SEELANGS Digest - 4 Jan 2000 to 5 Jan 2000 (#2000-4)

[Leaver at AOL.COM]

Rich, Irene, Ben --

I did not mean to imply that any university program was likely to produce 
students at level 3 or 4 in writing (or in any skill for that matter)! 
However, not only university professors read this list, and the word, 
"advanced," unfortunately, means several things, depending on who is using 
it. Among the university crowd, it seems to mean one of two things: 1) the 
ACTFL level (i.e., Level 2), or 2) anyone in third year or above, regardless 
of proficiency level. Among the government crowd, advanced courses have 
traditionally referred to student input at Level 3 and output at somewhat 
higher. Current FSI "advanced" courses in Russian and French are Level 3 
intake with a goal of Level 4 graduate. DLI, as far as I know, has not taught 
an advanced course in years (although I was in one as a student in the 
1970s—ouch, I just dated myself!); however, the Marshall Center still does, I 
believe, with similar level expectations. At DLI, the "intermediate" course 
is Level 2 input and, I believe, Level 2+ output is the current goal, 
although in my experience, many, if not most, students do achieve Level 3. 
So, the differences (that exist or do not exist, depending on whose view is 
holding sway) between the ACTFL and ILR scales aside, we do have a 
terminology issue. 

I simply wanted to clarify the definition I was using as a basis for my 
comments, rather than to imply that universities can realistically deliver 
"advanced" graduates. 

And, of course, there is always the heritage question. One might well end up 
with an "advanced" student who does write at a Level 3.

Well, hopefully, I have now clarified and not muddied the waters more!

Betty Lou Leaver

In a message dated 1/5/00 7:02:12 PM, LISTSERV at CUNYVM.CUNY.EDU writes:

<< Most students in undergraduate Russian programs do not come near superior
> level writing (level 3 in the ILR scale) in a mere 4 years of language
> training.  This excludes from consideration those students who are heritage
> learners; their background varies considerably.
> >>

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