on the Hunter posting

[Margo]

Rodney L. Patterson wrote:

>1)  Granted, a year abroad is hardly likely to produce "native-like"
>fluency.  But if such a stay comes after or at the end of four years of
>preparation at a superior university, it may.

As far as I know, five years of Russian study is normally considered
sufficient for fluency, but not for "native-like" fluency, regardless
of one's course of study.
However, people with doctorates in Slavic Languages have generally
studied Russian for many more years than five.

>2) Gerhart's dictum that "advanced degrees, or any sort of certification, are
> not offered for language ability.  The latter is merely assumed and judgement
> in fact rests on a stellar publication record and great research promise in
>literature or linguistics, neither of which require the same faculties
>or facilities as language" sounds very much like the "sour grapes" of one
>who hasn't been chosen.
> In any case, it's wrong.  A student without excellent
>language ability does not win an advanced degree at a fine college or
>university.

That is exactly what I understood Genevra to be saying.  (I'm sure
she'll correct me if I misunderstood her.)  Superior language
ability is normally considered a prerequisite for the advanced
degree.  (In practice, naturally, some graduates are more
superior than others.)

. . . .

>4)  Gerhart's sarcasm about the existence of jobs outside of Academia and
>her implication that anyone with half a brain would opt out of the
>competition for academic positions sounds racy, but it's facile and
>unconstructive.

Her statement was, I believe, not sarcastic, but realistic.  I have
heard other academics (full professors who have no reason to express
"sour grapes") express the same hope, that academia will not lose
many of its best people to other professions where they will be better
compensated.  Such concern may be unconstructive in the sense that
we don't see a way to change the system to reward its top people
more; but it is not therefore undeserving of expression.


Margo Ballou