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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=ES-MX link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>[My last post slipped out of my hands with a few errata. They are corrected here.]<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>**********************************************************<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Dear Ian:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>The page looks good. I think the word <i>tlachinolli</i> can be translated more precisely than “a burned thing”. The latter phrase is found a lot in Mesoamericanist literature. It looks like it was taken from Alonso de Molina’s (1571) gloss “Tlachinolli. cosa quemada assi, o chamuscada.” The word “assi” is important because Molina is referring to the previous entry, “Tlachinoliztli. el acto de quemar los campos;” before that is “Tlachinoa. ni. quemar los campos o montes. Pr. onitlachino.” Molina also registers the verb without fusing the object prefix tla- to the root: “chinoa. nitla. quemar los campos. preteri. onitlachino.”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><i><span style='color:black'>Tlachinolli</span></i><span style='color:black'>, then, is a noun derived from the verb <i>chinoa</i>, “to burn the cultivated field or bush,” meaning “burnt field,” or “burnt bush” (“bush” is used here to mean uncultivated land with mixed vegetation, which seems to be what Molina means here by “montes”; an alternative translation would be “hills” or “mountains”). It works like this:<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='color:black'>verb: <i>chinoa:</i>, “to burn the field/bush/hill;”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='color:black'>passive form: <i>tlachinolo:</i> (<i>tla</i> + (<i>chinoa:</i> - <i>a:</i>) + <i>lo:</i>), “some field/bush/hill is burned;”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText style='margin-left:36.0pt;text-indent:-18.0pt;mso-list:l0 level1 lfo2'><![if !supportLists]><span style='color:black'><span style='mso-list:Ignore'>-<span style='font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"'> </span></span></span><![endif]><span style='color:black'>deverbal noun derived from the passive form: tlachinolli (<i>tla</i> + (<i>chinoa:</i> - <i>a:</i>) + (<i>lo:</i> - <i>o:</i>) + <i>li</i>, “some burnt field/bush/hill.”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>(I restored the long vowels in the latter analysis, using colons, for the sake of precision.)<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>The pictorial signs associated with the Nahuatl doublet <i>atl tlachinolli</i>, found on pre-Hispanic sculptures like the <i>Teocalli de la Guerra Sagrada</i> and the <i>Huehuetl de Malinalco</i>, as well as several pictorial manuscripts from the early colonial period, communicate the idea of a conflagration in cultivated fields. Present in most of these sign clusters, in combination with igneous signs (usually a butterfly-like flame and bands of red-orange fire, is the combination of curved elements like the letter ‘c’ with rows of dots, on a grey background, found in other signs that express the idea of cultivated fields). An example of the latter is the Xochimilco toponymic sign on the <i>Piedra de Tízoc</i> and the <i>Piedra del ex Arzobispado</i>, and its counterpart in the <i>Codex Mendoza</i>, in all of which a rectangle with these elements appears under flower signs ((<i>xochitl - tl</i>) <i>+ </i>(<i>milli</i> - <i>li</i>) + co, “in the cultivated fields of flowers”). So I think we can discard “bush” and “hill” and assume the Nahuas were thinking “cultivated field (or fields).”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Sahagún explains the metaphorical meaning of the doublet (<i>difrasismo</i>) <i>atl tlachinolli</i> in book 6, chapter 43 of the <i>Florentine Codex</i>. The Nahuatl texts reads: “Teuatl, tlachinolli. Inin tla / tolli, itechpa mitoaia: in uei iao / oiotl muchioaia, anoço uei coco / liztli: mitoaia. Otopan muchiuh, / anoço otopan onquiz: iniuhqui / teuatl, tlachinolli: quitoznequi: / cocoliztli, anoço uel iehoatl in / iaoiotl.” This can be translated literally as: “The divine water, the burnt fields. With this saying it was said: the great war was done, or the great sickness. It was said: over us was done, or over us flowed, something like the divine water, the burnt fields. It means: the sickness or this war.” Sahagún’s Spanish translation, less literal than mine, is close in meaning: “Quiere dezir esta letra. El mar / o la chamusquina vino sobre noso / tros o paso sobre nosotros. Por meta / phora se dize: de la pestilencia o / guerra que quando se acaba dizen / otonpanquiz inteuatl in tlachinolli. / Paso sobre nosotros la mar y el fuego.”<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>I hope this helps clarify the meaning of <i>atl tlachinolli</i>.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Saludos desde Guanajuato,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>David<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span lang=ES style='color:black'>-----Mensaje original-----<br>De: nahuatl-bounces@lists.famsi.org [mailto:nahuatl-bounces@lists.famsi.org] En nombre de Ian Mursell<br>Enviado el: martes, 18 de enero de 2011 13:50<br>Para: Nahuat-l ((messages)); Aztlan<br>Asunto: Re: [Nahuat-l] the eagle, the cactus, the stone, sacred warfare - yes, but the snake...?</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Dear Listeros,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>We have been intrigued by a question our teaching team recently received<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>concerning the presence or absence of the snake in the original foundation<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>account and emblem of Tenochtitlan, and we've tried to highlight the<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>evidence for and against, for a general audience, on our educational<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>website. You can see the end result here -<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>http://www.mexicolore.co.uk/index.php?one=azt&two=wus&tab=aus&id=47<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>It strikes us that there's very little information on this subject 'out<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>there' for students to grapple with. If we're wrong, please correct us. In<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>any case, we would be grateful if any of you could take a few minutes to<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>read our modest attempt to 'state the case' on this fascinating question and<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>to add your contributions to the debate (forgive me if this has come up<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>before as a thread)...<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Best wishes,<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Ian<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Ian Mursell<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>MirandaNet Fellow, Institute of Education, London University<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Director, 'Mexicolore'<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>28 Warriner Gardens<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>London SW11 4EB, U.K.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Tel: +44 (0) 20 7622 9577<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Fax: +44 (0) 20 7498 0173<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>www.aztecs.org<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>Ian.Mursell@btinternet.com<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>info@mexicolore.co.uk<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>1980-2011: 31 years of bringing Mexico and the Mexica/Aztecs to life in over<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>2,000 schools and museums throughout England. Team visits, online teaching<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>resources and services, live interactive videoconferencing sessions, and<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>much more - all from Mexicolore, the 'highly successful teaching team'<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoPlainText><span style='color:black'>(British Museum Education Service)</span><span style='color:#1F497D'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></body></html>