:48:39 -0400 Subject: paleography Message-ID: A while ago there was a query--originating, as I recall, from the Newberry Library--about available paleography guides. I had something pertinent in mind, but I couldn't at the moment lay my hand on the publication I was thinking of. Now I have it at hand, but in the meantime the query received one or more useful responses. Nonetheless, let me bring this to the attention of anyone who might find it helpful. Back in 1981 the University of Arizona Press put out a work-book style publication (plastic ring binder) titled Northern New Spain: A Research Guide. The compilers were Thomas C. Barnes, Thomas H. Naylor, and Chalres W. Polzer. It contains a seven-page chapter "Paleography" with a long list of standard abbreviations and samples of how they appear in texts. Since notarial abbreviations are a particular obstacle to reading, this list of examples is particularly useful. Other helpful chapters are "Money and Currency," which shows Spanish units of currency and their relative value, "Weights and Measures," and "The Structure of Colonial Government." Although this guide was published a long time ago, it may still be available from Arizona. I think I acquired the copy I have in the 1990s. Fran Karttunen From rla2 at humboldt.edu Tue Apr 15 01:18:36 2003 From: rla2 at humboldt.edu (Ron Anderson) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2003 18:18:36 -0700 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Message-ID: Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there are some classes available nearby El Paso. -Thanks for your help, -Ron Anderson From Ixpolmeh14 at aol.com Tue Apr 15 03:03:00 2003 From: Ixpolmeh14 at aol.com (Ixpolmeh14 at aol.com) Date: Mon, 14 Apr 2003 23:03:00 EDT Subject: Nahuatl course Message-ID: I am seeking a college which teaches Nahuatl here in the US preferably, CA. I will be transfering in about a year and want to make sure i have the requirements to get in to that school. Does anyone know of such a school? Tlazcamati, Francisco Cardenas -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From schwallr at mrs.umn.edu Tue Apr 15 14:58:49 2003 From: schwallr at mrs.umn.edu (John F. Schwaller) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 09:58:49 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl course In-Reply-To: <14b.1e350634.2bccd064@aol.com> Message-ID: At 11:03 PM 4/14/03 -0400, you wrote: >I am seeking a college which teaches Nahuatl here in the US preferably, CA. Several places regularly offer Nahuatl. The one in California is UCLA, but frequently it is offered on an informal basis. Indiana University and Yale have offered the course, as has Vanderbilt. I'll be teaching a class next academic year. John F. Schwaller Vice Chancellor for Academic Affairs and Dean 315 Behmler Hall University of Minnesota, Morris 600 E 4th Street Morris, MN 56267 320-589-6015 FAX 320-589-6399 schwallr at mrs.umn.edu From mmccaffe at indiana.edu Tue Apr 15 17:45:55 2003 From: mmccaffe at indiana.edu (Michael Mccafferty) Date: Tue, 15 Apr 2003 12:45:55 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl course In-Reply-To: <5.1.0.14.0.20030415095726.03041ec0@cda.mrs.umn.edu> Message-ID: We, I.U., hope to have it in the fall semester, grant Gods willing. Michael McCafferty On Tue, 15 Apr 2003, John F. Schwaller wrote: > At 11:03 PM 4/14/03 -0400, you wrote: > >I am seeking a college which teaches Nahuatl here in the US preferably, CA. > > > Several places regularly offer Nahuatl. The one in California is UCLA, but > frequently it is offered on an informal basis. Indiana University and Yale > have offered the course, as has Vanderbilt. I'll be teaching a class next > academic year. > > > > > John F. Schwaller > Vice Chancellor for Academic Affairs and Dean > 315 Behmler Hall > University of Minnesota, Morris > 600 E 4th Street > Morris, MN 56267 > 320-589-6015 > FAX 320-589-6399 > schwallr at mrs.umn.edu > > > Michael McCafferty 307 Memorial Hall Indiana University Bloomington, Indiana 47405 mmccaffe at indiana.edu "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought it was". --Rumi From schwallr at mrs.umn.edu Thu Apr 17 15:49:01 2003 From: schwallr at mrs.umn.edu (John F. Schwaller) Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 10:49:01 -0500 Subject: Fwd: Az: 1519: Wonders of Aztec Mexico exhibition Message-ID: >For a website highlighting the upcoming exhibition "1519 / the One >Reed Year: Wonders of Aztec Mexico: Paintings and Drawings by >Scott and Stuart Gentling and Aztec Art from their Collection" > >Please visit: > >www.buddyhollycenter.org/htm/Press%20releases/pr_aztec.htm > >Or just www.buddyhollycenter.org and navigate to "Special Events >and Exhibitions" then "1519 / One Reed Year." > >You will be able to read a description of the exhibition and see >a number of the paintings and objects that will be included. > >Hope to see you this Fall in Lubbock! > >Carolyn Tate >Associate Professor, Art History, >School of Art, Box 42081,Texas Tech University >Lubbock, TX 79409-2081 >(806) 742-3825 x 236 From anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk Thu Apr 17 22:36:54 2003 From: anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk (anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk) Date: Thu, 17 Apr 2003 23:36:54 +0100 Subject: attempts to pronounce Nahuatl names Message-ID: I don't know how far this is within topic, but:- On British TV there is running a program called Treasure Hunt. This is a chase-around in a helicopter and on the ground following clues. One episode was set in Mexico City. The participants were English. Some of their attempts at pronouncing Nahuatl names (Tlalpan, Quetzalcoatl, Teotihuacan, Xochimilco) were unbelievable. Teotihuacan defeated the competitors completely and they spelt it out every time or called it "The City of the Gods". Xochimilco became "Zokkimilko". Tlalpan got away with merely an extra vowel after the T. From awallace at rwsoft-online.com Fri Apr 18 14:31:19 2003 From: awallace at rwsoft-online.com (Alexander Wallace) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 09:31:19 -0500 Subject: translating a name to nahuatl. Message-ID: Quizas los expertos en la lista me pudieran ayudar a encontrar la traduccion a nahuatl de mis nombres. Encontre los siguientes significados: Alexander del Griego significa: Asistente y defensor de la humanidad. Owen de la lengua Celta significa: Joven guerrero. Aunque no creo ser ninguna de esas cosas, seria bueno encontrar una version nahuatl para poder llamarme en mexicano, puesto que lo soy... Saludos de antemano. ---English version below---------------------------------- Maybe some of the experts here would be kind and help me translate my name into nahuatl. I found the following meannings: Alexander from the greek Alexandros means: Helper and defender of man kind Owen from a celtic origin means: Young fighter. Though I'm no such things, It would be nice to have a nahuatl equivalence. Thanks in advance. From zorrah at att.net Fri Apr 18 20:20:58 2003 From: zorrah at att.net (zorrah at att.net) Date: Fri, 18 Apr 2003 20:20:58 +0000 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Message-ID: Courtesy of http://ethnologue.com, I have maps of Nahuatl speaking communities posted at my message board link listed below. As one can see, the nearest Nahuatl speaking region is quite some distance from El paso. http://www.nahuatl.info/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=2776051131&f=7316061131&m=5096007602 citlalin xochime http://nahuatl.info/nahuatl.htm > Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking > communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there > are some classes available nearby El Paso. > > -Thanks for your help, > -Ron Anderson From mmccaffe at indiana.edu Sat Apr 19 13:23:03 2003 From: mmccaffe at indiana.edu (Michael Mccafferty) Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 08:23:03 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? In-Reply-To: <200304182021.h3IKL5fG237417@cda.mrs.umn.edu> Message-ID: On Fri, 18 Apr 2003 zorrah at att.net wrote: > Courtesy of http://ethnologue.com, I have maps of Nahuatl speaking communities > posted at my message board link listed below. As one can see, the nearest > Nahuatl speaking region is quite some distance from El paso. > > http://www.nahuatl.info/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=2776051131&f=7316061131&m=5096007602 Is anyone having trouble accessing this site? The computers don't seem to be able to read it. > > citlalin xochime > http://nahuatl.info/nahuatl.htm > > Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking > > communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there > > are some classes available nearby El Paso. > > > > -Thanks for your help, > > -Ron Anderson > > > Michael McCafferty 307 Memorial Hall Indiana University Bloomington, Indiana 47405 mmccaffe at indiana.edu "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought it was". --Rumi From mmccaffe at indiana.edu Sat Apr 19 13:55:51 2003 From: mmccaffe at indiana.edu (Michael Mccafferty) Date: Sat, 19 Apr 2003 08:55:51 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Ok. I got it. Thanks! On Sat, 19 Apr 2003, Michael Mccafferty wrote: > > > On Fri, 18 Apr 2003 zorrah at att.net wrote: > > > Courtesy of http://ethnologue.com, I have maps of Nahuatl speaking communities > > posted at my message board link listed below. As one can see, the nearest > > Nahuatl speaking region is quite some distance from El paso. > > > > http://www.nahuatl.info/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=2776051131&f=7316061131&m=5096007602 > > Is anyone having trouble accessing this site? The computers don't seem to > be able to read it. > > > > > citlalin xochime > > http://nahuatl.info/nahuatl.htm > > > Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking > > > communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there > > > are some classes available nearby El Paso. > > > > > > -Thanks for your help, > > > -Ron Anderson > > > > > > > > > Michael McCafferty > 307 Memorial Hall > Indiana University > Bloomington, Indiana > 47405 > mmccaffe at indiana.edu > > "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you > will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought > it was". > > --Rumi > > > > Michael McCafferty 307 Memorial Hall Indiana University Bloomington, Indiana 47405 mmccaffe at indiana.edu "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought it was". --Rumi From cipactonal at starmedia.com Sun Apr 20 06:14:01 2003 From: cipactonal at starmedia.com (Ignacio Silva) Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 02:14:01 -0400 Subject: Paleografia y Diplomatica. Message-ID: Listeros, dentro de muy poco tiempo van a estar listos dos cursos: 1) Lengua nahuatl. Nahuatl de Milpa Alta, el profesor va a ser el maestro Librado Silva Galeana quien actualmente esta traduciendo los Cantares Mexicanos bajo la batuta de Miguel Leon-Portilla. 2) Paleografia y Diplomatica de textos coloniales. Los profesores van a ser la maestra Clotilde Martinez Ibanez (Paleografia), experta en paleografia de documentos coloniales; y el maestro Jorge Nacif Mina (Diplomatica) experto en autentificacion de documentos. Estos cursos los esta organizando la Consultoria CGPC-Consultoria y Gestoria Patrimonial Cultural S.C. Estos dos cursos van a impartirse en Mexico. Es la informacion que tengo, posteriormente les hago llegar la demas informacion como el costo de cada uno de los cursos y el sitio en donde se van a realizar. Saludos. PD. Estamos realizando una lista previa de esos cursos, si estan interesados favor de hacernos llegar sus comentarios. Rafael Roura Director de Historia de CGPC _______________________________________________________________________________________________________ Obt?n gratis tu cuenta de correo en StarMedia Email. ?Reg?strate hoy mismo!. http://www.starmedia.com/email From awallace at rwsoft-online.com Sun Apr 20 15:21:42 2003 From: awallace at rwsoft-online.com (Alexander Wallace) Date: Sun, 20 Apr 2003 10:21:42 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: No, it works fine. On Saturday 19 April 2003 08:23 am, Michael Mccafferty wrote: > On Fri, 18 Apr 2003 zorrah at att.net wrote: > > Courtesy of http://ethnologue.com, I have maps of Nahuatl speaking > > communities posted at my message board link listed below. As one can > > see, the nearest Nahuatl speaking region is quite some distance from El > > paso. > > > > http://www.nahuatl.info/6/ubb.x?a=tpc&s=2776051131&f=7316061131&m=5096007 > >602 > > Is anyone having trouble accessing this site? The computers don't seem to > be able to read it. > > > citlalin xochime > > http://nahuatl.info/nahuatl.htm > > > > > Hello, I'm wondering if anyone knows of any Nahuatl speaking > > > communities nearby El Paso, TX or Juarez, Mexico? If not, maybe there > > > are some classes available nearby El Paso. > > > > > > -Thanks for your help, > > > -Ron Anderson > > Michael McCafferty > 307 Memorial Hall > Indiana University > Bloomington, Indiana > 47405 > mmccaffe at indiana.edu > > "When you eventually see through the veils to how things really are, you > will keep saying again and again, "This is certainly not like we thought > it was". > > --Rumi From schwallr at mrs.umn.edu Thu Apr 24 18:30:57 2003 From: schwallr at mrs.umn.edu (John F. Schwaller) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:30:57 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Message-ID: Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 13:25:16 -0500 (CDT) From: maestas at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu To: Michael Mccafferty cc: zorrah at att.net, Ron Anderson , Subject: Re: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Houston has a sizable undocumented Nahuatl speaking community. However, to find them you may have to go find areas where Mexican immigrants are looking for work. This may be the case in other major cities and would certainly not be included in linguistic maps of which I am aware. Enrique Maestas maestas at ccwf.cc.utexas.edu From zorrah at att.net Thu Apr 24 21:51:56 2003 From: zorrah at att.net (zorrah at att.net) Date: Thu, 24 Apr 2003 21:51:56 +0000 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? Message-ID: A member of the Mexika Eagle Society (Albuquerque, New Mexico) reported last summer after visiting Nahuatl speaking villages in Anahuac, that a Virginia (U.S.) contractor recruits Nahuatl speakers for three months out of the year to work the tobacco fields. Another Mexihcayotl student tells me that he knows of Nahuatl speakers in the Phoenix, Arizona area that recently migrated to South Carolina for more work. Citlalin Xochime > Houston has a sizable undocumented Nahuatl speaking community. However, > to find them you may have to go find areas where Mexican immigrants are > looking for work. This may be the case in other major cities and would > certainly not be included in linguistic mapsof which I am aware. > > Enrique Maestas From anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk Fri Apr 25 06:57:45 2003 From: anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk (anthony.appleyard at umist.ac.uk) Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 07:57:45 +0100 Subject: Nahuatl communities nearby TX? In-Reply-To: <200304242152.h3OLq3fG225547@cda.mrs.umn.edu> Message-ID: On 24 Apr 2003, at 21:51, zorrah at att.net wrote: > ... that a Virginia (U.S.) contractor recruits Nahuatl speakers for > three months out of the year to work the tobacco fields. > Another Mexihcayotl student tells me that he knows of Nahuatl speakers in the > Phoenix, Arizona area that recently migrated to South Carolina for more work. How likely is this to result in them or their descendants losing their language? How much are they literate in their own language? I don't know how far within topic this is, but recently on the email group http://groups.yahoo.com/group/alternate-history there has been discussion about what might have happened if the USA had annexed more of, or even all of, Mexico after the last big war between the two. Mexico was expecting to lose Coahuila and Chihuahua and Sonora etc and preparing to lose everything up to Mexico City. At the time the population of Mexico had not built up again very far from the post-Conquest population crash which was caused largely by white man's diseases, and Mexicans both Spanish-speaking and Nahuatl / Mayan / etc speaking would likely have been swamped by Anglos fron the north. Or, what would have happened if Cortez's army had been wiped out on the Noche Triste and the Aztec Empire managed to arm itself European fashion in time to stave off the next attack. It might have been, nowadays USA schoolboys routinely being taught high- school Nahuatl instead of high-school Spanish. Citlalyani From schwallr at mrs.umn.edu Fri Apr 25 13:33:58 2003 From: schwallr at mrs.umn.edu (John F. Schwaller) Date: Fri, 25 Apr 2003 08:33:58 -0500 Subject: research query Message-ID: From: "Brigid & Nick Nichols" To: Subject: research query I am a graduate student and my thesis concerns mid-19th century saddlery. In the course of my research, I have encountered references to horse brushes being made with "Okatka" bristles. I do not know whether these bristles were of animal (hair) or vegetable origin, as both materials were (and continue to be) used in horse brushes. The Okatka bristles were said to come in three colors: gray, black and yellow, with the gray being the best quality for brushes. The reason I'm writing you regarding this esoteric subject is that although I've searched through many period dictionaries, the only reference I've been able to find for the word "okatka" is in the Nahuatl language! I think it would be entirely possible that these bristles were being imported from Mexico, hence the use of a Nahuatl word (I'm assuming that it is a colloquial term in this context). Can you please circulate my query within the Nahuatl language studies community (or direct me to appropriate sources)? Please be assured that any assistance you may be able to provide will be most appreciated! Regards, Nick Nichols neocelt at earthlink.net From lemcia at uclink.berkeley.edu Mon Apr 28 15:15:04 2003 From: lemcia at uclink.berkeley.edu (Monika Jarosz) Date: Mon, 28 Apr 2003 08:15:04 -0700 Subject: Nahuatl course Message-ID: Hello, I am also seeking a place that offers a course on Nahuatl. I was wondering if there is such a place in the Bay Area. Thanks a lot, Monika Jarosz ----- Original Message ----- From: "John F. Schwaller" To: ; Sent: Tuesday, April 15, 2003 7:58 AM Subject: Re: Nahuatl course > At 11:03 PM 4/14/03 -0400, you wrote: > >I am seeking a college which teaches Nahuatl here in the US preferably, CA. > > > Several places regularly offer Nahuatl. The one in California is UCLA, but > frequently it is offered on an informal basis. Indiana University and Yale > have offered the course, as has Vanderbilt. I'll be teaching a class next > academic year. > > > > > John F. Schwaller > Vice Chancellor for Academic Affairs and Dean > 315 Behmler Hall > University of Minnesota, Morris > 600 E 4th Street > Morris, MN 56267 > 320-589-6015 > FAX 320-589-6399 > schwallr at mrs.umn.edu > > From awallace at rwsoft-online.com Wed Apr 30 14:11:19 2003 From: awallace at rwsoft-online.com (Alexander Wallace) Date: Wed, 30 Apr 2003 09:11:19 -0500 Subject: Origen de Eya. Message-ID: Falto de estudio en el origen del lenguaje, pero con algo de curiosidad, he observado como algunas palabras en nahuatl tienen similaridad, a veces en su escritura o a veces en su sonido, al castellando y me pregunto si tienen relacion real o es solo mi paranoya :) Solicito entonces me iluminen, en palabras como: anozo (Me pregunto si es adaptacion de la conjuncion _o_ del espanyol) ihuan (Me pregunto si es adaptacion de la conjuncion _y_ ) eya (pasado imperfecto ser/estar, me pregunto si es adaptacion del verbo conjugado _era_) Agradezco de antemano su atencion. -- ?Ma'titla'tocan Nahualla'tolli!