From ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX  Sun Jul  3 01:55:15 2005
From: ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX (=?iso-8859-1?q?Rita=20Monta=FFfffff1o?=)
Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 20:55:15 -0500
Subject: Alonso de Zorita
In-Reply-To: <BAY18-F3330040B13F23828DE456FBE30@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <SAT.2.JUL.2005.205515.0500.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

Hi Steffen:
I'm fraid there is a mistke about the date 1941. I'm almost sure that that edition doesn't exist. The first vertion of the "Los señores..." edited by the University of Mexico was from 1942, on the colection Biblioteca del Estudiante Universitario, number 32. On monday I'm going to the University and will try to find the year of the first edition. I live in Mexico City and work at the University so it wont be hard to find the first edition and of couse, tha right date.  Kind Regards Rita. Steffen Haurholm-Larsen <teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM> escribió:
Hello everybody

I have run into a problem with a quote from Zorita which is from a version 
of the Breve y sumaria Relación which I do not have access to:

Zorita, Alonso de (1941). Los señores de la Nueva España. Colección 
Biblioteca del estudiante Universitario. No. 32. Imprenta Universitaria 
UNAM. México

First of all I am not sure that the above title is even se same as the 
edition that I have, from 1942 entitled "Breve y sumaria relación de los 
señores de la nueva España".

Second, if it is the same, could someone please give me the correlation of 
pages between the two?

The quote given is for pp. 75, 143-144, 148, 152 in the 1941 edition. I need 
the corresponding page numbers from the 1942 edition.

Thanks a billion anyone who can help.

Kind regards

Steffen Haurholm-Larsen
University of Copenhagen

_________________________________________________________________
Find det, du søger på MSN Søg http://search.msn.dk

		
---------------------------------
  Do You Yahoo!? La mejor conexión a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por $100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx 
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From teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM  Sun Jul  3 10:09:24 2005
From: teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM (Steffen Haurholm-Larsen)
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 10:09:24 +0000
Subject: Alonso de Zorita
In-Reply-To: <20050703015516.56751.qmail@web60913.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <SUN.3.JUL.2005.100924.0000.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

Hi Rita

I found this other reference in a list of references:

ZORITA, ALONSO DE
1941 Breve y sumaria relaci�n de los se�ores y maneras y diferencias que 
hab�a en
ellos en la Nueva Espa�a . . . In Nueva colecci�n de documentos para la 
historia de
M�xico ( Joaqu�n Garc�a Icazbalceta, ed.) 3: 65�205. Editorial Salvador 
Chavez
Hayhoe, Mexico City.

Could this be the one?
I am looking forward to hearing what you find in the UNAM.
Kind regards
Steffen

>From: Rita Monta�fffff1o <ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX>
>Reply-To: Nahua language and culture discussion <NAHUAT-L at LISTS.UMN.EDU>
>To: NAHUAT-L at LISTS.UMN.EDU
>Subject: Re: Alonso de Zorita
>Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 20:55:15 -0500
>
>Hi Steffen:
>I'm fraid there is a mistke about the date 1941. I'm almost sure that that 
>edition doesn't exist. The first vertion of the "Los se�ores..." edited by 
>the University of Mexico was from 1942, on the colection Biblioteca del 
>Estudiante Universitario, number 32. On monday I'm going to the University 
>and will try to find the year of the first edition. I live in Mexico City 
>and work at the University so it wont be hard to find the first edition and 
>of couse, tha right date.  Kind Regards Rita. Steffen Haurholm-Larsen 
><teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM> escribi�:
>Hello everybody
>
>I have run into a problem with a quote from Zorita which is from a version
>of the Breve y sumaria Relaci�n which I do not have access to:
>
>Zorita, Alonso de (1941). Los se�ores de la Nueva Espa�a. Colecci�n
>Biblioteca del estudiante Universitario. No. 32. Imprenta Universitaria
>UNAM. M�xico
>
>First of all I am not sure that the above title is even se same as the
>edition that I have, from 1942 entitled "Breve y sumaria relaci�n de los
>se�ores de la nueva Espa�a".
>
>Second, if it is the same, could someone please give me the correlation of
>pages between the two?
>
>The quote given is for pp. 75, 143-144, 148, 152 in the 1941 edition. I 
>need
>the corresponding page numbers from the 1942 edition.
>
>Thanks a billion anyone who can help.
>
>Kind regards
>
>Steffen Haurholm-Larsen
>University of Copenhagen
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Find det, du s�ger p� MSN S�g http://search.msn.dk
>
>
>---------------------------------
>   Do You Yahoo!? La mejor conexi�n a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por 
>$100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx

_________________________________________________________________
Del din verden med MSN Spaces  http://spaces.msn.com


From ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX  Tue Jul  5 23:56:26 2005
From: ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX (=?iso-8859-1?q?Rita=20Monta=FFfffff1o?=)
Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 18:56:26 -0500
Subject: Alonso de Zorita
In-Reply-To: <BAY18-F36AC98A0FC8999A55DFEDFBE40@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <TUE.5.JUL.2005.185626.0500.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

Hi Steffen:
I'll try to find the book of the second reference and check the pages you need. A friend who works at the library of the Instituto de Investigaciones Históricas is looking if  there is a edition of 1941. Tomorrow (wensday) perhaps I can give you some news about both texts. Rita. 
 
 
 
Steffen Haurholm-Larsen <teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM> escribió:
Hi Rita

I found this other reference in a list of references:

ZORITA, ALONSO DE
1941 Breve y sumaria relación de los señores y maneras y diferencias que 
había en
ellos en la Nueva España . . . In Nueva colección de documentos para la 
historia de
México ( Joaquín García Icazbalceta, ed.) 3: 65–205. Editorial Salvador 
Chavez
Hayhoe, Mexico City.

Could this be the one?
I am looking forward to hearing what you find in the UNAM.
Kind regards
Steffen

>From: Rita Montaÿfffff1o 
>Reply-To: Nahua language and culture discussion 
>To: NAHUAT-L at LISTS.UMN.EDU
>Subject: Re: Alonso de Zorita
>Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 20:55:15 -0500
>
>Hi Steffen:
>I'm fraid there is a mistke about the date 1941. I'm almost sure that that 
>edition doesn't exist. The first vertion of the "Los señores..." edited by 
>the University of Mexico was from 1942, on the colection Biblioteca del 
>Estudiante Universitario, number 32. On monday I'm going to the University 
>and will try to find the year of the first edition. I live in Mexico City 
>and work at the University so it wont be hard to find the first edition and 
>of couse, tha right date. Kind Regards Rita. Steffen Haurholm-Larsen 
> escribió:
>Hello everybody
>
>I have run into a problem with a quote from Zorita which is from a version
>of the Breve y sumaria Relación which I do not have access to:
>
>Zorita, Alonso de (1941). Los señores de la Nueva España. Colección
>Biblioteca del estudiante Universitario. No. 32. Imprenta Universitaria
>UNAM. México
>
>First of all I am not sure that the above title is even se same as the
>edition that I have, from 1942 entitled "Breve y sumaria relación de los
>señores de la nueva España".
>
>Second, if it is the same, could someone please give me the correlation of
>pages between the two?
>
>The quote given is for pp. 75, 143-144, 148, 152 in the 1941 edition. I 
>need
>the corresponding page numbers from the 1942 edition.
>
>Thanks a billion anyone who can help.
>
>Kind regards
>
>Steffen Haurholm-Larsen
>University of Copenhagen
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Find det, du søger på MSN Søg http://search.msn.dk
>
>
>---------------------------------
> Do You Yahoo!? La mejor conexión a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por 
>$100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx

_________________________________________________________________
Del din verden med MSN Spaces http://spaces.msn.com

		
---------------------------------
  Do You Yahoo!? La mejor conexión a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por $100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx 
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From igr at STANFORD.EDU  Sun Jul 24 12:53:06 2005
From: igr at STANFORD.EDU (Ian Robertson)
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2005 07:53:06 -0500
Subject: new Molina printing
Message-ID: <SUN.24.JUL.2005.075306.0500.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

If I remember correctly, the last time I heard some discussion of 
Molina's Vocabulario on Nahuat-l, it was described as out-of-print. 
Yesterday I was pleased to find recently printed (2004) copies of this 
dictionary for sale in the Madero bookstore in Mexico City. This 5th 
edition has a new, bright cover, and the numerous blurry pages that 
plague my old copy don't seem to have been reproduced. I couldn't get on 
Porrua's website this morning, but I assume that copies can be ordered 
there.

I was also shown a wonderful facsimile of the Vocabulario, part of a 
very small run recently printed in Spain. The price (1800 pesos) seemed 
pretty cheap given the quality and beauty of the work. I was able to 
escape without buying it, but it was a close call...

Best,

Ian Robertson

-- 
Ian G. Robertson
Assistant Professor
Department of Anthropological Sciences
Building 360, 450 Serra Mall
Stanford University
Stanford, CA 94305-2117

p:	650-724-4994 [2579988]
f:	650-725-9996
e:	igr at stanford.edu


From amoxtli at EARTHLINK.NET  Sun Jul 31 15:16:10 2005
From: amoxtli at EARTHLINK.NET (Walter Koenig)
Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 08:16:10 -0700
Subject: new Molina printing
In-Reply-To: <42E38F32.2080400@stanford.edu>
Message-ID: <SUN.31.JUL.2005.081610.0700.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

Ian,

Do you have anymore information on the Molina re-printing? How many  
were printed? I have tried repeatedly to get into Editoral Porrua's  
web-site even before your announcement, but all I get is their  
Cargando.... message.

Also do you have any more information about the facsimile of the  
Vocabulario? I am very interested in that as well.

Many thanks.

Best Wishes,

Walter O. Koenig


On Jul 24, 2005, at 5:53 AM, Ian Robertson wrote:

> If I remember correctly, the last time I heard some discussion of  
> Molina's Vocabulario on Nahuat-l, it was described as out-of-print.  
> Yesterday I was pleased to find recently printed (2004) copies of  
> this dictionary for sale in the Madero bookstore in Mexico City.  
> This 5th edition has a new, bright cover, and the numerous blurry  
> pages that plague my old copy don't seem to have been reproduced. I  
> couldn't get on Porrua's website this morning, but I assume that  
> copies can be ordered there.
>
> I was also shown a wonderful facsimile of the Vocabulario, part of  
> a very small run recently printed in Spain. The price (1800 pesos)  
> seemed pretty cheap given the quality and beauty of the work. I was  
> able to escape without buying it, but it was a close call...
>
> Best,
>
> Ian Robertson
>
> -- 
> Ian G. Robertson
> Assistant Professor
> Department of Anthropological Sciences
> Building 360, 450 Serra Mall
> Stanford University
> Stanford, CA 94305-2117
>
> p:    650-724-4994 [2579988]
> f:    650-725-9996
> e:    igr at stanford.edu
>

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From ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX  Sun Jul  3 01:55:15 2005
From: ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX (=?iso-8859-1?q?Rita=20Monta=FFfffff1o?=)
Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 20:55:15 -0500
Subject: Alonso de Zorita
In-Reply-To: <BAY18-F3330040B13F23828DE456FBE30@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <SAT.2.JUL.2005.205515.0500.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

Hi Steffen:
I'm fraid there is a mistke about the date 1941. I'm almost sure that that edition doesn't exist. The first vertion of the "Los se?ores..." edited by the University of Mexico was from 1942, on the colection Biblioteca del Estudiante Universitario, number 32. On monday I'm going to the University and will try to find the year of the first edition. I live in Mexico City and work at the University so it wont be hard to find the first edition and of couse, tha right date.  Kind Regards Rita. Steffen Haurholm-Larsen <teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM> escribi?:
Hello everybody

I have run into a problem with a quote from Zorita which is from a version 
of the Breve y sumaria Relaci?n which I do not have access to:

Zorita, Alonso de (1941). Los se?ores de la Nueva Espa?a. Colecci?n 
Biblioteca del estudiante Universitario. No. 32. Imprenta Universitaria 
UNAM. M?xico

First of all I am not sure that the above title is even se same as the 
edition that I have, from 1942 entitled "Breve y sumaria relaci?n de los 
se?ores de la nueva Espa?a".

Second, if it is the same, could someone please give me the correlation of 
pages between the two?

The quote given is for pp. 75, 143-144, 148, 152 in the 1941 edition. I need 
the corresponding page numbers from the 1942 edition.

Thanks a billion anyone who can help.

Kind regards

Steffen Haurholm-Larsen
University of Copenhagen

_________________________________________________________________
Find det, du s?ger p? MSN S?g http://search.msn.dk

		
---------------------------------
  Do You Yahoo!? La mejor conexi?n a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por $100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx 
-------------- next part --------------
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From teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM  Sun Jul  3 10:09:24 2005
From: teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM (Steffen Haurholm-Larsen)
Date: Sun, 3 Jul 2005 10:09:24 +0000
Subject: Alonso de Zorita
In-Reply-To: <20050703015516.56751.qmail@web60913.mail.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <SUN.3.JUL.2005.100924.0000.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

Hi Rita

I found this other reference in a list of references:

ZORITA, ALONSO DE
1941 Breve y sumaria relaci?n de los se?ores y maneras y diferencias que 
hab?a en
ellos en la Nueva Espa?a . . . In Nueva colecci?n de documentos para la 
historia de
M?xico ( Joaqu?n Garc?a Icazbalceta, ed.) 3: 65?205. Editorial Salvador 
Chavez
Hayhoe, Mexico City.

Could this be the one?
I am looking forward to hearing what you find in the UNAM.
Kind regards
Steffen

>From: Rita Monta?fffff1o <ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX>
>Reply-To: Nahua language and culture discussion <NAHUAT-L at LISTS.UMN.EDU>
>To: NAHUAT-L at LISTS.UMN.EDU
>Subject: Re: Alonso de Zorita
>Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 20:55:15 -0500
>
>Hi Steffen:
>I'm fraid there is a mistke about the date 1941. I'm almost sure that that 
>edition doesn't exist. The first vertion of the "Los se?ores..." edited by 
>the University of Mexico was from 1942, on the colection Biblioteca del 
>Estudiante Universitario, number 32. On monday I'm going to the University 
>and will try to find the year of the first edition. I live in Mexico City 
>and work at the University so it wont be hard to find the first edition and 
>of couse, tha right date.  Kind Regards Rita. Steffen Haurholm-Larsen 
><teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM> escribi?:
>Hello everybody
>
>I have run into a problem with a quote from Zorita which is from a version
>of the Breve y sumaria Relaci?n which I do not have access to:
>
>Zorita, Alonso de (1941). Los se?ores de la Nueva Espa?a. Colecci?n
>Biblioteca del estudiante Universitario. No. 32. Imprenta Universitaria
>UNAM. M?xico
>
>First of all I am not sure that the above title is even se same as the
>edition that I have, from 1942 entitled "Breve y sumaria relaci?n de los
>se?ores de la nueva Espa?a".
>
>Second, if it is the same, could someone please give me the correlation of
>pages between the two?
>
>The quote given is for pp. 75, 143-144, 148, 152 in the 1941 edition. I 
>need
>the corresponding page numbers from the 1942 edition.
>
>Thanks a billion anyone who can help.
>
>Kind regards
>
>Steffen Haurholm-Larsen
>University of Copenhagen
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Find det, du s?ger p? MSN S?g http://search.msn.dk
>
>
>---------------------------------
>   Do You Yahoo!? La mejor conexi?n a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por 
>$100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx

_________________________________________________________________
Del din verden med MSN Spaces  http://spaces.msn.com


From ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX  Tue Jul  5 23:56:26 2005
From: ritamontano2002 at YAHOO.COM.MX (=?iso-8859-1?q?Rita=20Monta=FFfffff1o?=)
Date: Tue, 5 Jul 2005 18:56:26 -0500
Subject: Alonso de Zorita
In-Reply-To: <BAY18-F36AC98A0FC8999A55DFEDFBE40@phx.gbl>
Message-ID: <TUE.5.JUL.2005.185626.0500.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

Hi Steffen:
I'll try to find the book of the second reference and check the pages you need. A friend who works at the library of the Instituto de Investigaciones Hist?ricas is looking if  there is a edition of 1941. Tomorrow (wensday) perhaps I can give you some news about both texts. Rita. 
 
 
 
Steffen Haurholm-Larsen <teddy_30 at HOTMAIL.COM> escribi?:
Hi Rita

I found this other reference in a list of references:

ZORITA, ALONSO DE
1941 Breve y sumaria relaci?n de los se?ores y maneras y diferencias que 
hab?a en
ellos en la Nueva Espa?a . . . In Nueva colecci?n de documentos para la 
historia de
M?xico ( Joaqu?n Garc?a Icazbalceta, ed.) 3: 65?205. Editorial Salvador 
Chavez
Hayhoe, Mexico City.

Could this be the one?
I am looking forward to hearing what you find in the UNAM.
Kind regards
Steffen

>From: Rita Monta?fffff1o 
>Reply-To: Nahua language and culture discussion 
>To: NAHUAT-L at LISTS.UMN.EDU
>Subject: Re: Alonso de Zorita
>Date: Sat, 2 Jul 2005 20:55:15 -0500
>
>Hi Steffen:
>I'm fraid there is a mistke about the date 1941. I'm almost sure that that 
>edition doesn't exist. The first vertion of the "Los se?ores..." edited by 
>the University of Mexico was from 1942, on the colection Biblioteca del 
>Estudiante Universitario, number 32. On monday I'm going to the University 
>and will try to find the year of the first edition. I live in Mexico City 
>and work at the University so it wont be hard to find the first edition and 
>of couse, tha right date. Kind Regards Rita. Steffen Haurholm-Larsen 
> escribi?:
>Hello everybody
>
>I have run into a problem with a quote from Zorita which is from a version
>of the Breve y sumaria Relaci?n which I do not have access to:
>
>Zorita, Alonso de (1941). Los se?ores de la Nueva Espa?a. Colecci?n
>Biblioteca del estudiante Universitario. No. 32. Imprenta Universitaria
>UNAM. M?xico
>
>First of all I am not sure that the above title is even se same as the
>edition that I have, from 1942 entitled "Breve y sumaria relaci?n de los
>se?ores de la nueva Espa?a".
>
>Second, if it is the same, could someone please give me the correlation of
>pages between the two?
>
>The quote given is for pp. 75, 143-144, 148, 152 in the 1941 edition. I 
>need
>the corresponding page numbers from the 1942 edition.
>
>Thanks a billion anyone who can help.
>
>Kind regards
>
>Steffen Haurholm-Larsen
>University of Copenhagen
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Find det, du s?ger p? MSN S?g http://search.msn.dk
>
>
>---------------------------------
> Do You Yahoo!? La mejor conexi?n a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por 
>$100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx

_________________________________________________________________
Del din verden med MSN Spaces http://spaces.msn.com

		
---------------------------------
  Do You Yahoo!? La mejor conexi?n a Internet y 2GB extra a tu correo por $100 al mes. http://net.yahoo.com.mx 
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From igr at STANFORD.EDU  Sun Jul 24 12:53:06 2005
From: igr at STANFORD.EDU (Ian Robertson)
Date: Sun, 24 Jul 2005 07:53:06 -0500
Subject: new Molina printing
Message-ID: <SUN.24.JUL.2005.075306.0500.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

If I remember correctly, the last time I heard some discussion of 
Molina's Vocabulario on Nahuat-l, it was described as out-of-print. 
Yesterday I was pleased to find recently printed (2004) copies of this 
dictionary for sale in the Madero bookstore in Mexico City. This 5th 
edition has a new, bright cover, and the numerous blurry pages that 
plague my old copy don't seem to have been reproduced. I couldn't get on 
Porrua's website this morning, but I assume that copies can be ordered 
there.

I was also shown a wonderful facsimile of the Vocabulario, part of a 
very small run recently printed in Spain. The price (1800 pesos) seemed 
pretty cheap given the quality and beauty of the work. I was able to 
escape without buying it, but it was a close call...

Best,

Ian Robertson

-- 
Ian G. Robertson
Assistant Professor
Department of Anthropological Sciences
Building 360, 450 Serra Mall
Stanford University
Stanford, CA 94305-2117

p:	650-724-4994 [2579988]
f:	650-725-9996
e:	igr at stanford.edu


From amoxtli at EARTHLINK.NET  Sun Jul 31 15:16:10 2005
From: amoxtli at EARTHLINK.NET (Walter Koenig)
Date: Sun, 31 Jul 2005 08:16:10 -0700
Subject: new Molina printing
In-Reply-To: <42E38F32.2080400@stanford.edu>
Message-ID: <SUN.31.JUL.2005.081610.0700.NAHUATL@LISTS.UMN.EDU>

Ian,

Do you have anymore information on the Molina re-printing? How many  
were printed? I have tried repeatedly to get into Editoral Porrua's  
web-site even before your announcement, but all I get is their  
Cargando.... message.

Also do you have any more information about the facsimile of the  
Vocabulario? I am very interested in that as well.

Many thanks.

Best Wishes,

Walter O. Koenig


On Jul 24, 2005, at 5:53 AM, Ian Robertson wrote:

> If I remember correctly, the last time I heard some discussion of  
> Molina's Vocabulario on Nahuat-l, it was described as out-of-print.  
> Yesterday I was pleased to find recently printed (2004) copies of  
> this dictionary for sale in the Madero bookstore in Mexico City.  
> This 5th edition has a new, bright cover, and the numerous blurry  
> pages that plague my old copy don't seem to have been reproduced. I  
> couldn't get on Porrua's website this morning, but I assume that  
> copies can be ordered there.
>
> I was also shown a wonderful facsimile of the Vocabulario, part of  
> a very small run recently printed in Spain. The price (1800 pesos)  
> seemed pretty cheap given the quality and beauty of the work. I was  
> able to escape without buying it, but it was a close call...
>
> Best,
>
> Ian Robertson
>
> -- 
> Ian G. Robertson
> Assistant Professor
> Department of Anthropological Sciences
> Building 360, 450 Serra Mall
> Stanford University
> Stanford, CA 94305-2117
>
> p:    650-724-4994 [2579988]
> f:    650-725-9996
> e:    igr at stanford.edu
>

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