From hallen at gmail.com Wed May 2 13:09:13 2012 From: hallen at gmail.com (Heather Allen) Date: Wed, 2 May 2012 08:09:13 -0500 Subject: Narrating past events in Nahuatl / narrar eventos del pasado en nahuatl Message-ID: Piyali listeros, Lockhart, Klor de Alva, and John Sullivan mention that Nahuatl speakers tend to narrate past events in the present tense. Can anyone recommend some further reading on the subject? I'm curious because I noticed Fernando de Alva Ixtlilxochitl in the Historia de la nacion chichimeca tends to do the same when he recounts conversations between Nahuatl speakers, but then he switches to the past tense when narrating conversations among Spaniards, or between Spaniards and natives. ........ Lockhart, Klor de Alva, y John Sullivan dicen que los nahua hablantes cuentan eventos del pasado utilizando el tiempo presente. ¿Alquien me puede recomendar unas lecturas sobre el tema? Pregunto porque al leer la Historia de la nación chichimeca por Fernando de Alva Ixtlilxochit, noté que éste hace lo mismo cuando narra conversaciones entre nahua hablantes, pero utiliza el tiempo pasado al narrar conversaciones entre españoles, o entre españoles y nahua hablantes. Miac tlaxcamati, Heather -- Heather Allen, PhD Visiting Assistant Professor Department of Spanish & Portuguese University of Texas at Austin hallen at austin.utexas.edu _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From smielke at famsi.org Wed May 16 14:06:44 2012 From: smielke at famsi.org (Sandy Mielke) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 10:06:44 -0400 Subject: The List back online! Message-ID: Listeros, My sincerest apologies for the mailing list problems. We had numerous spam attacks that caused our list to be black-listed. We have since been removed from the blacklists and we can continue as usual. Thank you for your patience and understanding. Sorry for the inconvenience, Sandy Sandy Mielke Website Administrator/Programmer www.famsi.org _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From idiez at me.com Thu May 17 18:17:27 2012 From: idiez at me.com (IDIEZ) Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 13:17:27 -0500 Subject: icpatl Message-ID: Piyali notequixpoyohuan, Supposedly there are two icpatl morphemes. I:cpatl, with the long "i" is "cord or thread" and the other is the root of the relational word "-icpac". I haven't seen the root used in other words in Classical sources, but in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl, we have, "icpohuia, nic." "to carry s.t. on top of one's head". (Also seen as "tlacpohuia"; it would be attractive to think that there is only one morpheme, cord/thread, since woman actually carry the load on a doughnut shaped support made by winding up cloth. However, the fact that the "i" of "icpatl" elides in "tlacpohuia" means the root can't be "i:cpatl", "cord".) This is obviously from "icpa(tl)" and the "-huia" applicative verb-forming morpheme. The "a" of "icpa-" becomes "o" before the "hu-" of "-huia". Anyway, this gives us "icpohuia", "to use the top of one's head with respect to the object of the verb." Has anyone seen this "icpatl" morpheme used in any words besides "icpohuia", "icpac" and their derivatives? John John Sullivan, Ph.D. Professor of Nahua Language and Culture Zacatecas Institute for Teaching and Research in Ethnology Universidad Autónoma de Zacatecas +52 (492) 925-3425 (office) +52 1 (492) 103-0195 (mobile) idiez at me.com www.macehualli.org _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From campbel at indiana.edu Sun May 20 15:08:37 2012 From: campbel at indiana.edu (Campbell, R. Joe) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 11:08:37 -0400 Subject: icpatl In-Reply-To: <6E5AECA4-A68F-49E3-8082-2956E78E2B56@me.com> Message-ID: John, Are there other examples of /a/ becoming [o] before /w/? The older stage of the language has variability of a/e, but I haven't found any case of a/o. ...not doubting, just asking. Joe Quoting IDIEZ : > Piyali notequixpoyohuan, > Supposedly there are two icpatl morphemes. I:cpatl, with the long > "i" is "cord or thread" and the other is the root of the relational > word "-icpac". I haven't seen the root used in other words in > Classical sources, but in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl, we have, > "icpohuia, nic." "to carry s.t. on top of one's head". (Also seen as > "tlacpohuia"; it would be attractive to think that there is only one > morpheme, cord/thread, since woman actually carry the load on a > doughnut shaped support made by winding up cloth. However, the fact > that the "i" of "icpatl" elides in "tlacpohuia" means the root can't > be "i:cpatl", "cord".) This is obviously from "icpa(tl)" and the > "-huia" applicative verb-forming morpheme. The "a" of "icpa-" becomes > "o" before the "hu-" of "-huia". Anyway, this gives us "icpohuia", > "to use the top of one's head with respect to the object of the > verb." Has anyone seen this "icpatl" morpheme used in any words > besides "icpohuia", "icpac" and their derivatives? > John > > John Sullivan, Ph.D. > Professor of Nahua Language and Culture > Zacatecas Institute for Teaching and Research in Ethnology > Universidad Autónoma de Zacatecas > +52 (492) 925-3425 (office) > +52 1 (492) 103-0195 (mobile) > idiez at me.com > www.macehualli.org > > _______________________________________________ > Nahuatl mailing list > Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org > http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl > _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From campbel at indiana.edu Sun May 20 17:47:39 2012 From: campbel at indiana.edu (Campbell, R. Joe) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 13:47:39 -0400 Subject: coaxahuacayo Message-ID: Nocnihuan, "coaxahuacayo" is a regularization of "cooaxaoacaio", which occurs on p. 186 in Book 10 of the Dibble and Anderson's English edition. I thought that it might be a misprint for "cooaxaiacaio", so I checked the facsimile. Almost disappointed, I found that the transcription was correct. But accepting "coaxahuacayo" would have the problem of not fitting with the occurrence of "coaxayacayo" (Book 8, p. 23; Book 12, p.6). So I went back to the facsimile and looked more closely at the matching Nahuatl text in the left column -- and it had **coaxayacayo**! So I started out looking for a TYPO and found a SCRIBO!! ...and everyone who has been worrying about "coaxahuacayo" can put their minds at ease... Joe _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From idiez at me.com Sun May 20 23:58:39 2012 From: idiez at me.com (IDIEZ) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 18:58:39 -0500 Subject: icpatl In-Reply-To: <20120520110837.dhu65b1qo8s4w0g4@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: Joe, Off the top of my head, in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl we have: 1. to go: niyauh, tiyauh, yohui, etc. 2. ayohuitl/ayauhtli, “neblina“ 3. yohualli/yahualli, “noche“ And on another parallel subject, I have come to think that the roots for “noche/dark“ and “round“ are one (yohualli, yahualli). John On May 20, 2012, at 10:08 AM, Campbell, R. Joe wrote: > John, > > Are there other examples of /a/ becoming [o] before /w/? The older > stage of the language has variability of a/e, but I haven't found any > case of a/o. > ...not doubting, just asking. > > Joe > > Quoting IDIEZ : > >> Piyali notequixpoyohuan, >> Supposedly there are two icpatl morphemes. I:cpatl, with the long >> "i" is "cord or thread" and the other is the root of the relational >> word "-icpac". I haven't seen the root used in other words in >> Classical sources, but in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl, we have, >> "icpohuia, nic." "to carry s.t. on top of one's head". (Also seen as >> "tlacpohuia"; it would be attractive to think that there is only one >> morpheme, cord/thread, since woman actually carry the load on a >> doughnut shaped support made by winding up cloth. However, the fact >> that the "i" of "icpatl" elides in "tlacpohuia" means the root can't >> be "i:cpatl", "cord".) This is obviously from "icpa(tl)" and the >> "-huia" applicative verb-forming morpheme. The "a" of "icpa-" becomes >> "o" before the "hu-" of "-huia". Anyway, this gives us "icpohuia", >> "to use the top of one's head with respect to the object of the >> verb." Has anyone seen this "icpatl" morpheme used in any words >> besides "icpohuia", "icpac" and their derivatives? >> John >> >> John Sullivan, Ph.D. >> Professor of Nahua Language and Culture >> Zacatecas Institute for Teaching and Research in Ethnology >> Universidad Autónoma de Zacatecas >> +52 (492) 925-3425 (office) >> +52 1 (492) 103-0195 (mobile) >> idiez at me.com >> www.macehualli.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Nahuatl mailing list >> Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org >> http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl >> > > > _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From bleeming at gmail.com Mon May 21 01:44:35 2012 From: bleeming at gmail.com (Ben Leeming) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 21:44:35 -0400 Subject: mystery "n" Message-ID: Piyali listeros, In Sell & Burkhart's *Nahuatl Theater* Vol. 1 there is play titled "The Three Kings" the author of which had the habit of adding a mysterious "n" to the end of certain words. Here are a few examples: *tlacatlen*, "O personage" *tlatohuanien*, "O ruler" *teuctlen*, "O lord" *nocniuhtzinen*, "O my friend" I understand that the final "e" is the vocative, but does anyone have any idea what's going on here with the "n" tacked on to it? My guess is that it's some regional/dialectical thing. Are there modern Nahuatl speakers that do this today? Ben -- Ben Leeming PhD Student Department of Anthropology University at Albany, SUNY _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From magnuspharao at gmail.com Sun May 20 18:19:07 2012 From: magnuspharao at gmail.com (Magnus Pharao Hansen) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 14:19:07 -0400 Subject: Nahuatl Digest, Vol 261, Issue 3 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: In Hueyapan all short a's become o before w - that's mentioned in the written version of the paper I gave at Yale. Thats how I can see that the final h's actually come frome a previous w and only turned into h after the a>o change. also don't for get the word icpalli "seat" which I think is more related to the -cpa(c) "on-top-of-ness" relational noun than i:cpatl. best, Magnus On 20 May 2012 13:00, wrote: > Send Nahuatl mailing list submissions to > nahuatl at lists.famsi.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > nahuatl-request at lists.famsi.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > nahuatl-owner at lists.famsi.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Nahuatl digest..." > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: icpatl (Campbell, R. Joe) > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: "Campbell, R. Joe" > To: IDIEZ > Cc: nahuatl at lists.famsi.org > Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 11:08:37 -0400 > Subject: Re: [Nahuat-l] icpatl > John, > > Are there other examples of /a/ becoming [o] before /w/? The older stage > of the language has variability of a/e, but I haven't found any case of > a/o. > ...not doubting, just asking. > > Joe > > Quoting IDIEZ : > > Piyali notequixpoyohuan, >> Supposedly there are two icpatl morphemes. I:cpatl, with the long >> "i" is "cord or thread" and the other is the root of the relational >> word "-icpac". I haven't seen the root used in other words in >> Classical sources, but in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl, we have, >> "icpohuia, nic." "to carry s.t. on top of one's head". (Also seen as >> "tlacpohuia"; it would be attractive to think that there is only one >> morpheme, cord/thread, since woman actually carry the load on a >> doughnut shaped support made by winding up cloth. However, the fact >> that the "i" of "icpatl" elides in "tlacpohuia" means the root can't >> be "i:cpatl", "cord".) This is obviously from "icpa(tl)" and the >> "-huia" applicative verb-forming morpheme. The "a" of "icpa-" becomes >> "o" before the "hu-" of "-huia". Anyway, this gives us "icpohuia", >> "to use the top of one's head with respect to the object of the >> verb." Has anyone seen this "icpatl" morpheme used in any words >> besides "icpohuia", "icpac" and their derivatives? >> John >> >> John Sullivan, Ph.D. >> Professor of Nahua Language and Culture >> Zacatecas Institute for Teaching and Research in Ethnology >> Universidad Autónoma de Zacatecas >> +52 (492) 925-3425 (office) >> +52 1 (492) 103-0195 (mobile) >> idiez at me.com >> www.macehualli.org >> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> Nahuatl mailing list >> Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org >> http://www.famsi.org/mailman/**listinfo/nahuatl >> >> > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Nahuatl mailing list > Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org > http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl > > -- Magnus Pharao Hansen PhD. student Department of Anthropology Brown University 128 Hope St. Providence, RI 02906 *magnus_pharao_hansen at brown.edu* US: 001 401 651 8413 _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From tekuani at hotmail.es Mon May 28 01:51:57 2012 From: tekuani at hotmail.es (Jacinto Acatecatl) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 20:51:57 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl Digest, Vol 261, Issue 3 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ikpak : arriba de, encima de Xiktlale ikpak inon : pongalo sobre eso. _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From hallen at gmail.com Wed May 2 13:09:13 2012 From: hallen at gmail.com (Heather Allen) Date: Wed, 2 May 2012 08:09:13 -0500 Subject: Narrating past events in Nahuatl / narrar eventos del pasado en nahuatl Message-ID: Piyali listeros, Lockhart, Klor de Alva, and John Sullivan mention that Nahuatl speakers tend to narrate past events in the present tense. Can anyone recommend some further reading on the subject? I'm curious because I noticed Fernando de Alva Ixtlilxochitl in the Historia de la nacion chichimeca tends to do the same when he recounts conversations between Nahuatl speakers, but then he switches to the past tense when narrating conversations among Spaniards, or between Spaniards and natives. ........ Lockhart, Klor de Alva, y John Sullivan dicen que los nahua hablantes cuentan eventos del pasado utilizando el tiempo presente. ?Alquien me puede recomendar unas lecturas sobre el tema? Pregunto porque al leer la Historia de la naci?n chichimeca por Fernando de Alva Ixtlilxochit, not? que ?ste hace lo mismo cuando narra conversaciones entre nahua hablantes, pero utiliza el tiempo pasado al narrar conversaciones entre espa?oles, o entre espa?oles y nahua hablantes. Miac tlaxcamati, Heather -- Heather Allen, PhD Visiting Assistant Professor Department of Spanish & Portuguese University of Texas at Austin hallen at austin.utexas.edu _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From smielke at famsi.org Wed May 16 14:06:44 2012 From: smielke at famsi.org (Sandy Mielke) Date: Wed, 16 May 2012 10:06:44 -0400 Subject: The List back online! Message-ID: Listeros, My sincerest apologies for the mailing list problems. We had numerous spam attacks that caused our list to be black-listed. We have since been removed from the blacklists and we can continue as usual. Thank you for your patience and understanding. Sorry for the inconvenience, Sandy Sandy Mielke Website Administrator/Programmer www.famsi.org _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From idiez at me.com Thu May 17 18:17:27 2012 From: idiez at me.com (IDIEZ) Date: Thu, 17 May 2012 13:17:27 -0500 Subject: icpatl Message-ID: Piyali notequixpoyohuan, Supposedly there are two icpatl morphemes. I:cpatl, with the long "i" is "cord or thread" and the other is the root of the relational word "-icpac". I haven't seen the root used in other words in Classical sources, but in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl, we have, "icpohuia, nic." "to carry s.t. on top of one's head". (Also seen as "tlacpohuia"; it would be attractive to think that there is only one morpheme, cord/thread, since woman actually carry the load on a doughnut shaped support made by winding up cloth. However, the fact that the "i" of "icpatl" elides in "tlacpohuia" means the root can't be "i:cpatl", "cord".) This is obviously from "icpa(tl)" and the "-huia" applicative verb-forming morpheme. The "a" of "icpa-" becomes "o" before the "hu-" of "-huia". Anyway, this gives us "icpohuia", "to use the top of one's head with respect to the object of the verb." Has anyone seen this "icpatl" morpheme used in any words besides "icpohuia", "icpac" and their derivatives? John John Sullivan, Ph.D. Professor of Nahua Language and Culture Zacatecas Institute for Teaching and Research in Ethnology Universidad Aut?noma de Zacatecas +52 (492) 925-3425 (office) +52 1 (492) 103-0195 (mobile) idiez at me.com www.macehualli.org _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From campbel at indiana.edu Sun May 20 15:08:37 2012 From: campbel at indiana.edu (Campbell, R. Joe) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 11:08:37 -0400 Subject: icpatl In-Reply-To: <6E5AECA4-A68F-49E3-8082-2956E78E2B56@me.com> Message-ID: John, Are there other examples of /a/ becoming [o] before /w/? The older stage of the language has variability of a/e, but I haven't found any case of a/o. ...not doubting, just asking. Joe Quoting IDIEZ : > Piyali notequixpoyohuan, > Supposedly there are two icpatl morphemes. I:cpatl, with the long > "i" is "cord or thread" and the other is the root of the relational > word "-icpac". I haven't seen the root used in other words in > Classical sources, but in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl, we have, > "icpohuia, nic." "to carry s.t. on top of one's head". (Also seen as > "tlacpohuia"; it would be attractive to think that there is only one > morpheme, cord/thread, since woman actually carry the load on a > doughnut shaped support made by winding up cloth. However, the fact > that the "i" of "icpatl" elides in "tlacpohuia" means the root can't > be "i:cpatl", "cord".) This is obviously from "icpa(tl)" and the > "-huia" applicative verb-forming morpheme. The "a" of "icpa-" becomes > "o" before the "hu-" of "-huia". Anyway, this gives us "icpohuia", > "to use the top of one's head with respect to the object of the > verb." Has anyone seen this "icpatl" morpheme used in any words > besides "icpohuia", "icpac" and their derivatives? > John > > John Sullivan, Ph.D. > Professor of Nahua Language and Culture > Zacatecas Institute for Teaching and Research in Ethnology > Universidad Aut?noma de Zacatecas > +52 (492) 925-3425 (office) > +52 1 (492) 103-0195 (mobile) > idiez at me.com > www.macehualli.org > > _______________________________________________ > Nahuatl mailing list > Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org > http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl > _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From campbel at indiana.edu Sun May 20 17:47:39 2012 From: campbel at indiana.edu (Campbell, R. Joe) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 13:47:39 -0400 Subject: coaxahuacayo Message-ID: Nocnihuan, "coaxahuacayo" is a regularization of "cooaxaoacaio", which occurs on p. 186 in Book 10 of the Dibble and Anderson's English edition. I thought that it might be a misprint for "cooaxaiacaio", so I checked the facsimile. Almost disappointed, I found that the transcription was correct. But accepting "coaxahuacayo" would have the problem of not fitting with the occurrence of "coaxayacayo" (Book 8, p. 23; Book 12, p.6). So I went back to the facsimile and looked more closely at the matching Nahuatl text in the left column -- and it had **coaxayacayo**! So I started out looking for a TYPO and found a SCRIBO!! ...and everyone who has been worrying about "coaxahuacayo" can put their minds at ease... Joe _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From idiez at me.com Sun May 20 23:58:39 2012 From: idiez at me.com (IDIEZ) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 18:58:39 -0500 Subject: icpatl In-Reply-To: <20120520110837.dhu65b1qo8s4w0g4@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: Joe, Off the top of my head, in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl we have: 1. to go: niyauh, tiyauh, yohui, etc. 2. ayohuitl/ayauhtli, ?neblina? 3. yohualli/yahualli, ?noche? And on another parallel subject, I have come to think that the roots for ?noche/dark? and ?round? are one (yohualli, yahualli). John On May 20, 2012, at 10:08 AM, Campbell, R. Joe wrote: > John, > > Are there other examples of /a/ becoming [o] before /w/? The older > stage of the language has variability of a/e, but I haven't found any > case of a/o. > ...not doubting, just asking. > > Joe > > Quoting IDIEZ : > >> Piyali notequixpoyohuan, >> Supposedly there are two icpatl morphemes. I:cpatl, with the long >> "i" is "cord or thread" and the other is the root of the relational >> word "-icpac". I haven't seen the root used in other words in >> Classical sources, but in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl, we have, >> "icpohuia, nic." "to carry s.t. on top of one's head". (Also seen as >> "tlacpohuia"; it would be attractive to think that there is only one >> morpheme, cord/thread, since woman actually carry the load on a >> doughnut shaped support made by winding up cloth. However, the fact >> that the "i" of "icpatl" elides in "tlacpohuia" means the root can't >> be "i:cpatl", "cord".) This is obviously from "icpa(tl)" and the >> "-huia" applicative verb-forming morpheme. The "a" of "icpa-" becomes >> "o" before the "hu-" of "-huia". Anyway, this gives us "icpohuia", >> "to use the top of one's head with respect to the object of the >> verb." Has anyone seen this "icpatl" morpheme used in any words >> besides "icpohuia", "icpac" and their derivatives? >> John >> >> John Sullivan, Ph.D. >> Professor of Nahua Language and Culture >> Zacatecas Institute for Teaching and Research in Ethnology >> Universidad Aut?noma de Zacatecas >> +52 (492) 925-3425 (office) >> +52 1 (492) 103-0195 (mobile) >> idiez at me.com >> www.macehualli.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Nahuatl mailing list >> Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org >> http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl >> > > > _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From bleeming at gmail.com Mon May 21 01:44:35 2012 From: bleeming at gmail.com (Ben Leeming) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 21:44:35 -0400 Subject: mystery "n" Message-ID: Piyali listeros, In Sell & Burkhart's *Nahuatl Theater* Vol. 1 there is play titled "The Three Kings" the author of which had the habit of adding a mysterious "n" to the end of certain words. Here are a few examples: *tlacatlen*, "O personage" *tlatohuanien*, "O ruler" *teuctlen*, "O lord" *nocniuhtzinen*, "O my friend" I understand that the final "e" is the vocative, but does anyone have any idea what's going on here with the "n" tacked on to it? My guess is that it's some regional/dialectical thing. Are there modern Nahuatl speakers that do this today? Ben -- Ben Leeming PhD Student Department of Anthropology University at Albany, SUNY _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From magnuspharao at gmail.com Sun May 20 18:19:07 2012 From: magnuspharao at gmail.com (Magnus Pharao Hansen) Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 14:19:07 -0400 Subject: Nahuatl Digest, Vol 261, Issue 3 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: In Hueyapan all short a's become o before w - that's mentioned in the written version of the paper I gave at Yale. Thats how I can see that the final h's actually come frome a previous w and only turned into h after the a>o change. also don't for get the word icpalli "seat" which I think is more related to the -cpa(c) "on-top-of-ness" relational noun than i:cpatl. best, Magnus On 20 May 2012 13:00, wrote: > Send Nahuatl mailing list submissions to > nahuatl at lists.famsi.org > > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit > http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to > nahuatl-request at lists.famsi.org > > You can reach the person managing the list at > nahuatl-owner at lists.famsi.org > > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific > than "Re: Contents of Nahuatl digest..." > > Today's Topics: > > 1. Re: icpatl (Campbell, R. Joe) > > > ---------- Forwarded message ---------- > From: "Campbell, R. Joe" > To: IDIEZ > Cc: nahuatl at lists.famsi.org > Date: Sun, 20 May 2012 11:08:37 -0400 > Subject: Re: [Nahuat-l] icpatl > John, > > Are there other examples of /a/ becoming [o] before /w/? The older stage > of the language has variability of a/e, but I haven't found any case of > a/o. > ...not doubting, just asking. > > Joe > > Quoting IDIEZ : > > Piyali notequixpoyohuan, >> Supposedly there are two icpatl morphemes. I:cpatl, with the long >> "i" is "cord or thread" and the other is the root of the relational >> word "-icpac". I haven't seen the root used in other words in >> Classical sources, but in Modern Huastecan Nahuatl, we have, >> "icpohuia, nic." "to carry s.t. on top of one's head". (Also seen as >> "tlacpohuia"; it would be attractive to think that there is only one >> morpheme, cord/thread, since woman actually carry the load on a >> doughnut shaped support made by winding up cloth. However, the fact >> that the "i" of "icpatl" elides in "tlacpohuia" means the root can't >> be "i:cpatl", "cord".) This is obviously from "icpa(tl)" and the >> "-huia" applicative verb-forming morpheme. The "a" of "icpa-" becomes >> "o" before the "hu-" of "-huia". Anyway, this gives us "icpohuia", >> "to use the top of one's head with respect to the object of the >> verb." Has anyone seen this "icpatl" morpheme used in any words >> besides "icpohuia", "icpac" and their derivatives? >> John >> >> John Sullivan, Ph.D. >> Professor of Nahua Language and Culture >> Zacatecas Institute for Teaching and Research in Ethnology >> Universidad Aut?noma de Zacatecas >> +52 (492) 925-3425 (office) >> +52 1 (492) 103-0195 (mobile) >> idiez at me.com >> www.macehualli.org >> >> ______________________________**_________________ >> Nahuatl mailing list >> Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org >> http://www.famsi.org/mailman/**listinfo/nahuatl >> >> > > > > > _______________________________________________ > Nahuatl mailing list > Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org > http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl > > -- Magnus Pharao Hansen PhD. student Department of Anthropology Brown University 128 Hope St. Providence, RI 02906 *magnus_pharao_hansen at brown.edu* US: 001 401 651 8413 _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl From tekuani at hotmail.es Mon May 28 01:51:57 2012 From: tekuani at hotmail.es (Jacinto Acatecatl) Date: Sun, 27 May 2012 20:51:57 -0500 Subject: Nahuatl Digest, Vol 261, Issue 3 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: ikpak : arriba de, encima de Xiktlale ikpak inon : pongalo sobre eso. _______________________________________________ Nahuatl mailing list Nahuatl at lists.famsi.org http://www.famsi.org/mailman/listinfo/nahuatl