From vladimir.alexandrov at YALE.EDU Tue May 1 00:33:40 2007 From: vladimir.alexandrov at YALE.EDU (Vladimir Alexandrov) Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2007 19:33:40 -0500 Subject: Elizaveta Dmitrievna Uvarova Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, I would be grateful for contact information for Professor Elizaveta Dmitrievna Uvarova of the Gosudarstvennyi institut iskusstvoznaniia in Moscow, author of the recent book "Kak razvlekalis' v rossiiskikh stolitsakh" and author and editor of other books on Russian popular theatrical entertainment. I admire her work, would like to ask her some questions and have not succeeded in finding either an email or postal address for her. With thanks in advance, Vladimir Alexandrov Slavic Department Yale University vladimir.alexandrov at yale.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From maria at RCWS.ORG Tue May 1 15:08:41 2007 From: maria at RCWS.ORG (Maria Vorobieva) Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 11:08:41 -0400 Subject: Please join us on May 30th at Carnegie Hall at a concert featuring Anna Netrebko and Dmitry Hvorostovsky Message-ID: Dear All: If you are interested to attend the historic concert at Carnegie Hall in New York on May 30th featuring Anna Netrebko and Dmitri Hvorostovsky, please call me at 212-473-6263 or email maria at rcws.org Carnegie Hall is completely sold out for that evening, and the Russian Children's Welfare Society is the only organization that has tickets in its possession. Anna Netrebko is the Honorary Director of the RCWS (founded in 1926). A portion of proceeds from the evening will go to assist the charitable efforts of our organization - assisting disadvantaged children in Russia. To learn more about the RCWS, I invite you to visit www.rcws.org Please call us soon to reserve a good seat at a wonderful concert at the end of May! The tickets are selling very fast. Thank you. Kind regards, Masha Maria Vorobieva Director of Development The Russian Children's Welfare Society Tel: 212.473.6263 Cell: 201.233.6676 Fax: 212.473.6301 Email:maria at rcws.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ce.kramer at UTORONTO.CA Tue May 1 19:09:01 2007 From: ce.kramer at UTORONTO.CA (Christina Kramer) Date: Tue, 1 May 2007 15:09:01 -0400 Subject: Comprehensive exam query Message-ID: Dear Colleagues: I am writing to ask if you would be willing to share with us your policy on Comprehensive Exams. As the amount of funding for students becomes more and more restricted to four or five years, we are wondering how programs are scheduling Comprehensives. We currently have students write exams in the fall of the third year. In most areas, students typically take two three-hour exams followed by a Special field exam in the student's planned area of research. The special field exam has both a written and oral component. Students typically spend most of the summer of the second year and fall of the third year preparing and writing these exams. We are interested in learning other models used. Please respond to me off list (ce.kramer at utoronto.ca). At the end of May I will be happy to post a compilation (without university affiliation) on the list. Sincerely, Christina E. Kramer Christina E. Kramer, Chair and Professor of Slavic and Balkan Linguistics University of Toronto 121 Saint Joseph Street Toronto, Ontario Canada M5S 1J4 office (416) 926-1300, ext. 3221 FAX (416) 926-2076 ce.kramer at utoronto.ca Christina E. Kramer, Chair and Professor of Slavic and Balkan Linguistics University of Toronto 121 Saint Joseph Street Toronto, Ontario Canada M5S 1J4 office (416) 926-1300, ext. 3221 FAX (416) 926-2076 ce.kramer at utoronto.ca ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From billings at NCNU.EDU.TW Wed May 2 04:44:48 2007 From: billings at NCNU.EDU.TW (Loren A. Billings) Date: Wed, 2 May 2007 12:44:48 +0800 Subject: 18.1296, Qs: Russian Suffixes [...] In-Reply-To: <3870552.1177953431319.JavaMail.nobody@linguistlist.org> Message-ID: Katharina (CC: SEELangs and SlavicLing lists), I post copies of this message to two Slavic lists that might bring forth additional suggestions. I would recommend that you look at any of a number of backwards dictionaries of Russian. The best is _Grammaticheskii slovar' russkogo iazyka_ by Zalizniak. There's another, the title of which begins with _Obratnyi slovar'_ (if memory serves). All these retrograde dictionaries list words alphabetically but by the last letter of the word. Thus, you'd get all words ending in and grouped together; from there, you can look for patterns in other dictionaries that list their meanings. If you don't have access to either one, write me back and I'll type in the other words and complete references. --Loren On 5/1/07 1:17 AM, wrote: > From: Katharina Gernet < gernet at eth.mpg.de > > Subject: Russian Suffixal Morphemes -shchiki/-niki > > > Dear list members, > > I am a cultural anthropologist working with the Evens in Central Kamchatka, > Russian Far East. An issue that is discussed by anthropologists not only in > respect with the Evens from Kamchatka but with a number of other Siberian > indigenous groups is the phenomenon of so-called ''neotraditionalism'', > i.e. - to put it simple - the ''return'' from a life in the village to > ''traditional'' forms of subsistence as fishermen, hunters, reindeer > herders etc. in the taiga and tundra for various reasons. > > I have heard local Evens in Kamchatka speaking of themselves in Russian as > ''traditsionniki'' as well as ''traditsionshchiki''. I wonder what might be > the differing semantic connotations of the suffixes -shchiki/-niki. From > the contextual situation I drew the conclusion that while > ''traditsionniki'' seems to be a more neutral term, ''traditsionshchiki'' > might have some expressive connotation of irony in it or something of a > distanced view on the issue at hand (indigenous people citing academic > writers about ''neotraditionalism'' with a certain smile or critical > attitude). > > My question to you is: Can anyone of you give me a hint where to find > information about the possible semantic connotations of the Russian > suffixal morphem -shchiki in contrast to -niki? I would be grateful for any > suggestions. > > Thank you very much in advance for your help. > > With kind regards, > > Katharina Gernet > Max-Planck-Institut for Social Anthropology > Halle/Saale, Germany > > Linguistic Field(s): Semantics [...] > ----------------------------------------------------------- > LINGUIST List: Vol-18-1296 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From billings at NCNU.EDU.TW Wed May 2 05:28:22 2007 From: billings at NCNU.EDU.TW (Loren A. Billings) Date: Wed, 2 May 2007 13:28:22 +0800 Subject: FW: 18.1304, Review: AVAILABLE FOR REVIEW In-Reply-To: <22166035.1177978932959.JavaMail.nobody@linguistlist.org> Message-ID: Dear fellow Slavists (CC: ), The book listed below was announced a while back on the Linguist List; see the URL right at the end of the forwarded message. Now it is available for someone to review it. (That listserv publishes reviews much as a journal would. I've done so a couple times. They send you the book which you keep after reviewing the book.) The same message also says, "The following books are now available for review on the LINGUIST List. If you are interested in reviewing any of these books, please contact Chas Warner no later than 20 May at: " (angle brackets added). Please do not respond to me. I am merely forwarding this message from the other list. Sincerely, --Loren ------ Forwarded Message From: LINGUIST Network Reply-To: Date: Mon, 30 Apr 2007 20:22:12 -0400 To: Subject: 18.1304, Review: AVAILABLE FOR REVIEW Author(s): Bermel, Neil Title: Linguistic Authority, Language Ideology, and Metaphor Subtitle: The Czech Orthography Wars Series: (Language, Power and Social Process [LPSP] 17) Year: 2007 Publisher: Mouton de Gruyter ISBN: 9783110185966 Announced in: http://linguistlist.org/issues/18/18-1002.html ------ End of Forwarded Message ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gladney at UIUC.EDU Wed May 2 13:58:45 2007 From: gladney at UIUC.EDU (Frank Y Gladney) Date: Wed, 2 May 2007 08:58:45 -0500 Subject: 18.1296, Qs: Russian Suffixes [...] Message-ID: Zaliznjak's _Grammaticheskii slovar' russkogo iazyka_ lists around 870 nouns ending in _-shchik_, but the _Inversionnyi indeks k Slovariu russkikh narodnykh govorov_ compiled by F. P. Sorokoletov and R. V. Odekov (SPb. University Press, 2000) has 1361. Frank Y. Gladney ---- Original message ---- >Date: Wed, 2 May 2007 12:44:48 +0800 >From: "Loren A. Billings" >Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 18.1296, Qs: Russian Suffixes [...] >To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > >Katharina (CC: SEELangs and SlavicLing lists), > >I post copies of this message to two Slavic lists that might bring forth >additional suggestions. I would recommend that you look at any of a number >of backwards dictionaries of Russian. The best is _Grammaticheskii slovar' >russkogo iazyka_ by Zalizniak. There's another, the title of which begins >with _Obratnyi slovar'_ (if memory serves). All these retrograde >dictionaries list words alphabetically but by the last letter of the word. >Thus, you'd get all words ending in <nshchik> and <nnik> grouped together; >from there, you can look for patterns in other dictionaries that list their >meanings. If you don't have access to either one, write me back and I'll >type in the other words and complete references. --Loren > >On 5/1/07 1:17 AM, <linguist at LINGUISTLIST.ORG> wrote: > >> From: Katharina Gernet < gernet at eth.mpg.de > >> Subject: Russian Suffixal Morphemes -shchiki/-niki >> >> >> Dear list members, >> >> I am a cultural anthropologist working with the Evens in Central Kamchatka, >> Russian Far East. An issue that is discussed by anthropologists not only in >> respect with the Evens from Kamchatka but with a number of other Siberian >> indigenous groups is the phenomenon of so-called ''neotraditionalism'', >> i.e. - to put it simple - the ''return'' from a life in the village to >> ''traditional'' forms of subsistence as fishermen, hunters, reindeer >> herders etc. in the taiga and tundra for various reasons. >> >> I have heard local Evens in Kamchatka speaking of themselves in Russian as >> ''traditsionniki'' as well as ''traditsionshchiki''. I wonder what might be >> the differing semantic connotations of the suffixes -shchiki/-niki. From >> the contextual situation I drew the conclusion that while >> ''traditsionniki'' seems to be a more neutral term, ''traditsionshchiki'' >> might have some expressive connotation of irony in it or something of a >> distanced view on the issue at hand (indigenous people citing academic >> writers about ''neotraditionalism'' with a certain smile or critical >> attitude). >> >> My question to you is: Can anyone of you give me a hint where to find >> information about the possible semantic connotations of the Russian >> suffixal morphem -shchiki in contrast to -niki? I would be grateful for any >> suggestions. >> >> Thank you very much in advance for your help. >> >> With kind regards, >> >> Katharina Gernet >> Max-Planck-Institut for Social Anthropology >> Halle/Saale, Germany >> >> Linguistic Field(s): Semantics > >[...] > >> ----------------------------------------------------------- >> LINGUIST List: Vol-18-1296 > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Wed May 2 14:24:24 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Wed, 2 May 2007 10:24:24 -0400 Subject: 18.1296, Qs: Russian Suffixes [...] In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The -nnik unlike the regular -nik would be morphologically based on an adjective or participle. As for connotations, Victor Lychik did once a study comparing -nik, and -tel' (or maybe shchik and -tel'), that was some 15 years ago. It must be published somewhere, that's a start. I always begin with MLA bibliography, somebody must have written something on the subject. Alina On May 2, 2007, at 12:44 AM, Loren A. Billings wrote: > Katharina (CC: SEELangs and SlavicLing lists), > > I post copies of this message to two Slavic lists that might bring > forth > additional suggestions. I would recommend that you look at any of a > number > of backwards dictionaries of Russian. The best is _Grammaticheskii > slovar' > russkogo iazyka_ by Zalizniak. There's another, the title of which > begins > with _Obratnyi slovar'_ (if memory serves). All these retrograde > dictionaries list words alphabetically but by the last letter of > the word. > Thus, you'd get all words ending in and grouped > together; > from there, you can look for patterns in other dictionaries that > list their > meanings. If you don't have access to either one, write me back and > I'll > type in the other words and complete references. --Loren > > On 5/1/07 1:17 AM, wrote: > >> From: Katharina Gernet < gernet at eth.mpg.de > >> Subject: Russian Suffixal Morphemes -shchiki/-niki >> >> >> Dear list members, >> >> I am a cultural anthropologist working with the Evens in Central >> Kamchatka, >> Russian Far East. An issue that is discussed by anthropologists >> not only in >> respect with the Evens from Kamchatka but with a number of other >> Siberian >> indigenous groups is the phenomenon of so-called >> ''neotraditionalism'', >> i.e. - to put it simple - the ''return'' from a life in the >> village to >> ''traditional'' forms of subsistence as fishermen, hunters, reindeer >> herders etc. in the taiga and tundra for various reasons. >> >> I have heard local Evens in Kamchatka speaking of themselves in >> Russian as >> ''traditsionniki'' as well as ''traditsionshchiki''. I wonder what >> might be >> the differing semantic connotations of the suffixes -shchiki/- >> niki. From >> the contextual situation I drew the conclusion that while >> ''traditsionniki'' seems to be a more neutral term, >> ''traditsionshchiki'' >> might have some expressive connotation of irony in it or something >> of a >> distanced view on the issue at hand (indigenous people citing >> academic >> writers about ''neotraditionalism'' with a certain smile or critical >> attitude). >> >> My question to you is: Can anyone of you give me a hint where to find >> information about the possible semantic connotations of the Russian >> suffixal morphem -shchiki in contrast to -niki? I would be >> grateful for any >> suggestions. >> >> Thank you very much in advance for your help. >> >> With kind regards, >> >> Katharina Gernet >> Max-Planck-Institut for Social Anthropology >> Halle/Saale, Germany >> >> Linguistic Field(s): Semantics > > [...] > >> ----------------------------------------------------------- >> LINGUIST List: Vol-18-1296 > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface > at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From vanya1v at YAHOO.COM Wed May 2 16:01:29 2007 From: vanya1v at YAHOO.COM (J.W.) Date: Wed, 2 May 2007 12:01:29 -0400 Subject: Shoes for Russian orphans Message-ID: Ottawa (Canada), Wednesday 2/5/07 11h35 EDT Dear SEELANGERs, In a story I am currently translating from Russian there is a reference to an 'eccentric American woman' who died and left a fortune to provide shoes for orphans in Russia (and, presumably, other countries too). I believe this is an historical reference, dating back to the Second World War or post-war period. If anyone can supply any further details or direct me to a pertinent Internet source, I would appreciate hearing from you, either on or off list. (Mr) John Woodsworth Certified Translator (Russian-English) Website: http://www.kanadacha.ca E-mail: jw at kanadacha.ca / vanya1v at yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mgorham at GERMSLAV.UFL.EDU Wed May 2 18:38:15 2007 From: mgorham at GERMSLAV.UFL.EDU (Michael Gorham) Date: Wed, 2 May 2007 14:38:15 -0400 Subject: Reminder and Update: Call for nominations for the 2007 AATSEEL book prizes (Deadline -- May 15) Message-ID: (NB:* *Please note that the title for the prize in Linguistics has been changed to "Best Contribution to Slavic Linguistics" in order to better reflect the nature of scholarship in the field -- thus opening the door to nominations of outstanding articles published by AATSEEL members in 2005 or 2006.) *Call for nominations for the 2007 AATSEEL book prizes* The Publications Committee of AATSEEL is soliciting nominations for its annual awards competition. As in the past, awards will be given: for the best book of literary or cultural scholarship; for the best translation from a Slavic language into English; for the best contribution to Slavic linguistics; and for the best contribution to language pedagogy. For the 2007 competition, we will be considering books published in 2005 and 2006 for the prizes in literary/cultural scholarship, linguistics and translation. For the prize in language pedagogy we will consider books, as well as textbooks, computer software, testing materials, and other instructional tools, published in 2004, 2005 and 2006. To make a nomination in any of these four categories, please send one copy to: Professor Michael Gorham, Department of Germanic and Slavic Studies, University of Florida, 263 Dauer Hall, Gainesville, FL 32611-7430. For more information about the AATSEEL book prizes, see http://aatseel.org/Publications/Publicationscommittee.html The deadline for nominations is: May 15, 2007. -- Michael S. Gorham Chair, AATSEEL Publications Committee Associate Professor of Russian Studies Department of Germanic and Slavic Studies University of Florida 263 Dauer Hall P.O. Box 115430 Gainesville, FL 32611-7430 Tel: 352-392-2101 x206 Fax: 352-392-1067 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK Thu May 3 14:25:33 2007 From: Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK (Alexandra Smith) Date: Thu, 3 May 2007 15:25:33 +0100 Subject: Call For Papers -- Europe in Russia (Helsinki, August 2007) In-Reply-To: <20070426144752.hy8dmlki604o4ok4@webmail.uni-tuebingen.de> Message-ID: Thu, 03 May 2007 17:08:58 +0300 [15:08:58 BST] From: Tomi Huttunen To: aleksanteri-lista at helsinki.fi Reply-To: Tomi Huttunen Subject: [aleksanteri-lista] Europe in Russia / Evropa v Rossii, 28.-30.8.2007 ----------------------------------- EUROPE IN RUSSIA / EVROPA V ROSSII HELSINKI 28.-30.8.2007 ----------------------------------- EUROPE IN RUSSIA / EVROPA V ROSSII is an international conference to be held at the University of Helsinki in August 2007. The conference will mark the 20th anniversary of academic seminars, which since 1987 have brought together scholars of Russian literature and culture at the University of Helsinki and the University of Tartu. Initiated as a research seminar to bridge two university Slavonic departments ? one in Finland, the other in Estonia, the Helsinki-Tartu meetings have evolved into full-fledged international conferences with participants from academic communities in Russia, Europe, and the US. Each of the eleven seminars and conferences arranged so far has resulted in a book-form publication, the most recent ones under the title "Istorija i povestvovanie" (Moskva, 2006) and "Vek nyneshnij i vek minuvshij" (Tartu, 2006). The 2007 Helsinki-Tartu conference will examine questions concerning the perception of Europe and European culture in Russia. The speakers are invited to address such topics as what is considered European in Russia; how the perception of Europe has been changed throughout the ages; how ideas and cultural practices perceived as European travel to Russia; how they are received and transformed. The conference encourages papers that examine the ways the social, cultural, and linguistic diversity of Europe is reflected in these Russian perceptions. We especially welcome papers on the reception of North-European cultures (Finnish, Estonian, Scandinavian). In addition, the conference will welcome new perspectives on the study of those historical and cultural encounters between Europe and Russia, which are famously manifested by the city of St. Petersburg and its urban symbolism, as well as by the late 19^th and early 20^th century modernism and its continuing tradition within contemporary high and popular cultures. We ask You to submit proposals (in Russian or English) for individual papers. Proposals should be sent to Professor Pekka Pesonen or Assistant Tomi Huttunen by May 15th 2007. On behalf of the organizing committee, Pekka Pesonen pekka.pesonen at helsinki.fi Tomi Huttunen tomi.huttunen at helsinki.fi ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mkatz at MIDDLEBURY.EDU Thu May 3 15:03:40 2007 From: mkatz at MIDDLEBURY.EDU (Michael Katz) Date: Thu, 3 May 2007 11:03:40 -0400 Subject: Fathers and Sons Norton Critical Edition Message-ID: Dear Colleagues: First let me express my thanks to all those who sent me comments and suggestions for my revised Norton Critical Edition of Tolstoy's Short Fiction. I really appreciate your nominations for new Tolstoy texts to be included, as well as titles of new articles for the Critical Apparatus. I hope that you will be pleased with the result when it is published next year. Now I am setting to work on a revised edition of my Norton Critical Edition of Turgenev's Fathers and Sons. Once again, I turn to you for suggestions -- this time only for the Critical Apparatus, since the text remains the same. Please send me off-line any thoughts you have for articles or book chapters that you think should be considered, including your own work. With continued thanks and best wishes, Michael Katz Middlebury College ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gladney at UIUC.EDU Thu May 3 15:43:19 2007 From: gladney at UIUC.EDU (Frank Y Gladney) Date: Thu, 3 May 2007 10:43:19 -0500 Subject: Temira Pachmuss, 1927-2007 Message-ID: It is my sad duty to report the passing of our colleague Temira Pachmuss, who died at her home in Urbana on Tuesday, May 1, after a brief illness. Temira Andreevna was born December 24, 1927, in Vask-Narva, Estonia. Her high school studies in Leningrad were interrupted by the War, and she went on to earn B.A. and M.A. degrees at the University of Melbourne. In 1959 she earned her Ph.D. at the University of Washington, studying under Victor Ehrlich. She came to the University of Illinois in 1960 and retired from teaching in 1996. She was a leading authority on 20th-century Russian emigre litterature, the author of Ziniada Gippius: An Intellectual Profile (1971), Women Writers in Russian Modernism: An Anthology (1978), Russian Cultural Revival (1981), and Russian Literature in the Baltic between the World Wars (1988) and the editor and translator of numerous works by Zinaida Gippius and Dmitrii Merezhkovskii. With the renewed interest in formerly neglected or proscribed ! au! thors after the break-up of the Soviet Union, her scholarship finally won recognition also in Russia. In 2001 she was awarded the Order of the White Star by the Repubic of Estonia. Frank Y. Gladney ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gillespie.20 at ND.EDU Thu May 3 20:20:45 2007 From: gillespie.20 at ND.EDU (Alyssa Dinega Gillespie) Date: Thu, 3 May 2007 16:20:45 -0400 Subject: Visiting position in Russian, U. of Notre Dame 2007-08 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: The Department of German and Russian Languages and Literatures at the University of Notre Dame is seeking to fill an opening for a Visiting Assistant Professor of Russian for academic year 2007-2008 (with the possibility of renewal for 2008-2009). We are looking for candidates with a Ph.D. in hand to teach a 2-3 load that will include a section of Advanced Russian and a literature course in Russian each semester. Candidates who are ABD will be considered at the rank of Visiting Assistant Professional Specialist. Review of applications will begin immediately and continue until the position is filled. Please send a letter of application and CV to: David Gasperetti, Chair Department of German and Russian Languages and Literatures 318 O'Shaughnessy Hall University of Notre Dame Notre Dame, IN 46556 The University of Notre Dame is an affirmative action employer with a strong commitment to fostering a culturally diverse atmosphere for faculty, staff, and students. Women, minorities, and those attracted to a university with a Catholic identity are encouraged to apply. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jcostlow at BATES.EDU Fri May 4 16:10:32 2007 From: jcostlow at BATES.EDU (Jane Costlow) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 12:10:32 -0400 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? Message-ID: Colleagues, I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short fiction that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer Sonata or Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. (Suggestions that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to read sections of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - are also welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've received some suggestions from the students themselves - so far suggesting Hunter Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be Silent"). Thanks, Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From michael.pushkin at BTOPENWORLD.COM Fri May 4 17:00:47 2007 From: michael.pushkin at BTOPENWORLD.COM (michael.pushkin) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 18:00:47 +0100 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? Message-ID: Chekhov's 'Skuchnaya istoriya' as a reply to 'Smert' Ivana Il'icha'? Mike Pushkin CREES ERI University of Birmingham UK ----- Original Message ----- From: "Jane Costlow" To: Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 5:10 PM Subject: [SEELANGS] post or contra Tolstoy? > Colleagues, > > I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and > essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more > wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short fiction > that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer Sonata or > Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. (Suggestions > that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to read sections > of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - are also > welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've received some > suggestions from the students themselves - so far suggesting Hunter > Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be Silent"). > > Thanks, > > Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kalbouss at MAC.COM Fri May 4 17:23:17 2007 From: kalbouss at MAC.COM (George Kalbouss) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 13:23:17 -0400 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? In-Reply-To: <463B5AF8.8030005@bates.edu> Message-ID: Martin Luther King's "Letter from the Birmingham Jail" comes to mind. And, of course Chekhov's "Lady With a Dog," which our grad students call "Anna Karenina Lite." George Kalbouss The OHio State University On May 4, 2007, at 12:10 PM, Jane Costlow wrote: > Colleagues, > > I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and > essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more > wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short > fiction that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer > Sonata or Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. > (Suggestions that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to > read sections of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - > are also welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've > received some suggestions from the students themselves - so far > suggesting Hunter Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be > Silent"). > > Thanks, > > Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gust.olson at GMAIL.COM Fri May 4 23:36:34 2007 From: gust.olson at GMAIL.COM (Gust Olson) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 18:36:34 -0500 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? In-Reply-To: <463B5AF8.8030005@bates.edu> Message-ID: You might try Ted Hughes' poem "Kreutzer Sonata" in dialogue with Pozdnyshev and Tolstoy. Gust Olson Wauwatosa, WI 2007/5/4, Jane Costlow : > Colleagues, > > I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and > essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more > wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short fiction > that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer Sonata or > Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. (Suggestions > that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to read sections > of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - are also > welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've received some > suggestions from the students themselves - so far suggesting Hunter > Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be Silent"). > > Thanks, > > Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU Sat May 5 00:34:48 2007 From: Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU (Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 19:34:48 -0500 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? In-Reply-To: <1c536270705041636j3466467bnbe06c01df7736de9@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: Vladimir Sorokin's "The Blue Lard" contains an excellent parody to Tolstoy's scene of a wolf-hunt from "War&Pease". Since Sorokin's novel is about Russian literature this parody could be viewed as a dialogue with Tolstoy. Yevgeny Slivkin Department of Modern Languages, Literatures, and Linguistics University of Oklahoma 780 Van Vleet Oval, Room 202 Norman, Oklahoma 73019 ----- Original Message ----- From: Gust Olson Date: Friday, May 4, 2007 6:46 pm Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] post or contra Tolstoy? To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > You might try Ted Hughes' poem "Kreutzer Sonata" in dialogue with > Pozdnyshev and Tolstoy. > > Gust Olson > Wauwatosa, WI > > 2007/5/4, Jane Costlow : > > Colleagues, > > > > I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and > > essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more > > wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short fiction > > that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer Sonata > or > > Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. (Suggestions > > that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to read sections > > of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - are also > > welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've received some > > suggestions from the students themselves - so far suggesting Hunter > > Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be Silent"). > > > > Thanks, > > > > Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface > at: > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From russell-valentino at UIOWA.EDU Sat May 5 02:13:32 2007 From: russell-valentino at UIOWA.EDU (Valentino, Russell) Date: Fri, 4 May 2007 21:13:32 -0500 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? Message-ID: Speaking of parodies, Dubravka Ugresic, "The Kreutzer Sonata," in her Steffi Speck in the Jaws of Life (along with "A Hot Dog in a Warm Bun," which sends up another famous 19th-c. Russian short story -- you guess). For a shift of medium, you might also try Janacek's String Quartet No. 1 -- The Kreutzer. For more serious fare, try the Tolstoy chapter (Tolstoy and the Nonviolent Imperative) in Steven Marks, How Russia Shaped the Modern World (Princeton, 2003). It's suggestive rather than analytic and casts a wide net. I've used all these in class in the last 2-3 years. They went over well with my students. Russell Valentino > 2007/5/4, Jane Costlow : > > Colleagues, > > > > I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and > > essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more > > wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short fiction > > that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer Sonata > or > > Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. (Suggestions > > that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to read sections > > of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - are also > > welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've received some > > suggestions from the students themselves - so far suggesting Hunter > > Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be Silent"). > > > > Thanks, > > > > Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Mourka at HVC.RR.COM Sat May 5 15:47:50 2007 From: Mourka at HVC.RR.COM (Mourka) Date: Sat, 5 May 2007 11:47:50 -0400 Subject: SUBSCRIBE Message-ID: I would like to subscribe, please advise. Thank you. Margarita Meyendorff ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jcostlow at BATES.EDU Sat May 5 19:00:11 2007 From: jcostlow at BATES.EDU (Jane Costlow) Date: Sat, 5 May 2007 15:00:11 -0400 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks very much - these are all really helpful! Jane Costlow Valentino, Russell wrote: > Speaking of parodies, Dubravka Ugresic, "The Kreutzer Sonata," in her Steffi Speck in the Jaws of Life (along with "A Hot Dog in a Warm Bun," which sends up another famous 19th-c. Russian short story -- you guess). > > For a shift of medium, you might also try Janacek's String Quartet No. 1 -- The Kreutzer. > > For more serious fare, try the Tolstoy chapter (Tolstoy and the Nonviolent Imperative) in Steven Marks, How Russia Shaped the Modern World (Princeton, 2003). It's suggestive rather than analytic and casts a wide net. > > I've used all these in class in the last 2-3 years. They went over well with my students. > > Russell Valentino > > >> 2007/5/4, Jane Costlow : >> > Colleagues, >> > >> > I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and >> > essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more >> > wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short fiction >> > that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer Sonata >> or >> > Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. (Suggestions >> > that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to read sections >> > of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - are also >> > welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've received some >> > suggestions from the students themselves - so far suggesting Hunter >> > Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be Silent"). >> > >> > Thanks, >> > >> > Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) >> > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Sun May 6 20:56:15 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 16:56:15 -0400 Subject: To yo or not to yo? Message-ID: In the surname "Клюев" (Klyuyev), is the last syllable always, sometimes, or never "ё" ("yo")? MTIA -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jack.franke at GMAIL.COM Sun May 6 23:33:32 2007 From: jack.franke at GMAIL.COM (Jack Franke) Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 16:33:32 -0700 Subject: To yo or not to yo? In-Reply-To: <463E40EF.5020809@pbg-translations.com> Message-ID: Paul, It's always "yo." Best, Jack -- ********************************* Jack Franke, Ph.D., Professor of Russian Assistant Dean,European and Latin American School Defense Language Institute Foreign Language Center On 5/6/07, Paul B. Gallagher wrote: > > In the surname "Клюев" (Klyuyev), is the last syllable always, > sometimes, or never "ё" ("yo")? > > MTIA > > -- > War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. > -- > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > From jack.franke at GMAIL.COM Sun May 6 23:34:55 2007 From: jack.franke at GMAIL.COM (Jack Franke) Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 16:34:55 -0700 Subject: To yo or not to yo? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Sorry, Paul, I meant never "yo." Jack On 5/6/07, Jack Franke wrote: > > Paul, > > It's always "yo." > > Best, > > Jack > > -- > ********************************* > Jack Franke, Ph.D., Professor of Russian > Assistant Dean,European and Latin American School > Defense Language Institute Foreign Language Center > > On 5/6/07, Paul B. Gallagher wrote: > > > > In the surname "Клюев" (Klyuyev), is the last syllable always, > > sometimes, or never "ё" ("yo")? > > > > MTIA > > > > -- > > War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. > > -- > > Paul B. Gallagher > > pbg translations, inc. > > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > > http://pbg-translations.com > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > From thorstensson at WISC.EDU Mon May 7 00:08:18 2007 From: thorstensson at WISC.EDU (Victoria Thorstensson) Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 20:08:18 -0400 Subject: never yo Message-ID: it is never-never "yo" ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Mon May 7 02:32:06 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 22:32:06 -0400 Subject: To yo or not to yo? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks to Alina Israeli (who wrote privately), Jack Franke, and Victoria Thorstens (who changed the subject but nevertheless concurred). It is not "yo." Next question: I'm translating this conference document: ... which includes the following paper (last one at the bottom): Сварка композиционных материалов (Г.Г. Чернышов, Коперник Н.В., МГТУ им. Н.Э. Баумана, г. Москва, Россия). Now, it seems implausible to me (and web searches confirm it) that Nicolaus Copernicus could have risen from the dead to speak at this conference... ;-) However, Bauman Moscow State Technical University does advertise a Copernicus Grant , which makes me wonder whether Chernyshov is a Copernicus fellow. On the other hand, I don't see how the syntax supports that hypothesis. Neither does , though my German is very limited. Any thoughts? -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sclancy at UCHICAGO.EDU Mon May 7 03:37:27 2007 From: sclancy at UCHICAGO.EDU (Steven Clancy) Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 22:37:27 -0500 Subject: SCLA 2007 Annual Conference: October 12-14, 2007 at the University of Chicago Message-ID: The Center for the Study of Languages (CSL), The Center for East European and Russian/Eurasian Studies (CEERES), and The Department of Slavic Languages and Literatures at the University of Chicago present THE SEVENTH ANNUAL CONFERENCE OF THE SLAVIC COGNITIVE LINGUISTICS ASSOCIATION (SCLA) The Slavic Cognitive Linguistics Association (SCLA) announces the Call for Papers for the 2007 annual conference. The conference will be held on the University of Chicago campus at the Center for the Study of Languages on Friday, October 12 through Sunday, October 14, 2007. 2007 SCLA Keynote Speakers William Croft Professor of Linguistics University of New Mexico Mark Turner Institute Professor and Professor of Cognitive Science Case Western Reserve University Lawrence Zbikowski Associate Professor of Music University of Chicago CALL FOR PAPERS Abstracts are invited for presentations addressing issues of significance for cognitive linguistics. We define cognitive linguistics as any linguistic endeavour aimed at providing explanations of linguistic phenomena which are psychologically plausible, i.e. characterizing "the psychological structures that constitute a speaker's linguistic ability" (Langacker). As long as there is a cognitive orientation, papers may be in any of the traditional areas of synchronic or diachronic phonetics, phonology, morphology, syntax, semantics, discourse analysis or sociolinguistics. MAIN SESSIONS (Saturday and Sunday) Each presentation for the main sessions will be given 20 minutes and will be followed by a 10-minute discussion period. POSTER SESSIONS (Saturday and Sunday) We also welcome submissions for parallel poster sessions. Posters may consist of traditional posters, handouts, or multimedia presentations. Participants should plan for 15 minute presentations that will be repeated 3 times during a 60 minute session. Presentations may be in the native language of the presenter; however, if the presentation is not to be made in English we ask that you provide the abstract in English in addition to an abstract in any other language. Abstracts may be submitted anytime before July 15, 2007 to Steven Clancy . Please indicate if you would like your submission to be considered for a 20-minute presentation or the poster session. Abstracts should be 500-750 words, but strict word limits are not required. Notification of acceptance will be provided by August 20, 2007. PRELIMINARY SCHEDULE Friday, October 12: conference begins in evening with reception, keynote address, and dinner Saturday, October 13: main sessions and poster presentations as well as two keynote addresses, lunch and dinner Sunday, October 14: main sessions and poster presentations continue through lunchtime conclusion FURTHER INFORMATION Information on transportation, accommodations, and the conference venue will be forthcoming. Please see the conference website for further information. http://languages.uchicago.edu/scla We hope you will be able to join us for our seventh annual conference. Please forward this call for papers to your colleagues and graduate students who may be interested in presenting or attending. Sincerely, Steven Clancy Tore Nesset President, SCLA Vice-President, SCLA on behalf of the SCLA officers and the 2007 SCLA organizing committee ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM Mon May 7 08:31:15 2007 From: sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM (Benjamin Sher) Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 03:31:15 -0500 Subject: Russian Television Online -- Commercial In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear friends: For those of you who are looking for quality Russian TV broadcasts online, let me recommend the new commercial site called Ethnic Television at: http://www.etvnet.ca/ I recently subscribed to it, and it is indeed a dream come true: Access to over a dozen Russian television channels all in broadband with thousands of additional programs available in an online archive. The subject matter covers everything under the sun and, by the way, there are no commercials. However, there are also no captions in Russian or foreign language subtitles. The cost depends on the subscription plan: $10 for 20 hours a month, $20 for 50 hours a month and $40 for unlimited viewing. I have no commercial or professional relationship whatsoever with Ethnic Television. I feel duty-bound to inform the members of Sealangs of this extraordinary event in Internet broadcasting. Judge for yourself. The first three days of viewing are free. Yours, Benjamin -- Sher's Russian Web http://www.websher.net Benjamin Sher sher07 at mindspring.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU Mon May 7 08:05:52 2007 From: s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU (Prof Steven P Hill) Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 03:05:52 -0500 Subject: Kliuev-type names: pronunciation vs. transliteration Message-ID: Dear colleagues: It's good to have clarification from experts of the poet Kliuev's surname. Now I mention something peripheral to Paul Gallagher's principal question, which I think was directed at the PRONUNCIATION of this surname (as opposed to transliteration of it). We've gotten expert testimony that it's pronounced [ KLJU - jif ]. I suppose the original query would have been slightly clearer, if Prof Gallagher had enclosed the item in square brackets (assuming he was asking about pronunciation). Linguists often use brackets (or diagonals) to indicate pronunciation. In some Russian names and words where -JO- is indeed pronounced, there can be a separate question, namely, how does one TRANSLITERATE such words and names? This is a serious matter for, among others, library catalogers. E.g., "Mr. Crane" (bird), which I think is pronounced [ zhu ra VLJOF ]. In this instance, the 2d question (for catalogers, etc.) would be: to transliterate the surname as "Zhuravlev" or as "Zhuravliov" or as "Zhuravl-(E with 2 dots over it )-v." My impression is that many simply transliterate the vowel here as "plain E" ("Zhuravlev"), choosing to follow the common but unhelpful Russian practice of not indicating the [ JO ] pronunciation at all... Best wishes to everybody, Steven P Hill, University of Illinois. __ __ __ ___ __ __ _ Date: Mon 7 May 02:19:56 CDT 2007 From: Subject: Re: GETPOST SEELANGS To: "Steven P. Hill" Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 16:56:15 -0400 From: "Paul B. Gallagher" Subject: To yo or not to yo? In the surname "Клюев" (Klyuyev), is the last syllable always, sometimes, or never "ё" ("yo")? _ __ __ __ __ ___ __ __ __ __ ___ Date: Sun, 6 May 2007 22:32:06 -0400 From: "Paul B. Gallagher" Subject: Re: To yo or not to yo? Thanks to Alina Israeli (who wrote privately), Jack Franke, and Victoria Thorstens (who changed the subject but nevertheless concurred). It is not "yo." Paul B. Gallagher . __ __ __ __ ___ __ __ ___ __ _ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulr at RUSSIANLIFE.NET Mon May 7 13:45:46 2007 From: paulr at RUSSIANLIFE.NET (Paul Richardson) Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 09:45:46 -0400 Subject: Help contacting Irma Kudrova Message-ID: We would appreciate any assistance that SEELANGS members can offer in helping us make contact with Irma Kudrova, in connection with an article we are doing on Tsvetaeva. Please communicate directly, off-list. Thank you, Paul Richardson Editor & Publisher Russian Life magazine ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mp at MIPCO.COM Mon May 7 19:41:47 2007 From: mp at MIPCO.COM (mipco) Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 14:41:47 -0500 Subject: New Russian on-line Encyclopedia Message-ID: There is a new interesting and profound encyclopedia http://www.ruthenia.ru/moskva/encyc.htm on the site "Говорит Москва" (Govorit Moskva http://www.ruthenia.ru/moskva/index.htm). It is hosted by the Russian Department of Tartu University http://www.ruthenia.ru and is devoted to Russian Art and Literature. -- M.I.P. Company P.O.B. 27484 Minneapolis, Minnesota 55427 USA http://www.mipco.com mp at mipco.com phone:763-544-5915 fax: 612-871-5733 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From elizabethskomp at HOTMAIL.COM Tue May 8 00:40:46 2007 From: elizabethskomp at HOTMAIL.COM (Elizabeth Skomp) Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 19:40:46 -0500 Subject: Moscow homestay needed Message-ID: Dear SEELANGers, One of our incoming freshmen has an internship in Moscow this summer and is seeking homestay or dormitory-style accommodations from approximately June 18 to July 14. She has basic Russian language skills but is not fluent, and her family's primary concern is that the housing arrangements be safe and secure. If you would be willing to offer suggestions or advice, please contact Mike McAllister (mike at westlakesecurities.com) or Nina McAllister (nmcallister at sasaustin.org) off-list. Many thanks in advance, Elizabeth Skomp Sewanee: The University of the South _________________________________________________________________ Get a FREE Web site, company branded e-mail and more from Microsoft Office Live! http://clk.atdmt.com/MRT/go/mcrssaub0050001411mrt/direct/01/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Mourka at HVC.RR.COM Tue May 8 01:10:15 2007 From: Mourka at HVC.RR.COM (Mourka) Date: Mon, 7 May 2007 21:10:15 -0400 Subject: Russian American Cultural Center Message-ID: Newsletter Spring 2007 Dear Friends and Supporters of the Russian American Cultural Center, Please SAVE THE DATE: June 4, 2007 RACC Annual Gala & Benefit Art Auction at Sotheby’s Connect with the mission of the RACC Join us in the most esteemed event of the year The 2007 RACC Annual Gala - Benefit Art Auction Monday, June 4th 2007, 7:00 PM at Sotheby’s & 72nd Gala Honoree The Honorable Scott M. Stringer, Manhattan Borough President Cocktails & Buffet Dinner Entertainment & Exhibition & Silent Auction Live Art Auction from different periods of the 20th century Russian art, such as Russian Avant-garde, Socialist Realism, Nonconformist art and Russian stage design (purchase price is tax-deductible) For the Gala - Benefit Art Auction art catalog preview please visit: www.russianamericanculture at aol.com Click here for more information or to buy tickets through secure service PayPal (Space is limited) You can contact us at 646-831-0554 or russianculture at aol.com RACC Performance Series Tuesday, April 10, 7:00 PM Marina Shron Eden Open Rehearsal Director Alexnadra Aron Chashama Storefront Space 217 East 42nd Street Manhattan For additional information please call at: 646-831-0554 Visit our Website: www.russianamericanculture.com Suggested donations: $ 6 Two performers, an amateur and a professional are rehearsing an "unscripted" love story in a storefront window. Safely hidden behind the glass and shamelessly exposed to the onlookers, the two clash, merge and collapse in a desperate attempt to get to the place more real than reality itself. Their search for innocence turns out unexpectedly when the third character enters their virtual Eden... RACC Literary Series Monday, April 16, 6:30 PM Alexei Bayer and Valery Bazarov: Literature and Genealogical Investigation Russian Bookstore No.21 174 Fifth Ave /22/23/streets Manhattan http://www.russianbookstore21.com For additional information please call at: 212- 924-5477 and 646-831-0554 Visit our Website: www.russianamericanculture.com Reading from a new book by Alexei Bayer Alexei Bayer will read a short story from his collection “Wasp’s Nest and other Stories” . Valery Bazarov: Genealogist as a detective Valery Bazarov’s day job is to explore the mysteries of missing or dispersed persons and to reunite friends and next of kin who lost contact during emigration. He uses HIAS archives for his detective work—and every once in a while he comes across extraordinary stories. Exhibition Past and Present curated by Regina Khidekel Opening Reception April 15, 2007, 4:00-6:30 PM Paintings, sculpture and graphics by Anatoly Kaplan (1902-1980), Alexander Gluskin (1899-1970), Victor Perelman (1892 – 1967), Georgi Fitingof, Anatoly Zaslavsky, Robert Lotosh, Aron Zinshtein, Boris Borsch, Alla Davidova, Matvei Basov, and a masterpiece of the turn-of-the century by S. Tannenbaum RSVP required at (646) 831- 0554 or russianculture at aol.com RACC’s events are made possible in part with public funds from the New York State Council on the Arts, and a state agency, New York City Department of Cultural Affair News from our Friends: Angel Orensanz Arts Foundation of New York The State Russian Museum of Saint Petersburg Present Photo Exhibit Alla Esipovich Russia-Israel “Sandbox” Special Guest Dr. Alexander Borovsky, Head of Contemporary Arts Department The State Russian Museum You are cordially invited to attend “Blini & Caviar” cocktail reception On April 17 at 6:30 172 Norfolk Street, Manhattan, New York (South of Houston Street) Take F-Train to 2 Avenue Station For more info call: 212.780.0175 E-mail: vlad.luzgin at gmail.com Part of Exhibit sales will be donated to: Lowenstein Hospital Children’s Rehabilitation Center of Tel Aviv (Israel) Event is produced by Garts Management, New York www.esipovich.com -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- See what's free at AOL.com. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Tue May 8 10:01:38 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 11:01:38 +0100 Subject: Chekhov - The Cherry Orchard - Firs - Firsov - Platonov Message-ID: Dear all, Am just writing something about Platonov¹s ŒReka Potudan¹¹, the hero of which is called Firsov. I was wanting to quote the phrase ŒCheloveka zabyli¹ and had innocently imagined I would find it at the end of the Cherry Orchard. But all I can find is Firs saying ŒPro menya zabyli¹. Can anyone tell me who first came out with the famous ŒCheloveka zabyli¹? Best Wishes, Robert ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From frosset at WHEATONMA.EDU Tue May 8 14:22:12 2007 From: frosset at WHEATONMA.EDU (Francoise Rosset) Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 10:22:12 -0400 Subject: One-year position in Russian In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Russian and Russian Studies at Wheaton College: Visiting Assistant Professor or Instructor of Russian The Department of Russian at Wheaton College in Massachusetts seeks applicants for a one-year post in Russian. This post combines a part-time post with a semester sabbatical replacement; it is full time and for one year only. The successful candidate will teach six courses, but these must be distributed as follows: two in the fall and four in the spring. Courses will include three levels of Russian language and one course in English on Soviet and current Russian literature. Requirements: -- PhD in Russian languages and literatures preferred, ABD considered. -- Native or near-native fluency in both Russian and English. -- Experience teaching Russian in an American college or university. -- Field is open, but we are particularly interested in candidates with experience in advanced Russian language courses, cultural studies, and Soviet and post-Soviet literature. Our most pressing concern is to find someone with evidence of strong language teaching. Salary: this is a non-tenure-track visiting position, $42,000 for the year, with benefits. Review of applications will begin immediately and continue until the position is filled. E-mail applications are fine, but please send paper copies as well. Please submit a letter of application, curriculum vitae, and a dossier or three letters of reference to: Fran Weldon, Knapton Hall Russian Search Committee Wheaton College 26 E Main Street Norton, MA 02766 e-mail: fweldon at wheatonma.edu Wheaton College is a small, selective liberal arts college in Massachusetts, located between Boston and Providence. Wheaton seeks educational excellence through diversity and strongly encourages applications from women and men from minority groups. AA/EOE Thank you, -FR Francoise Rosset Chair, Russian and Russian Studies Coordinator, German and Russian Wheaton College Norton, Massachusetts 02766 Office: (508) 285-3696 FAX: (508) 286-3640 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Ambrosekat at AOL.COM Tue May 8 14:33:18 2007 From: Ambrosekat at AOL.COM (Ambrosekat at AOL.COM) Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 10:33:18 EDT Subject: SEELANGS: Women in Russian Literature Conference Message-ID: ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------- next part -------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: multipart/alternative Size: 2281 bytes Desc: not available URL: From sbauckus at EARTHLINK.NET Tue May 8 16:35:16 2007 From: sbauckus at EARTHLINK.NET (Susan Bauckus) Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 09:35:16 -0700 Subject: UCLA Summer Workshop in Social Science Translation Message-ID: Greetings, Please note the announcement below and share the information with colleagues and students. Thank you, Susan Bauckus UCLA Center for World Languages ************* UCLA Workshop in Social Science Translation The Workshop in Social Science Translation is a four-week summer session graduate course for students in any social science discipline with a reading knowledge of any foreign language. June 25 � July 20, 2007 Course Title: Social Science Translation for Southeast European Languages . Note: Students working in other languages will also be admitted. Instructor: Professor Michael Heim The Workshop in Social Science Translation is a four-week summer session graduate course for students in any social science discipline with a reading knowledge of any foreign language. Its primary goal is to teach students to render scholarly texts in their fields from the language they use in their research into English. A secondary goal is to advance the students� knowledge of their research languages. Each week students will attend two three-hour workshop sessions and one one-and-a-half hour tutorial session, for a total of thirty hours. Workshop sessions: Students will learn the general principles of translation, understood not as a theory but as practical ways of coping with the choices a translator must make. Reading assignments will include selected works on translation. Students will work independently and in class on a translation project (an article or book chapter) of their own choosing. Tutorial sessions: Students will do extensive reading of source-language texts in their chosen fields, based on bibliographies they themselves put together. They will take notes on the texts in English and discuss them with their tutors. The object of the sessions is for students to learn to make sense of texts whose every word they do not know and to increase their vocabulary. At tutorial sessions students may also seek assistance with their translation projects. Course objectives: At the end of the course the students will 1) be primed to produce publishable translations of works in their fields and 2) have improved their reading comprehension and acquired strategies for improving on their own. Students wishing to enroll in the workshop will submit by e-mail attachment to cwl at international.ucla.edu an application containing the following documentation: � a curriculum vitae, including a list of relevant courses; a bibliography containing three or four books and/or articles the applicant wishes to read in the language proposed for study � a translation into English of three pages from one of the books or articles � a statement of purpose outlining the applicant�s major interests and past training in both the language applied for and other languages In addition, students are asked to have two letters of recommendation submitted either by e-mail to cwl at international.ucla.edu or by mail to: Center for World Languages 1333 Rolfe Hall PO Box 951411 Los Angeles, CA 90095-1411 One of the recommendations should be from the professor most closely acquainted with their work and the other from their most recent language instructor. Deadline for enrollment is: Friday, June 8th 2007. Students working in other languages will be admitted into the course if space is available. The workshop is funded by an American Council of Learned Societies grant. Students presenting Southeast European languages are eligible to apply for an ACLS Language Grant to Individuals for Summer Study; other financial aid may also be offered. Information on fees, housing and application deadline are available at www.summer.ucla.edu. Please direct questions to cwl at international.ucla.edu Susan Bauckus UCLA Center for World Languages www.international.ucla.edu/languages Heritage Language Journal www.heritagelanguages.org LA Language World www.lalamag.ucla.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mdenner at STETSON.EDU Tue May 8 17:55:24 2007 From: mdenner at STETSON.EDU (Michael Denner) Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 13:55:24 -0400 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? In-Reply-To: A<463B5AF8.8030005@bates.edu> Message-ID: Jane, They are legion. There are many starting places, but I can recommend Peter Ulf Moller's really excellent historical investigation, _Postlude to the Kreutzer Sonata_, which follows the reverberations and counterpoints to that piece in Russia, China, Japan, USA, etc. The Tolstoy Studies Journal in the last issue had an article by Ron LeBlanc: "Saninism Versus Tolstoyism: The Anti-Tolstoy Subtext in M. Artsybashev's _Sanin_." That issue also had an interview with filmmaker Paul Schick on his really excellent short film "Alyosha the Pot." The previous (2005) issue had an article by Barbara Henry on Gordin's play, _Di Kreytser Sonata_, his "response" to Tolstoy's novella. A quick flip through past issues of the Journal will surely turn out dozens more examples. If you're feeling multi-media friendly, you could also poke through a filmography I put together a few years ago of films based on LNT's works: http://www.utoronto.ca/tolstoy/filmography/filmography.htm One final suggestions: Chekhov's only novel, _The Duel_, is perhaps more Tolstoyan than Tolstoy (well, a certain bent in the late Tolstoy, at least). It was written in direct response to Tolstoy, I think, and certainly under his (indirect and problematic) tutelage. It is, furthermore, my favorite piece of Russian fiction. ~mad ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* Dr. Michael A. Denner Editor, Tolstoy Studies Journal Director, University Honors Program Contact Information: Russian Studies Program Stetson University Campus Box 8361 DeLand, FL 32720-3756 386.822.7381 (department) 386.822.7265 (direct line) 386.822.7380 (fax) www.stetson.edu/~mdenner -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jane Costlow Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 12:11 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] post or contra Tolstoy? Colleagues, I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short fiction that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer Sonata or Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. (Suggestions that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to read sections of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - are also welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've received some suggestions from the students themselves - so far suggesting Hunter Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be Silent"). Thanks, Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) ------------------------------------------------------------------------ - Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jcostlow at BATES.EDU Tue May 8 19:44:30 2007 From: jcostlow at BATES.EDU (Jane Costlow) Date: Tue, 8 May 2007 15:44:30 -0400 Subject: post or contra Tolstoy? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Michael, Thanks for these suggestions - very helpful. My posting has turned up lots of interesting responses, some of which I'd thought about, but many were unexpected. Much of this will have to wait for the next iteration of the course. Thanks in particular for the tip on the TSJ interview with Paul Schick - my students are watching that film next week in connection with the story. Best, Jane Michael Denner wrote: > Jane, > > They are legion. > > There are many starting places, but I can recommend Peter Ulf Moller's > really excellent historical investigation, _Postlude to the Kreutzer > Sonata_, which follows the reverberations and counterpoints to that > piece in Russia, China, Japan, USA, etc. > > The Tolstoy Studies Journal in the last issue had an article by Ron > LeBlanc: "Saninism Versus Tolstoyism: The Anti-Tolstoy Subtext in M. > Artsybashev's _Sanin_." That issue also had an interview with filmmaker > Paul Schick on his really excellent short film "Alyosha the Pot." The > previous (2005) issue had an article by Barbara Henry on Gordin's play, > _Di Kreytser Sonata_, his "response" to Tolstoy's novella. > > A quick flip through past issues of the Journal will surely turn out > dozens more examples. > > If you're feeling multi-media friendly, you could also poke through a > filmography I put together a few years ago of films based on LNT's > works: > http://www.utoronto.ca/tolstoy/filmography/filmography.htm > > One final suggestions: Chekhov's only novel, _The Duel_, is perhaps more > Tolstoyan than Tolstoy (well, a certain bent in the late Tolstoy, at > least). It was written in direct response to Tolstoy, I think, and > certainly under his (indirect and problematic) tutelage. It is, > furthermore, my favorite piece of Russian fiction. > > ~mad > > ~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~*~* > Dr. Michael A. Denner > Editor, Tolstoy Studies Journal > Director, University Honors Program > > Contact Information: > Russian Studies Program > Stetson University > Campus Box 8361 > DeLand, FL 32720-3756 > 386.822.7381 (department) > 386.822.7265 (direct line) > 386.822.7380 (fax) > www.stetson.edu/~mdenner > > -----Original Message----- > From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list > [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Jane Costlow > Sent: Friday, May 04, 2007 12:11 PM > To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Subject: [SEELANGS] post or contra Tolstoy? > > Colleagues, > > I'm currently teaching a course on late Tolstoy (both fiction and > essays), and would like to pair some other writers with L.N.'s more > wonderfully outrageous pieces. I'd welcome suggestions of short fiction > > that is either directly influenced by Tolstoy (say, Kreutzer Sonata or > Ivan Ilych), or is written in reaction/opposition to it. (Suggestions > that relate more to his non-fiction - we're scheduled to read sections > of What Then Must We Do? and essays on non-violence - are also > welcome.) The writers don't have to be Russian. (I've received some > suggestions from the students themselves - so far suggesting Hunter > Thompson and Edward Abbey after reading "I Cannot be Silent"). > > Thanks, > > Jane Costlow (feel free to respond on- or off-list) > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > - > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > - > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Ambrosekat at AOL.COM Wed May 9 10:39:16 2007 From: Ambrosekat at AOL.COM (Ambrosekat at AOL.COM) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 06:39:16 EDT Subject: Women in Russian Literature Conference Message-ID: Dear Colleagues (Apologies for the previous error in posting) Please join us at Keele University, UK, for the inaugural conference of the Women in Literature Forum! It will take place in the Science Learning Centre at Keele University on 14th June 2007. This year’s event, which will hopefully be the first of many, will focus on women in Russian literature. In organising this event, we are aiming to establish a forum which will bring together people who are researching feminism and gender in literature across all cultures, from both within the Keele community and beyond. The papers to be presented are as follows: Dr Linda Edmondson, Birmingham University: ‘Women in Nineteenth-Century Russia: Social and Historical Perspectives.’ Kathryn Ambrose, Keele University: ‘Turgenev’s Women: Terrible Perfection?’ Victoria O’Neill, Keele University: 'Durova and Theorising Femininity and Masculinity.' Rebecca Barrett, Keele University: 'Pioneering Women: Nadezhda Sokhanskaia and Nadezhda Khvoshchinskaia.’ Professor Joe Andrew, Keele University: ‘A Room of One’s Own’, Part II: Narrative, Gender and Space in The Fiancée.’ This will be an all day event, and will include lunch and tea/coffee. The fee for attending will be £10 for students and £21 for staff. If you wish to attend, please contact Kathryn Ambrose off-list(_rhd19 at ihum.keele.ac.uk_ (mailto:rhd19 at ihum.keele.ac.uk) ) to book your place, by no later than 25th May 2007. I would be most grateful if you could forward details of this event to anyone who you think would be interested. Many thanks! Kathryn Ambrose PhD Student Keele University UK ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From MURPHYDT at SLU.EDU Wed May 9 10:39:27 2007 From: MURPHYDT at SLU.EDU (David Murphy) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 05:39:27 -0500 Subject: Out of Office Message-ID: Thank you for your message. I am currently out of the office and will not be checking e-mail. Your message has been saved and will be read upon my return. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From n_shevchuk at YAHOO.COM Wed May 9 13:38:02 2007 From: n_shevchuk at YAHOO.COM (Nina Shevchuk) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 06:38:02 -0700 Subject: Whitman in Ukraine In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Colleagues: The Walt Whitman digital archive (www.whitmanarchive.org) has started digitizing translations of Whitman's work into various languages to add to its resources. I am directly involved with the Russian and Ukrainian translations, so I am here to ask for some pointers. I think I have my Russian covered, and I have the two Soviet Ukrainian editions of Leaves of Grass (1954 and 1982), but I find it difficult to believe that there was no "Ukrainian Whitman" before 1954. I've had some difficulty even establishing the existence of earlier translations. Does anyone know of any Ukrainian poets translating Whitman? Does anyone know of any published translations before 1954? The archive has ways and means of obtaining materials -- even if there's just a manuscript in some obscure library, we can get it. Thanks in advance for all your input. Sincerely, Nina Shevchuk-Murray --------------------------------- Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From wolsen at GOLDENTIGERS.ORG Wed May 9 16:49:47 2007 From: wolsen at GOLDENTIGERS.ORG (William Olsen) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 11:49:47 -0500 Subject: High School Russian Teacher Wanted Message-ID: High School Russian Teacher Wanted: The Noble Street Campus of Noble Street Charter School in Chicago is seeking a Russian Teacher for 12th grade Russian. Noble Street campuses are high achieving college-prep high schools serving low-income Chicago students since 1999. Candidates should have experience working with high school age students. Please apply on-line at noblenetwork.org. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From monniern at MISSOURI.EDU Wed May 9 17:15:29 2007 From: monniern at MISSOURI.EDU (Nicole Monnier) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 12:15:29 -0500 Subject: Is Lenin in his tomb? Message-ID: SEELANGTSy! I had the brilliant idea of putting on my final Soviet civ exam the following extra credit question: "Who is buried in Lenin's tomb?" - until I began to be plagued by doubts of Lenin's current whereabouts. I remember someone telling me that Lenin had recently (? Past year?) been removed for maintenance; does anyone know whether this is true or not, and more importantly, can anyone assure me that he he is (or isn't) currently residing in his usual digs on Red Square? Curiously, Nicole **************************** Dr. Nicole Monnier Assistant Professor of Instruction Director of Undergraduate Studies (Russian) German & Russian Studies 415 GCB University of Missouri Columbia, MO 65211 phone: 573.882.3370 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From renee at ALINGA.COM Wed May 9 17:31:37 2007 From: renee at ALINGA.COM (Renee Stillings) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 10:31:37 -0700 Subject: Is Lenin in his tomb? In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Appears to be winter maintenance - a bit longer this year: http://eeuroperussiatravel.suite101.com/blog.cfm/lenins_mausoleum_winter_clo sing -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Nicole Monnier Sent: Wednesday, May 09, 2007 10:15 AM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] Is Lenin in his tomb? SEELANGTSy! I had the brilliant idea of putting on my final Soviet civ exam the following extra credit question: "Who is buried in Lenin's tomb?" - until I began to be plagued by doubts of Lenin's current whereabouts. I remember someone telling me that Lenin had recently (? Past year?) been removed for maintenance; does anyone know whether this is true or not, and more importantly, can anyone assure me that he he is (or isn't) currently residing in his usual digs on Red Square? Curiously, Nicole **************************** Dr. Nicole Monnier Assistant Professor of Instruction Director of Undergraduate Studies (Russian) German & Russian Studies 415 GCB University of Missouri Columbia, MO 65211 phone: 573.882.3370 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From maureen.riley at US.ARMY.MIL Wed May 9 17:41:06 2007 From: maureen.riley at US.ARMY.MIL (Riley, Maureen DLI-W) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 13:41:06 -0400 Subject: Vacancy announcement Message-ID: The Defense Language Institute, Washington Office (DLI-W) has opened a search to fill the following position. There is one position, but hiring will be done at the level appropriate to the successful candidate's qualifications. The position is open to US citizens ONLY who are eligible for a high-level security clearance. Instructor for Russian-English Translation, teaching individualized, specialized, intensive courses in sight translation for Presidential Translators at the Washington-Moscow Direct Communications Link (Moscow-Washington Hot Line MOLINK). Other teaching duties include delivering remedial instruction in Russian grammar as necessary; assigning and correcting student translations (Russian to English) on a broad range of topics (non-technical); regular post-instruction maintenance of sight-translation and written translation skills of MOLINK personnel; curriculum and materials development; organization of and participation in interagency pre-and post-instruction evaluation/certification panels. The faculty member must maintain his/her language skills at high levels and stay informed of current events in Russia and foreign events affecting Russia. Instruction is conducted in an intensive one-on-one setting, four hours/day, five days/week in the Washington, DC office (Crystal City, VA) of DLI. Focus is on acquisition of skills in Russian-to-English sight translation and written translation. Post-instruction maintenance training in both skills is done at MOLINK office, in the same one-on-one setting, four hours/day, four days/week, to include evening hours no later than 2000 hours. Occasional travel to Russia may also be required. For further information on the position or to apply, go to: www.usajobs.com and search for the following Vacancy Announcement Numbers: Vacancy Announcement Number: WTEY07FPS786216-04R Assistant Professor (Russian Translation) Vacancy Announcement Number: WTEY07FPS786216-05R Associate Professor (Russian Translation) Applications will be accepted until Monday, June 25, 2007 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From zielinski at GMX.CH Wed May 9 19:03:15 2007 From: zielinski at GMX.CH (Zielinski) Date: Wed, 9 May 2007 21:03:15 +0200 Subject: Whitman in Ukraine Message-ID: Nina Shevchuk: Message-ID: Jan, At this point, that would be me. I read Polish decently, and I'm the only person at the archive who could handle transcribing it. Any information you provide is interesting to us. I will copy Dr. Kenneth Price, the Archive co-director on this message -- I'm sure he'll be interested in this as well. Chukovsky mentions at least one Polish translation in his 1919 book, but I'm not at the archive at this moment, and can't tell who it is he mentions. The early translations are always exciting, since they show how Whitman's work entered another literature. Best, Nina Zielinski wrote: Nina Shevchuk: before 1954. I've had some difficulty even establishing the existence of earlier translations. Does anyone know of any Ukrainian poets translating Whitman? Does anyone know of any published translations before 1954? I don't know about the Ukrainian ones, but have some information about an early unpublished Polish translation. Who is dealing with Polish translations? Sincerely, Jan Zielinski ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------- Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From n_shevchuk at YAHOO.COM Thu May 10 13:47:02 2007 From: n_shevchuk at YAHOO.COM (Nina Shevchuk) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 06:47:02 -0700 Subject: Whitman in Ukraine In-Reply-To: <00ef01c7926c$b53bd8f0$82d14b54@JANEK> Message-ID: Dear Colleagues: Thank you all very much for all your input -- this is great info. Through an article by a modern Ukrainian translator I located a 1928 book -- an Antologia Amerykanskoj poezii 1855-1925 by Ivan Kulyk. It includes some Whitman poems, and, as best I can tell, this is the earliest I get in Ukrainian. Researching old periodicals might help, but I'm in Nebraska, and so I'm a bit geographically handicapped. Again, the information all of you provided is very valuable to me, and if you encounter anything else on the topic, please, send it my way. Respects, Nina --------------------------------- Ahhh...imagining that irresistible "new car" smell? Check outnew cars at Yahoo! Autos. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From dgoldfar at BARNARD.EDU Thu May 10 16:20:30 2007 From: dgoldfar at BARNARD.EDU (David Goldfarb) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 12:20:30 -0400 Subject: Whitman in Ukraine In-Reply-To: <576870.49104.qm@web30408.mail.mud.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Regarding Polish translations of Whitman, Czeslaw Milosz translated a couple of poems of Whitman between 1946-50 and then translated many more later while he was at Berkeley after 1961. I am not sure offhand when or where or if these were originally published, but you can find the translations in Milosz, _Mowa wiazana_ (Olsztyn: Pojezierze, 1986) (I think this came out in an earlier edition from PIW). Best, David Goldfarb On Thu, 10 May 2007, Nina Shevchuk wrote: > Jan, > At this point, that would be me. I read Polish decently, and I'm the only person at the archive who could handle transcribing it. Any information you provide is interesting to us. I will copy Dr. Kenneth Price, the Archive co-director on this message -- I'm sure he'll be interested in this as well. Chukovsky mentions at least one Polish translation in his 1919 book, but I'm not at the archive at this moment, and can't tell who it is he mentions. > The early translations are always exciting, since they show how Whitman's work entered another literature. > > Best, > Nina > > Zielinski wrote: > Nina Shevchuk: > > before 1954. I've had some difficulty even establishing the existence of > earlier translations. Does anyone know of any Ukrainian poets translating > Whitman? Does anyone know of any published translations before 1954? > > I don't know about the Ukrainian ones, but have some information about an > early unpublished Polish translation. Who is dealing with Polish > translations? > > Sincerely, > > Jan Zielinski -- David A. Goldfarb Assistant Professor Department of Slavic Languages Barnard College Columbia University 3009 Broadway dgoldfarb at barnard.edu New York, NY 10027-6598 http://www.echonyc.com/~goldfarb ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From zielinski at GMX.CH Thu May 10 16:18:36 2007 From: zielinski at GMX.CH (Zielinski) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 18:18:36 +0200 Subject: Whitman in Ukraine Message-ID: > Jan, > At this point, that would be me. I read Polish decently, and I'm the only person at the archive who could handle transcribing it. Any information you provide is interesting to us. I will copy Dr. Kenneth Price, the Archive co-director on this message -- I'm sure he'll be interested in this as well. Chukovsky mentions at least one Polish translation in his 1919 book, but I'm not at the archive at this moment, and can't tell who it is he mentions. > The early translations are always exciting, since they show how Whitman's work entered another literature. Well, maybe send me one day what you already have on the Polish side and I will see what can be done. I was once, many years ago, asked by a Warsaw publisher to prepare an edition of translations done by Julian Tuwim (from various kanguages) and I remember coming in Muzeum Literatury across a manuscript of an early lecture on Whitman by Tuwim, that contained some fragments translated, as far as I know the draft was never published, Unfortunately my publisher has suffered a crisis and the planned edition was cancelled. But I'm still interested in Tuwim. Best, Jan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From srogovyk at UMICH.EDU Thu May 10 17:07:04 2007 From: srogovyk at UMICH.EDU (Svitlana Rogovyk) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 13:07:04 -0400 Subject: Fwd: Russian to English translation of novel Message-ID: Forwarding request by Ruth Shamraj Please reply to: rshamraj at umich.edu I am seeking a translator who can translate a 250 page novel from Russian to English. The novel has already been published in Turkic, Russian, and French, and will also be translated into German this year. The contract is worth $5,000 and the author would like the translation to be completed as soon as possible. I am the literary agent and editor of the Russian to English translation of this book. I am also seeking a publishing house that will publish the English translation. Many thanks for your help. Best Regards, Ruth -- Ruth Shamraj Editor Inter-University Consortium for Political and Social Research (ICPSR) University of Michigan P.O. Box 1248, Ann Arbor, MI 48106 Voice: 734.615-7904 Fax: 734-647-8200 www.icpsr.umich.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Thu May 10 17:22:03 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 18:22:03 +0100 Subject: Fwd: Russian to English translation of novel In-Reply-To: <20070510130704.h2hw48p40gggkww0@web.mail.umich.edu> Message-ID: We really do need to know a bit more - the name of the author would be a good start! R. > Forwarding request by Ruth Shamraj > > Please reply to: rshamraj at umich.edu > > I am seeking a translator who can translate a 250 page novel from Russian to > English. The novel has already been published in Turkic, Russian, and > French, and will also be translated into German this year. The contract is > worth $5,000 and the author would like the translation to be completed as > soon as possible. I am the literary agent and editor of the Russian to > English translation of this book. > > I am also seeking a publishing house that will publish the English > translation. > > Many thanks for your help. > > Best Regards, > > Ruth -- Ruth Shamraj > Editor > Inter-University Consortium for Political and Social Research (ICPSR) > University of Michigan > P.O. Box 1248, Ann Arbor, MI 48106 > Voice: 734.615-7904 > Fax: 734-647-8200 > www.icpsr.umich.edu > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lgoering at CARLETON.EDU Thu May 10 20:12:52 2007 From: lgoering at CARLETON.EDU (Laura Goering) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 15:12:52 -0500 Subject: punctuation and capitalization Message-ID: Could someone kindly point me to a concise version of Russian punctuation and capitalization rules (in English) that would be suitable for first-year students? The ones I have found so far are too complete and use examples that are too difficult. Spasibo! Laura Goering -- ************************** Laura Goering Professor of Russian Chair, Dept. of German and Russian Carleton College Northfield, MN 55057 lgoering at carleton.edu Office: (507) 646-4125 Dept. office: (507) 646-4252 Fax: (507) 646-5942 Home: (507) 663-6142 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From maureen.riley at US.ARMY.MIL Thu May 10 20:30:10 2007 From: maureen.riley at US.ARMY.MIL (Riley, Maureen DLI-W) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 16:30:10 -0400 Subject: punctuation and capitalization Message-ID: Russian Punctuation and Related Symbols. A Guide for English Speakers. Authors: Edward Vajda and Valentina Umanets (Slavica, 2004) It's quite thorough; you should be able to distill something appropriate for your students from it, though. Maureen Riley Defense Language Institute -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Laura Goering Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2007 4:13 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] punctuation and capitalization Could someone kindly point me to a concise version of Russian punctuation and capitalization rules (in English) that would be suitable for first-year students? The ones I have found so far are too complete and use examples that are too difficult. Spasibo! Laura Goering -- ************************** Laura Goering Professor of Russian Chair, Dept. of German and Russian Carleton College Northfield, MN 55057 lgoering at carleton.edu Office: (507) 646-4125 Dept. office: (507) 646-4252 Fax: (507) 646-5942 Home: (507) 663-6142 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From n_shevchuk at YAHOO.COM Thu May 10 21:22:07 2007 From: n_shevchuk at YAHOO.COM (Nina Shevchuk) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 14:22:07 -0700 Subject: Whitman in Ukraine In-Reply-To: <00a401c79324$f574d990$d66d4cd5@JANEK> Message-ID: That sounds good to me. I will keep your email for future reference -- for whenever I find my way from under the pile of Russian translations :) Meanwhile, FYI, here's what the Archive's director has collected so far: Nina, For info on Polish translations, you may want to write to Marta Skwara, of Szczecin University in Poland. Or I can write to her since I met her this February in Paris. Just fyi her email is Here are a couple of things she has written. We may want to consider these before writing her with questions. Ken Skwara, Marta. Krag transcendentalistów amerykanskich w literaturze polskiej XIX i XX wieku: Dzieje recepcji, idei i powinowactw z wyboru [The Circle of American Transcendentalists in Polish Literature of the 19th and the 20th Centuries: A History of Reception, Ideas, and Literary Affinities]. Szczecin, Poland: Wydawnictwo Naukowe Uniwersytetu Szczecinskiego, 2004. [Examines "all aspects of Polish reception of American Transcendentalists," including Emerson, Fuller, Thoreau, and Whitman; in Part 1, one chapter, "Walt Whitman" (68-86), deals with his writings "in Polish translations, the opinions and discussions they provoked, and the way they were understood and interpreted in Polish literary culture"; in Part 2, seven chapters deal with Whitman (212-355), looking at early Whitman reception in Poland, where he was initially "perceived as a failed poet by Seweryna Duchinska and Zenon Przesmycki-Miriam," then truly discovered by Antoni Lange, who wrote about Whitman and translated his poetry, and further responded to by novelist Stefan Zeromski and Stanislaw Brzozowski; exploring how Whitman became "widely known" in Poland through the "enthusiasm" of poets Julian Tuwim, Kazimierz Wierzynski, and Jaroslaw Iwaszkiewicz, as well as translator and critic Stanislaw Vincenz; examining how Whitman was of interest to "Polish futurists, like Jerzy Jankowski" and to Polish expressionists, like Jan Stur and Stefan Stasiak; analyzing the "new ideological mode of reading Whitman," first by Antonina Sokolicz and later by others who sought to "fit Whitman into the ideal of social realism," including translators (like Stanislaw Helsztynski) who manipulated Whitman's poetry for ideological reasons; analyzing in detail Czeslaw Milosz's response to Whitman as "a poet of metaphysical reality"; and discussing recent Polish translations of Whitman by Andrzej Szuba and Krzysztof Boczkowski, who "underline certain aspects of Whitman's poetry, like the homosexual undertone, not visibly present in [the] Polish tradition of interpreting Leaves of Grass before"; in Polish, with a summary in English (430-433).] Skwara, Marta Anna. "Some Aspects of Cross-Cultural Intertextuality as Seen through the Polish 'Rewriting' of Emerson and Whitman." Canadian Review of Comparative Literature (March 2004), 67-76. [Examines "the long-lasting presence" of Emerson's and Whitman's writings in Polish literature and the ways their works "were creatively incorporated by Polish writers and poets into their own texts as a voice of 'another culture' that could redefine and reshape 'our culture'; focuses particularly Whitman's presence in Stefan Zeromski's novel Dzieje grzechu (The History of Sin, 1908) and in the poetry of Julian Tuwim and Czeslaw Milosz.] Zielinski wrote: > Jan, > At this point, that would be me. I read Polish decently, and I'm the only person at the archive who could handle transcribing it. Any information you provide is interesting to us. I will copy Dr. Kenneth Price, the Archive co-director on this message -- I'm sure he'll be interested in this as well. Chukovsky mentions at least one Polish translation in his 1919 book, but I'm not at the archive at this moment, and can't tell who it is he mentions. > The early translations are always exciting, since they show how Whitman's work entered another literature. Well, maybe send me one day what you already have on the Polish side and I will see what can be done. I was once, many years ago, asked by a Warsaw publisher to prepare an edition of translations done by Julian Tuwim (from various kanguages) and I remember coming in Muzeum Literatury across a manuscript of an early lecture on Whitman by Tuwim, that contained some fragments translated, as far as I know the draft was never published, Unfortunately my publisher has suffered a crisis and the planned edition was cancelled. But I'm still interested in Tuwim. Best, Jan ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------- 8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time with theYahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kalbouss at MAC.COM Thu May 10 22:50:54 2007 From: kalbouss at MAC.COM (George Kalbouss) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 18:50:54 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing Message-ID: The discussion on the pronunciation of Kluev has led me to wonder out loud about a phenomenon that I have been patiently putting up with lo these 60 years, namely, how Anglo-speakers seem to have a talent to rarely guess where the stress should go on a Russian name. Some of the worst mis-stresses I can figure out. MiKHAIL becomes "Mick-HALE" because it looks like that, and DACHa is stressed correctly but the pronunciation is DAKHA (not the way the word actually looks) because an analogy, for some unknown reason, is made with the concentration camp, Dachau. Others, however, make me wonder -- and perhaps some linguist colleagues can help out -- is there an overriding principle in the English language or culture why this butchering is done? Some of the more common examples: VLAdimir PavLOVa SharaPOva (she finally gave in and said, ok, that's my name) Ki-EV TOLstoy LerMONTov (I doubt the pronouncers have heard of Learmont) KHRUSHchev TURD-jenev LeNEEN, StaLEEN (yes, despite the notoriety of these names) StolichNAYA (the escape route is STOLi, not StoLI). In exasperation, I tell my Anglo speakers, just decide where you want to put the stress and then move it one to the right. If you think the stress should go on the last syllable, then put it on the first. At least I increase the probablity of getting it right. As a consolation, they get BLOK and TVER right the first time. Then, there's Nemerovich-Danchenko, Dnepropetrovsk and Petrodvorets.-- maybe we're asking too much. George Kalbouss (The) Ohio State University ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Fri May 11 00:15:36 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 20:15:36 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: <5492d6a06096648fc7ee9257257dc4fb@mac.com> Message-ID: The feeling is rather mutual, just to look at the way Russians pronounce MacLean, (ulica MAklina), Fitzgerald or Sinatra. Granted Sinatra might be Italian, but then Lollobrigida is also mis-stressed. And to add to the stress factor that Shaw became Show. But then there is a small item of the stress of the name of Henry Purcell between British and Americans, as far as I know. But then there are many disagreements as to which syllAble should be stressed between the speakers of these two dialects. On May 10, 2007, at 6:50 PM, George Kalbouss wrote: > The discussion on the pronunciation of Kluev has led me to wonder > out loud about a > phenomenon that I have been patiently putting up with lo these 60 > years, namely, how > Anglo-speakers seem to have a talent to rarely guess where the > stress should go on > a Russian name. > Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lgoering at CARLETON.EDU Fri May 11 01:26:20 2007 From: lgoering at CARLETON.EDU (Laura Goering) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 20:26:20 -0500 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: <5492d6a06096648fc7ee9257257dc4fb@mac.com> Message-ID: > Others, however, make me wonder -- and perhaps some linguist colleagues can > help out -- is there an overriding principle in the English language or > culture why this > butchering is done? > PavLOVa > SharaPOva (she finally gave in and said, ok, that's my name) I long thought the tendency for Americans to stress the -OV in feminine names, as in the two examples you give, was one such overriding principle. But then, at precisely the same time that ShaRApova turned into SharaPOva, KuznetSOva mutated into KuzNETZova. That one has be baffled. The other seeming regularity is a tendency to want to stress the -IN in feminine names, but not masculine. So people who have no problem saying SAfin call his sister SaFEENa. > > LerMONTov (I doubt the pronouncers have heard of Learmont) > This is a new one on me. My students have no trouble with LERmontov, by analogy with their versions of TURgenev and NABokov. > > In exasperation, I tell my Anglo speakers, just decide where you want > to put the stress and > then move it one to the right. If you think the stress should go on > the last syllable, then put > it on the first. At least I increase the probablity of getting it right. > Not a bad rule of thumb. It really does increase the probability of getting it right. Laura Goering ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Fri May 11 01:32:52 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 21:32:52 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: <5492d6a06096648fc7ee9257257dc4fb@mac.com> Message-ID: George Kalbouss wrote: > The discussion on the pronunciation of Kluev has led me to wonder out > loud about a phenomenon that I have been patiently putting up with > lo these 60 years, namely, how Anglo-speakers seem to have a talent > to rarely guess where the stress should go on a Russian name. > > Some of the worst mis-stresses I can figure out. MiKHAIL becomes > "Mick-HALE" because it looks like that, and DACHa is stressed > correctly but the pronunciation is DAKHA (not the way the word > actually looks) because an analogy, for some unknown reason, is made > with the concentration camp, Dachau. I've never heard anyone say "Dakha"; maybe I should get out more. Or maybe not. > Others, however, make me wonder -- and perhaps some linguist > colleagues can help out -- is there an overriding principle in the > English language or culture why this butchering is done? Some of the > more common examples: If you're looking for psychological motivations, the top two have to be laziness and ignorance. For the general public, I'd say ignorance tops the list -- if you don't know Russian, you haven't got a clue. For the news media, it has to be laziness -- if you're standing there interviewing someone and you don't bother to listen to how they say their name, or even ask, you have no excuse. Be that as it may, what do naive monolinguals do when confronted with a foreign name? I'd say they try to apply their native stress rules and/or find one or more similar-sounding words and stress them like that. Since English is a mélange of words from languages with different stress patterns (Germanic with initial stress except for prefixes, French with final stress, Latin with penultimate or antepenultimate stress, etc.), we end up with a very complicated set of rules and patterns to try. My guesses on the specific names you mention: > VLAdimir VL- is foreign and attracts stress; also the Germans have initial stress on Wladimir. > PavLOVa > SharaPOva (she finally gave in and said, ok, that's my name) There seems to be a pattern of stressing -Ova/-Eva in Slavic names even when that would be completely inappropriate in the source language (Polish immigrant substratum?). For example, Navrátilová with initial stress and long vowels in the second and fifth syllables mysteriously gets primary stress on the first and fourth syllables -- obviously because people have only seen it, never heard it. The one in this pattern (other than Share-u-POE-vuh) that bugs me lately is Dementi-YAY-vuh. And of course there's the model who fancies herself a tennis player (who shall remain nameless). > Ki-EV To keep the syllables separate? (IE normally spells /i/, and I do often hear "Chicken KI-ev"). > TOLstoy Germanic initial stress? > LerMONTov (I doubt the pronouncers have heard of Learmont) Never heard this one; wild guessing that a heavy syllable attracts stress. > KHRUSHchev > TURD-jenev Germanic initial stress? > LeNEEN, StaLEEN (yes, despite the notoriety of these names) Never heard either of these, but if you listen to hockey games on radio/TV you'll hear a lot of Swedish names ending with /in/, so maybe that's what they're imitating. > StolichNAYA (the escape route is STOLi, not StoLI). Americans seem to favor stress on -Aya; cf. SlutsKAya, ButyrsKAya, etc. > In exasperation, I tell my Anglo speakers, just decide where you want > to put the stress and then move it one to the right. If you think the > stress should go on the last syllable, then put it on the first. At > least I increase the probablity of getting it right. > > As a consolation, they get BLOK and TVER right the first time. Cute. > Then, there's Nemerovich-Danchenko, Dnepropetrovsk and > Petrodvorets.-- maybe we're asking too much. To paraphrase the prince in /Amadeus/, "too many consonants, couldn't you manage with less"? ;-) -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From emilka at MAC.COM Fri May 11 02:08:18 2007 From: emilka at MAC.COM (Emily Saunders) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 19:08:18 -0700 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: <5492d6a06096648fc7ee9257257dc4fb@mac.com> Message-ID: Not having studied the stress patterns of my native language, I can't really comment on the "mis-stressing" of Russian names by anglo-speakers, but I have noticed some common errors in the opposite direction: DZHEEP CheROkee SuBAru FoRESter being two of my favorites. (Though I have been told that SuBAru is the original Japanese pronunciation and that we anglo-speakers have that one wrong while the Russians have it right.) And there are more, but I can't think of any offhand. At any rate I would say that butchering the pronunciation of foreign words is common across all languages and is not something culturally specific to one linguistic group. Cheers, Emily Saunders P.S. To the previous list of commonly mispronounced Russian words I'd also add baBUSHka and VLADiVOStok (two stressed syllables and neither of them the right one...) On May 10, 2007, at 3:50 PM, George Kalbouss wrote: > The discussion on the pronunciation of Kluev has led me to wonder out > loud about a > phenomenon that I have been patiently putting up with lo these 60 > years, namely, how > Anglo-speakers seem to have a talent to rarely guess where the stress > should go on > a Russian name. > > Some of the worst mis-stresses I can figure out. MiKHAIL becomes > "Mick-HALE" > because it looks like that, and DACHa is stressed correctly but the > pronunciation is > DAKHA (not the way the word actually looks) because an analogy, for > some unknown > reason, is made with the concentration camp, Dachau. > > Others, however, make me wonder -- and perhaps some linguist > colleagues can > help out -- is there an overriding principle in the English language > or culture why this > butchering is done? Some of the more common examples: > > VLAdimir > PavLOVa > SharaPOva (she finally gave in and said, ok, that's my name) > Ki-EV > TOLstoy > LerMONTov (I doubt the pronouncers have heard of Learmont) > KHRUSHchev > TURD-jenev > LeNEEN, StaLEEN (yes, despite the notoriety of these names) > StolichNAYA (the escape route is STOLi, not StoLI). > > In exasperation, I tell my Anglo speakers, just decide where you want > to put the stress and > then move it one to the right. If you think the stress should go on > the last syllable, then put > it on the first. At least I increase the probablity of getting it > right. > > As a consolation, they get BLOK and TVER right the first time. > > Then, there's Nemerovich-Danchenko, Dnepropetrovsk and > Petrodvorets.-- maybe we're > asking too much. > > George Kalbouss > (The) Ohio State University > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From colkitto at ROGERS.COM Fri May 11 03:00:48 2007 From: colkitto at ROGERS.COM (colkitto) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 23:00:48 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing Message-ID: > > Some of the worst mis-stresses I can figure out. MiKHAIL becomes > "Mick-HALE" > because it looks like that, and DACHa is stressed correctly but the > pronunciation is > DAKHA (not the way the word actually looks) because an analogy, for some > unknown > reason, is made with the concentration camp, Dachau. Actually, I heard the analogy made with Scottish Gaelic dachaidh (dhachaidh) - "home" , where a linguistically sophisticated speaker (university lecturer in a European language, neither Slavic or Celtic) asked if it were related to dacha (same stress), but with a fricative instead of palatal. folk etuymologies never case to amaze and meanwhile, to round off the triangle, equating "Dachau" and "dachaidh" is something that never occurred to me - although judging from the recent apparent shift of interest on the part of the insaner neo-Nazis to Celtic material, maybe there's a short horror story waiting to be written ....... also, in Afrikaans "dagga:" (pron. dakha!!) is "marijuana".......... ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kbtrans at COX.NET Fri May 11 03:06:27 2007 From: kbtrans at COX.NET (Kim Braithwaite) Date: Thu, 10 May 2007 20:06:27 -0700 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing Message-ID: Several of Mr Gallagher's in-depth linguistic points are well taken. I do think calling natural speechways "ignorance" is going too far. I don't buy the notion that speakers of English ought to reproduce every phonological nicety of foreign names when speaking English. While interacting with Russians and Georgians in Tbilisi, I found it perfectly natural and acceptable that they pronounced my surname with a "tapped r" instead of the correct retroflex r, or a plain or aspirated t instead of the correct interdental th, or a v instead of the correct w. They were, after all, speaking Russian and Georgian. (I did point out during one interview - with wry intent - that the correct pronunciation of Texas is TEK-suss rather than teh-KHASS. They got the joke). Russian names aside, consider Chinese. Does anyone think that English speakers (whether journalists or layfolk) should be obliged to master the intricacies of the tones? A wrong tone on a Chinese name or ordinary word, as everyone knows, may not only sound strange but could cause serious misunderstanding and even offense - when speaking Chinese. When speaking English, I say live with it. My sympathies to Mr Koulbass. Sixty years adds up to a lot of anguish. Mr Kim Braithwaite, Translator "Good is better than evil, because it's nicer" - Mammy Yokum (Al Capp) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul B. Gallagher" To: Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2007 6:32 PM Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Anglo mis-stressing > George Kalbouss wrote: > >> The discussion on the pronunciation of Kluev has led me to wonder out >> loud about a phenomenon that I have been patiently putting up with >> lo these 60 years, namely, how Anglo-speakers seem to have a talent >> to rarely guess where the stress should go on a Russian name. >> >> Some of the worst mis-stresses I can figure out. MiKHAIL becomes >> "Mick-HALE" because it looks like that, and DACHa is stressed >> correctly but the pronunciation is DAKHA (not the way the word >> actually looks) because an analogy, for some unknown reason, is made >> with the concentration camp, Dachau. > > I've never heard anyone say "Dakha"; maybe I should get out more. Or maybe > not. > >> Others, however, make me wonder -- and perhaps some linguist colleagues >> can help out -- is there an overriding principle in the >> English language or culture why this butchering is done? Some of the >> more common examples: > > If you're looking for psychological motivations, the top two have to be > laziness and ignorance. For the general public, I'd say ignorance tops the > list -- if you don't know Russian, you haven't got a clue. For the news > media, it has to be laziness -- if you're standing there interviewing > someone and you don't bother to listen to how they say their name, or even > ask, you have no excuse. > > Be that as it may, what do naive monolinguals do when confronted with a > foreign name? I'd say they try to apply their native stress rules and/or > find one or more similar-sounding words and stress them like that. Since > English is a mélange of words from languages with different stress > patterns (Germanic with initial stress except for prefixes, French with > final stress, Latin with penultimate or antepenultimate stress, etc.), we > end up with a very complicated set of rules and patterns to try. > > My guesses on the specific names you mention: > >> VLAdimir > > VL- is foreign and attracts stress; also the Germans have initial stress > on Wladimir. > >> PavLOVa >> SharaPOva (she finally gave in and said, ok, that's my name) > > There seems to be a pattern of stressing -Ova/-Eva in Slavic names even > when that would be completely inappropriate in the source language (Polish > immigrant substratum?). For example, Navrátilová with initial stress and > long vowels in the second and fifth syllables mysteriously gets primary > stress on the first and fourth syllables -- obviously because people have > only seen it, never heard it. The one in this pattern (other than > Share-u-POE-vuh) that bugs me lately is Dementi-YAY-vuh. And of course > there's the model who fancies herself a tennis player (who shall remain > nameless). > >> Ki-EV > > To keep the syllables separate? (IE normally spells /i/, and I do often > hear "Chicken KI-ev"). > >> TOLstoy > > Germanic initial stress? > >> LerMONTov (I doubt the pronouncers have heard of Learmont) > > Never heard this one; wild guessing that a heavy syllable attracts stress. > >> KHRUSHchev >> TURD-jenev > > Germanic initial stress? > >> LeNEEN, StaLEEN (yes, despite the notoriety of these names) > > Never heard either of these, but if you listen to hockey games on radio/TV > you'll hear a lot of Swedish names ending with /in/, so maybe that's what > they're imitating. > >> StolichNAYA (the escape route is STOLi, not StoLI). > > Americans seem to favor stress on -Aya; cf. SlutsKAya, ButyrsKAya, etc. > >> In exasperation, I tell my Anglo speakers, just decide where you want >> to put the stress and then move it one to the right. If you think the >> stress should go on the last syllable, then put it on the first. At >> least I increase the probablity of getting it right. >> >> As a consolation, they get BLOK and TVER right the first time. > > Cute. > >> Then, there's Nemerovich-Danchenko, Dnepropetrovsk and Petrodvorets.-- >> maybe we're asking too much. > > To paraphrase the prince in /Amadeus/, "too many consonants, couldn't you > manage with less"? ;-) > > -- > War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. > -- > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jwilson at SRAS.ORG Fri May 11 08:16:25 2007 From: jwilson at SRAS.ORG (Josh Wilson) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 12:16:25 +0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: <009601c79379$5ddf4e30$6401a8c0@your46e94owx6a> Message-ID: This is definitely something that affects all cross-cultural relations, and in both directions. I've lived in Moscow for nearly 4 years now. My name - Josh Wilson - although fairly common for an American name, contains two sounds that do not occur in Russian. The phonetics of my last name are inevitably changed by Russians who pronounce it "u-ILson" or, heaven forbid "VILson," which is a linguistic twist I've never really understood (English pronounced with German rules by a Russian? Strange). Add to that that my first name, Josh, is rarely known by Russians and consists of sounds that are difficult for Russians to naturally put together. So, their natural speechways morph the name into "George," a name they are more familiar with and can more easily pronounce. What is your name? Josh George! What a great English name! No, Josh Yes, George! Pleased to meet you. In many cases, if I don't plan to have a long term relationship with the person, I just let them think my name is George. If I will have a long term relationship with them, I go through the explanation of the name Josh, that it is different from George, derived from the Hebrew... blah blah blah, and please don't confuse me with my president. Only then do they seem to be able to see the difference, but they still usually poorly pronounce the name, usually as something like "Dzhush." So, while I send Ms. SharaPOva my condolences, I agree with Mr. Braitvait. Best just to accept that fact that vast majority of people in a foreign country will not be able to "properly" pronounce your name because all speechways are unique and difficult to change. If you want people to properly pronounce it every time, you will have to individually educate each foreigner - and not always with success. Best, Dzhush VILson Asst. Director The School of Russian and Asian Studies Editor-in-Chief Vestnik, The Journal of Russian and Asian Studies www.sras.org jwilson at sras.org -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Kim Braithwaite Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 7:06 AM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Anglo mis-stressing Several of Mr Gallagher's in-depth linguistic points are well taken. I do think calling natural speechways "ignorance" is going too far. I don't buy the notion that speakers of English ought to reproduce every phonological nicety of foreign names when speaking English. While interacting with Russians and Georgians in Tbilisi, I found it perfectly natural and acceptable that they pronounced my surname with a "tapped r" instead of the correct retroflex r, or a plain or aspirated t instead of the correct interdental th, or a v instead of the correct w. They were, after all, speaking Russian and Georgian. (I did point out during one interview - with wry intent - that the correct pronunciation of Texas is TEK-suss rather than teh-KHASS. They got the joke). Russian names aside, consider Chinese. Does anyone think that English speakers (whether journalists or layfolk) should be obliged to master the intricacies of the tones? A wrong tone on a Chinese name or ordinary word, as everyone knows, may not only sound strange but could cause serious misunderstanding and even offense - when speaking Chinese. When speaking English, I say live with it. My sympathies to Mr Koulbass. Sixty years adds up to a lot of anguish. Mr Kim Braithwaite, Translator "Good is better than evil, because it's nicer" - Mammy Yokum (Al Capp) ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul B. Gallagher" To: Sent: Thursday, May 10, 2007 6:32 PM Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Anglo mis-stressing > George Kalbouss wrote: > >> The discussion on the pronunciation of Kluev has led me to wonder out >> loud about a phenomenon that I have been patiently putting up with >> lo these 60 years, namely, how Anglo-speakers seem to have a talent >> to rarely guess where the stress should go on a Russian name. >> >> Some of the worst mis-stresses I can figure out. MiKHAIL becomes >> "Mick-HALE" because it looks like that, and DACHa is stressed >> correctly but the pronunciation is DAKHA (not the way the word >> actually looks) because an analogy, for some unknown reason, is made >> with the concentration camp, Dachau. > > I've never heard anyone say "Dakha"; maybe I should get out more. Or maybe > not. > >> Others, however, make me wonder -- and perhaps some linguist colleagues >> can help out -- is there an overriding principle in the >> English language or culture why this butchering is done? Some of the >> more common examples: > > If you're looking for psychological motivations, the top two have to be > laziness and ignorance. For the general public, I'd say ignorance tops the > list -- if you don't know Russian, you haven't got a clue. For the news > media, it has to be laziness -- if you're standing there interviewing > someone and you don't bother to listen to how they say their name, or even > ask, you have no excuse. > > Be that as it may, what do naive monolinguals do when confronted with a > foreign name? I'd say they try to apply their native stress rules and/or > find one or more similar-sounding words and stress them like that. Since > English is a mélange of words from languages with different stress > patterns (Germanic with initial stress except for prefixes, French with > final stress, Latin with penultimate or antepenultimate stress, etc.), we > end up with a very complicated set of rules and patterns to try. > > My guesses on the specific names you mention: > >> VLAdimir > > VL- is foreign and attracts stress; also the Germans have initial stress > on Wladimir. > >> PavLOVa >> SharaPOva (she finally gave in and said, ok, that's my name) > > There seems to be a pattern of stressing -Ova/-Eva in Slavic names even > when that would be completely inappropriate in the source language (Polish > immigrant substratum?). For example, Navrátilová with initial stress and > long vowels in the second and fifth syllables mysteriously gets primary > stress on the first and fourth syllables -- obviously because people have > only seen it, never heard it. The one in this pattern (other than > Share-u-POE-vuh) that bugs me lately is Dementi-YAY-vuh. And of course > there's the model who fancies herself a tennis player (who shall remain > nameless). > >> Ki-EV > > To keep the syllables separate? (IE normally spells /i/, and I do often > hear "Chicken KI-ev"). > >> TOLstoy > > Germanic initial stress? > >> LerMONTov (I doubt the pronouncers have heard of Learmont) > > Never heard this one; wild guessing that a heavy syllable attracts stress. > >> KHRUSHchev >> TURD-jenev > > Germanic initial stress? > >> LeNEEN, StaLEEN (yes, despite the notoriety of these names) > > Never heard either of these, but if you listen to hockey games on radio/TV > you'll hear a lot of Swedish names ending with /in/, so maybe that's what > they're imitating. > >> StolichNAYA (the escape route is STOLi, not StoLI). > > Americans seem to favor stress on -Aya; cf. SlutsKAya, ButyrsKAya, etc. > >> In exasperation, I tell my Anglo speakers, just decide where you want >> to put the stress and then move it one to the right. If you think the >> stress should go on the last syllable, then put it on the first. At >> least I increase the probablity of getting it right. >> >> As a consolation, they get BLOK and TVER right the first time. > > Cute. > >> Then, there's Nemerovich-Danchenko, Dnepropetrovsk and Petrodvorets.-- >> maybe we're asking too much. > > To paraphrase the prince in /Amadeus/, "too many consonants, couldn't you > manage with less"? ;-) > > -- > War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. > -- > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From colkitto at ROGERS.COM Fri May 11 13:18:34 2007 From: colkitto at ROGERS.COM (colkitto) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 09:18:34 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing Message-ID: What Josh Wilson is describing affects place names as well as personal names ..... As a minor example of the forces that led to St. Petersburg being changed to Petrograd ....... snippet from a dialogue in Minsk late 70's Soviet (I forgot the name, a one-time acquaintance): Gde Vy zanimaetes? Self: Edinburg (as found in most dictionaries) Soviet: A pocemu u Vasej stolicy nemeckoe nazvanie? ........ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From anthony.j.vanchu at NASA.GOV Fri May 11 14:58:33 2007 From: anthony.j.vanchu at NASA.GOV (Vanchu, Anthony J. (JSC-AH)[TTI]) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 09:58:33 -0500 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: A<5492d6a06096648fc7ee9257257dc4fb@mac.com> Message-ID: > StolichNAYA (the escape route is STOLi, not StoLI). >Americans seem to favor stress on -Aya; cf. SlutsKAya, ButyrsKAya, etc. A propros StolichNAYA: I don't know if they still do it in their ads, but--and it was perhaps the US distributors of Stolichnaya that were behind this--they used to give the a guide to pronounciation of the vodka that showed the stress where we all know it shouldn't be. Remember also that Stolichnaya was sold in the US pre-glasnost'. Perhaps the US distributors managed to convince the Soviet side that they would sell more vodka that way. Or perhaps they never even asked--or cared. Tony Dr. Anthony J. Vanchu Director, JSC Language Education Center TechTrans International, Inc. NASA Johnson Space Center Houston, TX anthony.j.vanchu at nasa.gov Phone: (281) 483-0644 Fax: (281) 483-4050 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From katilahti at YAHOO.COM Fri May 11 15:09:23 2007 From: katilahti at YAHOO.COM (Katherine Lahti) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 08:09:23 -0700 Subject: Help with finding good English "Pikovaia Dama" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Slavists, My colleague in the English Department, Diane Hunter, regularly writes me for recommendations. I thought I would just share her request with you. Though you can answer onlist, it's probably best to write her directly: e-mail address below. -K. Lahti "Can you direct me to a good edition of 'The Queen of Spades'? I would like to study the story and perhaps the opera as well. Thank you for your attention to this inquiry. All the best, DH Professor Dianne Hunter Trinity College Department of English Hartford, CT 06106 USA dhunter at trincoll.edu voice: (860) 297 2462 fax: (860) 297 5258 web: http://www.trincoll.edu/~dhunter/" ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Franssuasso at HOTMAIL.COM Sat May 12 15:40:22 2007 From: Franssuasso at HOTMAIL.COM (Frans Suasso) Date: Sat, 12 May 2007 17:40:22 +0200 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing Message-ID: Not only Americans, but Germans and Dutch also miss-stress Aya . Not because this is a normal stress pattern in their own language, but because it is not, and it therefore sounds exotic. Dr Frans Suasso Naarden, the Netherlands ----- Original Message ----- From: "Vanchu, Anthony J. (JSC-AH)[TTI]" To: Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 4:58 PM Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Anglo mis-stressing >> StolichNAYA (the escape route is STOLi, not StoLI). > >>Americans seem to favor stress on -Aya; cf. SlutsKAya, ButyrsKAya, etc. > > > > A propros StolichNAYA: I don't know if they still do it in their ads, > but--and it was perhaps the US distributors of Stolichnaya that were > behind this--they used to give the a guide to pronounciation of the > vodka that showed the stress where we all know it shouldn't be. > Remember also that Stolichnaya was sold in the US pre-glasnost'. > Perhaps the US distributors managed to convince the Soviet side that > they would sell more vodka that way. Or perhaps they never even > asked--or cared. > > Tony > > Dr. Anthony J. Vanchu > Director, JSC Language Education Center > TechTrans International, Inc. > NASA Johnson Space Center > Houston, TX > anthony.j.vanchu at nasa.gov > Phone: (281) 483-0644 > Fax: (281) 483-4050 > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From M.J.BERRY.RUS at BHAM.AC.UK Fri May 11 15:51:23 2007 From: M.J.BERRY.RUS at BHAM.AC.UK (Michael Berry) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 16:51:23 +0100 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing Message-ID: This correspondence reminds me of a related phenomenon I have often noticed with beginners - students tend to make the same number of mistakes whether they are reading from a stressed text or an unstressed text. Has anyone else noticed this? Mike Berry Honorary Senior Research Fellow, Centre for Russian and East European Studies, University of Birmingham, Birmingham B15 2TT ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sbishop at WELLESLEY.EDU Fri May 11 16:53:22 2007 From: sbishop at WELLESLEY.EDU (Sarah Clovis Bishop) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 12:53:22 -0400 Subject: Seeking apartment rental in St. Petersburg Message-ID: I'd like to rent a three-room apartment in a central Petersburg location for one week starting July 16. Please respond off-line at aweiner at wellesley.edu Spasibo! Adam Weiner ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sforres1 at SWARTHMORE.EDU Fri May 11 17:47:03 2007 From: sforres1 at SWARTHMORE.EDU (Sibelan E S Forrester) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 13:47:03 -0400 Subject: send your institution's enrollment data Message-ID: Dear colleagues, As the semester is ending and you're taking care of the associated house-keeping, it's an excellent time to visit the CCPCR web site at and enter the enrollments for your institution's first- and second-year Russian courses. It is also possible to enter data for earlier years, if you did not do so at the time. The site contains a great deal of other useful information as well. With best wishes, Sibelan Sibelan Forrester Russian/Modern Languages and Literatures Swarthmore College (AATSEEL President, 2007-2008) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gjanecek at UKY.EDU Fri May 11 18:29:00 2007 From: gjanecek at UKY.EDU (Gerald Janecek) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 14:29:00 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: Message-ID: For what it's worth, I did a study of stress patterns in connection with zaum' and discovered that there is a statistical tendency (stress entropy, if you will) toward the first syllable in English and toward the middle syllable in Russian. This doesn't explain all the peculiarities, where analogy may play a part, but it seems to be connected with English's monosyllabic, Anglo-Saxon roots versus the agglutinative structure of Russian words, where the root tends to be in the middle, surrounded by prefixes and suffixes. Just a hypothesis, but it explains VLAdimir in English and marKEting in Russian. Jerry Janecek On May 10, 2007, at 10:08 PM, Emily Saunders wrote: > Not having studied the stress patterns of my native language, I > can't really comment on the "mis-stressing" of Russian names by > anglo-speakers, but I have noticed some common errors in the > opposite direction: > > DZHEEP CheROkee > SuBAru FoRESter > > being two of my favorites. (Though I have been told that SuBAru > is the original Japanese pronunciation and that we anglo-speakers > have that one wrong while the Russians have it right.) > > And there are more, but I can't think of any offhand. At any rate > I would say that butchering the pronunciation of foreign words is > common across all languages and is not something culturally > specific to one linguistic group. > > Cheers, > > Emily Saunders > > P.S. To the previous list of commonly mispronounced Russian words > I'd also add baBUSHka and VLADiVOStok (two stressed syllables and > neither of them the right one...) > > On May 10, 2007, at 3:50 PM, George Kalbouss wrote: > >> The discussion on the pronunciation of Kluev has led me to wonder >> out loud about a >> phenomenon that I have been patiently putting up with lo these 60 >> years, namely, how >> Anglo-speakers seem to have a talent to rarely guess where the >> stress should go on >> a Russian name. >> >> Some of the worst mis-stresses I can figure out. MiKHAIL becomes >> "Mick-HALE" >> because it looks like that, and DACHa is stressed correctly but >> the pronunciation is >> DAKHA (not the way the word actually looks) because an analogy, >> for some unknown >> reason, is made with the concentration camp, Dachau. >> >> Others, however, make me wonder -- and perhaps some linguist >> colleagues can >> help out -- is there an overriding principle in the English >> language or culture why this >> butchering is done? Some of the more common examples: >> >> VLAdimir >> PavLOVa >> SharaPOva (she finally gave in and said, ok, that's my name) >> Ki-EV >> TOLstoy >> LerMONTov (I doubt the pronouncers have heard of Learmont) >> KHRUSHchev >> TURD-jenev >> LeNEEN, StaLEEN (yes, despite the notoriety of these names) >> StolichNAYA (the escape route is STOLi, not StoLI). >> >> In exasperation, I tell my Anglo speakers, just decide where you >> want to put the stress and >> then move it one to the right. If you think the stress should go >> on the last syllable, then put >> it on the first. At least I increase the probablity of getting it >> right. >> >> As a consolation, they get BLOK and TVER right the first time. >> >> Then, there's Nemerovich-Danchenko, Dnepropetrovsk and >> Petrodvorets.-- maybe we're >> asking too much. >> >> George Kalbouss >> (The) Ohio State University >> >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> ---- >> Use your web browser to search the archives, control your >> subscription >> options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface >> at: >> http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >> --------------------------------------------------------------------- >> ---- >> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > Gerald Janecek, Professor of Russian gjanecek at uky.edu Dept. of Modern & Classical Languages University of Kentucky Lexington, KY 40506 Editor, Slavic & East European Journal seej at uky.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From vanya1v at YAHOO.COM Fri May 11 19:06:21 2007 From: vanya1v at YAHOO.COM (J.W.) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 15:06:21 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing Message-ID: Ottawa (Canada), Friday 11/5/07 14h40 EDT In response to Mr Braithwaite's comment on the Russian pronunciation of 'Texas', I would say the 'correctness' depends on whether one favours the American or Mexican point of view. As with an earlier comment on the Japanese pronunciation of 'Subaru', when it comes to preserving original pronunciations, it is the Russians who have the more 'correct' take on Texas. My own all-time favourite in this department is some German friends of mine (new immigrants to Canada) pronouncing the English word 'husband' as 'Halsband' (a German word meaning, literally, 'throat-collar') -- the same German friends who insisted that English 'become' must mean the same as the German word 'bekommen' (acquire), and kept saying that they were most eager to 'become a car'. But in terms of adaptation, I think Mr Braithwaite has a good point. Not even TV journalists, at least while speaking their own language, should be expected to master foreign phonlogy (though many would argue that an exception should be made for stress, since that is within most human beings' capabilities). On the other hand, I have no problem with Russians' pronouncing the name of my country as 'ka-NA-da' or even my own name as 'vuds-VORT', as long as they are speaking Russian. But if they are trying to speak English, I feel they should make the effort to get the stress right, especially after it is pointed out. A similar onus, of course, is on English-speakers in their attempts to speak Russian. But just think -- if everyone learnt to pronounce all foreign names with perfect ease, the world might become more politically correct, but at the same time it would lose a terrific source of humour! (Mr) John Woodsworth Certified Translator (Russian-English) Website: http://www.kanadacha.ca E-mail: jw at kanadacha.ca / vanya1v at yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Fri May 11 19:09:32 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 15:09:32 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: <009601c79379$5ddf4e30$6401a8c0@your46e94owx6a> Message-ID: Kim Braithwaite wrote: > Several of Mr Gallagher's in-depth linguistic points are well taken. > I do think calling natural speechways "ignorance" is going too far. I > don't buy the notion that speakers of English ought to reproduce > every phonological nicety of foreign names when speaking English. Well, it may not have been perfectly clear given the context, but I was using "ignorance" in the neutral sense, to mean "lack of knowledge." Как известно, we are all ignorant of other cultures to some extent, and that doesn't imply any fault on our part. I happen to be largely ignorant of Kalenjin (a language of Kenya), so if you ask me to pronounce a Kalenjin name I will have no rules to follow but the ones I've picked up as a speaker of English. I do realize that many people use "ignorant" in a pejorative sense, as a near synonym for "stupid," but that wasn't my intent. Now, where we draw the line between reasonable and unreasonable expectations for familiarity with other cultures is open to debate, and honest men and women will differ. I happen to think it reasonable for a person making the acquaintance of a person from another culture to make some reasonable effort to get their name reasonably correct. And I think it reasonable for a journalist covering a subject to make more than a reasonable effort to get the names as close to correct as possible, just as they are expected to make their best efforts to get the facts straight. Suppose for a moment that were is no long-standing convention on the pronunciation and we encountered the city of Paris for the first time. Should we say /'pærɪs/ according to English spelling conventions, with utter disregard for the native sound, or should we make the slightest effort and say /pæ'ri/, which is eminently pronounceable? I would say that /pæ'ri/ is quite reasonable, but in this case of course I'm overruled by convention. > While interacting with Russians and Georgians in Tbilisi, I found it > perfectly natural and acceptable that they pronounced my surname > with a "tapped r" instead of the correct retroflex r, or a plain or > aspirated t instead of the correct interdental th, or a v instead of > the correct w. They were, after all, speaking Russian and Georgian. Here we're dealing with sounds that are "unpronounceable" or "illegal" in the target language, and that's a different matter. > (I did point out during one interview - with wry intent - that the > correct pronunciation of Texas is TEK-suss rather than teh-KHASS. > They got the joke). Hm. I didn't... > Russian names aside, consider Chinese. Does anyone think that English > speakers (whether journalists or layfolk) should be obliged to > master the intricacies of the tones? A wrong tone on a Chinese name > or ordinary word, as everyone knows, may not only sound strange but > could cause serious misunderstanding and even offense -- when > speaking Chinese. When speaking English, I say live with it. It depends on your purpose. If you're speaking to other monolinguals, you're right, though as a linguist I do try harder. But if you're a journalist who can't speak the language even passably, you're at a severe disadvantage and you're doing your readers a disservice by not getting the real story. And I find it very difficult to say Крусчевъ in the presence of Russian speakers or Lemioux in the presence of French speakers. I expect them to wince just as I do when a Frenchman calls me "Pole" instead of "Paul," and I think a person who knows better but still engages in such butchery is disrespectful to the listener. -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Ambrosekat at AOL.COM Fri May 11 19:16:23 2007 From: Ambrosekat at AOL.COM (Ambrosekat at AOL.COM) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 15:16:23 EDT Subject: Help with finding good English "Pikovaia Dama" Message-ID: There is an excellent recent (2005) translation by Robert Chandler, in Russian Short Stories from Pushkin to Buida, Penguin Classics. Regards Kathryn Ambrose Keele University UK ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Fri May 11 20:05:25 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 21:05:25 +0100 Subject: Help with finding good English "Pikovaia Dama" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear all, I'm really grateful to Kathryn for saying this - but I need to say that it was a collaborative translation, by me and my wife and Olga Meerson. Pushkin's is the most subtle prose I know, and there is a great deal that would have passed me by if it were not for Olga. Best Wishes, Robert > There is an excellent recent (2005) translation by Robert Chandler, in > Russian Short Stories from Pushkin to Buida, Penguin Classics. > > Regards > > Kathryn Ambrose > Keele University > UK > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From pstock at BRANDEIS.EDU Fri May 11 20:18:05 2007 From: pstock at BRANDEIS.EDU (David Powelstock) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 16:18:05 -0400 Subject: Help with finding good English "Pikovaia Dama" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: I enthusiastically second this recommendation. David David Powelstock Asst. Prof. of Russian & East European Literatures Chair, Program in Russian & East European Studies Brandeis University GRALL, MS 024 Waltham, MA 02454-9110 781.736.3347 (Office) -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Ambrosekat at AOL.COM Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 3:16 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Help with finding good English "Pikovaia Dama" There is an excellent recent (2005) translation by Robert Chandler, in Russian Short Stories from Pushkin to Buida, Penguin Classics. Regards Kathryn Ambrose Keele University UK ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jm3 at EVANSVILLE.EDU Fri May 11 20:18:35 2007 From: jm3 at EVANSVILLE.EDU (Meredig, John) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 15:18:35 -0500 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: A<4644BEA8.9428DE7C@yahoo.com> Message-ID: This latest thread brings to mind the mnemonic devices in English used to remember various words and phrases in Russian, such as "Nice driveway!", "yellow blue tibia", and the infamous "Does your ass fit ya!" (supposedly taught to American soldiers in the Second World War so they could greet their Russian allies--say it really fast and it works passably. I suspect the story may be apocryphal. It sounds too good to be true--can anyone vouch for its authenticity? I do use it on Day One of beginning Russian and it never fails to make an impression). Perhaps there are more such phrases out there? John Meredig -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of J.W. Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 2:06 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Anglo mis-stressing Ottawa (Canada), Friday 11/5/07 14h40 EDT In response to Mr Braithwaite's comment on the Russian pronunciation of 'Texas', I would say the 'correctness' depends on whether one favours the American or Mexican point of view. As with an earlier comment on the Japanese pronunciation of 'Subaru', when it comes to preserving original pronunciations, it is the Russians who have the more 'correct' take on Texas. My own all-time favourite in this department is some German friends of mine (new immigrants to Canada) pronouncing the English word 'husband' as 'Halsband' (a German word meaning, literally, 'throat-collar') -- the same German friends who insisted that English 'become' must mean the same as the German word 'bekommen' (acquire), and kept saying that they were most eager to 'become a car'. But in terms of adaptation, I think Mr Braithwaite has a good point. Not even TV journalists, at least while speaking their own language, should be expected to master foreign phonlogy (though many would argue that an exception should be made for stress, since that is within most human beings' capabilities). On the other hand, I have no problem with Russians' pronouncing the name of my country as 'ka-NA-da' or even my own name as 'vuds-VORT', as long as they are speaking Russian. But if they are trying to speak English, I feel they should make the effort to get the stress right, especially after it is pointed out. A similar onus, of course, is on English-speakers in their attempts to speak Russian. But just think -- if everyone learnt to pronounce all foreign names with perfect ease, the world might become more politically correct, but at the same time it would lose a terrific source of humour! (Mr) John Woodsworth Certified Translator (Russian-English) Website: http://www.kanadacha.ca E-mail: jw at kanadacha.ca / vanya1v at yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------ - Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------ - ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Fri May 11 20:27:15 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 16:27:15 -0400 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: <5C7554D82F4671478985015814A65B770AC6755B@UEEXCHANGE.evansville.edu> Message-ID: On May 11, 2007, at 4:18 PM, Meredig, John wrote: > This latest thread brings to mind the mnemonic devices in English used > to remember various words and phrases in Russian, such as "Nice > driveway!", "yellow blue tibia", and the infamous "Does your ass fit > ya!" (supposedly taught to American soldiers in the Second World > War so > they could greet their Russian allies--say it really fast and it works > passably. I suspect the story may be apocryphal. It sounds too good to > be true--can anyone vouch for its authenticity? I do use it on Day One > of beginning Russian and it never fails to make an impression). > > Perhaps there are more such phrases out there? Dogs feet on you. Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From nflrc at HAWAII.EDU Fri May 11 20:44:40 2007 From: nflrc at HAWAII.EDU (National Foreign Language Resource Center) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 10:44:40 -1000 Subject: TBLT 2007 registration reminder Message-ID: Our apologies for any cross-postings . . . Dear colleague, The early-bird registration deadline for the Hawaii TBLT 2007 conference is May 15, 2007. Registration forms and instructions are available on the TBLT 2007 web site at: http://www.hawaii.edu/tblt2007/registration.html **Important note for participants registering from outside of the U.S.: It is possible to pay registration fees via a direct bank-to-bank wire transfer, should you need to do so. If you would like to utilize this method for paying your registration fees, please send a message to us at organizers at tblt2007.org and we will provide you with further instructions. Here is an overview of the TBLT 2007 schedule. For more information, please consult the web site. All conference events will take place in the Imin International Conference Center on the University of Hawaii at Manoa Campus. Please see the "Transportation" page on the web site for directions to the conference venue. The only exception will be the Friday evening optional social event hosted at the Waikiki Aquarium. Thursday, September 20 2:30-4:30 pm: Registration 4:30-6:00 pm: Welcome and Plenary Session #1: Kris Van den Branden, Task-based language education: from theory to practice... and back again. 6:00-8:00 pm: Opening Reception Friday, September 21 8:00-8:30 am: Registration (ongoing throughout the day) 8:30-10:00 am: Concurrent Presentation Sessions 10:00-10:30 am: Coffee Break 10:30-11:30 am: Concurrent Presentation Sessions 11:30-1:00 pm: Lunch 1:00-2:30 pm: Concurrent Presentation Sessions 2:30-3:00 pm: Coffee Break 3:00-4:00 pm: Concurrent Presentation Sessions 4:00-4:30 pm: Break 4:30-6:00 pm: Plenary Session #2: Peter Robinson, Rethinking-for-speaking and L2 task demands: The Cognition Hypothesis, task classification and sequencing AND Peter Skehan, Evidence and interpretation: Attentional limitations and the Cognition Hypothesis in task-based performance 6:30-9:00 pm: TBLT 2007 Social at the Waikiki Aquarium (extra ticketed event) Saturday, September 22 8:00-8:30 am: Registration & Poster Set-up (viewing available throughout the day) 8:30-10:00 am: Concurrent Presentation Sessions 10:00-10:30 am: Coffee Break 10:30-11:30 am: Concurrent Presentation Sessions 11:30-12:30 pm: Lunch 12:30-1:30 pm: Poster Viewing with Presenters on site 1:30-2:30 pm: Concurrent Presentation Sessions 2:30-3:00 pm: Coffee Break 3:00-4:00 pm: Concurrent Presentation Sessions 4:00-4:30 pm: Break 4:30-6:00 pm: Closing and Plenary Session #3: Virginia Samuda, Tasks, design, and the architecture of pedagogic spaces We look forward to seeing you in Hawaii in September. Sincerely, TBLT 2007 Organizing Committee ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From bigjim at U.WASHINGTON.EDU Fri May 11 21:40:02 2007 From: bigjim at U.WASHINGTON.EDU (augerot) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 14:40:02 -0700 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing In-Reply-To: <7FA1312F-1912-483C-9779-4853B8987454@american.edu> Message-ID: Better: "dogs feed on ya". -- jim On Fri, 11 May 2007, Alina Israeli wrote: > On May 11, 2007, at 4:18 PM, Meredig, John wrote: > >> This latest thread brings to mind the mnemonic devices in English used >> to remember various words and phrases in Russian, such as "Nice >> driveway!", "yellow blue tibia", and the infamous "Does your ass fit >> ya!" (supposedly taught to American soldiers in the Second World War so >> they could greet their Russian allies--say it really fast and it works >> passably. I suspect the story may be apocryphal. It sounds too good to >> be true--can anyone vouch for its authenticity? I do use it on Day One >> of beginning Russian and it never fails to make an impression). >> >> Perhaps there are more such phrases out there? > > > Dogs feet on you. > > > Alina Israeli > LFS, American University > 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW > Washington DC. 20016 > (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 > aisrael at american.edu > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kbtrans at COX.NET Fri May 11 22:37:50 2007 From: kbtrans at COX.NET (Kim Braithwaite) Date: Fri, 11 May 2007 15:37:50 -0700 Subject: Anglo mis-stressing Message-ID: It's refreshing to see a note or two of levity in these exchanges, which have been wonderfully enlightening in so many ways and from so many points of view. We're all in the same club. We learn from each other. On a slightly related note (very slightly), I'm reminded of the punchline to one of Steve Martin's comic routines, delivered in his patented faux-naive and mock-exasperated manner: "Those French!" he said with wry intent. "They've got a different word for everything!" Mr Kim Braithwaite, Translator "Good is better than evil, because it's nicer" - Mammy Yokum (Al Capp) ----- Original Message ----- From: "augerot" To: Sent: Friday, May 11, 2007 2:40 PM Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Anglo mis-stressing > Better: "dogs feed on ya". > > -- > jim > > On Fri, 11 May 2007, Alina Israeli wrote: > >> On May 11, 2007, at 4:18 PM, Meredig, John wrote: >> >>> This latest thread brings to mind the mnemonic devices in English used >>> to remember various words and phrases in Russian, such as "Nice >>> driveway!", "yellow blue tibia", and the infamous "Does your ass fit >>> ya!" (supposedly taught to American soldiers in the Second World War so >>> they could greet their Russian allies--say it really fast and it works >>> passably. I suspect the story may be apocryphal. It sounds too good to >>> be true--can anyone vouch for its authenticity? I do use it on Day One >>> of beginning Russian and it never fails to make an impression). >>> >>> Perhaps there are more such phrases out there? >> >> >> Dogs feet on you. >> >> >> Alina Israeli >> LFS, American University >> 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW >> Washington DC. 20016 >> (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 >> aisrael at american.edu >> >> >> >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription >> options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: >> http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Sun May 13 04:12:50 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 00:12:50 -0400 Subject: Educational terminology -- equivalents? Message-ID: I'm translating a fairly general piece on the Moscow education system (present day), and hopingf someone can suggest the nearest equivalents for these terms: профильный класс лицей колледж кадетский корпус Is a "лицей" like a prep school? I hesitate to translate "колледж" as "college" because my American reader will take it to mean "вуз." The other two have me pretty baffled. For a text that covers territory similar enough to mine to help with context, see . And here's the controlling law (MS Word file in zip archive, 21 KB): Art. 7, Para. 7 defines: Лицей - вид государственного общеобразовательного учреждения, реализующего общеобразовательные программы основного общего и среднего (полного) общего образования, обеспечивающего профильную подготовку обучающихся VIII-XI, IX-XI, X-XI классов и, по решению городского органа управления образованием, VII-XI классов и формирование у них навыков самостоятельной проектной и научно-исследовательской деятельности. Art. 7, Para. 3 defines: Кадетская школа - вид государственного общеобразовательного учреждения, реализующего общеобразовательные программы начального общего, основного общего и среднего (полного) общего и дополнительного образования, обеспечивающие подготовку обучающихся к служению Отечеству на гражданском и военном поприще. This is as close as they get to "кадетский корпус." The terms "профильный класс" and "колледж" do not appear anywhere in the law. MTIA -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU Sun May 13 07:14:01 2007 From: s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU (Prof Steven P Hill) Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 02:14:01 -0500 Subject: Educ. terms (cont.) Message-ID: Dear colleagues: How about "military academy" for "kadetskii korpus"? As a rough approximation, "litsei" (like "gimnaziia") might be rendered as "prep school." But if exactitude is needed in an official document, then one way to skin the cat would be to retain the Russian term in Latin transliteration, followed by a paraphrase in parentheses: e.g., " litsei ( somewhat analogous to a US 'prep school' ) . " Does anybody out there know whether "profil'nyi klass" roughly corresponds to "class in the major [field]"? Or quite a different meaning? Best wishes to all, Steven P Hill, University of Illinois. __ ___ __ __ __ __ __ _ Date: Sun 13 May 01:55:42 CDT 2007 From: Subject: Re: GETPOST SEELANGS To: "Steven P. Hill" Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 00:12:50 -0400 From: "Paul B. Gallagher" Subject: Educational terminology -- equivalents? I'm translating a fairly general piece on the Moscow education system (present day), and hopingf someone can suggest the nearest equivalents for these terms: профильный класс лицей колледж кадетский корпус Is a "лицей" like a prep school? I hesitate to translate "колледж" as "college" because my American reader will take it to mean "вуз." The other two have me pretty baffled. For a text that covers territory similar enough to mine to help with context, see . And here's the controlling law (MS Word file in zip archive, 21 KB): Art. 7, Para. 7 defines: Лицей - вид государственного общеобразовательного учреждения, реализующего общеобразовательные программы основного общего и среднего (полного) общего образования, обеспечивающего профильную подготовку обучающихся VIII-XI, IX-XI, X-XI классов и, по решению городского органа управления образованием, VII-XI классов и формирование у них навыков самостоятельной проектной и научно-исследовательской деятельности. Art. 7, Para. 3 defines: Кадетская школа - вид государственного общеобразовательного учреждения, реализующего общеобразовательные программы начального общего, основного общего и среднего (полного) общего и дополнительного образования, обеспечивающие подготовку обучающихся к служению Отечеству на гражданском и военном поприще. This is as close as they get to "кадетский корпус." The terms "профильный класс" and "колледж" do not appear anywhere in the law. Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com _ __ __ __ __ __ ___ __ ___ _ __ __ __ _ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Sun May 13 12:55:40 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 05:55:40 -0700 Subject: Educ. terms (cont.) Message-ID: Profil'nyj klass, I think is not merely a class in the major field but is also for additional training in the field, either because the students need that extra-preparation for applying to post-highschool higher education institutions (VUZy, the preparation theoretical) or because they need extra-training for immediate post-highschool employment (practical and vocational). In the theoretical sense, a profil'nyj klass may be elite; in the practical, determining the end of one's formal education--an ambiguity akin to the notion of a special ed. class in (American?) English. Olga Meerson Georgetown U. ----- Original Message ----- From: Prof Steven P Hill Date: Sunday, May 13, 2007 0:14 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Educ. terms (cont.) > Dear colleagues: > > How about "military academy" for "kadetskii korpus"? > > As a rough approximation, "litsei" (like "gimnaziia") might be > rendered > as "prep school." But if exactitude is needed in an official > document,then one way to skin the cat would be to retain the > Russian term in > Latin transliteration, followed by a paraphrase in parentheses: e.g., > " litsei ( somewhat analogous to a US 'prep school' ) . " > > Does anybody out there know whether "profil'nyi klass" roughly > corresponds to "class in the major [field]"? Or quite a different > meaning? > > Best wishes to all, > Steven P Hill, > University of Illinois. > __ ___ __ __ __ __ __ _ > > Date: Sun 13 May 01:55:42 CDT 2007 > From: > Subject: Re: GETPOST SEELANGS > To: "Steven P. Hill" > > Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 00:12:50 -0400 > From: "Paul B. Gallagher" > Subject: Educational terminology -- equivalents? > > I'm translating a fairly general piece on the Moscow education > system > (present day), and hopingf someone can suggest the nearest > equivalents > for these terms: > ?????????? ????? > ????? > ??????? > ????????? ?????? > > Is a "?????" like a prep school? > I hesitate to translate "???????" as "college" because my American > reader will take it to mean "???." > The other two have me pretty baffled. > > For a text that covers territory similar enough to mine to help > with > context, see . > > And here's the controlling law (MS Word file in zip archive, 21 > KB): > > > Art. 7, Para. 7 defines: > ????? - ??? ???????????????? ???????????????????? ??????????, > ???????????? ??????????????????? ????????? ????????? ?????? ? > ???????? > (???????) ?????? ???????????, ??????????????? ?????????? > ?????????? > ??????????? VIII-XI, IX-XI, X-XI ??????? ?, ?? ??????? ?????????? > ?????? > ?????????? ????????????, VII-XI ??????? ? ???????????? ? ??? > ??????? > ??????????????? ????????? ? ??????-????????????????? ????????????. > > Art. 7, Para. 3 defines: > ????????? ????? - ??? ???????????????? ???????????????????? > ??????????, > ???????????? ??????????????????? ????????? ?????????? ??????, > ????????? > ?????? ? ???????? (???????) ?????? ? ??????????????? ???????????, > ?????????????? ?????????? ??????????? ? ???????? ????????? ?? > ??????????? ? ??????? ???????. > > This is as close as they get to "????????? ??????." > The terms "?????????? ?????" and "???????" do not appear anywhere > in the > law. > > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > _ __ __ __ __ __ ___ __ ___ _ __ __ __ _ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From margaret.samu at NYU.EDU Sun May 13 13:19:33 2007 From: margaret.samu at NYU.EDU (Margaret Anne Samu) Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 07:19:33 -0600 Subject: Educ. terms (cont.) In-Reply-To: <20070513021401.AOJ15966@expms6.cites.uiuc.edu> Message-ID: Or you could keep "litsei" as "lycee" (with acute accent on the first e). That should be a term that is sufficiently international by rendering it in its original tongue rather than keeping the Russian transliteration into Cyrillic, transliterated into English. Margaret Samu Ph.D. Candidate in Art History Institute of Fine Arts, NYU 1 East 78th Street New York, NY 10021 ----- Original Message ----- From: Prof Steven P Hill Date: Sunday, May 13, 2007 1:14 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Educ. terms (cont.) To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Dear colleagues: > > How about "military academy" for "kadetskii korpus"? > > As a rough approximation, "litsei" (like "gimnaziia") might be > rendered > as "prep school." But if exactitude is needed in an official document, > then one way to skin the cat would be to retain the Russian term in > Latin transliteration, followed by a paraphrase in parentheses: e.g., > " litsei ( somewhat analogous to a US 'prep school' ) . " > > Does anybody out there know whether "profil'nyi klass" roughly > corresponds to "class in the major [field]"? Or quite a different > meaning? > > Best wishes to all, > Steven P Hill, > University of Illinois. > __ ___ __ __ __ __ __ _ > > Date: Sun 13 May 01:55:42 CDT 2007 > From: > Subject: Re: GETPOST SEELANGS > To: "Steven P. Hill" > > Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 00:12:50 -0400 > From: "Paul B. Gallagher" > Subject: Educational terminology -- equivalents? > > I'm translating a fairly general piece on the Moscow education system > > (present day), and hopingf someone can suggest the nearest equivalents > > for these terms: > профильный класс > лицей > колледж > кадетский корпус > > Is a "лицей" like a prep school? > I hesitate to translate "колледж" as "college" because my American > reader will take it to mean "вуз." > The other two have me pretty baffled. > > For a text that covers territory similar enough to mine to help with > context, see <. > > And here's the controlling law (MS Word file in zip archive, 21 KB): > < > > Art. 7, Para. 7 defines: > Лицей - вид государственного общеобразовательного учреждения, > реализующего общеобразовательные программы основного общего и среднего > > (полного) общего образования, обеспечивающего профильную подготовку > обучающихся VIII-XI, IX-XI, X-XI классов и, по решению городского > органа > управления образованием, VII-XI классов и формирование у них навыков > самостоятельной проектной и научно-исследовательской деятельности. > > Art. 7, Para. 3 defines: > Кадетская школа - вид государственного общеобразовательного > учреждения, > реализующего общеобразовательные программы начального общего, > основного > общего и среднего (полного) общего и дополнительного образования, > обеспечивающие подготовку обучающихся к служению Отечеству на > гражданском и военном поприще. > > This is as close as they get to "кадетский корпус." > The terms "профильный класс" and "колледж" do not appear anywhere in > the > law. > > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > _ __ __ __ __ __ ___ __ ___ _ __ __ __ _ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Sun May 13 13:31:54 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 09:31:54 -0400 Subject: Educ. terms (cont.) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: http://www.kket.ru/ Колледж formerly a техникум. Here's another one: http://aadk.astranet.ru/ Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mshrage at INDIANA.EDU Sun May 13 18:35:10 2007 From: mshrage at INDIANA.EDU (Shrager, Miriam) Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 14:35:10 -0400 Subject: Educational terminology In-Reply-To: Message-ID: "Profil'nyj klass" is a specialized class. There used to be (and there are still) many specialized high schools in Russia, e.g. math schools, languages schools, etc. "Licej" is a new type of specialized school where there are several specializations. For example, in Licej where my children studied there were 4 specialized classes: mathematics, biology, physics-chemistry, and humanities. In order to be accepted to one of these classes, one must pass specialized tests in the relevant subjects. During the high school years students study all the subjects, but the specialized subject they study in depth. I don't know what is the English equivqlent to these. I heard that there are "magnet schools" in the USA (for example, there is one in Chicago), which are similar. So maybe that would be a good candidate for translation. Regarding "colledge", it is a college, but one that has a "lower" status than the university or an "Institute". This is so because student's don't need to pass the hard entrance exams, just pay in order to study there. Usually, those who want to be in academia don't study in a college. I think that this one is hard to translate because I don't know of an equivalent, say, in the USA for that. Hope it helps. Best regards -Miriam Quoting SEELANGS automatic digest system : > There is 1 message totalling 67 lines in this issue. > > Topics of the day: > > 1. Educational terminology -- equivalents? > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 00:12:50 -0400 > From: "Paul B. Gallagher" > Subject: Educational terminology -- equivalents? > > I'm translating a fairly general piece on the Moscow education system > (present day), and hopingf someone can suggest the nearest equivalents > for these terms: > > профильный класс > лицей > колледж > кадетский корпус > > Is a "лицей" like a prep school? > > I hesitate to translate "колледж" as "college" because my American > reader will take it to mean "вуз." > > The other two have me pretty baffled. > > For a text that covers territory similar enough to mine to help with > context, see . > > And here's the controlling law (MS Word file in zip archive, 21 KB): > > > Art. 7, Para. 7 defines: > Лицей - вид государственного > общеобразовательного учреждения, > реализующего общеобразовательные > программы основного общего и среднего > (полного) общего образования, > обеспечивающего профильную > подготовку > Ð¾Ð±ÑƒÑ‡Ð°ÑŽÑ‰Ð¸Ñ ÑÑ VIII-XI, IX-XI, X-XI классов и, по > решению городского органа > управления образованием, VII-XI классов > и формирование у Ð½Ð¸Ñ Ð½Ð°Ð²Ñ‹ÐºÐ¾Ð² > самостоятельной проектной и > научно-исследовательской > деятельности. > > Art. 7, Para. 3 defines: > Кадетская школа - вид > государственного > общеобразовательного учреждения, > реализующего общеобразовательные > программы начального общего, > основного > общего и среднего (полного) общего и > дополнительного образования, > обеспечивающие подготовку > Ð¾Ð±ÑƒÑ‡Ð°ÑŽÑ‰Ð¸Ñ ÑÑ к служению Отечеству на > гражданском и военном поприще. > > This is as close as they get to "кадетский корпус." > > The terms "профильный класс" and "колледж" do > not appear anywhere in the > law. > > MTIA > > -- > War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. > -- > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------ > > End of SEELANGS Digest - 11 May 2007 to 12 May 2007 (#2007-68) > ************************************************************** > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From resco at UMICH.EDU Mon May 14 13:25:26 2007 From: resco at UMICH.EDU (=?iso-8859-1?Q?Alina_Makin?=) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 08:25:26 -0500 Subject: Educational terminology Message-ID: Kolledzh is a vocational school or a two-year college that grants associate degrees. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Lyssakov at EU.SPB.RU Mon May 14 13:28:25 2007 From: Lyssakov at EU.SPB.RU (Pavel Lyssakov) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 17:28:25 +0400 Subject: Educational terminology Message-ID: Well, two year vocational school is more like the former PTU (professional'no tekhnicheskoe uchilishche) College is a post-Soviet official term for what used top be called "tekhnikum" -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Alina Makin Sent: Monday, May 14, 2007 5:25 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Educational terminology Kolledzh is a vocational school or a two-year college that grants associate degrees. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From vinarska at YAHOO.COM Mon May 14 08:08:27 2007 From: vinarska at YAHOO.COM (Maryna Vinarska) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 01:08:27 -0700 Subject: Educational terminology - profil'nye klassy In-Reply-To: <20070513143510.twp6pbdivk8k0sw0@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: In Ukraine we used to have (and still have) them too, those klassy s uglyblennym izucheniem chego-nibud'. I think it is comparable with Erweiterungskurs and, later, Leistungskurs vs Grundkurs in German public schools. Both are about learning on a higher level starting from year 7. Those who can't join such classes or don't need them, continue studying the subject in a Grundkurs. And whenever I see both words in English texts, I see 'intermediate level' in brackets for Erweiterungskurs and 'advanced level' for Leistungskurs. However, in more general contexts, but exactly about high schools, not universities, they are _both_ called advanced-level courses (vs basic-level courses, i.e. Grundkurse). Maybe this is it, the equivalent. Although the dictionary says: Leistungskurs - in Schule etwa: special subject, AE honors course; Ich bin im Leistungskurs Geschichte. - I'm taking history as a special subject. But I myself would never trust dictionaries... Regards, Maryna Vinraska "Shrager, Miriam" wrote: "Profil'nyj klass" is a specialized class. There used to be (and there are still) many specialized high schools in Russia, e.g. math schools, languages schools, etc. "Licej" is a new type of specialized school where there are several specializations. For example, in Licej where my children studied there were 4 specialized classes: mathematics, biology, physics-chemistry, and humanities. In order to be accepted to one of these classes, one must pass specialized tests in the relevant subjects. During the high school years students study all the subjects, but the specialized subject they study in depth. I don't know what is the English equivqlent to these. I heard that there are "magnet schools" in the USA (for example, there is one in Chicago), which are similar. So maybe that would be a good candidate for translation. Regarding "colledge", it is a college, but one that has a "lower" status than the university or an "Institute". This is so because student's don't need to pass the hard entrance exams, just pay in order to study there. Usually, those who want to be in academia don't study in a college. I think that this one is hard to translate because I don't know of an equivalent, say, in the USA for that. Hope it helps. Best regards -Miriam Quoting SEELANGS automatic digest system : > There is 1 message totalling 67 lines in this issue. > > Topics of the day: > > 1. Educational terminology -- equivalents? > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Date: Sun, 13 May 2007 00:12:50 -0400 > From: "Paul B. Gallagher" > Subject: Educational terminology -- equivalents? > > I'm translating a fairly general piece on the Moscow education system > (present day), and hopingf someone can suggest the nearest equivalents > for these terms: > > пÑ�оÑ�илÑ�нÑ�й клаÑ�Ñ� > лиÑ�ей > колледж > кадеÑ�Ñ�кий коÑ�пÑ�Ñ� > > Is a "лиÑ�ей" like a prep school? > > I hesitate to translate "колледж" as "college" because my American > reader will take it to mean "вÑ�з." > > The other two have me pretty baffled. > > For a text that covers territory similar enough to mine to help with > context, see . > > And here's the controlling law (MS Word file in zip archive, 21 KB): > > > Art. 7, Para. 7 defines: > Ð�иÑ�ей - вид гоÑ�Ñ�даÑ�Ñ�Ñ�венного > обÑ�еобÑ�азоваÑ�елÑ�ного Ñ�Ñ�Ñ�еждениÑ�, > Ñ�еализÑ�Ñ�Ñ�его обÑ�еобÑ�азоваÑ�елÑ�нÑ�е > пÑ�огÑ�аммÑ� оÑ�новного обÑ�его и Ñ�Ñ�еднего > (полного) обÑ�его обÑ�азованиÑ�, > обеÑ�пеÑ�иваÑ�Ñ�его пÑ�оÑ�илÑ�нÑ�Ñ� > подгоÑ�овкÑ� > обÑ�Ñ�аÑ�Ñ�иÑ�Ñ�Ñ� VIII-XI, IX-XI, X-XI клаÑ�Ñ�ов и, по > Ñ�еÑ�ениÑ� гоÑ�одÑ�кого оÑ�гана > Ñ�пÑ�авлениÑ� обÑ�азованием, VII-XI клаÑ�Ñ�ов > и Ñ�оÑ�миÑ�ование Ñ� ниÑ� навÑ�ков > Ñ�амоÑ�Ñ�оÑ�Ñ�елÑ�ной пÑ�оекÑ�ной и > наÑ�Ñ�но-иÑ�Ñ�ледоваÑ�елÑ�Ñ�кой > деÑ�Ñ�елÑ�ноÑ�Ñ�и. > > Art. 7, Para. 3 defines: > Ð�адеÑ�Ñ�каÑ� Ñ�кола - вид > гоÑ�Ñ�даÑ�Ñ�Ñ�венного > обÑ�еобÑ�азоваÑ�елÑ�ного Ñ�Ñ�Ñ�еждениÑ�, > Ñ�еализÑ�Ñ�Ñ�его обÑ�еобÑ�азоваÑ�елÑ�нÑ�е > пÑ�огÑ�аммÑ� наÑ�алÑ�ного обÑ�его, > оÑ�новного > обÑ�его и Ñ�Ñ�еднего (полного) обÑ�его и > дополниÑ�елÑ�ного обÑ�азованиÑ�, > обеÑ�пеÑ�иваÑ�Ñ�ие подгоÑ�овкÑ� > обÑ�Ñ�аÑ�Ñ�иÑ�Ñ�Ñ� к Ñ�лÑ�жениÑ� Ð�Ñ�еÑ�еÑ�Ñ�вÑ� на > гÑ�ажданÑ�ком и военном попÑ�иÑ�е. > > This is as close as they get to "кадеÑ�Ñ�кий коÑ�пÑ�Ñ�." > > The terms "пÑ�оÑ�илÑ�нÑ�й клаÑ�Ñ�" and "колледж" do > not appear anywhere in the > law. > > MTIA > > -- > War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. > -- > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------ > > End of SEELANGS Digest - 11 May 2007 to 12 May 2007 (#2007-68) > ************************************************************** > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------- Moody friends. Drama queens. Your life? Nope! - their life, your story. Play Sims Stories at Yahoo! Games. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Mon May 14 18:02:38 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 14:02:38 -0400 Subject: sevrjuzhina Message-ID: Dear Seelangers, Does anyone remember where Saltykov-Shchedrin's statement of "xochetsja ne to konstitucii, ne to sevrjuzhiny" comes from? Thanks. Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ssychov at UMICH.EDU Mon May 14 18:36:39 2007 From: ssychov at UMICH.EDU (Sergei Sychov) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 14:36:39 -0400 Subject: sevrjuzhina In-Reply-To: Message-ID: It comes from the opening paragraph of "Kul'turnye liudi" ("kul'turnaia toska"). -Sergei Quoting Alina Israeli : > Dear Seelangers, > > Does anyone remember where Saltykov-Shchedrin's statement of > "xochetsja ne to konstitucii, ne to sevrjuzhiny" comes from? > > Thanks. > > Alina Israeli > LFS, American University > 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW > Washington DC. 20016 > (202) 885-2387 > fax (202) 885-1076 > aisrael at american.edu > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From benjamin.rifkin at TEMPLE.EDU Mon May 14 19:03:49 2007 From: benjamin.rifkin at TEMPLE.EDU (Benjamin Rifkin) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 15:03:49 -0400 Subject: FW: Sale on Approaches to Teaching World Literature Titles In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear SEELANGers: MLA members recently received an invitation to purchase books in the ³Approaches to Teaching World Literature² series at a discount. I reviewed the titles and found that there was only one volume in the series on Russian Literature (Approaches to Teaching Anna Karenina) and none for any of the other Slavic literatures (although there is a volume on teaching Kafka). I wrote to the MLA about this matter and the Executive Director responded inviting Slavists to propose volumes. I asked her if I could share my message with the list and she agreed, so I am appending the message below. If you are interested in editing such a volume, please contact the MLA directly, of course. With best wishes to all, Ben Rifkin -- Benjamin Rifkin Vice Dean for Undergraduate Affairs and Professor of Russian College of Liberal Arts, Temple University 1206 Anderson Hall 1114 W. Berks Street Philadelphia, PA 19122 (215) 204-1816; fax (215) 204-3731 www.temple.edu/fgis/rifkin ------ Forwarded Message From: Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 13:12:25 -0400 To: Benjamin Rifkin Subject: Re: Sale on Approaches to Teaching World Literature Titles Dear Ben, Thank you for writing to me about this matter. The Publications Committee has long wanted to add volumes on Dostoevsky and Chekhov and would welcome suggestions for possible editors for these and other Slavic authors. We have a list of desired additions that the committee reviews every year, and the primary goal is to increase the diversity of offerings on our list. We currently have four volumes on African literature in development and two in Chinese, all the result of efforts by the staff to identify editors and encourage the development of new titles. There is also a book forthcoming on Nabokov's Lolita that involves specialists in Russian. We did a study a few years ago and found that the field coverage in the series nearly matches the field coverage in the MLA as a whole. The exception was Spanish and Latin American, which was under-represented in the series. We can't create new books in Slavic without the active participation of the leading scholars in that field. Please help us by proposing new books! The guidelines are here: http://www.mla.org/publications/publication_program/pub_prog_guidelines/pub_ guidelines_gen With thanks and best wishes, Rosemary Rosemary G. Feal Executive Director Modern Language Association ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From benjamin.rifkin at TEMPLE.EDU Mon May 14 19:12:54 2007 From: benjamin.rifkin at TEMPLE.EDU (Benjamin Rifkin) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 15:12:54 -0400 Subject: New textbook for Advanced Russian Message-ID: Dear SEELANGers: Olga Kagan, Anna Yatsenko and I are pleased to announce the publication of our new textbook by Yale University Press: Advanced Russian through History: Dela davno minuvshikh dnei Each of the 36 chapters in the textbook consists of an essay in Russian (marked for stress, with lexical glosses) written by a Russian scholar of history, anthropology, or other social science or humanities disciplines, and a related mini-lecture (mp3 file) of 4-8 minutes in length, recorded by the same scholar (on a CD-ROM packaged with the textbook). Each of the 36 chapters is also accompanied by over 20 learning tasks (including pre-reading, lexical and grammatical analysis, and post-reading research and presentation tasks) and glossaries. The learning tasks and glossaries are on the web (no password required) and may be found at My coauthors and I hope you will find the book an interesting and useful contribution to the curriculum for advanced and/or heritage Russian language classes. Sincerely, Ben Rifkin -- Benjamin Rifkin Vice Dean for Undergraduate Affairs and Professor of Russian College of Liberal Arts, Temple University 1206 Anderson Hall 1114 W. Berks Street Philadelphia, PA 19122 (215) 204-1816; fax (215) 204-3731 www.temple.edu/fgis/rifkin ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Mon May 14 19:14:36 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 15:14:36 -0400 Subject: sevrjuzhina In-Reply-To: <20070514143639.6f8r77a9fcwsk8gc@web.mail.umich.edu> Message-ID: Thank you both very much, Denis Akhapkin and Sergei Sychov. Alina Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From tsergay at COLUMBUS.RR.COM Mon May 14 19:22:18 2007 From: tsergay at COLUMBUS.RR.COM (Timothy D. Sergay) Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 15:22:18 -0400 Subject: New textbook for Advanced Russian Message-ID: Congratulations, Ben and co-authors! Try this link, though, for the learning tasks and glossaries (the other one didn't work for me): http://yalepress.yale.edu/yupbooks/russian/ Tim Sergay ----- Original Message ----- From: "Benjamin Rifkin" To: Sent: Monday, May 14, 2007 3:12 PM Subject: [SEELANGS] New textbook for Advanced Russian > Dear SEELANGers: > > Olga Kagan, Anna Yatsenko and I are pleased to announce the publication of > our new textbook by Yale University Press: > > Advanced Russian through History: > Dela davno minuvshikh dnei ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU Tue May 15 06:37:22 2007 From: s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU (Prof Steven P Hill) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 01:37:22 -0500 Subject: US equivalent of "kolledzh" (educ.term., cont.) Message-ID: Dear colleagues: Sounds as if the experts are telling us that the new post-Soviet term "kolledzh" may be an approximate equivalent of the U.S. "community college" (in some places still called "junior college"). I.e., a school which can be entered after secondary school, and which offers only the first 2 years of higher education ("freshman" & "sophomore" years only). The completion of those two years of instruction is certified by an "associate's degree." In US "community colleges," some students study "hands-on" type technical subjects, and some go on to technical jobs after the two years of study. In the sports-obsessed USA, "community colleges" are frequently the first stop in higher education for those star athletes who in secondary school received poor grades, insufficient to earn admission to major, full-fledged "4-year" universities. Using their 2 years in a less-demanding community college to redeem their previous poor grades, the sports stars are then eligible to transfer to a major, full-fledged university, where they hope to excell on the football field or basketball court during their last two ("junior & senior") years of higher education... Best wishes to all, Steven P Hill, University of Illinois. __ __ __ _ Date: Tue 15 May 00:39:29 CDT 2007 From: Subject: Re: GETPOST SEELANGS To: "Steven P. Hill" Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 08:25:26 -0500 From: Alina Makin Subject: Re: Educational terminology Kolledzh is a vocational school or a two-year college that grants associate degrees. _ ___ __ ___ __ ___ ___ _ Date: Mon, 14 May 2007 17:28:25 +0400 From: Pavel Lyssakov Subject: Re: Educational terminology Well, two year vocational school is more like the former PTU (professional'no tekhnicheskoe uchilishche) College is a post-Soviet official term for what used to be called "tekhnikum" _ __ __ ___ __ __ __ __ ___ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From vanya1v at YAHOO.COM Tue May 15 13:53:48 2007 From: vanya1v at YAHOO.COM (J.W.) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 09:53:48 -0400 Subject: Educational terminology Message-ID: Ottawa (Canada), Tuesday 15/5/07 9h35 EDT ***** "Shrager, Miriam" wrote: Regarding "colledge", it is a college, but one that has a "lower" status than the university or an "Institute". ... Usually, those who want to be in academia don't study in a college. I think that this one is hard to translate because I don't know of an equivalent, say, in the USA for that. Hope it helps. ***** (a) This is exactly the (at least, the most common) usage of the term 'college' in Canada, where, as a rule, only universities grant degrees, while colleges offer non-degree programmes, generally (but by no means limited to) technical and trade disciplines. (b) But a 'college' can also be an institution within a university, the degree coming from the university, not the college. (c) Finally, academia-bound pupils might well study in a 'college', as a prelude to university, in the sense of a privately-run secondary school. I'd be interested to know whether either of these latter senses of 'college' has been attached to the Russian "kolledzh" (колледж). (Mr) John Woodsworth Certified Translator (Russian-English) Website: http://www.kanadacha.ca E-mail: jw at kanadacha.ca / vanya1v at yahoo.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sara.stefani at YALE.EDU Tue May 15 15:02:09 2007 From: sara.stefani at YALE.EDU (Sara Stefani) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 10:02:09 -0500 Subject: Apartment in Petersburg needed Message-ID: Dear All, A student of mine - a responsible graduate student - needs to rent an apartment in St. Petersburg for a month this summer. He will be in Petersburg studying Russian from mid-June to mid-July, and if possible he'd prefer something more or less centrally located. If you have an apartment you'd like to rent out for that time or have some leads, he and I would be grateful for any help. You can contact me off-line at sara.stefani at yale.edu and I'll pass the information on to him, or you can contact him directly at david.hafetz at yale.edu Many thanks in advance! Best, Sara ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From vinarska at YAHOO.COM Tue May 15 17:38:03 2007 From: vinarska at YAHOO.COM (Maryna Vinarska) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 10:38:03 -0700 Subject: Educational terminology - correction Message-ID: It turned out that 'klassy s uglublennym izuchenien togo ili inogo predmeta' and 'profil'nye klassy' is not the same nowadays. Here is the link which can shed some light: http://www.school.unn.ru/arrival/specific It seems to be smth absolutely new. I mean 'profil'nye klassy'. Without seeing their 'uchebnye plany' it is impossible to understand what it really is and what the difference between such classes and classes 's uglublennym izucheniem predmeta' is. The following is probably the key: 3.5. ðÒÏÇÒÁÍÍÎÏÅ ÏÂÅÓÐÅÞÅÎÉÅ ÐÒÏÆÉÌØÎÙÈ ËÌÁÓÓÏ× ÕÔ×ÅÒÖÄÁÅÔÓÑ × Ä×ÕÓÔÏÒÏÎÎÅÍ ÐÏÒÑÄËÅ «÷õú — ÛËÏÌÁ» É ÓÏÇÌÁÓÏ×Ù×ÁÅÔÓÑ Ó ÕÞÒÅÄÉÔÅÌÅÍ. And this too: ÷ÙÐÕÓËÎÉËÁÍ ÐÒÏÆÉÌØÎÙÈ ËÌÁÓÓÏ×, ËÁË É ÓÌÕÛÁÔÅÌÑÍ ÐÏÄÇÏÔÏ×ÉÔÅÌØÎÙÈ ËÕÒÓÏ×, ×ÙÄÁ£ÔÓÑ ÓÅÒÔÉÆÉËÁÔ, ÐÒÅÄÏÓÔÁ×ÌÑÀÝÉÊ ÉÍ ÐÒÅÉÍÕÝÅÓÔ×Á ÐÒÉ ÐÏÓÔÕÐÌÅÎÉÉ × ôÀÍÅÎÓËÉÊ ÇÏÓÕÄÁÒÓÔ×ÅÎÎÙÊ ÎÅÆÔÅÇÁÚÏ×ÙÊ ÕÎÉ×ÅÒÓÉÔÅÔ. (http://noudo.tsogu.ru/education/copy_of_profile) Regards, Maryna Vinarska --------------------------------- Building a website is a piece of cake. Yahoo! Small Business gives you all the tools to get online. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU Wed May 16 01:20:21 2007 From: s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU (Prof Steven P Hill) Date: Tue, 15 May 2007 20:20:21 -0500 Subject: can "Spam Block" affect Slav.lang.citations? Message-ID: Dear colleagues: A few days ago, I sent a short query about Polish vocabulary to 3 Polish experts on my own campus, about the un-Polish suffix "-TEL" in the Polish word for "citizen" ("obywatel," rather than *"obywaciel"). Two colleagues eventually replied, & I have my answer. No problem. But now I have a bizarre sort of follow-up question. At the time of my original query, I sent a blind copy ("BCC") to myself. Incredibly, the U of IL "Spam Filter" blocked my own message ("BCC") from being delivered directly TO MYSELF. Believe it or not, I needed to go through a little "Release from Block" procedure, in order to liberate my own copy to myself. (As I "liberated" my message, I added my own name to a list of "OK addressees," so that in future, let us hope, I would not be at risk of being viewed as my own persona non grata...) This "self-block" had never happened to me before, and in fact I still find it hard to believe. My original message had been assigned a very bad "spam score" of only 70 out of 100, classifying it as "possible" or even "probable" spam! (100 = definitely not spam, under 90 = possible spam, etc.) Perhaps the several foreign (Polish) citations in the body of my orig. query to the 3 colleagues caused the low score of 70; and/or the fact I sent my query to 3 addressees at once? Has this bizarre sort of "spam block of one's own self" ever happened to any of you Slavists out there? Or only to me...? Gratefully, Steven P Hill, University of Illinois. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From k.r.hauge at ILOS.UIO.NO Wed May 16 13:25:50 2007 From: k.r.hauge at ILOS.UIO.NO (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?Kjetil_R=E5_Hauge?=) Date: Wed, 16 May 2007 15:25:50 +0200 Subject: can "Spam Block" affect Slav.lang.citations? In-Reply-To: <20070515202021.AOM66282@expms6.cites.uiuc.edu> Message-ID: Prof Steven P Hill wrote: > Dear colleagues: > > A few days ago, I sent a short query about Polish vocabulary to 3 > Polish experts on my own campus, about the un-Polish suffix "-TEL" > in the Polish word for "citizen" ("obywatel," rather than *"obywaciel"). > Two colleagues eventually replied, & I have my answer. No problem. > > But now I have a bizarre sort of follow-up question. > > At the time of my original query, I sent a blind copy ("BCC") to myself. > Incredibly, the U of IL "Spam Filter" blocked my own message ("BCC") > from being delivered directly TO MYSELF. Believe it or not, I needed > to go through a little "Release from Block" procedure, in order to > liberate my own copy to myself. (As I "liberated" my message, I added > my own name to a list of "OK addressees," so that in future, let us > hope, I would not be at risk of being viewed as my own persona non > grata...) > > This "self-block" had never happened to me before, and in fact I still > find it hard to believe. My original message had been assigned a very > bad "spam score" of only 70 out of 100, classifying it as "possible" or > even "probable" spam! (100 = definitely not spam, under 90 = possible > spam, etc.) Perhaps the several foreign (Polish) citations in the body > of my orig. query to the 3 colleagues caused the low score of 70; > and/or the fact I sent my query to 3 addressees at once? > > Has this bizarre sort of "spam block of one's own self" ever happened > to any of you Slavists out there? Or only to me...? I am no expert on this, but I'll try to explain it anyway :-). Spam filters work by weighing the features of the message that are indicators of spamminess against those that are indicators of it being a bona fide message ("ham"). These features include text in the "headers" - the "technical" part of the message, most of which is not displayed in the default mode of mail programs. There are several spam filters out there, they may be configured in many different ways according to the needs of the institution and/or the end user, they may or may not be configured to "learn" new rules (for instance from what you salvage from the junk mail folder), and your institution and/or you might use more than one of them. If you set your mail program to show "all headers" or "source code" of the given message, you might find there a written record in more or less cryptic terms of the factors of the spam analysis, not only the final score, as in your case. Your computing department should be able to translate this into more human-readable language. Just to make a wild guess at a possible scenario (I don't say it's probable): if you 1) used a "To:" address with some "international" character not enclosed in quotes, 2) sent the message as HTML, 3) used the words "milllion" and "dollars" a couple of times, 4) accidentally hit the "zero" key while aiming for the "O" key in some word, 5) addressed your correspondents as "Dear Friend[s]", 6) inadvertently set the text encoding to Korean (typing in English with no ethnic characters, you might not notice), and a number of things like that, it might have contributed to the spamminess of the message. Spammers fake the "From:" header, BTW, so there is probably no reason mail apparently from yourself should be exempt from spam rules by default. I sometimes receive notices of non-deliverability for messages I have never sent. -- --- Kjetil Rå Hauge, U. of Oslo, PO Box 1003 Blindern, N-0315 Oslo, Norway Tel. +47/22856710, fax +47/22854140 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From M.J.BERRY.RUS at BHAM.AC.UK Thu May 17 13:16:50 2007 From: M.J.BERRY.RUS at BHAM.AC.UK (Michael Berry) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 14:16:50 +0100 Subject: Russian archive of TV programmes?? Message-ID: Does anyone know of any archives of Russian TV programmes, from where it is possible to obtain copies of old programmes, such as news broadcasts etc? I have found a few sites with some programmes but nothing very comprehensive. Mike Berry Honorary Senior Research Fellow, Centre for Russian and East European Studies, University of Birmingham, Birmingham B15 2TT ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kdianina at YAHOO.COM Thu May 17 18:32:19 2007 From: kdianina at YAHOO.COM (Katia Dianina) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 11:32:19 -0700 Subject: Firebird; culture In-Reply-To: <464B065E.60707@ilos.uio.no> Message-ID: Dear colleagues, 1) Can anybody help me identify the source (if there is one) for Rozanov's comparison of Russian culture with a cooked egg of a Firebird. This is what I have from one Russian text: Василий Розанов сравнивал русскую культуру с яйцом Жар-птицы, из которой сделали яичницу, не дав вылупиться редкой и прекрасной птице. 2) How to best translate "khudozhestvennaia kul'tura" and "khudozhestvennaia zhizn'" into English (aside from artistic culture)? Please reply to dianina at virginia.edu. Many thanks for your help in advance. Katia Kjetil Rå Hauge wrote: Prof Steven P Hill wrote: > Dear colleagues: > > A few days ago, I sent a short query about Polish vocabulary to 3 > Polish experts on my own campus, about the un-Polish suffix "-TEL" > in the Polish word for "citizen" ("obywatel," rather than *"obywaciel"). > Two colleagues eventually replied, & I have my answer. No problem. > > But now I have a bizarre sort of follow-up question. > > At the time of my original query, I sent a blind copy ("BCC") to myself. > Incredibly, the U of IL "Spam Filter" blocked my own message ("BCC") > from being delivered directly TO MYSELF. Believe it or not, I needed > to go through a little "Release from Block" procedure, in order to > liberate my own copy to myself. (As I "liberated" my message, I added > my own name to a list of "OK addressees," so that in future, let us > hope, I would not be at risk of being viewed as my own persona non > grata...) > > This "self-block" had never happened to me before, and in fact I still > find it hard to believe. My original message had been assigned a very > bad "spam score" of only 70 out of 100, classifying it as "possible" or > even "probable" spam! (100 = definitely not spam, under 90 = possible > spam, etc.) Perhaps the several foreign (Polish) citations in the body > of my orig. query to the 3 colleagues caused the low score of 70; > and/or the fact I sent my query to 3 addressees at once? > > Has this bizarre sort of "spam block of one's own self" ever happened > to any of you Slavists out there? Or only to me...? I am no expert on this, but I'll try to explain it anyway :-). Spam filters work by weighing the features of the message that are indicators of spamminess against those that are indicators of it being a bona fide message ("ham"). These features include text in the "headers" - the "technical" part of the message, most of which is not displayed in the default mode of mail programs. There are several spam filters out there, they may be configured in many different ways according to the needs of the institution and/or the end user, they may or may not be configured to "learn" new rules (for instance from what you salvage from the junk mail folder), and your institution and/or you might use more than one of them. If you set your mail program to show "all headers" or "source code" of the given message, you might find there a written record in more or less cryptic terms of the factors of the spam analysis, not only the final score, as in your case. Your computing department should be able to translate this into more human-readable language. Just to make a wild guess at a possible scenario (I don't say it's probable): if you 1) used a "To:" address with some "international" character not enclosed in quotes, 2) sent the message as HTML, 3) used the words "milllion" and "dollars" a couple of times, 4) accidentally hit the "zero" key while aiming for the "O" key in some word, 5) addressed your correspondents as "Dear Friend[s]", 6) inadvertently set the text encoding to Korean (typing in English with no ethnic characters, you might not notice), and a number of things like that, it might have contributed to the spamminess of the message. Spammers fake the "From:" header, BTW, so there is probably no reason mail apparently from yourself should be exempt from spam rules by default. I sometimes receive notices of non-deliverability for messages I have never sent. -- --- Kjetil Rå Hauge, U. of Oslo, PO Box 1003 Blindern, N-0315 Oslo, Norway Tel. +47/22856710, fax +47/22854140 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ================== We are moving (again)! Please note new address, effective July 1, 2006: Katia Dianina dianina at post.harvard.edu 103 Village Court Charlottesville, VA 22903 434 293-9157 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From renee at ALINGA.COM Fri May 18 02:35:45 2007 From: renee at ALINGA.COM (Renee Stillings) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 19:35:45 -0700 Subject: New idiocy in student visa procedures Message-ID: Dear All, I thought you might like to know what the current situation is with student visas to Russia as you are likely to have students affected by this, and if you are running your own programs you should be aware as well. Washington DC consulate. They will on one hand take copies (scan/fax) of invitations and won't require the HIV test for a standard 90-day student visa. HOWEVER, they have recently implemented a policy that they will take 10 full days for visa processing. That is 10 business days and they WILL NOT rush a student visa regardless of what you pay. As many of you know, several universities, such as MGU, have a habit of releasing visa support within fewer days of that of departure, forcing rush processing. Out of luck. Student will need to beg and plead with airline about force majeure situation and pray he/she is not nailed on that non-refundable and non-changeable student-priced ticket. We don't know whether this is a temporary thing due to the rush season and they are just overwhelmed, but I think we should all plan around it for the future. DC has also decided to clamp down as concerns jurisdiction and may not process your visa if you are not in their territory. Options for avoiding this nightmare: 1. New York will rush processing - BUT demands the original invitation and HIV test. Also last time I tried to rush something there they said that regardless of the visa entry date, on a student visa, they will not put an entry date on the visa itself that is less than 5 business days from the date they receive the application. They also do not answer the phone at this consulate. 2. San Francisco and Seattle. Our understanding is that they also demand originals and HIV tests. No information yet about whether they will do rush processing. 3. In the future, I think what we are going to do is request visas for a date about 1.5 months ahead of the real entry date. This prompts the support to be done earlier and so even if they delay as usual it still is ready a good month or more before departure. The other potential upside of this is that many of the universities who delay in doing the conversion to multi-entry until the 90-day period has expired, will sort of be forced to do it earlier, perhaps making students happier. This is the story of Russia - they make new stupid rule, we create new silly way around it. They will then probably make some other silly rule. On a related note, for anyone else frustrated by MGU visas in particular, apparently there is ONE person at the MGU visa office dealing with hordes of visas for foreign students and they have told all departments that they do not want stacks of extensions turned in at once and so should be done only when they are really expiring - staggered, ideally. I could go on with further tirade about how absurd this situation is, but will refrain. It has been one of those days when I question just why we spend so much time and effort trying to promote study of this country that makes more efforts against us than for us. I would be curious as to whether anyone else on the list has been hit yet with this problem. I am starting to wonder whether I should tell students to just not purchase tickets at all until we have invitations. Unfortunate, and expensive, for the students, but in the foreseeable future I don't see anyone at OVIR, the consulate, or even the universities caring. Or if they do, we get the usual "that's life, we can't do anything about it" reply. Renee ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Fri May 18 02:53:02 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Thu, 17 May 2007 22:53:02 -0400 Subject: New idiocy in student visa procedures In-Reply-To: <200705180235.l4I2ZhpG017677@alinga.com> Message-ID: New idiocy covers not only students but tourists as well, which means anyone on this list who travels to Russia on non-Russian passport: http://travel.mail.ru/news/38738/ This is particularly cute during the year of the Russian language: http://www.rusintercenter.ru/?lang=ru&menu=117 Головотяпство со взломом. On May 17, 2007, at 10:35 PM, Renee Stillings wrote: > Dear All, > > > > I thought you might like to know what the current situation is with > student > visas to Russia as you are likely to have students affected by > this, and if > you are running your own programs you should be aware as well. Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM Fri May 18 06:21:33 2007 From: sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM (Benjamin Sher) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 01:21:33 -0500 Subject: Russian TV Broadcasts In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Michael Berry: The premier Russian TV videos site, available in broadband, is on the Ethnic TV Network at: http://www.etvnet.ca/ Superb, full-screen videos. Thousands of taped programs available in the archive. Thsi is a commercial site. Cost: $10 for 20 hours a month, $20 for 50 hours a month, $40 for unlimited viewing. I have NO professional or personal connection to this site. Benjamin -- Sher's Russian Web http://www.websher.net Benjamin Sher sher07 at mindspring.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Fri May 18 08:05:08 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 09:05:08 +0100 Subject: More depressing news about journalism in Russia: RUJ served notice to quit building In-Reply-To: <000d01c7982c$9c25e2a0$fc406858@userbzuulkn2r9> Message-ID: Forwarded message from a friend: 'The Russian Union of Journalists' lease on the building they've rented (for the last ?20 years, at the very least) is being ended and the premises wholly handed over to Russia Today, the overseas TV propaganda channel Putin's team set up. If this all goes through it also puts GDF and CJES out on the street. Igor Yakovenko was particularly singled out as having provoked this reaction from the authorities, due to his constant protection and sponsorship of opposition and critical gatherings at the Union's premises on Zubovsky Boulevard.' Best Wishes, Robert Chandler ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jwilson at SRAS.ORG Fri May 18 08:35:56 2007 From: jwilson at SRAS.ORG (Josh Wilson) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 12:35:56 +0400 Subject: More depressing news about journalism in Russia: RUJ served notice to quit building In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Read about this in the news yesterday myself. The article - there is always wonderful irony to everything depressing in Russia - also pointed out that Russia Today television is tasked with "creating positive images of Russia abroad.".... Apparently nobody specified that they should try to not create PR disasters. The eviction is coinciding with an international convention of journalist to be held in Moscow at (the end of?) this month... sure we will hear much, much more about this later. -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Robert Chandler Sent: Friday, May 18, 2007 12:05 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] More depressing news about journalism in Russia: RUJ served notice to quit building Forwarded message from a friend: 'The Russian Union of Journalists' lease on the building they've rented (for the last ?20 years, at the very least) is being ended and the premises wholly handed over to Russia Today, the overseas TV propaganda channel Putin's team set up. If this all goes through it also puts GDF and CJES out on the street. Igor Yakovenko was particularly singled out as having provoked this reaction from the authorities, due to his constant protection and sponsorship of opposition and critical gatherings at the Union's premises on Zubovsky Boulevard.' Best Wishes, Robert Chandler ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From natalia.pylypiuk at UALBERTA.CA Fri May 18 13:51:11 2007 From: natalia.pylypiuk at UALBERTA.CA (Natalia Pylypiuk) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 07:51:11 -0600 Subject: More depressing news about journalism in Russia: RUJ served notice to quit building In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Today leaders of the Russian opposition where not permitted to fly from Moscow to Samara, where they were to join the March of Dissenters. Foreign journalists, representing Reuters, The Wall Street Journal and The London Daily telegraph were also detained, according to this report on Channel 5: http://5tv.com.ua/newsline/251/0/40913/ Regards, Natalia Pylypiuk On May 18, 2007, at 2:05 AM, Robert Chandler wrote: > Forwarded message from a friend: > > 'The Russian Union of Journalists' lease on the building they've > rented (for > the last ?20 years, at the very least) is being ended and the premises > wholly handed over to Russia Today, the overseas TV propaganda channel > Putin's team set up. If this all goes through it also puts GDF and > CJES out > on the street. > > Igor Yakovenko was particularly singled out as having provoked this > reaction from the authorities, due to his constant protection and > sponsorship of opposition and critical gatherings at the Union's > premises > on Zubovsky Boulevard.' > > Best Wishes, > > Robert Chandler > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface > at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > --- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From tdolack at UOREGON.EDU Fri May 18 19:19:23 2007 From: tdolack at UOREGON.EDU (Tom Dolack) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 12:19:23 -0700 Subject: FW: [evol-psych] Article: Russian speakers get the blues Message-ID: Vsem privet! I just came across this in the depths of my inbox and thought it would be of interest to the list. I get questions related to this when we do colors; perhaps it will help answer them, or perhaps it will just raise more questions. To make up for the technical nature of the article I'll also include this little bit of fun: "Chris Berman's Nicknames Becoming More Obscure After Taking Night Course In Russian Literature" http://www.theonion.com/content/news/chris_bermans_nicknames_becoming Best to the list, Tom Dolack -----Original Message----- From: evolutionary-psychology at yahoogroups.com [mailto:evolutionary-psychology at yahoogroups.com] Sent: Thursday, May 03, 2007 7:34 PM To: Cognitive NeuroScience; Mind and Brain; Evolutionary-Psychology Subject: [evol-psych] Article: Russian speakers get the blues Russian speakers get the blues 11:46 01 May 2007 NewScientist.com news service Roxanne Khamsi The language you speak can affect how you see the world, a new study of colour perception indicates. Native speakers of Russian - which lacks a single word for "blue" - discriminated between light and dark blues differently from their English-speaking counterparts, researchers found. The Russian language makes an obligatory distinction between light blue, pronounced "goluboy", and dark blue, pronounced "siniy". Jonathan Winawer at MIT in the US and colleagues set out to determine whether this linguistic distinction influences colour perception. The team recruited 50 people from the Boston area in Massachusetts, US, roughly half of whom were native Russian speakers. Volunteers viewed three blue squares on a screen and had to indicate by pushing a button whether the single square on top matched the bottom right or bottom left square in terms of hue (see image for an example). In total there were 20 different shades of blue. [ORIGINAL IMAGE VIEWABLE THROUGH LINK BELOW] Subjects had to pick which one of the two bottom squares matched the colour of the top square. (Credit: Winawer et al./PNAS) True blue Subjects completed two types of tests: in one version, the three squares were of a similar shade, whereas the other test involved one square that was a markedly different shade - for example, distinguishing a dark blue from a light blue. English speakers were no better at distinguishing between dark and light blues than they were at telling apart two blues of a similar shade. Russian speakers, by comparison, were 10% faster at distinguishing between light (goluboy) blues and dark (siniy) blues than at discriminating between blues within the same shade category. "This is the first time that evidence has been offered to show cross-linguistic differences in colour perception in an objective task," says Winawer. Moreover, when Russian speakers had to memorise an eight-digit number while doing the colour task, they were no better at distinguishing between dark and light blues and those within of a similar shade. Winawer believes that this is because the concentration needed to memorise the number interfered with their verbal brainpower - removing the extra boost that the Russian language gives in classifying light and dark blues. Journal reference: Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences (DOI: 10.1073/pnas.0701644104) Source: NewScientist http://www.newscien tist.com/article/dn11759?DCMP=NLC-nletter&nsref=dn11759 Posted by Robert Karl Stonjek ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Fri May 18 19:24:18 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 20:24:18 +0100 Subject: Platonov translation question: 'Sredi zhivotnykh I rastenii' Message-ID: Dear all, My wife and I and Olga Meerson are at present revising our translation of this wonderful and witty story about a strelochnik on a remote stretch of railway in Soviet Karelia. We are hopelessly stuck on the last underlined line of the following passage. The strelochnik has just been promoted. And he is now working in the town of Medvezhya Gora, which to him seems somewhere very important and cultured: Not knowing how to be in command of others, he began by doing all their work for them; he cleaned and greased the points himself and went out to meet every train, even though the train was already being met by a junior pointsman. He went on seeing to everything: were the points positioned correctly and did they move freely and smoothly? The junior pointsmen were bewildered. ‘What is it, Ivan Alekseyevich? Aren’t we working-class enough for you? Why are you greasing the points yourself? We’ve got reason to be here, you know.’ ‘But can you do everything the way I do?’ asked Fyodorov. ‘The way you do?’ said one elderly junior pointsman. ‘Not likely. We’ll do things better.’ ‘We’ll see,’ Fyodorov said gloomily. ‘To you it’s a job – but what I do is feel.’ ?? Не зная, как нужно начальствовать, Иван Алексеевич стал сперва работать за всех: сам чистил каждую стрелку, сам заправлял ее смазкой и выходил встречать каждый поезд, не обращая внимания, что поезд уже встречает второй стрелочник. Федоров все равно следил лично: правильно ли стоит стрелка и хорошо ли она работает при движении. Младшие стрелочники жили в недоумении: - Что ж ты, Иван Алексеевич, нас за рабочий класс не считаешь, - сказали они. – Чего ты сам переводы мажешь, мы тоже здесь не в виду пустяка находимся. - А вы можете так же делать, как я? – спросил их Федоров. Один пожилой младший стрелочник ответил: - Кто ее знает!... Так же, как ты, едва ли: мы лучше будем делать. - Я там погляжу, - сумрачно сказал Федоров. – Вы тут только служите, а я чувствую. * Not sure about this, but there may be an echo of a line from KOTLOVAN: Я здесь не существую... я толско думаю здесь. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From donna.orwin at UTORONTO.CA Fri May 18 19:23:36 2007 From: donna.orwin at UTORONTO.CA (donna.orwin at UTORONTO.CA) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 15:23:36 -0400 Subject: Tolstoy Virtual Exhibit Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Our new virtual exhibit "Tolstoy and the Arts" is now available on line in Russian and English. To access it, go to the TSJ website at www.tolstoystudies.org. Best to all, Donna Orwin, President Tolstoy Society ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Fri May 18 19:32:27 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 20:32:27 +0100 Subject: Same Platonov question again Message-ID: Dear all, Just realized that the underlining gets lost. My question is about the word ‘chuvstvuyu’ We cannot think of anything that has the right resonance: ‘We’ll see,’ Fyodorov said gloomily. ‘To you it’s a job – but what I do is feel.’ ?? - Я там погляжу, - сумрачно сказал Федоров. – Вы тут только служите, а я чувствую. ‘Ya tam poglyazhu,’ sumrachno skazal Fyodorov. ‘Vy tut tol’ko sluzhite, a ya zdes’ chuvstvuyu.’ By the way, this story is almost unobtainable in its full, uncensored version. If anyone would like an electronic copy, I’ll gladly send them one. I recently typed it into my computer. Poka, R. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From yfurman at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU Fri May 18 19:42:20 2007 From: yfurman at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU (Furman, Yelena) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 12:42:20 -0700 Subject: Russian/East/Central European postcolonial literature Message-ID: Dear all, This may be a somewhat unusual question, but I'll try anyway. I have been asked for recommendations of texts by contemporary Russian writers who deal with the issue of post-colonialism (defined loosely, given that it's a very different historical situation). Since the person who asked me doesn't read Russian, these would have to be in English translation. Perhaps there are also writers from East/Central Europe, or Central Asia, who deal with the issue of Russian (Soviet) 'colonialism'? I freely admit that I know virtually nothing about the topic, so any suggestions for readings would be very much appreciated. Thank you in advance. Yelena Furman Department of Literature, UCSD ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From reei at INDIANA.EDU Fri May 18 19:59:15 2007 From: reei at INDIANA.EDU (REEI) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 15:59:15 -0400 Subject: Indiana University Professional Staff Opening - REEI Message-ID: Indiana University https://webdb.iu.edu/humanresources/secure/app-new/pa_browse.cfm#0000552 0 ASSISTANT DIRECTOR/OUTREACH COORDINATOR Russian and East European Institute (PA11 ) Position#: 00005520 Manages the financial, administrative, personnel, alumni relations/development, and outreach activities of the Russian and East European Institute. Serves as Fiscal Officer and manages budgets, as well as monitors and manages IU federal grant and IU Foundation accounts. Carries primary administrative responsibility for the unit's receipt of external funding from the U.S. Department of Education Title VI program. Works with the director and executive committee to gather data and draft grant proposals. Communicates with sponsoring agency and other units at IU; implements grant activities; and submits reports by deadline. Outreach activities include: organizing seminars and teacher training workshops for K-12 teachers (emphasis on pre-college Russian language teachers); organizes and manages two major academic conferences per year plus weekly enrichment activities; organizes events and represents the Institute at national conferences and other venues aimed at constituencies (post-secondary, business, government, military, and general public). Supervises two regular staff and several student employees. Qualifications: Bachelor's degree required. Master's degree preferred. Background in international studies related field and higher education administration; knowledge of Russian or another language of the region; three years administrative/budgeting and supervisory experience required. Demonstrated organizational, technical, analytical, and problem-solving abilities required in conjunction with effective leadership. Excellent interpersonal and communication skills required for working collaboratively and strategically within a diverse environment of faculty, students, alumni and outreach clients. Strongly prefer candidates with knowledge of IU fiscal/administrative policies and processes, federal agency guidelines and restrictions, and policies governing visas and hiring of non-citizens. Please include a cover letter and contact information for three references with your online application. How to apply: http://www.indiana.edu/~uhrs/jobs/OLA-howtoapply.html Russian and East European Institute 1020 E. Kirkwood Ave. Ballantine Hall 565 Indiana University Bloomington, IN 47405-6615 Phone: (812) 855-7309 Fax: (812) 855-6411 Website: www.indiana.edu/~reeiweb/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Mark.Leiderman at COLORADO.EDU Fri May 18 22:57:40 2007 From: Mark.Leiderman at COLORADO.EDU (Mark N Leiderman) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 16:57:40 -0600 Subject: Russian/East/Central European postcolonial literature Message-ID: Dear Yelena, You may use Andrei Volos' "Hurramabad" (English version is published by Glas), a chapter from Oksana Zabuzhko's "Filed Work in Ukrainian Sex" (http://www.bu.edu/agni/fiction/print/2001/53-zabuzhko.html) and of course Milan Kundera's numerous writings on Central Europe including his recent "Die Weltliteratur" ("The New Yorker", January 8, 2007). Everything pertaining North Caucuses is valuable too: some of texts on this subject may be found in the recent Glas collection "War and Peace" (Arkadii Babchenko, Julia Latynina, and the fragment from Dmitri Bykov's novel "ZhD" under the title "Jewhad"). Makanin's "The Prisoner of the Caucuses" is included into the collection of his works "The Loss" (Northwestern UP) translated by Byron Lyndsey - although it's more a post-imperial rather than a post-colonial text. Best of luck, Mark ******************************************************************************* MARK LIPOVETSKY [Leiderman] Associate Professor of Russian Studies and Comparative Literature, Department of Germanic and Slavic Languages and Literatures Office Address: CU-Boulder, 276 UCB, Boulder CO 80309 Fax: 303-492-5376 Tel: 303-492-7957 ---- Original message ---- Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 12:42:20 -0700 From: "Furman, Yelena" Subject: [SEELANGS] Russian/East/Central European postcolonial literature To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU >Dear all, >This may be a somewhat unusual question, but I'll try anyway. I have been asked for recommendations of texts by contemporary Russian writers who deal with the issue of post-colonialism (defined loosely, given that it's a very different historical situation). Since the person who asked me doesn't read Russian, these would have to be in English translation. Perhaps there are also writers from East/Central Europe, or Central Asia, who deal with the issue of Russian (Soviet) 'colonialism'? >I freely admit that I know virtually nothing about the topic, so any suggestions for readings would be very much appreciated. >Thank you in advance. >Yelena Furman >Department of Literature, UCSD > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From iamlearningenglish at GMAIL.COM Fri May 18 23:09:04 2007 From: iamlearningenglish at GMAIL.COM (Dustin Hosseini) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 18:09:04 -0500 Subject: New idiocy in student visa procedures Message-ID: Well, what should we have expected? What did Chernomyrdin say? We tried to make things better, but things remained the same anyway... As far as tourism, it's amazing how other European cities all around Russia are so well-developed in terms of providing low-cost accomodations for students and travelers (hostels) but they only recently appeared in Moscow and comparably are quite expensive. There aren't discounts for students in Russia either, unless you have a Russian-issued studencheskiy bilet. The ISIC is widely unrecognized here. Foreigners still have to pay more at most museums and of course the Kremlin... All foreigners are rich, as we all know. Moscow doesn't need tourism. Lots of locals have told me this. "We don't want to become like Turkey, where they live off tourism..." is what I've heard a number of times. Russia's black gold is an endless supply...never to run dry. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ANTHONY.QUALIN at TTU.EDU Sat May 19 00:35:39 2007 From: ANTHONY.QUALIN at TTU.EDU (Qualin, Anthony) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 19:35:39 -0500 Subject: Russian/East/Central European postcolonial literature In-Reply-To: A<31C1DA6A7615F74EAE7A4262334C447FD90B2A@hermes.humnet.ucla.edu> Message-ID: Dear Yelena, Almost anything by Chingiz Aitmatov is worth reading for someone interested in the topic. Iskander, especially Sandro iz Chegema, has a lot to offer, too. Timur Pulatov, Olzhas Suleimenov, Hrant Matevosyan, Fazu Alieva, Otar Ioselani, Yuri Rykhteu, and Timur Zulfikarov are all worth reading, as well, but they are harder to find in translation (although there are things out there). I've left a lot of worthy authors out, I'm sure. If your friend/colleague has access to old issues of the journal Soviet Literature, it is a gold mine. It has translations, not just from Russian, but from other languages as well. If you want to pass my e-mail address on to your friend, I could discuss the topic with him or her in more depth. Anthony ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Anthony Qualin Associate Professor Classical and Modern Languages and Literatures Texas Tech University Lubbock, Texas 79409-2071 Telephone: 806-742-3145 ext. 244 Fax: 806-742-3306 E-mail: anthony.qualin at ttu.edu Web: www2.tltc.ttu.edu/qualin/personal ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Sat May 19 01:49:56 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Fri, 18 May 2007 21:49:56 -0400 Subject: Educational terminology -- THANKS In-Reply-To: <46469042.8080904@pbg-translations.com> Message-ID: Thanks to everyone who responded, both on- and off-list: Prof. Steven P. Hill Olga Meerson Margaret Anne Samu Alina Israeli Victoria Thorstensson Miriam Schrager Maryna Vinarska Alina Makin Pavel Lyssakov John Woodsworth I hope I haven't missed anyone; if so, the omission is unintentional and I apologize. This has been quite the education for me. -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From is382 at NYU.EDU Sat May 19 19:46:59 2007 From: is382 at NYU.EDU (Irina Sizova) Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 15:46:59 -0400 Subject: Please join us on May 30th at Carnegie Hall at a concert featuring Anna Netrebko and Dmitry Hvorostovsky In-Reply-To: <01eb01c78c02$9ba762d0$6f01a8c0@russian2000> Message-ID: Maria, I was wondering if you still have tickets for this event. If so, what is the price range? Thank you. Regards, Irina ----- Original Message ----- From: Maria Vorobieva Date: Tuesday, May 1, 2007 11:05 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Please join us on May 30th at Carnegie Hall at a concert featuring Anna Netrebko and Dmitry Hvorostovsky To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Dear All: > > If you are interested to attend the historic concert at Carnegie Hall > in New York on May 30th featuring Anna Netrebko and Dmitri > Hvorostovsky, please call me at 212-473-6263 or email maria at rcws.org > > Carnegie Hall is completely sold out for that evening, and the > Russian Children's Welfare Society is the only organization that has > tickets in its possession. Anna Netrebko is the Honorary Director of > the RCWS (founded in 1926). A portion of proceeds from the evening > will go to assist the charitable efforts of our organization - > assisting disadvantaged children in Russia. To learn more about the > RCWS, I invite you to visit www.rcws.org > > Please call us soon to reserve a good seat at a wonderful concert at > the end of May! The tickets are selling very fast. Thank you. > > Kind regards, > Masha > > Maria Vorobieva > Director of Development > The Russian Children's Welfare Society > Tel: 212.473.6263 > Cell: 201.233.6676 > Fax: 212.473.6301 > Email:maria at rcws.org > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jane.chamberlain at GMAIL.COM Sat May 19 21:11:19 2007 From: jane.chamberlain at GMAIL.COM (Pangloss Publishing) Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 16:11:19 -0500 Subject: Robert Chandler In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Robert, could the meaning lie in the difference between ÚÛÚ and Á”ÂÒ¸ (the latter is in your transliterated rendering but not in your cyrillic). Dictionary definitions of the two differ only in that the word 'place' appears with Á”ÂÒ¸ . How about "To you it's just a job, but I have a feeling for this place"? Jane >Dear all, > >Just realized that the underlining gets lost. My question is about the word >'chuvstvuyu' We cannot think of anything that has the right resonance: > > 'We'll see,' Fyodorov said gloomily. 'To you it's a job - but what I do is >feel.' ?? > > - ü ÚýÏ ÔӓÎþÊÛ, - ÒÛϕý—ÌÓ ÒÍýýÎ î”ӕӒ. - ǚ ÚÓθÍÓ ÒÎÛÊËÚÂ, ý þ >—Û’Òڒۜ. >'Ya tam poglyazhu,' sumrachno skazal Fyodorov. 'Vy tut tol'ko sluzhite, a ya >zdes' chuvstvuyu.' > >By the way, this story is almost unobtainable in its full, uncensored >version. If anyone would like an electronic copy, I'll gladly send them >one. I recently typed it into my computer. > >Poka, > >R. > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From nataliek at UALBERTA.CA Sat May 19 22:40:47 2007 From: nataliek at UALBERTA.CA (nataliek at UALBERTA.CA) Date: Sat, 19 May 2007 16:40:47 -0600 Subject: Ukrainian Foodways on line Message-ID: Dear SEELANGS colleagues, Just wanted to let you know that we have added a new section to the Ukrainian Traditional Folklore webpage. We filmed a master baker making what she called paskhy for Provody, the commemoration of the dead that is held in the cemetery after Easter. We have a short text, some still photos and a 7 minute video which highlights the steps of the baking process. You can find all this material by going to http://www.arts.ualberta.ca/uvp/. Go under Canadian Folklore and you will see a section on traditional food. So far Anne Mayko and her baking is the only unit there. Natalie Kononenko Kule Chair of Ukrainian Ethnography University of Alberta Modern Languages and Cultural Studies 200 Arts Building Edmonton, Alberta, Canada T6G 2E6 Phone: 780-492-6810 Web: http://www.arts.ualberta.ca/uvp/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Sun May 20 06:01:59 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 07:01:59 +0100 Subject: Platonov question: Vy tut tol'ko sluzhite, khodite, a ya chusvtvuyu Message-ID: Dear all, Thanks to everyone who sent in their thoughts about this line of Platonov. And please forgive various confusions in my previous messages. Sometimes I get fixated on one difficult word and lose sight of the others. In any case, I think we may now be there, or at least a lot closer than we were: ‘But can you do everything the way I do?’ asked Fyodorov. ‘The way you do?’ said one elderly junior pointsman. ‘Not likely. We’ll do things better.’ ‘That’s as maybe,’ Fyodorov said gloomily. ‘You carry out tasks. I work by feeling.’ The last line of the original is - Я там погляжу, - сумрачно сказал Федоров. – Вы тут только служите, ходите, а я чувствую. Best Wishes, R. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK Sun May 20 07:16:28 2007 From: Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK (Alexandra Smith) Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 08:16:28 +0100 Subject: the Platonov question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Quoting Robert Chandler : > > ‘That’s as maybe,’ Fyodorov said gloomily. ‘You carry out tasks. I work > by feeling.’ > > The last line of the original is > - Я там погляжу, - сумрачно сказал Федоров. – Вы тут только служите, > ходите, а я чувствую. > Dear Robert, I think that the your rendering of the above line is not entirely correct and looses the rhythmical pattern of the phrase. I would have put it as follows: "I'll see how it goes", Fedorov said gloomily. "You just work here, walk around, but I live through my sensitivities". All very best, Sasha Smith ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From boris.dagaev at GMAIL.COM Mon May 21 08:11:22 2007 From: boris.dagaev at GMAIL.COM (Boris Dagaev) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 04:11:22 -0400 Subject: the Platonov question In-Reply-To: <20070520081628.175kzcpbkowgkc0c@www.staffmail.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: Robert, "trudge" might work for "ходите"... "Вы тут" is important as well, because the whole phrase is somewhat condescending. On 5/20/07, Alexandra Smith wrote: > Quoting Robert Chandler : > > > > > 'That's as maybe,' Fyodorov said gloomily. 'You carry out tasks. I work > > by feeling.' > > > > The last line of the original is > > - Я там погляжу, - сумрачно сказал Федоров. – Вы тут только служите, > > ходите, а я чувствую. > > > Dear Robert, > > I think that the your rendering of the above line is not entirely > correct and looses the rhythmical pattern of the phrase. > I would have put it as follows: > > "I'll see how it goes", Fedorov said gloomily. "You just work here, > walk around, but I live through my sensitivities". > > All very best, > Sasha Smith > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From M.J.BERRY.RUS at BHAM.AC.UK Mon May 21 10:39:08 2007 From: M.J.BERRY.RUS at BHAM.AC.UK (Michael Berry) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 11:39:08 +0100 Subject: the Platonov question Message-ID: I don't like "You carry out tasks. I work by feeling" - it doesn't sound natural conversation... What about something like: "For you it's just a job, you go through the motions, but I've got a real feel for it." Mike Berry Honorary Senior Research Fellow, Centre for Russian and East European Studies, University of Birmingham, Birmingham B15 2TT ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Mon May 21 10:59:47 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 11:59:47 +0100 Subject: the Platonov question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Thanks very much! But I need to say a few things: 'For you it's (just) a job' is fine, and I may use it - but the original is not simply 'natural conversation'. Platonov's 'a ya chuvstvuyu' (with no object' is clumsy and touching (as someone has already said). And it has many possible meanings - touch, emotional feeling, and (perhaps) Platonov talking about his own self. 'I work by feeling' is also ambiguous and has a certain resonance, so I am happy with that part of my tr. I am MUCH LESS HAPPY about the first part. It is certainly possible that 'you go through the motions' is what 'khodite' means here, but I'm really not sure. And I would rather be not be so much more explicit than Platonov himself! Best Wishes to all, R. > I don't like "You carry out tasks. I work by feeling" - it doesn't sound > natural conversation... > What about something like: > "For you it's just a job, you go through the motions, but I've got a real feel > for it." > > Mike Berry > Honorary Senior Research Fellow, > Centre for Russian and East European Studies, > University of Birmingham, > Birmingham B15 2TT > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From frosset at WHEATONMA.EDU Mon May 21 11:23:12 2007 From: frosset at WHEATONMA.EDU (Francoise Rosset) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 07:23:12 -0400 Subject: the Platonov question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: >> > - Я там погляжу, - сумрачно сказал Федоров. – Вы тут только >>служите, >> > ходите, а я чувствую. >> >> "I'll see how it goes", Fedorov said gloomily. "You just work here, >> walk around, but I live through my sensitivities". >> A variation on other responses, only the last part is new -- and probably someone has suggested this already: "You just work here, walk around/trudge around, but I feel things." -FR Francoise Rosset Chair, Russian and Russian Studies Coordinator, German and Russian Wheaton College Norton, Massachusetts 02766 Office: (508) 285-3696 FAX: (508) 286-3640 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lino59 at AMERITECH.NET Mon May 21 11:44:34 2007 From: lino59 at AMERITECH.NET (Deborah Hoffman) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 04:44:34 -0700 Subject: Platonov question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Could khodite here be the regular motion of just coming to work every day? Also, how about inserting a word or two after chuvstvuyu to convey meaning rather than sticking to the original syntax, thus: "You only work here, you show up every day, but I feel what I do." Just a thought to convey the speaker's main concern of contrasting the rote performance of his co-workers with his greater emotional participation. SEELANGS automatic digest system wrote: > Dear Robert, I think that the your rendering of the above line is not entirely correct and looses the rhythmical pattern of the phrase. I would have put it as follows: "I'll see how it goes", Fedorov said gloomily. "You just work here, walk around, but I live through my sensitivities". All very best, Sasha Smith ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lino59 at AMERITECH.NET Mon May 21 12:15:56 2007 From: lino59 at AMERITECH.NET (Deborah Hoffman) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 05:15:56 -0700 Subject: Platonov question Message-ID: Wait - I have something better. How about "You just work here, going through the motions, but I feel what I do." It's not literal, but perhaps also renders the colloquial "Vy tut." Sorry to be coming late to the party - no matter which encoding I switch my machine to I can never read the Cyrillic parts of some of the messages. Deborah Hoffman wrote: Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 04:44:34 -0700 (PDT) From: Deborah Hoffman Subject: Platonov question To: "SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list" Could khodite here be the regular motion of just coming to work every day? Also, how about inserting a word or two after chuvstvuyu to convey meaning rather than sticking to the original syntax, thus: "You only work here, you show up every day, but I feel what I do." Just a thought to convey the speaker's main concern of contrasting the rote performance of his co-workers with his greater emotional participation. Date: Sun, 20 May 2007 07:01:59 +0100 From: Robert Chandler Subject: Platonov question: Vy tut tol'ko sluzhite, khodite, a ya chusvtvuyu Dear all, Thanks to everyone who sent in their thoughts about this line of Platonov. And please forgive various confusions in my previous messages. Sometimes I get fixated on one difficult word and lose sight of the others. In any case, I think we may now be there, or at least a lot closer than we were: =91But can you do everything the way I do?=92 asked Fyodorov. =91The way you do?=92 said one elderly junior pointsman. =91Not likely. We=92ll do things better.=92 =91That=92s as maybe,=92 Fyodorov said gloomily. =91You carry out tasks. I work by feeling.=92 The last line of the original is - =DF =F2=E0=EC =EF=EE=E3=EB=FF=E6=F3, - =F1=F3=EC=F0=E0=F7=ED=EE =F1=EA=E0=E7=E0=EB =D4=E5=E4=EE=F0=EE=E2. =96 =C2=FB =F2=F3=F2 =F2=EE=EB=FC=EA=EE =F1=EB=F3=E6=E8=F2=E5, =F5=EE=E4=E8=F2=E5, =E0 =FF =F7=F3=E2=F1=F2=E2=F3=FE. Best Wishes, R. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulr at RUSSIANLIFE.NET Mon May 21 12:49:45 2007 From: paulr at RUSSIANLIFE.NET (Paul Richardson) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 08:49:45 -0400 Subject: SEELANGS Digest - 19 May 2007 to 20 May 2007 (#2007-76) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Or, how about: "You here merely live to serve, but I live through my senses." On May 21, 2007, at 1:00 AM, SEELANGS automatic digest system wrote: >> >> ‘That’s as maybe,’ Fyodorov said gloomily. ‘You carry out >> tasks. I work >> by feeling.’ >> >> The last line of the original is >> - Я там погляжу, - сумрачно сказал >> Федоров. – Вы тут только служите, >> ходите, а я чувствую. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Carol.Any at TRINCOLL.EDU Mon May 21 13:48:24 2007 From: Carol.Any at TRINCOLL.EDU (Any, Carol J) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 09:48:24 -0400 Subject: Kakdoma apartment services In-Reply-To: A<008c01c7965d$307cd200$0302a8c0@blackie> Message-ID: Has anyone used the Moscow apartment rental services of kakdoma.ru? I'm thinking of using them and would like to know whether people have had good or bad experiences. Carol Any ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From colkitto at ROGERS.COM Mon May 21 13:59:07 2007 From: colkitto at ROGERS.COM (colkitto) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 09:59:07 -0400 Subject: Platonov question Message-ID: or (maybe more idiomatically and freely) "you're just putting in time here, but I'm emotionally involved in this job" ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Mon May 21 14:07:13 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 07:07:13 -0700 Subject: the Platonov question Message-ID: I like "I feel things" for chuvstvuiu. Robert, what do you think? Olga Meerson ----- Original Message ----- From: Francoise Rosset Date: Monday, May 21, 2007 4:23 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] the Platonov question > >> > - ? ??? ???????, - ???????? ?????? ???????. – ?? ??? ?????? > >>???????, > >> > ??????, ? ? ????????. > >> > >> "I'll see how it goes", Fedorov said gloomily. "You just work here, > >> walk around, but I live through my sensitivities". > >> > > A variation on other responses, only the last part is new -- > and probably someone has suggested this already: > "You just work here, walk around/trudge around, but I feel things." > > -FR > > Francoise Rosset > Chair, Russian and Russian Studies > Coordinator, German and Russian > Wheaton College > Norton, Massachusetts 02766 > Office: (508) 285-3696 > FAX: (508) 286-3640 > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Mon May 21 14:08:04 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 07:08:04 -0700 Subject: Platonov question Message-ID: No. Tut xodite is not siuda xodite. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Deborah Hoffman Date: Monday, May 21, 2007 4:44 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Platonov question > Could khodite here be the regular motion of just coming to work > every day? Also, how about inserting a word or two after > chuvstvuyu to convey meaning rather than sticking to the original > syntax, thus: > > "You only work here, you show up every day, but I feel what I do." > > Just a thought to convey the speaker's main concern of > contrasting the rote performance of his co-workers with his > greater emotional participation. > > > SEELANGS automatic digest system wrote: > > > > Dear Robert, > > I think that the your rendering of the above line is not entirely > correct and looses the rhythmical pattern of the phrase. > I would have put it as follows: > > "I'll see how it goes", Fedorov said gloomily. "You just work > here, > walk around, but I live through my sensitivities". > > All very best, > Sasha Smith > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lily.alexander at UTORONTO.CA Mon May 21 14:14:53 2007 From: lily.alexander at UTORONTO.CA (Lily Alexander) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 10:14:53 -0400 Subject: Fwd: Platonov, and his metaphors Message-ID: Hi Robert, I read in the morning all messages sent to you regarding this peace, and I cannot help thinking that people are giving you good advice of "good English" that sounds right. This is exactly the point: this sentence - about feelings - is designed NOT to sound right. The word "chuvstvuyu" in the context is out of place and must stick out. In Platonov, almost in every sentence there is a word unconventionally used, so his language and the language of his characters sound "childish," as if they do not know how to use language properly, or "wizardly" as if they know something about the secret life of words that nobody else knows. He often uses words "pod uglom" k rechi. They are in strange relationships with his text, and they are disobediently used. Like in Vico (each metaphor is a little myth) Platonov's words are metaphors which are little myths. For example, with this "chuvstvuiu." Imagine a person, a railroad worker, who is connected to his rails, and other mechanical things, and his road as if by means of thousands nerves connected to his body or coming from his body - he "feels" them all . He is connected with them - a man of the universe, or universe's "central station." And of course he points out to others that they are who they are, and he understands himself as this special being, take it or leave it. They are flabbergasted, offended and bewildered at once. So the hero imagines himself (and Platonov does not dispute) as almost some kind of fantastic being - fantastic human tree with the roots going everywhere. The image of the man connected with his nerves (and hence feelings) with the entire world is repeated by Platonov in so many ways and in so many works. This image is one of Platonov's "foundational metaphors, " or "root metaphors" of his fictional world. This is why you stumbled on this word and cannot get through. Maybe the author does not allow you - until you get it his way. :-) Regarding the use of the word "pustiak" in another sentence, which we discussed with you - when people say "eto ne pustiak," this connotes a tiny resentment. I would not omit "pustiak" or replace it with anything else. Besides, pustiak is a "little" pustota. Emptiness comes through the word "pustiak" in Russian. And it is another of Platonov's root metaphors, with a negative connotation about what the world has become to - tragically. Again, various images of emptiness come through in abundance in many works of Platonov. It seems to me that loosing Platonov's "stick out" words means loosing Platonov. It is not a good idea to "straighten him out" and clean his clumsy language because this clumsiness is meaning-making. His "stick out" words that are almost metaphors are important - often because they are part of his imagery and of the system of root-metaphors of his world. They are part of his recurrent vocabulary of word-images. I think you are "feeling it" (like the character) and cannot get through this peace without resolving these issues. I also think that when he uses words incorrectly grammatically or in other unpredictable ways, he establishes an instant contact with us through the textual frames. He uses strange words not simply as attention-getters, but as a sudden moments of a dialogue on "feeling" or other "sensitive" things that is directed at us, the readers. So messing with Platonov's weird usage of words, one can affect Platonov's communication system with his readers, constructed very carefully and elaborately. While reading, and running into this strangely used words, one must stop for a second and subconsciously reflect on language itself - why the word is used this way and what this means. Platonov has an amazing flow of course, but he also punctuates his language with unusual usage, creating some strange rhythm of delays and "stops." Well, defamiliarization of course - but also something else, putrefy Platonov's, hard to define. Good luck. Lily Alexander ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From colkitto at ROGERS.COM Mon May 21 14:25:54 2007 From: colkitto at ROGERS.COM (colkitto) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 10:25:54 -0400 Subject: Fwd: Platonov, and his metaphors Message-ID: too many Roberts on this list ...... "In Platonov, almost in every sentence there is a word unconventionally > used, " in that case, why not borrow from a Hancock dialogue (from memory) for cuvstvuju ... I paint with ... light Swipe me! .... 'e paints with light!!!!!! and suggest "you're just ..... but I do this job with light" or "I bring light to this job" that would be a bit out of context. It was funny enough applied to art, but railway sleepers? ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jwilson at SRAS.ORG Mon May 21 16:10:46 2007 From: jwilson at SRAS.ORG (Josh Wilson) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 20:10:46 +0400 Subject: Fwd: Platonov, and his metaphors In-Reply-To: <4651A95D.10105@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: First off, thanks to Lily for this insightful comment on the ART of translation. I do not wish to offend anyone on this list, but it really seems to me that most of these suggestions I've read so far seem out-of-the-blue and a little stale. The type of sentences I read time and time again that always leave me wondering "I wonder the original said (and meant)." Of course, I could look that up, but translations should not leave one with that feeling. Given Lily's contemplation of the subject - that the phrase should sound odd but also imply a mystical connection with the railroad as well as the fact that he excels in his job - I would leave many of the words behind and translate the thought instead. Something like: "You only work here, go through the motions, but I bleed rail ties." It does differ from the original, but achieves the same effect of slightly alienating the listener, and also makes instant sense as a metaphor by borrowing from a common image about "having something in one's blood." I've also assumed that "tut khodite" would imply regular motion in a single place and convey a slight condescension... Just a(nother) suggestion. JW -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Lily Alexander Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 6:15 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] Fwd: Platonov, and his metaphors Hi Robert, I read in the morning all messages sent to you regarding this peace, and I cannot help thinking that people are giving you good advice of "good English" that sounds right. This is exactly the point: this sentence - about feelings - is designed NOT to sound right. The word "chuvstvuyu" in the context is out of place and must stick out. In Platonov, almost in every sentence there is a word unconventionally used, so his language and the language of his characters sound "childish," as if they do not know how to use language properly, or "wizardly" as if they know something about the secret life of words that nobody else knows. He often uses words "pod uglom" k rechi. They are in strange relationships with his text, and they are disobediently used. Like in Vico (each metaphor is a little myth) Platonov's words are metaphors which are little myths. For example, with this "chuvstvuiu." Imagine a person, a railroad worker, who is connected to his rails, and other mechanical things, and his road as if by means of thousands nerves connected to his body or coming from his body - he "feels" them all . He is connected with them - a man of the universe, or universe's "central station." And of course he points out to others that they are who they are, and he understands himself as this special being, take it or leave it. They are flabbergasted, offended and bewildered at once. So the hero imagines himself (and Platonov does not dispute) as almost some kind of fantastic being - fantastic human tree with the roots going everywhere. The image of the man connected with his nerves (and hence feelings) with the entire world is repeated by Platonov in so many ways and in so many works. This image is one of Platonov's "foundational metaphors, " or "root metaphors" of his fictional world. This is why you stumbled on this word and cannot get through. Maybe the author does not allow you - until you get it his way. :-) Regarding the use of the word "pustiak" in another sentence, which we discussed with you - when people say "eto ne pustiak," this connotes a tiny resentment. I would not omit "pustiak" or replace it with anything else. Besides, pustiak is a "little" pustota. Emptiness comes through the word "pustiak" in Russian. And it is another of Platonov's root metaphors, with a negative connotation about what the world has become to - tragically. Again, various images of emptiness come through in abundance in many works of Platonov. It seems to me that loosing Platonov's "stick out" words means loosing Platonov. It is not a good idea to "straighten him out" and clean his clumsy language because this clumsiness is meaning-making. His "stick out" words that are almost metaphors are important - often because they are part of his imagery and of the system of root-metaphors of his world. They are part of his recurrent vocabulary of word-images. I think you are "feeling it" (like the character) and cannot get through this peace without resolving these issues. I also think that when he uses words incorrectly grammatically or in other unpredictable ways, he establishes an instant contact with us through the textual frames. He uses strange words not simply as attention-getters, but as a sudden moments of a dialogue on "feeling" or other "sensitive" things that is directed at us, the readers. So messing with Platonov's weird usage of words, one can affect Platonov's communication system with his readers, constructed very carefully and elaborately. While reading, and running into this strangely used words, one must stop for a second and subconsciously reflect on language itself - why the word is used this way and what this means. Platonov has an amazing flow of course, but he also punctuates his language with unusual usage, creating some strange rhythm of delays and "stops." Well, defamiliarization of course - but also something else, putrefy Platonov's, hard to define. Good luck. Lily Alexander ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From pstock at BRANDEIS.EDU Mon May 21 16:39:23 2007 From: pstock at BRANDEIS.EDU (David Powelstock) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 12:39:23 -0400 Subject: Fwd: Platonov, and his metaphors In-Reply-To: <200705211610.l4LGAkLW031704@alinga.com> Message-ID: I'm also very grateful for Lily's post, which made a number of points I had on my mind. Her post and Josh's got me thinking about the "khodite" part. I think the force of it has to do with the (metaphysically speaking) accidental character of the workers' presence by comparison with the speaker's sense of the organic necessity of his own presence. "You're just walking around here" (like strangers, with no deeper connection), while the speaker, as Lily acutely observed, has some kind of profound (and profoundly surprising) connection to the technology--a variation of the 1920s Soviet cultural theme of the man-machine fusion. If "vy tut khodite" were the only part of the sentence I were translating, I'd render it, "you're just here." Including the whole first part, I might venture: "You're just here, on the job." As for the last part, I agree with Josh that you need some kind of inspired invention here. I don't see any remotely literal translation that will do the job (so to speak). Here's what just came to my mind, for better or worse: "You're just here, on the job, but this is my body." This implies the "feeling" bit pretty strongly, I think, while being pretty startling. Incidentally, I must admit that I rather enjoy these collective brainstorming sessions over translatin problems. All best wishes, David David Powelstock Asst. Prof. of Russian & East European Literatures Chair, Program in Russian & East European Studies Brandeis University GRALL, MS 024 Waltham, MA 02454-9110 781.736.3347 (Office) -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Josh Wilson Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 12:11 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Fwd: Platonov, and his metaphors First off, thanks to Lily for this insightful comment on the ART of translation. I do not wish to offend anyone on this list, but it really seems to me that most of these suggestions I've read so far seem out-of-the-blue and a little stale. The type of sentences I read time and time again that always leave me wondering "I wonder the original said (and meant)." Of course, I could look that up, but translations should not leave one with that feeling. Given Lily's contemplation of the subject - that the phrase should sound odd but also imply a mystical connection with the railroad as well as the fact that he excels in his job - I would leave many of the words behind and translate the thought instead. Something like: "You only work here, go through the motions, but I bleed rail ties." It does differ from the original, but achieves the same effect of slightly alienating the listener, and also makes instant sense as a metaphor by borrowing from a common image about "having something in one's blood." I've also assumed that "tut khodite" would imply regular motion in a single place and convey a slight condescension... Just a(nother) suggestion. JW -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Lily Alexander Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 6:15 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] Fwd: Platonov, and his metaphors Hi Robert, I read in the morning all messages sent to you regarding this peace, and I cannot help thinking that people are giving you good advice of "good English" that sounds right. This is exactly the point: this sentence - about feelings - is designed NOT to sound right. The word "chuvstvuyu" in the context is out of place and must stick out. In Platonov, almost in every sentence there is a word unconventionally used, so his language and the language of his characters sound "childish," as if they do not know how to use language properly, or "wizardly" as if they know something about the secret life of words that nobody else knows. He often uses words "pod uglom" k rechi. They are in strange relationships with his text, and they are disobediently used. Like in Vico (each metaphor is a little myth) Platonov's words are metaphors which are little myths. For example, with this "chuvstvuiu." Imagine a person, a railroad worker, who is connected to his rails, and other mechanical things, and his road as if by means of thousands nerves connected to his body or coming from his body - he "feels" them all . He is connected with them - a man of the universe, or universe's "central station." And of course he points out to others that they are who they are, and he understands himself as this special being, take it or leave it. They are flabbergasted, offended and bewildered at once. So the hero imagines himself (and Platonov does not dispute) as almost some kind of fantastic being - fantastic human tree with the roots going everywhere. The image of the man connected with his nerves (and hence feelings) with the entire world is repeated by Platonov in so many ways and in so many works. This image is one of Platonov's "foundational metaphors, " or "root metaphors" of his fictional world. This is why you stumbled on this word and cannot get through. Maybe the author does not allow you - until you get it his way. :-) Regarding the use of the word "pustiak" in another sentence, which we discussed with you - when people say "eto ne pustiak," this connotes a tiny resentment. I would not omit "pustiak" or replace it with anything else. Besides, pustiak is a "little" pustota. Emptiness comes through the word "pustiak" in Russian. And it is another of Platonov's root metaphors, with a negative connotation about what the world has become to - tragically. Again, various images of emptiness come through in abundance in many works of Platonov. It seems to me that loosing Platonov's "stick out" words means loosing Platonov. It is not a good idea to "straighten him out" and clean his clumsy language because this clumsiness is meaning-making. His "stick out" words that are almost metaphors are important - often because they are part of his imagery and of the system of root-metaphors of his world. They are part of his recurrent vocabulary of word-images. I think you are "feeling it" (like the character) and cannot get through this peace without resolving these issues. I also think that when he uses words incorrectly grammatically or in other unpredictable ways, he establishes an instant contact with us through the textual frames. He uses strange words not simply as attention-getters, but as a sudden moments of a dialogue on "feeling" or other "sensitive" things that is directed at us, the readers. So messing with Platonov's weird usage of words, one can affect Platonov's communication system with his readers, constructed very carefully and elaborately. While reading, and running into this strangely used words, one must stop for a second and subconsciously reflect on language itself - why the word is used this way and what this means. Platonov has an amazing flow of course, but he also punctuates his language with unusual usage, creating some strange rhythm of delays and "stops." Well, defamiliarization of course - but also something else, putrefy Platonov's, hard to define. Good luck. Lily Alexander ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lino59 at AMERITECH.NET Mon May 21 17:01:52 2007 From: lino59 at AMERITECH.NET (Deborah Hoffman) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 10:01:52 -0700 Subject: Platonov question In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Did not mean to suggest it was - probably should have used "activity" instead of motion since I was mainly plugging the idea of contrasting being physically present and moving aimlessly with what the narrator claims he does. As Lily Alexander and Josh Wilson point out, some knowledge of Platonov in general is also probably indispensable in struggling with issues like this. Probably applies to all literary endeavors. ___________________________________________________ Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 07:08:04 -0700 From: Olga Meerson Subject: Re: Platonov question No. Tut xodite is not siuda xodite. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Deborah Hoffman Date: Monday, May 21, 2007 4:44 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Platonov question > Could khodite here be the regular motion of just coming to work > every day? Also, how about inserting a word or two after > chuvstvuyu to convey meaning rather than sticking to the original > syntax, thus: > > "You only work here, you show up every day, but I feel what I do." > > Just a thought to convey the speaker's main concern of > contrasting the rote performance of his co-workers with his > greater emotional participation. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From renee at ALINGA.COM Mon May 21 17:27:18 2007 From: renee at ALINGA.COM (Renee Stillings) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 10:27:18 -0700 Subject: clarification on visa silliness Message-ID: Today I clarified a rather interesting tidbit regarding the visa issue I described earlier. Apparently at the DC consulate, this policy of slowing to 10 business days processing is being applied SPECIFICALLY to students going to St. Petersburg State University. It is beyond me as to whether this is because they have a larger volume than anyone else and the consulate is flooded with their applications or someone in the consulate has some vendetta against that university. If anyone has insights into this, it would be appreciated. The visa expediter helping us on this matter now says there has historically always been an issue with St. Pete invites at that consulate. Renee ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From olgames at IASTATE.EDU Mon May 21 17:42:19 2007 From: olgames at IASTATE.EDU (Olga Mesropova) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 12:42:19 -0500 Subject: clarification on visa silliness In-Reply-To: <200705211727.l4LHRIZV019438@alinga.com> Message-ID: Renee, I've just had the same problem of not being able to get my students expedited visas at the DC consulate. My group was going to St.Petersburg but NOT to St.Petersburg State University. This said, I am not sure that Petersburg State is the target here. Best, Olga Olga Mesropova, Ph.D. Assistant Professor of Russian Director, Russian, East European, and Eurasian Studies Associate Editor, NWSA Journal Iowa State University -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Renee Stillings Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 12:27 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] clarification on visa silliness Today I clarified a rather interesting tidbit regarding the visa issue I described earlier. Apparently at the DC consulate, this policy of slowing to 10 business days processing is being applied SPECIFICALLY to students going to St. Petersburg State University. It is beyond me as to whether this is because they have a larger volume than anyone else and the consulate is flooded with their applications or someone in the consulate has some vendetta against that university. If anyone has insights into this, it would be appreciated. The visa expediter helping us on this matter now says there has historically always been an issue with St. Pete invites at that consulate. Renee ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From renee at ALINGA.COM Mon May 21 17:48:25 2007 From: renee at ALINGA.COM (Renee Stillings) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 10:48:25 -0700 Subject: clarification on visa silliness In-Reply-To: <002801c79bcf$62ad7960$06040f0a@OlgaLT> Message-ID: It may well be a St. Petersburg city thing then. Apparently they are expediting MGU and YarGU for me now. Very odd. -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Olga Mesropova Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 10:42 AM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] clarification on visa silliness Renee, I've just had the same problem of not being able to get my students expedited visas at the DC consulate. My group was going to St.Petersburg but NOT to St.Petersburg State University. This said, I am not sure that Petersburg State is the target here. Best, Olga Olga Mesropova, Ph.D. Assistant Professor of Russian Director, Russian, East European, and Eurasian Studies Associate Editor, NWSA Journal Iowa State University -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Renee Stillings Sent: Monday, May 21, 2007 12:27 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] clarification on visa silliness Today I clarified a rather interesting tidbit regarding the visa issue I described earlier. Apparently at the DC consulate, this policy of slowing to 10 business days processing is being applied SPECIFICALLY to students going to St. Petersburg State University. It is beyond me as to whether this is because they have a larger volume than anyone else and the consulate is flooded with their applications or someone in the consulate has some vendetta against that university. If anyone has insights into this, it would be appreciated. The visa expediter helping us on this matter now says there has historically always been an issue with St. Pete invites at that consulate. Renee ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mkatz at MIDDLEBURY.EDU Mon May 21 17:52:39 2007 From: mkatz at MIDDLEBURY.EDU (Katz, Michael) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 13:52:39 -0400 Subject: FW: East Europeanist Message-ID: Dear Colleagues: Our PROPOSAL FOR AN OFF-CAMPUS J-TERM COURSE, JANUARY 2008, entitled VILNIUS AND ODESSA: THE SACRED AND THE PROFANE IN EAST EUROPEAN JEWRY has been approved. We will be taking a group of students to those two cities during the second and third week of the course. Meanwhile, we are eager to identify an East European specialist who might be willing to visit Middlebury in early January and deliverone or two background lectures on those cities, with particular attention paid to the Jewish population. We would be willing to pay all expenses and a modest honorarium; downhill and cross-country skiers, take note. Please reply off-line if you are intrerested, and attach your resume. With thanks. Michael Katz Middlebury College PS If you know someone who is not on SEELANGS who would fit the bill, please let me know and I will contact him/her directly. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From yfurman at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU Mon May 21 18:11:02 2007 From: yfurman at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU (Furman, Yelena) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 11:11:02 -0700 Subject: Russian/East/Central European postcolonial literature Message-ID: Dear all, A huge thank you to everyone who answered my query. I now have a very interesting list of titles/authors, not only for the person who asked me but for my own education, as well. Many thanks again. All best, Lena ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lily.alexander at UTORONTO.CA Mon May 21 19:04:47 2007 From: lily.alexander at UTORONTO.CA (Lily Alexander) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 15:04:47 -0400 Subject: Platonov - Kosnoyazuchie Message-ID: Dear Robert and All, Just one more thought. Maybe sacrilegious. Although people like me and others may take part in the search for a good word, and native speakers may help in deciphering the hidden meaning and grammatical controversies - it seems to me that the group that could be of help to you in finding correlating English odd words/usage, would be American comedians. I was looking last week in a bookstore at the complete script of Seinfeld, and was thinking about buying it. On paper, the power of language in the dialogues is even more clear. The script centers on a word or a notion that seems known, habitual and banal, and offensively makes fun of it by displacing it in contexts or repeating it to death. The word and its core meaning, together with the users, turn absurd. As often in Larry David (Curb Your Enthusiasm). My family is a "big fan" of stand-up comedy, and these people twist words in amazing ways. This is the closest - what I can think of - to your uneasy task. That's why I earlier mentioned to you the connection between Platonov and Chaplin. What Chaplin does with the gravity of a body, Platonov does to a stability of a word in language. Of course Platonov is much more tender, kind, philosophical and mythological than David. Larry David, the writer of Seinfeld and Curb, especially in the latter - he is too gloomy and his twisted words drop on your head like stones. Your don't want to live in his universe. He is way too ruthless and sarcastic to be compared to Platonov. One loved his heroes and another does not. But David is good, and nobody has such freedom of word-twisting in this intentionally awkward way (not even English-American modernist poets) as the best of the comedians. And after all - you are translating for the contemporary readers, and you want them to accept and like Platonov as their own. If I were you, I would keep some scripts or the comedians' texts on paper or on tapes/DVD at home for inspiration. Perhaps of your personal favorite. I am NOT suggesting that you should turn Platonov into The Simpsons or Seinfeld, but there is a holyfooldom and clownery in all of them. The big question is how to translate Platonov's creative kosnoyazuchie (twisted tongue) into contemporary English. Some part or element of what Platonov was doing with language is currently in the most joyful brunch of American humor. To inject its spirit into your translations just a little bit, if not their specific vocabulary, may be liberating. In any case, you would enjoy having those scripts and tapes one way or another. This of course opens the whole new can of worms about translating for specific generations, but lets leave it to the theorists, and I wish your work on Platonov to be an enjoyable process. Best regards, Lily Alexander ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From colkitto at ROGERS.COM Mon May 21 19:42:51 2007 From: colkitto at ROGERS.COM (colkitto) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 15:42:51 -0400 Subject: Platonov - Kosnoyazuchie Message-ID: Dear Lily and All (et al)?, > Although people like me and others may take part in the search for a good > word, and native speakers may help in deciphering the hidden meaning and > grammatical controversies - it seems to me that the group that could be of > help to you in finding correlating English odd words/usage, would be > American comedians. I actually did suggest a (late) British comedian, Tony Hancock ("I paint ... with light" - sounds much funnier than it reads) as a source of inspiration. Hancock, however, achieved much of his effect with tone of voice rather than word-choice - maybe Platonov needs to be read aloud to be appreciated properly? Robert Orr (have to put my name in (not quite) full for this thread) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK Mon May 21 20:00:45 2007 From: Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK (Alexandra Smith) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 21:00:45 +0100 Subject: Platonov - Kosnoyazychie In-Reply-To: <4651ED4F.4000702@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: Dear Lily, I think that your reading of Platonov could stretch further, beyond Shklovsky, pointing to some analogies with the issues related to the philosophy of language discussed in the writings of Diderot and other 18th-c. thinkers. See, for example, Smoliarova's excellent article: Tatiana Smoliarova, ?Distortion and Theatricality: Estrangement in Diderot and Shklovsky?, Poetics Today, Spring: 27:1, 2006. The article also sheds some light on the issue related to Chaplin and Shklovsky's notion of estrangement. However, having done a considerable amount of research on Platonov and his language at some stage of my life, I came to the conclusion that to a large extent Platonov's language has some strong links with the language of various Soviet newspapers of the 1920s and some colloqual and non-standard language used in Southern parts of Russia (Voronezh region, etc.). It is not always a product of clever tricks and lingistic games. Naturally, Platonov had a very good ear for picking up lots of things that deviated from the norm, so to speak. In the sentence that includes the phrase "Ia chuvstvuiu" the strangeness comes from the fact that in the Russian language this phrase is not used by itself, it appears to be incomplete, since native speakers would usually continue this type of sentences along the lines "I feel that..." (Ia chuvstvuiu, chto...) or "ia chuvstvuiu, kak"... It seems to me that the phrase discussed earlier stands close to the idiomatic expression "Ia boleiu vsei dushoi".... but in the end of the day the translator still needs to preserve the stylistic mask of a simpleton used by Platonov and look for similar cases that exist in non-standard English. I'm not sure though whether Robert Chandler and Olga Meerson (who already wrote a wonderful book on Platonov's estrangement) are prearing their new translation for British or US readers ... I would imagine that the factor of readership should determine to a large extent the narrative and translation strategies that the translators of this story would like to develop... I agree with your description of the narrator though but I think that you are reading too much into this text. In the end of the day, readers of the story should be aware of some eccentric qualities of the narrator's speech who is not as sophisticated as Platonov. But one shouldn't forget about the stylistic mask of a simpleton that Platonov uses here. All very best, Sasha Smith ===================================== Alexandra Smith (PhD, University of London) Lecturer in Russian School of European Languages and Cultures The University of Edinburgh David Hume Tower George Square Edinburgh EX8 9JX UK tel. +44-(0)131-6511381 fax: +44- (0)131- 650-3604 e-mail: Alexandra.Smith at ed.ac.uk ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU Mon May 21 20:02:15 2007 From: s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU (Prof Steven P Hill) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 15:02:15 -0500 Subject: Platonov's compositions Message-ID: Dear colleagues, especially Platonov experts: Reading all the fascinating information on SEELANGS about Platonov the writer, and translators' difficulties rendering him in English, I (not a Platonov expert) cannot resist asking: Does anyone know whether Platonov as a youngster had taken school/ college courses in Russian composition and/or creative writing? And, if he did, what sort of marks ("otmetki") did he receive in the classroom? Best wishes to all, Steven P Hill, University of Illinois. _ _ _ _ _ _ __ _ __ __ __ ___ __ ___ _ __ ___ ___ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lily.alexander at UTORONTO.CA Mon May 21 20:35:57 2007 From: lily.alexander at UTORONTO.CA (Lily Alexander) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 16:35:57 -0400 Subject: Platonov - Kosnoyazychie In-Reply-To: <20070521210045.mrf147sna8koks0k@www.staffmail.ed.ac.uk> Message-ID: Dear Sasha and All, I agree with you of course, with everything you mentioned. Re: "Ia boleiu vsei dushoi" is a very good correlation. And yet, he would have used it if he wanted to. He wanted a new slovoobrazovanie. And it looks like this man does not want to explain himself completely to his peers, so the sentence, being torn, or self censored, or for no reason - has some incompleteness. Platonov has the dimensions of kosnoyasychie of the holy fool, of the Soviet press, and of the Soviet muzhik, and of street language merging with literature, and many many more things. That's why I believe that it is difficult to read too much into Platonov's texts, because they have so many hidden channels and semantic niches opening into all kinds of possible interesting readings. I have seen students interpreting his texts very differently, but all of them made sense to me - I enjoyed seeing them trying. This is his richness. His texts are provoking in this sense - they are almost force us into some kind of Talmudic intense interpretation set of mind. Prof. Hill touched upon the composition issue - and it is the whole new area of inquiry. Several remarkable books have been written on Platonov, numerous articles, and he will likely inspire many more publications and open discussions. Btw, I just found out that Robert has already been very effectively "injecting" Beckett into Platonov, on stage. So he knows his stuff and appreciates the absurd edge of Platonov, and of course a creative process of finding the words is very difficult and open ended. Hopefully, Robert, you are enjoying the process and thank you for letting us in. There likely will be different translations of Platonov eventually, in different styles, and why not? Best regards, Lily Alexandra Smith wrote: > Dear Lily, > > I think that your reading of Platonov could stretch further, beyond > Shklovsky, pointing to some analogies with the issues related to the > philosophy of language discussed in the writings of Diderot and other > 18th-c. thinkers. See, for example, Smoliarova's excellent article: > Tatiana Smoliarova, ?Distortion and Theatricality: Estrangement in > Diderot and Shklovsky?, Poetics Today, Spring: 27:1, 2006. The > article also sheds some light on the issue related to Chaplin and > Shklovsky's notion of estrangement. > However, having done a considerable amount of research on Platonov > and his language at some stage of my life, I came to the conclusion > that to a large extent Platonov's language has some strong links with > the language of various Soviet newspapers of the 1920s and some > colloqual and non-standard language used in Southern parts of Russia > (Voronezh region, etc.). It is not always a product of clever tricks > and lingistic games. Naturally, Platonov had a very good ear for > picking up lots of things that deviated from the norm, so to speak. > In the sentence that includes the phrase "Ia chuvstvuiu" the > strangeness comes from the fact that in the Russian language this > phrase is not used by itself, it appears to be incomplete, since > native speakers would usually continue this type of sentences along > the lines "I feel that..." (Ia chuvstvuiu, chto...) or "ia > chuvstvuiu, kak"... > It seems to me that the phrase discussed earlier stands close to the > idiomatic expression "Ia boleiu vsei dushoi".... but in the end of > the day the translator still needs to preserve the stylistic mask of > a simpleton used by Platonov and look for similar cases that exist > in non-standard English. I'm not sure though whether Robert Chandler > and Olga Meerson (who already wrote a wonderful book on Platonov's > estrangement) are prearing their new translation for British or US > readers ... I would imagine that the factor of readership should > determine to a large extent the narrative and translation strategies > that the translators of this story would like to develop... > I agree with your description of the narrator though but I think that > you are reading too much into this text. In the end of the day, > readers of the story should be aware of some eccentric qualities of > the narrator's speech who is not as sophisticated as Platonov. But > one shouldn't forget about the stylistic mask of a simpleton that > Platonov uses here. > > All very best, > Sasha Smith > > > > > ===================================== > Alexandra Smith (PhD, University of London) > Lecturer in Russian > School of European Languages and Cultures > The University of Edinburgh > David Hume Tower > George Square > Edinburgh EX8 9JX > UK > > tel. +44-(0)131-6511381 > fax: +44- (0)131- 650-3604 > e-mail: Alexandra.Smith at ed.ac.uk > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Mon May 21 21:15:11 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 17:15:11 -0400 Subject: Platonov - Kosnoyazuchie In-Reply-To: <4651ED4F.4000702@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: Lily Alexander wrote: > ... > I was looking last week in a bookstore at the complete script of > Seinfeld, and was thinking about buying it. On paper, the power of > language in the dialogues is even more clear. The script centers on a > word or a notion that seems known, habitual and banal, and offensively > makes fun of it by displacing it in contexts or repeating it to death. > The word and its core meaning, together with the users, turn absurd. As > often in Larry David (Curb Your Enthusiasm). My family is a "big fan" of > stand-up comedy, and these people twist words in amazing ways. > > This is the closest - what I can think of - to your uneasy task. That's > why I earlier mentioned to you the connection between Platonov and > Chaplin. What Chaplin does with the gravity of a body, Platonov does to > a stability of a word in language. > > Of course Platonov is much more tender, kind, philosophical and > mythological than David. Larry David, the writer of Seinfeld and Curb, > especially in the latter - he is too gloomy and his twisted words drop > on your head like stones. Your don't want to live in his universe. He is > way too ruthless and sarcastic to be compared to Platonov. One loved his > heroes and another does not. But David is good, and nobody has such > freedom of word-twisting in this intentionally awkward way (not even > English-American modernist poets) as the best of the comedians. And > after all - you are translating for the contemporary readers, and you > want them to accept and like Platonov as their own. One sitcom I've enjoyed over the years specifically because it's /not/ bitter, sarcastic, or cynical is /Dharma and Greg/. The lead character -- and in fact most of the characters -- are fundamentally happy and playful, and though the writers (Chuck Lorre and Dottie Dortland) play on their quirks and foibles, it's generally not to sabotage them but to reveal them and humanize them. "Where Dharma & Greg stands apart from all other shows is in how you laugh at it. you don't! You laugh WITH it. In Raymond you laugh at the characters when they get in one of their many arguments. In Frasier you laugh when he and Niles do something snobbish. There is a general trend in sitcom humour, akin to the newspaper saying of 'it bleeds, it leads', that trend is making us laugh by making the characters miserable, making them argue, in general, we laugh at their misfortune. On the other hand Dharma is at its best when we are laughing with the characters, at their happiness, because unlike most other shows, the characters in D&G do laugh. They laugh at themselves, at each other, at the situations they encounter, and when they are laughing and having a good time I find it much more funny, much more real, then when I'm asked to laugh at Ray's pathetic brother or Jim's flimsy excuses to his angry wife. Life is funny, why do none of the characters in other sitcoms realize it?" "Dharma and Greg rocks. This show was funny, witty, and highly entertaining. Although it is available in syndication almost everywhere, it is worth purchasing, if for no other reason than to support good writing, talented acting, and sheer television pleasure. "I have never understood why this show didn't last longer. In an age of really stupid 'I don't deserve my wife' sitcoms, this program reminds us that it is possible to have a smart and engaging show about new marriage. Although the initial premise (a couple meet and marry on the same day despite wildly different lifestyles and beliefs) was a bit farcical, a superb ensemble cast held it together with finesse. This show handled serious, realistic situations with uncharacteristic grace and humor. Many times, it could have gone down the road with cheap gags and one-liners (and sometimes, to be honest, it does) but the situations are usually quite well-thought out. "Totally worth the cost and then some. This is NOT your typical stupid sitcom. For people jaded with today's sub-par crop, pick this up and remember that there are actually comedy writers who are funny, or at least there were in the recent past!" End of plug. -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Mon May 21 23:02:30 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Mon, 21 May 2007 16:02:30 -0700 Subject: Platonov - Kosnoyazychie Message-ID: Platonov's ia chuvstvuiu--without an object or a clause governed by it--is analogous, first and foremost, to Platonov's own locution of the same structure elsewhere, in Kotlovan, ia zdes' ne sushchestvuiu, ia tol'ko dumaiu zdes'. In both cases, feeling and thinking are valuable independently of their objects or objectives. The model for that latter one, in Kotlovan, in turn, is a tongue-in-cheek polemic with Descarthes, who claimed that the latter was the sole necessary condition and guarantee of the former. Platonov is anti-Shklovskian in one particular respect: he reverses the device of defamiliarization. But I have written a whole book on that. Like Pilate but on a happier occasion, I may say that what I have written is what I have written. That is, I still stand by my conclusions in that book. Olga Meerson ----- Original Message ----- From: Alexandra Smith Date: Monday, May 21, 2007 1:00 pm Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Platonov - Kosnoyazychie > Dear Lily, > > I think that your reading of Platonov could stretch further, > beyond > Shklovsky, pointing to some analogies with the issues related to > the > philosophy of language discussed in the writings of Diderot and > other > 18th-c. thinkers. See, for example, Smoliarova's excellent > article: > Tatiana Smoliarova, ?Distortion and Theatricality: Estrangement in > > Diderot and Shklovsky?, Poetics Today, Spring: 27:1, 2006. The > article > also sheds some light on the issue related to Chaplin and > Shklovsky's > notion of estrangement. > However, having done a considerable amount of research on Platonov > and > his language at some stage of my life, I came to the conclusion > that > to a large extent Platonov's language has some strong links with > the > language of various Soviet newspapers of the 1920s and some > colloqual > and non-standard language used in Southern parts of Russia > (Voronezh > region, etc.). It is not always a product of clever tricks and > lingistic games. Naturally, Platonov had a very good ear for > picking > up lots of things that deviated from the norm, so to speak. > In the sentence that includes the phrase "Ia chuvstvuiu" the > strangeness comes from the fact that in the Russian language this > phrase is not used by itself, it appears to be incomplete, since > native speakers would usually continue this type of sentences > along > the lines "I feel that..." (Ia chuvstvuiu, chto...) or "ia > chuvstvuiu, > kak"... > It seems to me that the phrase discussed earlier stands close to > the > idiomatic expression "Ia boleiu vsei dushoi".... but in the end of > the > day the translator still needs to preserve the stylistic mask of a > > simpleton used by Platonov and look for similar cases that exist > in > non-standard English. I'm not sure though whether Robert Chandler > and > Olga Meerson (who already wrote a wonderful book on Platonov's > estrangement) are prearing their new translation for British or US > > readers ... I would imagine that the factor of readership should > determine to a large extent the narrative and translation > strategies > that the translators of this story would like to develop... > I agree with your description of the narrator though but I think > that > you are reading too much into this text. In the end of the day, > readers of the story should be aware of some eccentric qualities > of > the narrator's speech who is not as sophisticated as Platonov. But > one > shouldn't forget about the stylistic mask of a simpleton that > Platonov > uses here. > > All very best, > Sasha Smith > > > > > ===================================== > Alexandra Smith (PhD, University of London) > Lecturer in Russian > School of European Languages and Cultures > The University of Edinburgh > David Hume Tower > George Square > Edinburgh EX8 9JX > UK > > tel. +44-(0)131-6511381 > fax: +44- (0)131- 650-3604 > e-mail: Alexandra.Smith at ed.ac.uk > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK Tue May 22 06:51:38 2007 From: Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK (Alexandra Smith) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 07:51:38 +0100 Subject: Platonov's sensitivitiesProfessor Meerson, In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Quoting Olga Meerson : > Platonov's ia chuvstvuiu--without an object or a clause governed by > it--is analogous, first and foremost, to Platonov's own locution of > the same structure elsewhere, in Kotlovan, ia zdes' ne > sushchestvuiu, ia tol'ko dumaiu zdes'. In both cases, feeling and > thinking are valuable independently of their objects or objectives. > The model for that latter one, in Kotlovan, in turn, is a > tongue-in-cheek polemic with Descarthes, who claimed that the latter > was the sole necessary condition and guarantee of the former. > Platonov is anti-Shklovskian in one particular respect: he reverses > the device of defamiliarization. But I have written a whole book on > that. Like Pilate but on a happier occasion, I may say that what I > have written is what I have written. That is, I still stand by my > conclusions in that book. > Olga Meerson ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Tue May 22 07:07:39 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 08:07:39 +0100 Subject: Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" In-Reply-To: <465202AD.3060008@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: Dear all, THANK YOU all for your suggestions, all of which, in their different ways are helpful. And it is gratifying to generate so much interest both in questions about the nature of translation and in a writer I love. I'd like to mention again that, in spite of the wonderful work being done by textologists and editors in Moscow and Petersburg, there are still a number of Platonov's finest works which are still hardly known. 'Sredi zhivotnykh I rastenii' is one of them. The full text is published only in the journal ROSSIYA (Jan. 1998). And I have attempted to type the text into my computer and have sent a WORD file to several of you who have asked for it. I'm grateful to Sasha for mentioning Olga Meerson's brilliant book. I'd like to add that a much-shortened English version of this is available in ESSAYS IN POETICS (University of Keele: Autumn 2001), p. 21-38. I doubt if there is any single essay that says so much of importance about Platonov. And I do passionately agree with almost everything that Lily Alexander has said in the last couple of days, especially in passages like this: > Platonov has the dimensions of kosnoyasychie of the holy fool, of the > Soviet press, and of the Soviet muzhik, and of street language merging > with literature, and many many more things. That's why I believe that it > is difficult to read too much into Platonov's texts, because they have > so many hidden channels and semantic niches opening into all kinds of > possible interesting readings. I have seen students interpreting his > texts very differently, but all of them made sense to me - I enjoyed > seeing them trying. This is his richness. His texts are provoking in > this sense - they are almost force us into some kind of Talmudic intense > interpretation set of mind. Sasha raised the question of US and British readership. The differences between US and British English are subtler and more numerous than is often realized. I would not dream of trying to write in 'American', even though this current volume is to be published by NYRB Classics; I'd gladly write American if I could, but I can't. And this is what I wrote in my preface to my Penguin Classics anthology RUSSIAN SHORT STORIES FROM PUSHKIN TO BUIDA: "for all our lip service to cultural pluralism, both British and American readers are often surprisingly intolerant of ‘Americanisms’ or ‘Britishisms’. This volume contains work by both British and American translators; I enjoy their different styles and have not attempted to reduce them to a pallid norm. It may even be the case that some stories translate more readily into particular varieties of English. It is hard, for example, to imagine Vasily Shukshin’s ‘In the Autumn’ sounding as effective in British English as in the American version by John Givens and Laura Michael." In answer to Professor Hill: Platonov went to a parish school on the outskirts of Voronezh in the early 20th century. I doubt if there would have been such a thing as 'creative writing' there. He was publishing a lot of poems and articles by 1920, when he was 21. The thoughts and images are bold, but the language is not subtle. As for my original question - in some respects I like the suggested translation 'I bleed railway ties', but it is only very rarely indeed, esp. in his later work, that Platonov uses an image as shocking as that. For the main part he uses rather ordinary words and infringes linguistic and other norms in a way that is not only startling but also startlingly subtle. Some time ago, on this list, we discussed one of the most remarkable sentences from CHEVENGUR: 'Skoro ya umru k tebe', spoken by a small boy to his dead father in the grave. The most ordinary of words put together in the most extraordinary way... Platonov's heroes often have a certain amount in common with one another and with their author. The pointsman certainly has something in common with the hero of the story 'V prekrasnom i yarostnom mire', of whom the narrator observes, ' «Он чувствовал свое превосходство перед нами, потому что понимал машину точнее, чем мы, и он не верил, что я или кто другой может научиться тайне его таланта… Мальцев понимал, конечно, что в усердии, в старательности мы даже можем его превозмочь, но не представлял, чтобы мы больше его любили паровоз и лучше его водили поезда, — лучше, он думал, было нельзя. И Мальцеву поэтому было грустно с нами; он скучал от своего таланта, как от одиночества, не зная, как нам высказать его, чтобы мы поняли». I'll transliterate the last sentence: 'I Mal'tsevu poetomu bylo grustno s nami; on skuchal ot svoego talanta, kak ot odinochestva, ne znaya, kak nam vyskazat' ego, chtoby my ponyali.' I'm still not sure how to translate 'khodite' in the sentence I originally asked about, but I certainly want to leave the meaning of the sentence as a whole as open as possible. 'Vy tut tol'ko sluzhite, khodite, a ya chuvstvuyu' is something that Platonov himself could have said to his fellow writers. For that reason I shall stay with the words I came up with a few days ago: 'but I work by feeling'. These words can be read with very different meanings and emphases. It could simply be Fyodorov running his hand along a rail to check its condition, something he does repeatedly; it could be Fyodorov putting his heart and soul into his work; it could be Platonov putting his heart and soul into his work. I like a number of the suggested translations for the first half of the sentence - 'put in time' is appealing - but I can't quite settle on anything yet. Greetings and thanks to all, Robert ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK Tue May 22 07:32:18 2007 From: Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK (Alexandra Smith) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 08:32:18 +0100 Subject: Platonov - Kosnoyazychie In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Professor Meerson, Thank you very much for your interesting insight. In principle, your comparision with one phrase in Kotlovan is up to the point when it comes to understanding Platonov's philosophical tenets. But the two phrases are slightly different from the formal point of view: the phrase "ia zdes' ne suschestvuiu, ia tol'ko dumaiu zdes'" doesn't have a sense of strangeness and readers don't perceive it as very strange, especially because of the fact that both verbs are related to the same subject and the repetition of the word "zdes'" produces some form of cohesion. The verb "dumat'" is used very often without any references to objects. You could recall Tsvetaeva's usage of it in "Poema kontsa": "Vy slishkom mnogo dumali?" -- "Zadumchivoe: da". In the phrase: "vy tut rabotaete, khodite, a ia chuvstvuiu" discussed earlier, the second sentence sounds out of the blue since it doesn't correspond well to the first part of the compound sentence that describes other people. I still think that the verb chuvstvovat' in this sentence appears to be as part of an incomplete sentence. If you ask, for example, someone a question "what to you do here?" (chto Vy zdes' delaete?) the answer "ia zdes' dumaiu" would sound more or less normal, since it implies that someone comes to a particular spot to think about life, etc. Any listener would be satisfied with such an answer, but if we are told that someone comes here to feel (chto vy zdes' delaete" - ia chuvstvuiu)then we will be under impression that the sentence is not complete. There will be a natural expectation to hear some explanation: ia sebia sdes' khorosho chuvstvuiu, poetomu ia zdes' sizhu; or: ia zdes' chuvstvuiu sebia chelovekom..., or: ia chuvstvuiu zdes' chastiu mirovogo protcessa, etc. But I agree with you that it's not just an example of defamiliarisation. However, I still doubt that Platonov thought of so many clever tricks himself, I think that he had a brilliant ear for language: perhaps, he wrote down various abnormalities when listened to people he encountered on the streets of Moscow or in provincial towns? It well might be that in some areas (might be Voronezh, Briansk, etc.)people's talk reflects on the fact that some words were not completely fixed in terms of connotations, grammatical links etc. One needs to consult linguists who are specialising in dialects and history of grammar in order to see what was available to Platonov in the 20s-30s in terms of language material... I did enjoy reading your book on Platonov a few year ago. I do find it very thoought-provoking, indeed. All very best, Sasha Smith Quoting Olga Meerson : > Platonov's ia chuvstvuiu--without an object or a clause governed by > it--is analogous, first and foremost, to Platonov's own locution of > the same structure elsewhere, in Kotlovan, ia zdes' ne > sushchestvuiu, ia tol'ko dumaiu zdes'. In both cases, feeling and > thinking are valuable independently of their objects or objectives. > The model for that latter one, in Kotlovan, in turn, is a > tongue-in-cheek polemic with Descarthes, who claimed that the latter > was the sole necessary condition and guarantee of the former. > Platonov is anti-Shklovskian in one particular respect: he reverses > the device of defamiliarization. But I have written a whole book on > that. Like Pilate but on a happier occasion, I may say that what I > have written is what I have written. That is, I still stand by my > conclusions in that book. > Olga Meerson > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aleksanteri7 at GMAIL.COM Tue May 22 08:59:51 2007 From: aleksanteri7 at GMAIL.COM (7th Annual Conference Aleksanteri Institute) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 11:59:51 +0300 Subject: NEWS & 2nd CfP: REVISITING PERESTROIKA - PROCESSES AND ALTERNATIVES Message-ID: 2nd Call for Papers: REVISITING PERESTROIKA - PROCESSES AND ALTERNATIVES November 29 - December 1, 2007 http://www.helsinki.fi/aleksanteri/conference2007 NEWS The Aleksanteri CULTURAL FORA: Parallel to the academic conference, participants and guests will enjoy a new international series of cultural events - artistic, documentary, archival, literary and cinematic. See the website for the 6 fora already confirmed: http://www.helsinki.fi/aleksanteri/conference2007/cultural_fora.htm POSTER: A new pdf poster may be found at the below link from our website. It is designed for A3 printing, although A4 is also possible. Please send your postal address to aleksanteri7 at gmail.com to receive a hard-copy colour print: http://www.helsinki.fi/aleksanteri/conference2007/files/poster_alexconf.pdf DEADLINE It is less than two weeks to our first deadline for submissions: June 1, 2007. Ivor Stodolsky Conference Coordinator ============================================== 2nd Call for Papers for the 7th Annual Aleksanteri Conference http://www.helsinki.fi/aleksanteri/conference2007 (Refresh your browser to get the new colours) REVISITING PERESTROIKA - PROCESSES AND ALTERNATIVES November 29 - December 1, 2007 The Aleksanteri Institute, University of Helsinki, Finland KEYNOTE SPEAKERS (in alphabetical order): Marietta CHUDAKOVA - Professor at the World Literature Institute, Moscow; member of Boris Yeltsin's Presidential Council; member, European Academy. http://www.ecsocman.edu.ru/db/msg/203701.html Boris GROYS - Professor of Philosophy and Media Theory, Hochschule für Gestaltung, Karlsruhe; Global Distinguished Professor of Russian and Slavic Studies, NYU http://as.nyu.edu/object/aboutas.globalprofessor.BorisGroys Boris KAGARLITSKY - Director, Institute of Globalization Studies, Moscow; former Deputy, Moscow City Soviet; dissident and former political prisoner. http://www.tni-archives.org/detail_page.phtml?page=fellows_kagarlitsky Jutta SCHERRER - Directeur d'études, EHESS, Paris, Centre d'études du monde russe, soviétique et post-soviétique; Centre d'études Interdisciplinaires des Faits Religieux. http://cercec.ehess.fr/document.php?id=511 Alexei YURCHAK - Associate Professor, University of California at Berkeley, author of "Everything Was Forever, Until It Was No More". http://ls.berkeley.edu/dept/anth/yurchak.html Elena ZDRAVOMYSLOVA - Co-director of the Gender Studies Program, Associate Professor, The European University at St. Petersburg. http://www.eu.spb.ru/en/imars/faculty.htm A WIDE SCOPE FOR DEBATE The political foundation for the reforms of Perestroika, whose outcome was to seal the fate of the USSR, was laid in Mikhail Gorbachev's "basic theses" of 1987. Twenty years down that road which led to the demise of an entire way of life and the re-constellation of the international system, Helsinki's Aleksanteri Institute is hosting an intellectual forum to revisit this era of dramatic changes, reassessing causes and effects, while considering alternative perspectives and paths not taken. This call for papers is an open invitation for panels, papers and suggestions for innovative formats (such as debates on new key publications, round-tables or film presentations). It is addressed to scholars and advanced graduate students from a wide range of disciplinary backgrounds, including the social and political sciences, cultural studies, the arts and humanities, law and economics. The direct relation of the perestroika-process to the collapse of the Soviet bloc, leading to the end of the Cold War means that contributions concerning Eastern Europe as well as global repercussions are also very much welcome. To stimulate topics for debate and the formation of panels, please find below some questions indicating the wide, multi-disciplinary scope aimed at: o Revolutions and Processes - Was the collapse of the Soviet bloc a result of a series of contingencies, or deliberate political decisions? Was economic collapse avoidable, and if so, for how long? Was the restoration of capitalism inevitable, or were there alternative paths of development? What role did ideas and cultural movements play in perestroika, its pre-history and aftermath? o Actors and Institutions - Which groups or traditions emerged, which survived and which were neglected or "written out of history" during the perestroika era? Did practices and customs genuinely see a transformation in all fields of life - from the Kremlin to the kitchen table? How was the role of women transformed? Did "parallel" and "underground" cultures cease to exist? o Generations, Retrospectives and Perspectives - How did different age groups evaluate the changes, and how did people of different "mind-sets" see each other? How do contemporary social formations assess the perestroika era and how does this inflect the future? CONFERENCE SCHEDULE AND DEADLINES: Panel Proposals / Innovative Formats Submissions: June 1, 2007 Individual Paper Submissions (circa 300 words): June 1, 2007 Notification of acceptance: July 2, 2007 Online Registration by November 1, 2007 Conference: November 29 - December 1, 2007 All proposals should be sent via the conference website , where an Extended Call for Papers as well as a Conference Discussion Forum for establishing panels is available. For Inquiries Concerning Submissions contact: fcree-aleksconf at helsinki.fi THE ALEKSANTERI CULTURAL FORA Running parallel to the academic conference, participants and guests will enjoy the opportunity to attend a new international series of cultural events - artistic, documentary, archival, literary and cinematic.See the website for the 6 fora already confirmed: http://www.helsinki.fi/aleksanteri/conference2007/cultural_fora.htm THE ANNUAL ALEKSANTERI CONFERENCE is an international, multidisciplinary conference organized by the Aleksanteri Institute, the Finnish Centre for Russian and Eastern European Studies affiliated with the University of Helsinki. Aleksanteri Conferences have attracted broad interest among scholars as well as policy and opinion-makers from a wide variety of fields. ORGANISING COMMITTEE Dr. Markku Kangaspuro (Head of Research), Suvi Kansikas (Conference Coordinator), Senior Researcher Vesa Oittinen, Professor Pekka Pesonen, Senior Researcher Aino Saarinen, Ivor Stodolsky (Conference Coordinator) Welcome! _______________________________ Ivor A Stodolsky Researcher, Russian Culture and Theory Aleksanteri Institute, Helsinki University Aleksanteri Conference Coordinator / Curator of the Aleksanteri Cultural Fora http://www.helsinki.fi/aleksanteri/conference2007 http://www.helsinki.fi/aleksanteri/conference2007/cultural_fora.htm Institute: +358 3 191 23631 ================================================= ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From thomasy at WISC.EDU Tue May 22 12:56:55 2007 From: thomasy at WISC.EDU (Molly Thomasy) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 07:56:55 -0500 Subject: CFP: AATSEEL-Wisconsin 2007 Conference Message-ID: Call for papers for the 2007 AATSEEL-Wisconsin Conference AATSEEL-Wisconsin Conference 19-20 October 2007 University of Wisconsin-Madison Abstracts for 20-minute papers on any aspect of Slavic languages, literatures and cultures (including pedagogy, film and drama) are invited for the annual conference of the Wisconsin chapter of AATSEEL (The American Association of Teachers of Slavic and East European Literatures). Comparative topics and interdisciplinary approaches are welcome. The conference will be held at the University of Wisconsin-Madison on Saturday, 20 October 2007. Recent conference programs and guidelines for preparing abstracts are posted on the AATSEEL-Wisconsin website at http://slavic.lss.wisc.edu/programs/conference.html To present a paper at the AATSEEL-Wisconsin conference, please submit an abstract by 31 August 2007. The complete proposal should include: 1. Author’s contact information (name, affiliation, mailing address, telephone, and email) 2. Paper title 3. 300-500 word abstract 4. Equipment request (if necessary) You may include the above information as an attachment (in MS Word) or paste the proposal into the body of your message. Send proposals by email to: Molly Thomasy (thomasy at wisc.edu) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulr at RUSSIANLIFE.NET Tue May 22 16:52:12 2007 From: paulr at RUSSIANLIFE.NET (Paul Richardson) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 12:52:12 -0400 Subject: Krylatye slova Message-ID: Dear SEELANGERS: We want to start offering readers a short list of current krylatye slova and neologisms in each issue of our magazine, Russian Life. And we invite your submissions of word and phrase discoveries. They should be in current use and something like: 1) old words used in new and interesting ways, or old, culturally- charged words returning to the fore; 2) neologisms which seek to be "true" Russian words, using Slavic roots; 3) complete mash-ups, for example a photographer recently wrote that he was sending us "превьюшки" (prev'yushki) - i.e. previews; 4) interesting twists on set phrases (perhaps this is where to put the email greeting I seem to be getting with increasing frequency from temporally differentiated Russians: Доброго времени суток, Dobrovo vremeni sutok); Email your discoveries directly to us at: editors at russianlife.net and cc the list if you like, to share them immediately with others. Where relevant, please provide citation, context, and - if spoken or written by a public official, that person's name and title. We will credit you if we use your contribution (unless you tell us not to), and the best contribution for each bimonthly issue will be offered a gift of a free tshirt! We look forward to hearing from you. Paul Richardson Publisher and Editor Russian Life magazine PO Box 567 Montpelier, VT 05601 802.223.4955 www.russianlife.net editors at russianlife.net ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ad5537 at WAYNE.EDU Tue May 22 17:35:59 2007 From: ad5537 at WAYNE.EDU (Kenneth Brostrom) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 13:35:59 -0400 Subject: Fathers and Sons Norton Critical Edition In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Prof. Katz, Some years ago I did a rather long article on this novel that was included in a special volume on Turgenev by Canadian-American Slavic Studies. It attempts a detailed examination of Bazarov's thought patterns and motivations. I received some reassuringly positive responses to it, including some from the USSR. If you might want to look it over, I will be happy to save you some time by mailing a photocopy to you. "The Journey as Solitary Confinement in Fathers and Children, Canadian-American Slavic Studies, 17, no. 1 (1983), 13-38. Best wishes, Ken Brostrom >Dear Colleagues: > >First let me express my thanks to all those who sent me comments and >suggestions for my revised Norton Critical Edition of Tolstoy's Short >Fiction. I really appreciate your nominations for new Tolstoy texts to be >included, as well as titles of new articles for the Critical Apparatus. I >hope that you will be pleased with the result when it is published next >year. > >Now I am setting to work on a revised edition of my Norton Critical Edition >of Turgenev's Fathers and Sons. Once again, I turn to you for suggestions -- >this time only for the Critical Apparatus, since the text remains the same. > >Please send me off-line any thoughts you have for articles or book chapters >that you think should be considered, including your own work. > >With continued thanks and best wishes, > >Michael Katz >Middlebury College > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- Kenneth Brostrom, Assoc. Prof. of Russian Dept. of German and Slavic Studies 443 Manoogian Hall Wayne State University Detroit, MI 48202 email: kenneth.brostrom at wayne.edu telephone: 313-577-6238 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ad5537 at WAYNE.EDU Tue May 22 17:39:17 2007 From: ad5537 at WAYNE.EDU (Kenneth Brostrom) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 13:39:17 -0400 Subject: Fathers and Sons Norton Critical Edition In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Seelangers, Sorry for the posing to the entire list. Always swore it wouldn't happen to me . . . Ken Brostrom -- Kenneth Brostrom, Assoc. Prof. of Russian Dept. of German and Slavic Studies 443 Manoogian Hall Wayne State University Detroit, MI 48202 email: kenneth.brostrom at wayne.edu telephone: 313-577-6238 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mkatz at MIDDLEBURY.EDU Tue May 22 18:48:53 2007 From: mkatz at MIDDLEBURY.EDU (Michael Katz) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 14:48:53 -0400 Subject: Fathers and Sons Norton Critical Edition In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Yes, please. Michael Katz FIC 6 Middlebury College Middlebury, VT 05753 Thanks very much. Michael Katz > From: Kenneth Brostrom > Reply-To: "SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list" > > Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 13:35:59 -0400 > To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Fathers and Sons Norton Critical Edition > > Dear Prof. Katz, > > Some years ago I did a rather long article on this novel that was > included in a special volume on Turgenev by Canadian-American Slavic > Studies. It attempts a detailed examination of Bazarov's thought > patterns and motivations. I received some reassuringly positive > responses to it, including some from the USSR. If you might want to > look it over, I will be happy to save you some time by mailing a > photocopy to you. > > "The Journey as Solitary Confinement in Fathers and Children, > Canadian-American Slavic Studies, 17, no. 1 (1983), 13-38. > > > Best wishes, > Ken Brostrom > > > >> Dear Colleagues: >> >> First let me express my thanks to all those who sent me comments and >> suggestions for my revised Norton Critical Edition of Tolstoy's Short >> Fiction. I really appreciate your nominations for new Tolstoy texts to be >> included, as well as titles of new articles for the Critical Apparatus. I >> hope that you will be pleased with the result when it is published next >> year. >> >> Now I am setting to work on a revised edition of my Norton Critical Edition >> of Turgenev's Fathers and Sons. Once again, I turn to you for suggestions -- >> this time only for the Critical Apparatus, since the text remains the same. >> >> Please send me off-line any thoughts you have for articles or book chapters >> that you think should be considered, including your own work. >> >> With continued thanks and best wishes, >> >> Michael Katz >> Middlebury College >> >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription >> options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: >> http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > -- > Kenneth Brostrom, Assoc. Prof. of Russian > Dept. of German and Slavic Studies > 443 Manoogian Hall > Wayne State University > Detroit, MI 48202 > email: kenneth.brostrom at wayne.edu > telephone: 313-577-6238 > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From bliss at WMONLINE.COM Tue May 22 22:01:40 2007 From: bliss at WMONLINE.COM (=?GB2312?Q?Liv_Bliss?=) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 17:01:40 -0500 Subject: Dostoevsky query Message-ID: I wonder if someone far better informed than I can help me with this. In his notes for Writer's Diary (for August 1876), Dostoevsky wrote the following memo to himself: "Взять из Герцена, из 'Станкевича круга' для возраженья Селину" [Vzyat' iz Gertsena, iz 'Stankevicha kruga' dlya vozrazhen'ya Selinu]. "Selin" has me stumped: who on earth was that? (Obviously not Louis- Ferdinand Destouches-Céline, who wasn't even born until 1894, but that's where the trail went cold for me.) I would vastly appreciate any clues that anyone can offer. Best to all Liv *************** Liv Bliss ATA Certified Russian to English Translator tel.: (928) 367-1615 fax: (928) 367-1950 email: bliss @ wmonline.com Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and good with ketchup -- Anon. *************** ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ggerhart at COMCAST.NET Wed May 23 04:31:43 2007 From: ggerhart at COMCAST.NET (Genevra Gerhart) Date: Tue, 22 May 2007 21:31:43 -0700 Subject: Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Robert, 1. Thank you so much for having started such a good thread. The quality of the comments was so good that I was sorry not to have paid more attention to literary classes. 2. Josh's "I bleed rail ties" I thought was very inventive, and accurate; and I think it also raised his place on the list by more than 20 points. Genevra Gerhart ggerhart at comcast.net www.genevragerhart.com www.russiancommonknowledge.com -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Robert Chandler Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 12:08 AM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" Dear all, THANK YOU all for your suggestions, all of which, in their different ways are helpful. And it is gratifying to generate so much interest both in questions about the nature of translation and in a writer I love. I'd like to mention again that, in spite of the wonderful work being done by textologists and editors in Moscow and Petersburg, there are still a number of Platonov's finest works which are still hardly known. 'Sredi zhivotnykh I rastenii' is one of them. The full text is published only in the journal ROSSIYA (Jan. 1998). And I have attempted to type the text into my computer and have sent a WORD file to several of you who have asked for it. I'm grateful to Sasha for mentioning Olga Meerson's brilliant book. I'd like to add that a much-shortened English version of this is available in ESSAYS IN POETICS (University of Keele: Autumn 2001), p. 21-38. I doubt if there is any single essay that says so much of importance about Platonov. And I do passionately agree with almost everything that Lily Alexander has said in the last couple of days, especially in passages like this: > Platonov has the dimensions of kosnoyasychie of the holy fool, of the > Soviet press, and of the Soviet muzhik, and of street language merging > with literature, and many many more things. That's why I believe that it > is difficult to read too much into Platonov's texts, because they have > so many hidden channels and semantic niches opening into all kinds of > possible interesting readings. I have seen students interpreting his > texts very differently, but all of them made sense to me - I enjoyed > seeing them trying. This is his richness. His texts are provoking in > this sense - they are almost force us into some kind of Talmudic intense > interpretation set of mind. Sasha raised the question of US and British readership. The differences between US and British English are subtler and more numerous than is often realized. I would not dream of trying to write in 'American', even though this current volume is to be published by NYRB Classics; I'd gladly write American if I could, but I can't. And this is what I wrote in my preface to my Penguin Classics anthology RUSSIAN SHORT STORIES FROM PUSHKIN TO BUIDA: "for all our lip service to cultural pluralism, both British and American readers are often surprisingly intolerant of 'Americanisms' or 'Britishisms'. This volume contains work by both British and American translators; I enjoy their different styles and have not attempted to reduce them to a pallid norm. It may even be the case that some stories translate more readily into particular varieties of English. It is hard, for example, to imagine Vasily Shukshin's 'In the Autumn' sounding as effective in British English as in the American version by John Givens and Laura Michael." In answer to Professor Hill: Platonov went to a parish school on the outskirts of Voronezh in the early 20th century. I doubt if there would have been such a thing as 'creative writing' there. He was publishing a lot of poems and articles by 1920, when he was 21. The thoughts and images are bold, but the language is not subtle. As for my original question - in some respects I like the suggested translation 'I bleed railway ties', but it is only very rarely indeed, esp. in his later work, that Platonov uses an image as shocking as that. For the main part he uses rather ordinary words and infringes linguistic and other norms in a way that is not only startling but also startlingly subtle. Some time ago, on this list, we discussed one of the most remarkable sentences from CHEVENGUR: 'Skoro ya umru k tebe', spoken by a small boy to his dead father in the grave. The most ordinary of words put together in the most extraordinary way... Platonov's heroes often have a certain amount in common with one another and with their author. The pointsman certainly has something in common with the hero of the story 'V prekrasnom i yarostnom mire', of whom the narrator observes, ' <Он чувствовал свое превосходство перед нами, потому что понимал машину точнее, чем мы, и он не верил, что я или кто другой может научиться тайне его таланта: Мальцев понимал, конечно, что в усердии, в старательности мы даже можем его превозмочь, но не представлял, чтобы мы больше его любили паровоз и лучше его водили поезда, - лучше, он думал, было нельзя. И Мальцеву поэтому было грустно с нами; он скучал от своего таланта, как от одиночества, не зная, как нам высказать его, чтобы мы поняли>. I'll transliterate the last sentence: 'I Mal'tsevu poetomu bylo grustno s nami; on skuchal ot svoego talanta, kak ot odinochestva, ne znaya, kak nam vyskazat' ego, chtoby my ponyali.' I'm still not sure how to translate 'khodite' in the sentence I originally asked about, but I certainly want to leave the meaning of the sentence as a whole as open as possible. 'Vy tut tol'ko sluzhite, khodite, a ya chuvstvuyu' is something that Platonov himself could have said to his fellow writers. For that reason I shall stay with the words I came up with a few days ago: 'but I work by feeling'. These words can be read with very different meanings and emphases. It could simply be Fyodorov running his hand along a rail to check its condition, something he does repeatedly; it could be Fyodorov putting his heart and soul into his work; it could be Platonov putting his heart and soul into his work. I like a number of the suggested translations for the first half of the sentence - 'put in time' is appealing - but I can't quite settle on anything yet. Greetings and thanks to all, Robert ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.7.6/814 - Release Date: 5/21/2007 2:01 PM No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.7.6/815 - Release Date: 5/22/2007 3:49 PM ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Wed May 23 04:53:31 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 05:53:31 +0100 Subject: Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" In-Reply-To: <001001c79cf3$44555ee0$6400a8c0@DB4SFP51> Message-ID: Thanks very much, Genevra! And yes, I agree, more or less, about Josh. It isn't perfect for Platonov, but it might be for many other writers. R. > Dear Robert, > 1. Thank you so much for having started such a good thread. The quality of > the comments was so good that I was sorry not to have paid more attention to > literary classes. > 2. Josh's "I bleed rail ties" I thought was very inventive, and accurate; > and I think it also raised his place on the list by more than 20 points. > > Genevra Gerhart > > ggerhart at comcast.net > > www.genevragerhart.com > www.russiancommonknowledge.com > > > -----Original Message----- > From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list > [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Robert Chandler > Sent: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 12:08 AM > To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Subject: [SEELANGS] Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" > > Dear all, > > THANK YOU all for your suggestions, all of which, in their different ways > are helpful. And it is gratifying to generate so much interest both in > questions about the nature of translation and in a writer I love. > > I'd like to mention again that, in spite of the wonderful work being done by > textologists and editors in Moscow and Petersburg, there are still a number > of Platonov's finest works which are still hardly known. 'Sredi zhivotnykh > I rastenii' is one of them. The full text is published only in the journal > ROSSIYA (Jan. 1998). And I have attempted to type the text into my computer > and have sent a WORD file to several of you who have asked for it. > > I'm grateful to Sasha for mentioning Olga Meerson's brilliant book. I'd > like to add that a much-shortened English version of this is available in > ESSAYS IN POETICS (University of Keele: Autumn 2001), p. 21-38. I doubt if > there is any single essay that says so much of importance about Platonov. > > And I do passionately agree with almost everything that Lily Alexander has > said in the last couple of days, especially in passages like this: >> Platonov has the dimensions of kosnoyasychie of the holy fool, of the >> Soviet press, and of the Soviet muzhik, and of street language merging >> with literature, and many many more things. That's why I believe that it >> is difficult to read too much into Platonov's texts, because they have >> so many hidden channels and semantic niches opening into all kinds of >> possible interesting readings. I have seen students interpreting his >> texts very differently, but all of them made sense to me - I enjoyed >> seeing them trying. This is his richness. His texts are provoking in >> this sense - they are almost force us into some kind of Talmudic intense >> interpretation set of mind. > > Sasha raised the question of US and British readership. The differences > between US and British English are subtler and more numerous than is often > realized. I would not dream of trying to write in 'American', even though > this current volume is to be published by NYRB Classics; I'd gladly write > American if I could, but I can't. And this is what I wrote in my preface to > my Penguin Classics anthology RUSSIAN SHORT STORIES FROM PUSHKIN TO BUIDA: > "for all our lip service to cultural pluralism, both British and American > readers are often surprisingly intolerant of 'Americanisms' or > 'Britishisms'. This volume contains work by both British and American > translators; I enjoy their different styles and have not attempted to reduce > them to a pallid norm. It may even be the case that some stories translate > more readily into particular varieties of English. It is hard, for example, > to imagine Vasily Shukshin's 'In the Autumn' sounding as effective in > British English as in the American version by John Givens and Laura > Michael." > > In answer to Professor Hill: Platonov went to a parish school on the > outskirts of Voronezh in the early 20th century. I doubt if there would > have been such a thing as 'creative writing' there. He was publishing a > lot of poems and articles by 1920, when he was 21. The thoughts and images > are bold, but the language is not subtle. > > As for my original question - in some respects I like the suggested > translation 'I bleed railway ties', but it is only very rarely indeed, esp. > in his later work, that Platonov uses an image as shocking as that. For the > main part he uses rather ordinary words and infringes linguistic and other > norms in a way that is not only startling but also startlingly subtle. Some > time ago, on this list, we discussed one of the most remarkable sentences > from CHEVENGUR: 'Skoro ya umru k tebe', spoken by a small boy to his dead > father in the grave. The most ordinary of words put together in the most > extraordinary way... > > Platonov's heroes often have a certain amount in common with one another and > with their author. The pointsman certainly has something in common with the > hero of the story 'V prekrasnom i yarostnom mire', of whom the narrator > observes, ' <Он чувствовал свое превосходство перед нами, потому что понимал > машину точнее, чем мы, и он не верил, что я или кто другой может научиться > тайне его таланта: Мальцев понимал, конечно, что в усердии, в старательности > мы даже можем его превозмочь, но не представлял, чтобы мы больше его любили > паровоз и лучше его водили поезда, - лучше, он думал, было нельзя. > И Мальцеву поэтому было грустно с нами; он скучал от своего таланта, как > от одиночества, не зная, как нам высказать его, чтобы мы поняли>. I'll > transliterate the last sentence: 'I Mal'tsevu poetomu bylo grustno s nami; > on skuchal ot svoego talanta, kak ot odinochestva, ne znaya, kak nam > vyskazat' ego, chtoby my ponyali.' > > I'm still not sure how to translate 'khodite' in the sentence I originally > asked about, but I certainly want to leave the meaning of the sentence as a > whole as open as possible. 'Vy tut tol'ko sluzhite, khodite, a ya > chuvstvuyu' is something that Platonov himself could have said to his fellow > writers. For that reason I shall stay with the words I came up with a few > days ago: 'but I work by feeling'. These words can be read with very > different meanings and emphases. It could simply be Fyodorov running his > hand along a rail to check its condition, something he does repeatedly; it > could be Fyodorov putting his heart and soul into his work; it could be > Platonov putting his heart and soul into his work. > > I like a number of the suggested translations for the first half of the > sentence - 'put in time' is appealing - but I can't quite settle on anything > yet. > > Greetings and thanks to all, > > Robert > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > No virus found in this incoming message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.7.6/814 - Release Date: 5/21/2007 > 2:01 PM > > > No virus found in this outgoing message. > Checked by AVG Free Edition. > Version: 7.5.467 / Virus Database: 269.7.6/815 - Release Date: 5/22/2007 > 3:49 PM > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jwilson at SRAS.ORG Wed May 23 06:12:54 2007 From: jwilson at SRAS.ORG (Josh Wilson) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 10:12:54 +0400 Subject: Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" In-Reply-To: <001001c79cf3$44555ee0$6400a8c0@DB4SFP51> Message-ID: >As for my original question - in some respects I like the suggested >translation 'I bleed railway ties', but it is only very rarely indeed, esp. >in his later work, that Platonov uses an image as shocking as that. Interesting, when I suggested it, I did not consider it at all shocking. Simply a play on words. Actually, I still don't see it as shocking - certainly much more mild than the little boy's statement to his dead father. Maybe this is a difference between "American" and... that other language? Best, JW P.S. Isn't it also interesting that I phrased it "rail ties" and Mr. Chandler turned it into "railway ties" (which I don't think flows near as well...) Language is fascinating... ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From tsergay at COLUMBUS.RR.COM Wed May 23 12:19:31 2007 From: tsergay at COLUMBUS.RR.COM (Timothy D. Sergay) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 08:19:31 -0400 Subject: Bleeding rail ties and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" Message-ID: Josh's "I bleed rail ties" I thought was very inventive, and accurate; >> and I think it also raised his place on the list by more than 20 points. >> Dear Seelangers, To venture that Platonov's character Fyodorov "bleeds rail ties" may well be an inventive, accurate and idiomatic way of describing his intuitive passion for his profession, but I can't agree that "I bleed rail ties" is a valid translation of what Fyodorov actually says of himself in his dialogue: "no ia chuvstvuiu..." And that's not because I'm a literalist ninny, although sometimes I suppose I am. That's because Fyodorov is not uttering an utterly idiomatic, slogan-like, quite finished and readily comprehensible thought about himself. If you google for "I bleed" you find Cardinals baseball fans cheerfully confessing "I bleed Cardinals red" and so on. Fyodorov shouldn't say "I eat this railroads stuff for breakfast," or "My middle name is rolling stock," either. He is not pronouncing a well-formulated slogan about himself. He is groping toward an articulation. As mentioned many times, what he says is significantly incomplete. I think the translations proposed here that come closest to that quality are Robert's "I work by feeling" (which might be even better, less finished, less determinate, as "I go by feeling), and someone else's very fine suggestion "I feel things" ("WHAT things?"). Best to all, Tim Sergay ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Wed May 23 12:39:37 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 05:39:37 -0700 Subject: Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" Message-ID: Dear Josh and all, No, this is not the difference between British and American idioms--I know because I am an outsider to both :) The difference is between the effect of what Platonov does with idioms and what happens when people use them automatically, without what Shklovsky called the resurrection of the word. You see, in Platonov's world, no matter how accepted the IDIOM of bleeding something as living and breathing it may be, the actual bleeding creeps in. If he uses it, he always means it, not just what the idiom would mean. (The technique he uses for this literalization of idioms is slightly distorting them; they sound as if a foreigner attempted to talk in idioms instead of plainly. Something shifts about the syntactic government or word compatibility--and here you go: the idiomatic meaning turns into a thin veil over the literal. If you are interested in some corroboration of my conclusions in my life-long project on Platonov, check out Alexei Tsvetkov's Dissertation at U. Michigan on the topic, written and defended back in the '70s: it is mostly linguistic). What Robert meant then is that you can't translate Platonov specifically idiom-by-idiom, because his own, Platonovian, idioms always imply what they say literally and not merely idiomatically. Robert has worked on that problem for decades, so naturally, he was shocked by the literal meaning of the idiom, the meaning which he always takes into consideration (that is why I admire his work and try to contribute as much as he would take). Paying attention to the literal meaning of idioms is what Platonov does to his reader, in the original and in an ideal translation, to which Robert comes so close that the difference between his work and the ideal is often negligible. After all, Robert has managed to create a language WITHIN the English language that does to people what Platonov does to them in Russian. All this explains why he (R.) considered your translation fit for many other writers but not for Platonov: many excellent writers can be translated idiom-by-idiom. If you try to do that with Platonov, you might as well dance and prance on a mine-field. Recently, a student of mine attempted to read Pl. in Russian. Her spoken Russian is very good but she still does take idioms in Russian at face-value: if people say so and it reminds me of something idiomatic then this must be the relevant idiom in their language. You know what she told me? That Platonov sounded cheesy to her! She was so careless about that mine-field! The more you know Russian, the weirder Platonov sounds, not the other way around. I admire Robert for his constant awareness of that, native-speaker's perspective on Russia's greatest 20th c. writer. Cheers to Josh and all, o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Josh Wilson Date: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 11:12 pm Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" > >As for my original question - in some respects I like the suggested > >translation 'I bleed railway ties', but it is only very rarely > indeed, esp. > >in his later work, that Platonov uses an image as shocking as > that. > > Interesting, when I suggested it, I did not consider it at all > shocking.Simply a play on words. Actually, I still don't see it as > shocking - > certainly much more mild than the little boy's statement to his > dead father. > > > Maybe this is a difference between "American" and... that other > language? > > Best, > > JW > > P.S. Isn't it also interesting that I phrased it "rail ties" and Mr. > Chandler turned it into "railway ties" (which I don't think flows > near as > well...) Language is fascinating... > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Wed May 23 12:39:59 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 05:39:59 -0700 Subject: Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" Message-ID: Dear Josh and all, No, this is not the difference between British and American idioms--I know because I am an outsider to both :) The difference is between the effect of what Platonov does with idioms and what happens when people use them automatically, without what Shklovsky called the resurrection of the word. You see, in Platonov's world, no matter how accepted the IDIOM of bleeding something as living and breathing it may be, the actual bleeding creeps in. If he uses it, he always means it, not just what the idiom would mean. (The technique he uses for this literalization of idioms is slightly distorting them; they sound as if a foreigner attempted to talk in idioms instead of plainly. Something shifts about the syntactic government or word compatibility--and here you go: the idiomatic meaning turns into a thin veil over the literal. If you are interested in some corroboration of my conclusions in my life-long project on Platonov, check out Alexei Tsvetkov's Dissertation at U. Michigan on the topic, written and defended back in the '70s: it is mostly linguistic). What Robert meant then is that you can't translate Platonov specifically idiom-by-idiom, because his own, Platonovian, idioms always imply what they say literally and not merely idiomatically. Robert has worked on that problem for decades, so naturally, he was shocked by the literal meaning of the idiom, the meaning which he always takes into consideration (that is why I admire his work and try to contribute as much as he would take). Paying attention to the literal meaning of idioms is what Platonov does to his reader, in the original and in an ideal translation, to which Robert comes so close that the difference between his work and the ideal is often negligible. After all, Robert has managed to create a language WITHIN the English language that does to people what Platonov does to them in Russian. All this explains why he (R.) considered your translation fit for many other writers but not for Platonov: many excellent writers can be translated idiom-by-idiom. If you try to do that with Platonov, you might as well dance and prance on a mine-field. Recently, a student of mine attempted to read Pl. in Russian. Her spoken Russian is very good but she still does take idioms in Russian at face-value: if people say so and it reminds me of something idiomatic then this must be the relevant idiom in their language. You know what she told me? That Platonov sounded cheesy to her! She was so careless about that mine-field! The more you know Russian, the weirder Platonov sounds, not the other way around. I admire Robert for his constant awareness of that, native-speaker's perspective on Russia's greatest 20th c. writer. Cheers to Josh and all, o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Josh Wilson Date: Tuesday, May 22, 2007 11:12 pm Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Platonov and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" > >As for my original question - in some respects I like the suggested > >translation 'I bleed railway ties', but it is only very rarely > indeed, esp. > >in his later work, that Platonov uses an image as shocking as > that. > > Interesting, when I suggested it, I did not consider it at all > shocking.Simply a play on words. Actually, I still don't see it as > shocking - > certainly much more mild than the little boy's statement to his > dead father. > > > Maybe this is a difference between "American" and... that other > language? > > Best, > > JW > > P.S. Isn't it also interesting that I phrased it "rail ties" and Mr. > Chandler turned it into "railway ties" (which I don't think flows > near as > well...) Language is fascinating... > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Wed May 23 12:52:10 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 05:52:10 -0700 Subject: Bleeding rail ties and 'Ya chuvstvuyu" Message-ID: Hurray for Tim Sergay! Olga > Dear Seelangers, > > To venture that Platonov's character Fyodorov "bleeds rail ties" > may well be > an inventive, accurate and idiomatic way of describing his > intuitive passion > for his profession, but I can't agree that "I bleed rail ties" is > a valid > translation of what Fyodorov actually says of himself in his > dialogue: "no > ia chuvstvuiu..." And that's not because I'm a literalist ninny, > although > sometimes I suppose I am. That's because Fyodorov is not uttering > an utterly > idiomatic, slogan-like, quite finished and readily comprehensible > thought > about himself. If you google for "I bleed" you find Cardinals > baseball fans > cheerfully confessing "I bleed Cardinals red" and so on. Fyodorov > shouldn't > say "I eat this railroads stuff for breakfast," or "My middle name > is > rolling stock," either. He is not pronouncing a well-formulated > slogan about > himself. He is groping toward an articulation. As mentioned many > times, what > he says is significantly incomplete. I think the translations > proposed here > that come closest to that quality are Robert's "I work by feeling" > (which > might be even better, less finished, less determinate, as "I go by > feeling), > and someone else's very fine suggestion "I feel things" ("WHAT > things?"). > Best to all, > > Tim Sergay > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From pstock at BRANDEIS.EDU Wed May 23 15:33:45 2007 From: pstock at BRANDEIS.EDU (David Powelstock) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 11:33:45 -0400 Subject: Russia Scuttles Export Of Art Images of Putin Message-ID: FYI, from today's NY Times. You can view an image of one of the works at Reuters: http://tinyurl.com/2een85. Arts, Briefly Compiled by LAWRENCE VAN GELDER May 23, 2007 Russian Customs has barred the export of six works of art — including two that mock President Vladimir P. Putin — for an exhibition at a gallery in Dresden, Germany, where he served as a K.G.B. officer in the 1980s, Reuters reported. The Städtische Galerie in Dresden said a letter from the shipping company ExpART explained that the ban had been issued because the art was considered to have the potential to cause international discord. The works were intended for “Learning From Moscow,” a show of about 40 works by contemporary Moscow artists that is to open tomorrow. One, by Konstantin Latyshev, superimposes Putin’s face on an image of the poet Alexander Pushkin, a Russian national hero. Below it appears a nickname used derisively by some of Mr. Putin’s critics. Another work, “The Candle of Our Life,” by the Blue Noses Group and executed in a style reminiscent of Russian religious icons, shows Jesus with a bared chest and a beer belly; Pushkin, in a red T-shirt, lights Jesus’ candle from one side, while Mr. Putin leans in from the other. Other banned art depicts Osama bin Laden , Hitler , the Pope and Muslim minarets and women’s veils. David Powelstock Asst. Prof. of Russian & East European Literatures Chair, Program in Russian & East European Studies Brandeis University GRALL, MS 024 Waltham, MA 02454-9110 781.736.3347 (Office) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulr at RUSSIANLIFE.NET Wed May 23 16:03:45 2007 From: paulr at RUSSIANLIFE.NET (Paul Richardson) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 12:03:45 -0400 Subject: EDITOR SOUGHT: Russian Life Message-ID: Russian Life magazine seeks an energetic, reliable, detail-oriented News Editor to assist the U.S. Editor and Publisher in the gathering and writing of short news and travel items for the magazine. This part-time position requires approximately 20 hours of work per month and offers the opportunity to be involved in production of the world's premiere English language magazine on Russia. The ideal applicant will have: native fluency in Russian excellent English language writing skills strong proficiency in Microsoft Word good online research skills sound journalism and writing experience excellent personal and employment references Applicant must be resident full-time in Russia. For more information, visit: http://www.russianlife.net/jobs.cfm ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From pstock at BRANDEIS.EDU Wed May 23 15:33:45 2007 From: pstock at BRANDEIS.EDU (David Powelstock) Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 11:33:45 -0400 Subject: Russia Scuttles Export Of Art Images of Putin Message-ID: FYI, from today's NY Times. You can view an image of one of the works at Reuters: http://tinyurl.com/2een85. Arts, Briefly Compiled by LAWRENCE VAN GELDER May 23, 2007 Russian Customs has barred the export of six works of art — including two that mock President Vladimir P. Putin — for an exhibition at a gallery in Dresden, Germany, where he served as a K.G.B. officer in the 1980s, Reuters reported. The Städtische Galerie in Dresden said a letter from the shipping company ExpART explained that the ban had been issued because the art was considered to have the potential to cause international discord. The works were intended for “Learning From Moscow,” a show of about 40 works by contemporary Moscow artists that is to open tomorrow. One, by Konstantin Latyshev, superimposes Putin’s face on an image of the poet Alexander Pushkin, a Russian national hero. Below it appears a nickname used derisively by some of Mr. Putin’s critics. Another work, “The Candle of Our Life,” by the Blue Noses Group and executed in a style reminiscent of Russian religious icons, shows Jesus with a bared chest and a beer belly; Pushkin, in a red T-shirt, lights Jesus’ candle from one side, while Mr. Putin leans in from the other. Other banned art depicts Osama bin Laden , Hitler , the Pope and Muslim minarets and women’s veils. David Powelstock Asst. Prof. of Russian & East European Literatures Chair, Program in Russian & East European Studies Brandeis University GRALL, MS 024 Waltham, MA 02454-9110 781.736.3347 (Office) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU Thu May 24 05:07:28 2007 From: s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU (Prof Steven P Hill) Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 00:07:28 -0500 Subject: Valentin Berezhkov on film Message-ID: Dear colleagues: An interesting appeal from a student in Deutschland with a Slavic-sounding surname (Simanek). I noticed it on a film-archivists' list-server. Not exactly Slavonic philology, but someone out there on SEELANGS might have some suggestions for this German youth (in addition to the one suggestion attached at the end)... Best wishes to all, Steven P Hill, University of Illinois. _ __ __ __ ___ __ ___ __ Date: Wed 23 May 23:45:32 CDT 2007 From: Subject: Re: GETPOST AMIA-L To: Steven P Hill Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 19:15:42 +0200 From: Peter Simanek Subject: Footage of Soviet Interpreter Valentin Berezhkov urgently needed! Hello to all of you! My name is Peter. I am a student at a linguistic university in Germany. I am desperately looking for films/interviews/general footage/documentaries on Mr. Valentin Berezhkov, the former personal interpreter of Stalin. Just one piece of the below-mentioned material would already do! Or any other film/documentary/interview with Mr. Berezhkov that you can provide! It may also cost something, but not a fortune please! Please help! I cannot get hold of these films in Germany! 1. Stanley Siegel, Valentine Berezhkov - Stalin´s interpreter, parts 1-3 2. Title: Russian Consulate [videorecording] / Valentin Berezhkov. Published: Evanston, Ill. : National College of Education, Instructional Media Center, 1981. Physical Description: 1 cassette (55 min.) : sd., b&w.; 3/4 in. Summary: Presentation by Dr. Valentin Berezhkov, a Soviet diplomat, on the prospects of United States-Soviet detente in the 1980's. Dr. Berezhkov is concerned about the pressure of the arms race, especially with the election of Ronald Reagan. He views Soviet effort mainly as a race to keep up with the U.S. 3. At Stalin*s Side, An Evening with Valentin M. Berezhkov. 1995 1 videocassette of 1 (VHS) : sd., col. ; 1/2 in. viewing copy. Notes: Copyright: Conrad Herbjorn Hendriksen. DCR 1995; PUB 10Dec95; REG 12Feb96; PA777-152. 4. "The Road to War" 5. "The Cold War and Beyond" 6. "The Interpreter of the Century" Thank you so much for your help! I am looking forward to your soon replies. Best regards, Peter. Der frühe Vogel fängt den Wurm. Hier gelangen Sie zum neuen Yahoo! Mail: http://mail.yahoo.de _ _ _ _ _ _ _ _ __ ___ __ _ _ __ __ ___ __ ___ _ _ __ __ __ ___ ___ Date: Wed, 23 May 2007 11:13:36 -0700 From: CommonTouch Subject: Re: Footage of Soviet Interpreter Valentin Berezhkov urgently needed! You can buy a DVD here that has an interview with him: http://www.amazon.com/Biography-Vladimir-Lenin-Voice-Revolution/dp/ B000AABKX6 And here: http://store.aetv.com/html/product/index.jhtml?id=70686 I don't know if they're multi-region DVDs. _ _ _ ___ __ ___ __ _ __ __ ___ __ ___ __ ___ _ __ __ _____________ ______ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jpf3 at UCHICAGO.EDU Thu May 24 16:11:24 2007 From: jpf3 at UCHICAGO.EDU (June Farris) Date: Thu, 24 May 2007 11:11:24 -0500 Subject: Dostoevsky & A. I. Selin In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Hello! In the index to the 30-volume Academy of Sciences 1972-1990 edition, A. I. Selin is mentioned several times, as follows: Dostoevskii, F. M. Polnoe sobranie sochinenii v tridtsati tomakh. V. 24 = Dnevnik pisateli za 1876 god (noiabr'- dekabr'). Leningrad: Nauka, 1982, p. 225: Samoubiitsy Selin--Prachkov The commentary is on p. 473, as follows: Selin, Aleksandr Ivanovich (1816-1877-zasluzhenyi professor Kievskogo universiteta po kafedre russkoi slovestnosti. V pis'me k Dostoevskomu ot 28 ianvaria 1876g. on izlozhil mysli, vyskazannye im v doktorskoi dissertatsii ("O dramticheskoi poezii v Rossii, preimushchestvenno o komedii, do Griboedova vkliuchitel'no" 1850-1852", ne opublikovana) i sozvuchnye, po ego mneniiu, vzgliadam pisatelia: "V odnom iz polozhenii ia govoriu, kogda imenno ideal, dannyi russkomu obshchestvu Petrom Velikim, nachal otzhivat'svoiu poru: ; dalee govoriu kakaia glavnaia ideia vsei russkoi literatury posle nashestvie Napoleona... This commentary continues on for quite a bit more, so if you'd like me to send it to you, please let me know... p. 227: NB: Kstati o Seline (professore kievskom) i ego dissertatsii o tom, chto my vstupili v sovershennuiu neizvestnost' p. 229 (the citation you quoted in your note to SEELANGS). Note that although it is under the heading "Sostav avgustovskogo", it is in the November-December 1876 section. The commentary to this quote is on p. 476, which identifies it as being from the end of chapter 25 of Herzen's "Byloe i dumy". The commentary does not mention Selin. p. 236-37: entry entitled "K Selinu" and is a fairly lengthy paragraph, which I can copy and send to you, if you like. There are several more references to Selin in the Nov-December 1876 section of Dnevnik pisatelia. If you would like a photocopy of any of these entries, please send me your mailing address. Regards, June Farris At 05:01 PM 5/22/2007, =?GB2312?Q?Liv_Bliss?= wrote: >I wonder if someone far better informed than I can help me with this. > >In his notes for Writer's Diary (for August 1876), Dostoevsky wrote the >following memo to himself: "§£§Ù§ñ§ä§î §Ú§Ù §¤§Ö§â§è§Ö§ß§Ñ, §Ú§Ù >'§³§ä§Ñ§ß§Ü§Ö§Ó§Ú§é§Ñ §Ü§â§å§Ô§Ñ' §Õ§Ý§ñ >§Ó§à§Ù§â§Ñ§Ø§Ö§ß§î§ñ §³§Ö§Ý§Ú§ß§å" [Vzyat' iz Gertsena, iz 'Stankevicha >kruga' dlya >vozrazhen'ya Selinu]. > >"Selin" has me stumped: who on earth was that? (Obviously not Louis- >Ferdinand Destouches-C¨¦line, who wasn't even born until 1894, but that's >where the trail went cold for me.) > >I would vastly appreciate any clues that anyone can offer. > >Best to all >Liv > >*************** >Liv Bliss >ATA Certified Russian to English Translator >tel.: (928) 367-1615 >fax: (928) 367-1950 >email: bliss @ wmonline.com > >Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, >for you are crunchy and good with ketchup -- Anon. >*************** > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >------------------------------------------------------------------------- June Pachuta Farris Bibliographer for Slavic, East European and Eurasian Studies and Bibliographer for General Linguistics Room 263 Regenstein Library University of Chicago 1100 E. 57th Street Chicago, Illinois 60637 jpf3 at uchicago.edu 1-773-702-8456 (phone) 1-773-702-6623 (fax) ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Fri May 25 05:21:28 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 06:21:28 +0100 Subject: Rossica translation prize Message-ID: Dear all, Just to say 2 things: 1) Last night, here in London, Joanne Turnbull was awarded the Rossica Translation Prize (it is quite a new prize, this is only the second year it has been running) for her translation of Sigizmund Krzhizhanovsky, Seven Stories, published by GLAS. Krzh. is a great writer, and Joanne¹s translation is outstanding. If you want to know more, please read my review in SEEJ, Winter 2006! 2) I received a ŒSpecial Commendation¹ both for my translation of Hamid Ismailov¹s The Railway, published by Harvill Secker, and for my translations over the years. The Railway is an exuberant and witty novel set in Central Asia. There is a bit about it on amazon.com, though I have just seen that it is at present available only second hand. A new VINTAGE edition should be available in the UK in early July and in the USA by the end of July. Best Wishes, Robert ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mkatz at MIDDLEBURY.EDU Fri May 25 11:13:19 2007 From: mkatz at MIDDLEBURY.EDU (Katz, Michael) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 07:13:19 -0400 Subject: advice Message-ID: Dear colleagues: In connection with a new course I will be teaching in January, 2008, I am interested in identifying works of fiction in English translation (from Russian or Yiddish), preferably, short stories, that describe Jewish life in Vilnius at the end of the 19th and beginning of the 20th century. I would be grateful for any suggestions and recommendations. With thanks, Michael Katz Middlebury College mkatz at middlebury.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From O.F.Boele at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL Fri May 25 12:53:25 2007 From: O.F.Boele at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL (Boele, O.F.) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 14:53:25 +0200 Subject: Russian poetry and Rembrandt Message-ID: Dear Seelangers, I am aware of the irony of a Dutch slavist asking this question, but can anyone help me find Russian poetry (other than Joseph Brodsky's) that mentions or alludes to the work of Rembrandt? Any suggestions will be highly appreciated. Otto Boele Dr. Otto Boele Slavic Department University of Leiden P.O. Box 9515 2300 RA Leiden The Netherlands Tel. +31-71-5272085 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Fri May 25 13:31:41 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 06:31:41 -0700 Subject: Russian poetry and Rembrandt Message-ID: My favorite is Mandelstam's "Kak svetoteni muchenik Rembrandt..." It is piercing, as concerns both Rembrandt's world and Mandelstam's affinity with him. I find it that Mand. uses the chiaroscuro of Rembrandt's just the same way as he does it in St. Issac's, in his poem "Liubliu pod svodami sedyia tishiny"--as perhaps not terribly enlightening or appealing but the only haven for the tormented souls of his Russian contemporaries. The last two sources of light on Rembrandt's canvesses are implicitly opposed to other sources of light in Rembrandt's own works, I think. (You also have that internal opposition in the St. Isaac's poem). In case your program reads Cyrillic: Как светотени мученик Рембрандт... Как светотени мученик Рембрандт, Я глубоко ушел в немеющее время, И резкость моего горящего ребра Не охраняется ни сторожами теми, Ни этим воином, что под грозою спят. Простишь ли ты меня, великолепный брат И мастер и отец черно-зеленой теми,- Но око соколиного пера И жаркие ларцы у полночи в гареме Смущают не к добру, смущают без добра Мехами сумрака взволнованное племя. 4 февраля 1937 Hope this helps but will keep looking. Olga Meerson ----- Original Message ----- From: "Boele, O.F." Date: Friday, May 25, 2007 5:53 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Russian poetry and Rembrandt > Dear Seelangers, > > I am aware of the irony of a Dutch slavist asking this question, > but can > anyone help me find Russian poetry (other than Joseph Brodsky's) that > mentions or alludes to the work of Rembrandt? Any suggestions will be > highly appreciated. > > Otto Boele > > > Dr. Otto Boele > Slavic Department > University of Leiden > P.O. Box 9515 > 2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > Tel. +31-71-5272085 > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Fri May 25 13:33:13 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 06:33:13 -0700 Subject: Rossica translation prize Message-ID: Dear Robert, Hamid, Joanne, et al., Congratulations!!! o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Robert Chandler Date: Thursday, May 24, 2007 10:21 pm Subject: [SEELANGS] Rossica translation prize > Dear all, > > Just to say 2 things: > > 1) Last night, here in London, Joanne Turnbull was awarded the Rossica > Translation Prize (it is quite a new prize, this is only the > second year it > has been running) for her translation of Sigizmund Krzhizhanovsky, > SevenStories, published by GLAS. Krzh. is a great writer, and > Joanne¹stranslation is outstanding. If you want to know more, > please read my review > in SEEJ, Winter 2006! > > 2) I received a ?Special Commendation¹ both for my translation of > HamidIsmailov¹s The Railway, published by Harvill Secker, and for > my translations > over the years. The Railway is an exuberant and witty novel set > in Central > Asia. There is a bit about it on amazon.com, though I have just > seen that > it is at present available only second hand. A new VINTAGE > edition should > be available in the UK in early July and in the USA by the end of > July. > Best Wishes, > > Robert > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jane.chamberlain at GMAIL.COM Fri May 25 14:51:48 2007 From: jane.chamberlain at GMAIL.COM (Pangloss Publishing) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 09:51:48 -0500 Subject: Rossica translation prize In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Congratulations, Robert! Your book must have sold out -- I bought a new copy on Amazon UK in February. Jane >2) I received a 'Special Commendation' both for my translation of Hamid >Ismailov's The Railway, published by Harvill Secker, and for my translations >over the years. The Railway is an exuberant and witty novel set in Central >Asia. There is a bit about it on amazon.com, though I have just seen that >it is at present available only second hand. A new VINTAGE edition should >be available in the UK in early July and in the USA by the end of July. > >Best Wishes, > >Robert > > >------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ >------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK Fri May 25 14:54:51 2007 From: Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK (Alexandra Smith) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 15:54:51 +0100 Subject: Russian poetry and Rembrandt Message-ID: Dear Otto, In addition to Olga Meerson's suggestion to look at Mandelshtam's poem "Kak svetoteni muchenik Rembrandt" (1937) (see Nadezhda Mandelshtam's comment on its autobiographical and prophetic qualities), I would like to add to your list of texts Akhmatova's poem "I prekrasnei mrakov Rembrandta/Prosto plesen' v chernom uglu..." (1954); Kushner's collection of poems "Nochnoi dozor" (inspired by Rembrandt as Kushner revealed in several interviews); and Aleksander Kochetkov's one-act play about Rembrandt -- "Golova gomera"; Dmitrii Kedrin's play (written in verse) "Rembrandt" (1940)... Vladimir Narbut was very much inspired by Rembrandt's paintings, too, but I don't remeber any specific references at this point; Nikolai Otsup wrote in his long narrative poem about his meeting with Annensky in a study compared to Rembrandt's paintings (na sumrak Rembrandta pokhozhii...)(Otsup, 1993: it's the edition that was prepared by Roman Timenchik)... Pavel Antokol'skii was often compared to Rembrandt but I don't remember whether his collection of poems "Nochnoi smotr" (1974, I think) has any specific references to Rembrandt, it contains allusions to Zhukovsky, of course, but there might be something that evokes Rembrandt's works ... and, of course, Nikolai Zabolotsky was always very sensitive to paintings. You might wish to have a look at his poem "Gomborskii les" (1957) which includes the lines: "Zdes' osen' sumela takie passazhi/ Naliapat' iz okhry, ognia i belil, /Chtob dub busheval, kak Rembrandt v Ermitazhe, /A klen, akak Muril'o, na kryl'iakh paril"." Good luck with your fascinating project! All best, Sasha Smith ===================================== Alexandra Smith (PhD, University of London) Lecturer in Russian School of European Languages and Cultures The University of Edinburgh David Hume Tower George Square Edinburgh EX8 9JX UK tel. +44-(0)131-6511381 fax: +44- (0)131- 650-3604 e-mail: Alexandra.Smith at ed.ac.uk ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From malevichsociety at HOTMAIL.COM Fri May 25 16:19:07 2007 From: malevichsociety at HOTMAIL.COM (Julia Tulovsky) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 12:19:07 -0400 Subject: Call for grant proposals. The Malevich Society Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, The Malevich Society is pleased to announce its grant competition for the year 2007. The Malevich Society is a not-for-profit organization dedicated to advancing knowledge about the Russian artist Kazimir Malevich and his work. In the belief that Malevich was a pioneer of modern art, and should be recognized for his key contributions to the history of Modernism, the Society awards grants to encourage research and writing relating to his history and memory. The Malevich Society also sponsors publications devoted to Malevich, as well as translations of his texts, and texts about him, into other languages. The Society welcomes applications from scholars of any nationality, and at all stages of their career. Proposed projects should increase the understanding of Malevich and his work, or augment historical, biographical, or artistic information about Malevich and/or his artistic legacy. Application forms and instructions may be requested by telephone at 1-718-980-1805, by e-mail at malevichsociety at hotmail.com, or may be downloaded from the web-site: www.malevichsociety.org. Deadline: September 30, 2007 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From tarsis at GMAIL.COM Fri May 25 16:30:43 2007 From: tarsis at GMAIL.COM (Irina Tarsis) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 12:30:43 -0400 Subject: Call for grant proposals. The Malevich Society In-Reply-To: Message-ID: On 5/25/07, Julia Tulovsky wrote: > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > The Malevich Society is pleased to announce its grant competition for the > year 2007. > > > > The Malevich Society is a not-for-profit organization dedicated to > advancing knowledge about the Russian artist Kazimir Malevich and his work. > > > > In the belief that Malevich was a pioneer of modern art, and should be > recognized for his key contributions to the history of Modernism, the > Society awards grants to encourage research and writing relating to his > history and memory. The Malevich Society also sponsors publications devoted > to Malevich, as well as translations of his texts, and texts about him, into > other languages. > > > > The Society welcomes applications from scholars of any nationality, and at > all stages of their career. Proposed projects should increase the > understanding of Malevich and his work, or augment historical, biographical, > or artistic information about Malevich and/or his artistic legacy. > > > > Application forms and instructions may be requested by telephone at > 1-718-980-1805, by e-mail at malevichsociety at hotmail.com, or may be > downloaded from the web-site: www.malevichsociety.org. > > > > Deadline: September 30, 2007 > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From bliss at WMONLINE.COM Fri May 25 16:44:08 2007 From: bliss at WMONLINE.COM (bliss@wmonline.com) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 11:44:08 -0500 Subject: Dostoevsky & A. I. Selin Message-ID: Dear Ms. Farris: I wanted to thank you on-list for your comprehensive and extremely helpful reply re. Professor Selin. It was exactly what I needed. Best regards Liv *************** Liv Bliss ATA Certified Russian to English Translator tel.: (928) 367-1615 fax: (928) 367-1950 email: bliss @ wmonline.com Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons, for you are crunchy and good with ketchup -- Anon. *************** ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From yfurman at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU Fri May 25 19:02:00 2007 From: yfurman at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU (Furman, Yelena) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 12:02:00 -0700 Subject: Rossica translation prize Message-ID: Congratulations to all! Best, YF ________________________________ From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list on behalf of Robert Chandler Sent: Thu 5/24/2007 10:21 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] Rossica translation prize Dear all, Just to say 2 things: 1) Last night, here in London, Joanne Turnbull was awarded the Rossica Translation Prize (it is quite a new prize, this is only the second year it has been running) for her translation of Sigizmund Krzhizhanovsky, Seven Stories, published by GLAS. Krzh. is a great writer, and Joanne¹s translation is outstanding. If you want to know more, please read my review in SEEJ, Winter 2006! 2) I received a OESpecial Commendation¹ both for my translation of Hamid Ismailov¹s The Railway, published by Harvill Secker, and for my translations over the years. The Railway is an exuberant and witty novel set in Central Asia. There is a bit about it on amazon.com, though I have just seen that it is at present available only second hand. A new VINTAGE edition should be available in the UK in early July and in the USA by the end of July. Best Wishes, Robert ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Fri May 25 23:42:43 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 16:42:43 -0700 Subject: Russian poetry and Rembrandt Message-ID: Wow! Sasha Smith's list is a comprehensive course in Russian Silver Age and contemporary poetry all in itself! Wonderful! o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Alexandra Smith Date: Friday, May 25, 2007 7:54 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Russian poetry and Rembrandt > Dear Otto, > > In addition to Olga Meerson's suggestion to look at Mandelshtam's poem > "Kak svetoteni muchenik Rembrandt" (1937) (see Nadezhda Mandelshtam's > comment on its autobiographical and prophetic qualities), I would like > to add to your list of texts Akhmatova's poem "I prekrasnei mrakov > Rembrandta/Prosto plesen' v chernom uglu..." (1954); Kushner's > collection of poems "Nochnoi dozor" (inspired by Rembrandt as Kushner > revealed in several interviews); and Aleksander Kochetkov's one-act > play about Rembrandt -- "Golova gomera"; Dmitrii Kedrin's play > (written in verse) "Rembrandt" (1940)... Vladimir Narbut was very > much > inspired by Rembrandt's paintings, too, but I don't remeber any > specific references at this point; Nikolai Otsup wrote in his long > > narrative poem about his meeting with Annensky in a study > compared to > Rembrandt's paintings (na sumrak Rembrandta pokhozhii...)(Otsup, > 1993: > it's the edition that was prepared by Roman Timenchik)... Pavel > Antokol'skii was often compared to Rembrandt but I don't remember > whether his collection of poems "Nochnoi smotr" (1974, I think) > has > any specific references to Rembrandt, it contains allusions to > Zhukovsky, of course, but there might be something that evokes > Rembrandt's works ... and, of course, Nikolai Zabolotsky was > always > very sensitive to paintings. You might wish to have a look at his > poem > "Gomborskii les" (1957) which includes the lines: "Zdes' osen' > sumela > takie passazhi/ Naliapat' iz okhry, ognia i belil, /Chtob dub > busheval, kak Rembrandt v Ermitazhe, /A klen, akak Muril'o, na > kryl'iakh paril"." > Good luck with your fascinating project! > > All best, > Sasha Smith > > > ===================================== > Alexandra Smith (PhD, University of London) > Lecturer in Russian > School of European Languages and Cultures > The University of Edinburgh > David Hume Tower > George Square > Edinburgh EX8 9JX > UK > > tel. +44-(0)131-6511381 > fax: +44- (0)131- 650-3604 > e-mail: Alexandra.Smith at ed.ac.uk > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From awreynolds at FACSTAFF.WISC.EDU Sat May 26 01:00:29 2007 From: awreynolds at FACSTAFF.WISC.EDU (ANDREW W REYNOLDS) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 20:00:29 -0500 Subject: Russian poetry and Rembrandt In-Reply-To: <41F1521454BEF247B9C037A02FC3DC1B0362072C@WSDPD-XC01.wsdpd.wsdad.leidenuniv.nl> Message-ID: The following are more obvious than Sasha’s fine list, but perhaps are worth mentioning: Mikhail Lermontov, On a Painting by Rembrandt (1830) Allusions in Pushkin’s "Domik v Kolomne” and in Journey to Arzrum Evgenii Rein’s “Nochnoi dozor” Also Mandelstam’s 1931 poems “Eshche daleko mne do patriarkha” and “Polnoch’ v Moskve” Jan Paul Hinrichs's Van nachtwacht tot Huizinga: Russiche dichters over Nederland (1994) has an updated bibliography on Holland in Russian poetry, including a number of Rembrandt poems, at http://ub.leidenuniv.nl/vak/index.php3?m=&c=183 Andrew Reynolds University of Wisconsin-Madison ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU Sat May 26 02:18:09 2007 From: Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU (Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU) Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 21:18:09 -0500 Subject: Russian poetry and Rembrandt In-Reply-To: <41F1521454BEF247B9C037A02FC3DC1B0362072C@WSDPD-XC01.wsdpd.wsdad.leidenuniv.nl> Message-ID: Also there is a poem by Gennady Grigor'ev (a brilliant poet from St. Petersburg who died just two months ago) "Nochnoi dozor". Try to google it, using the following lines "Ночной дозор, как прежде, под надзором,//Но он не даст покрыть себя позором..." Yevgeny Slivkin Department of Modern Languages, Literatures, and Linguistics University of Oklahoma ----- Original Message ----- From: "Boele, O.F." Date: Friday, May 25, 2007 7:53 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Russian poetry and Rembrandt To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Dear Seelangers, > > I am aware of the irony of a Dutch slavist asking this question, but > can > anyone help me find Russian poetry (other than Joseph Brodsky's) that > mentions or alludes to the work of Rembrandt? Any suggestions will be > highly appreciated. > > Otto Boele > > > Dr. Otto Boele > Slavic Department > University of Leiden > P.O. Box 9515 > 2300 RA Leiden > The Netherlands > Tel. +31-71-5272085 > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU Sat May 26 06:23:42 2007 From: s-hill4 at UIUC.EDU (Prof Steven P Hill) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 01:23:42 -0500 Subject: Ukrainian liturgic chants Message-ID: Dear SEELANGS colleagues: Evidently this is the week for far-out searches, such as this one from Brazil, seeking Ukr. religious music. ( I noticed it on a musicology site. ) If anybody out there can provide any input to Senora Babbar, send it to HER E-Mail address (below).-- Steven P Hill, University of Illinois. _ __ __ __ __ ___ __ __ ___ __ ___ _ Date: Sat 26 May 01:08:24 CDT 2007 From: LISTSERV at LISTSERV.INDIANA.EDU Subject: Re: GETPOST AMS-L To: Prof Steven P Hill Date: Fri, 25 May 2007 10:03:30 -0300 From: lara j babbar Subject: Ukrainian Liturgic Chants Dear List, I would kindly ask for suggestion of bibliography, including scores, on traditional Ukrainian Orthodox or Greek Catholic Chants. Specifically does anybody know about Djak in South America (particularly Brazil) ? So far I know the book by Klymasz, on Djak in Canada. All the best, Lara Babbar Federal University of Paraná, Brasil. Fale com seus amigos de graça com o novo Yahoo! Messenger http://br.messenger.yahoo.com/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lily.alexander at UTORONTO.CA Sat May 26 09:50:04 2007 From: lily.alexander at UTORONTO.CA (Lily Alexander) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 05:50:04 -0400 Subject: Protivoslovo Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Rereading yesterday Bakhtin, I ran into "protivoslovo." I am surprised that I did not come across any attempts of its theorization. Of course Bakhtin invented many words, but this one may have slipped through undiscussed. It is used in his "Marxism and the Philosophy of Language." As with all of his invented words (or reinvented), it is more than what just meets the eye. It certainly will be more than just "vozrazhenie," counter argument, etc. Slovo also connotes tale, myth, even epos, so it might have an extended meaning beyond "word." But of course, for starters, "word" and "utterance" would be the subject of his discussion. I have two questions. Have anyone seen or read (or written!) any theoretical work discussing it as a term or concept? I saw in one semiotic paper - it was mentioned in passing. How to translate it? Trying to translate it, I came up with "antiword" (like antiworld), or "counterword" (like counter-culture). I saw "counterword" used in an article in an journal on aesthetics simply as "vozrazhenie." It is also interesting what both (or any other possible) translations would connote in English. Antiword is part of the software engineering vocabulary. Counterword is translated in Multitran - definitely far from what Bakhtin meant. See below: Counterword ??????????????????? ????? ; ???????????? ?????????? ????? ?? ??????? ?????????-?????????? ????????? 1) a desemantized word, 2) an emotionally colored word with faded [objective-logical] meaning This will be something fossilized - exactly the opposite to what was meant by Bakhtin, as "I am feeling" :-) Bakhtin was rarely interested in anything "stertoe," but rather of the the things that "stick out." Slovo provokes protivoslovo in his context. This would be more along the lines of passionate counterargument. Something polyarnoe in a dialoical context, coming out of opposition or provocation and stimulated by debate. Any thoughts? Thanks you. Lily Alexander ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Sat May 26 10:05:40 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 11:05:40 +0100 Subject: Protivoslovo In-Reply-To: <465802CC.80600@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: Dear Lily and all, > How to translate it? > Trying to translate it, I came up with "antiword" (like antiworld), or > "counterword" (like counter-culture). I'd need to know a lot more about context to venture anything with confidence. For now let me just say that 'counterword' has a greater range of possible meanings. 'The counterculture' is definitely in opposition to 'the culture'; but a counterpart of some person or thing is not necessarily in opposition to that person or thing. My guess is that there is more open opposition in words beginning with 'anti' than in words beginning with 'counter'. But this is only a first thought! R. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK Sat May 26 11:45:37 2007 From: Alexandra.Smith at ED.AC.UK (Alexandra Smith) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 12:45:37 +0100 Subject: Protivoslovo/Bakhtin and Kundera In-Reply-To: <465802CC.80600@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: Dear Lily, I'm not sure whether it will help you or not but there is an interesting usage of the word "anti-word" in Milan Kundera's novel The Unbearable Lightness of Being, in the chapter called "Music". It has a sentence that states that the music appeared to be to Franz as negation of sentences, as anti-word. There is a fascinating discussion of the notion of polyphony in Bakhtin's and Kundera's works in: Benson, Stephen."For Whant of a Better Term? Polyphony and the Value of Music in Bakhtin and Kundera", NARRATIVE, vol.11, 2003, pp.292-311. All very best, Sasha Smith ===================================== Alexandra Smith (PhD, University of London) Lecturer in Russian School of European Languages and Cultures The University of Edinburgh David Hume Tower George Square Edinburgh EX8 9JX UK tel. +44-(0)131-6511381 fax: +44- (0)131- 650-3604 e-mail: Alexandra.Smith at ed.ac.uk ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Sat May 26 13:49:14 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 06:49:14 -0700 Subject: Protivoslovo Message-ID: It is important that protivoslovo is like chuzhoe slovo in Baxtin. Like all of these in him, including the trendy and trendily misused word dialogue, what matters is that this word (actually a whole layer of discourse) is embedded in the main "slovo". From the contexts familiar to me in Baxtin, protivoslovo is nearly synonymous with chuzhoe slovo but with a more pronounced irony, a more direct reversal or detachment from the meaning with which the implicitly quoted voice originally invested the word. Thus i eta samaia Dunechka za eto samoe KZAHETSIA zamuzh idet! -- is chuzhoe slovo (the italicized kazhetsia) but Makar Devushkin's "ia perepisyvaiu" (meaning a whole range of things--some will say I am merely a copyist but perhaps even being a copyist is not without a point--I quote from Batin directly) introduces the unmentioned "some will say" or, in Russian, deskat', and "they may be wrong" (also the implied deskat' and what is implied by this deskat'). What Baxtin means is a word (or a whole discourse) ironically divested of its original meaning by its new context. This may be too long, but show me a good existent translation of Baxtin's chuzhoe slovo. All this considered, I think the best of the available would be COUNTER-DISCOURSE-discourse. Nowadays it is fashionable to talk about discourse in terms of physics or political science -- in the plural, as mutually antagonizing forces. Using this word (counter-discourse) will remind to the reader how much this fad owes to Baxtin's original ear and coining language. I think this reminder is worth a lot. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Lily Alexander Date: Saturday, May 26, 2007 2:50 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Protivoslovo > Dear Colleagues, > > Rereading yesterday Bakhtin, I ran into "protivoslovo." > > I am surprised that I did not come across any attempts of its > theorization.Of course Bakhtin invented many words, but this one > may have slipped > through undiscussed. It is used in his "Marxism and the Philosophy > of > Language." > > As with all of his invented words (or reinvented), it is more than > what > just meets the eye. It certainly will be more than just > "vozrazhenie," > counter argument, etc. > Slovo also connotes tale, myth, even epos, so it might have an > extended > meaning beyond "word." But of course, for starters, "word" and > "utterance" would be the subject of his discussion. > > I have two questions. Have anyone seen or read (or written!) any > theoretical work discussing it as a term or concept? I saw in one > semiotic paper - it was mentioned in passing. > > How to translate it? > Trying to translate it, I came up with "antiword" (like > antiworld), or > "counterword" (like counter-culture). I saw "counterword" used in > an > article in an journal on aesthetics simply as "vozrazhenie." It is > also > interesting what both (or any other possible) translations would > connote > in English. > > Antiword is part of the software engineering vocabulary. > Counterword is > translated in Multitran - definitely far from what Bakhtin meant. > See below: > > Counterword > ??????????????????? ????? > ; ???????????? > ?????????? > ????? ?? ??????? ?????????-?????????? ????????? > > > 1) a desemantized word, 2) an emotionally colored word with faded > [objective-logical] meaning > > This will be something fossilized - exactly the opposite to what > was > meant by Bakhtin, as "I am feeling" :-) > Bakhtin was rarely interested in anything "stertoe," but rather of > the > the things that "stick out." > > Slovo provokes protivoslovo in his context. This would be more > along the > lines of passionate counterargument. Something polyarnoe in a > dialoical > context, coming out of opposition or provocation and stimulated by > debate. > Any thoughts? > > Thanks you. > > Lily Alexander > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Sat May 26 13:52:34 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 06:52:34 -0700 Subject: Protivoslovo: typo Message-ID: Sorry, what I meant is not the monstrosity of a "counter-discourse-discourse" but merely conter-discourse. ----- Original Message ----- From: Olga Meerson Date: Saturday, May 26, 2007 6:49 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Protivoslovo > It is important that protivoslovo is like chuzhoe slovo in Baxtin. > Like all of these in him, including the trendy and trendily > misused word dialogue, what matters is that this word (actually a > whole layer of discourse) is embedded in the main "slovo". From > the contexts familiar to me in Baxtin, protivoslovo is nearly > synonymous with chuzhoe slovo but with a more pronounced irony, a > more direct reversal or detachment from the meaning with which the > implicitly quoted voice originally invested the word. Thus i eta > samaia Dunechka za eto samoe KZAHETSIA zamuzh idet! -- is chuzhoe > slovo (the italicized kazhetsia) but Makar Devushkin's "ia > perepisyvaiu" (meaning a whole range of things--some will say I am > merely a copyist but perhaps even being a copyist is not without a > point--I quote from Batin directly) introduces the unmentioned > "some will say" or, in Russian, deskat', and "they may be wrong" > (also the implied deskat' and what is implied by this deskat'). > What Baxtin means is a > word (or a whole discourse) ironically divested of its original > meaning by its new context. This may be too long, but show me a > good existent translation of Baxtin's chuzhoe slovo. All this > considered, I think the best of the available would be COUNTER- > DISCOURSE-discourse. Nowadays it is fashionable to talk about > discourse in terms of physics or political science -- in the > plural, as mutually antagonizing forces. Using this word (counter- > discourse) will remind to the reader how much this fad owes to > Baxtin's original ear and coining language. I think this reminder > is worth a lot. > o.m. > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Lily Alexander > Date: Saturday, May 26, 2007 2:50 am > Subject: [SEELANGS] Protivoslovo > > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > Rereading yesterday Bakhtin, I ran into "protivoslovo." > > > > I am surprised that I did not come across any attempts of its > > theorization.Of course Bakhtin invented many words, but this one > > may have slipped > > through undiscussed. It is used in his "Marxism and the > Philosophy > > of > > Language." > > > > As with all of his invented words (or reinvented), it is more > than > > what > > just meets the eye. It certainly will be more than just > > "vozrazhenie," > > counter argument, etc. > > Slovo also connotes tale, myth, even epos, so it might have an > > extended > > meaning beyond "word." But of course, for starters, "word" and > > "utterance" would be the subject of his discussion. > > > > I have two questions. Have anyone seen or read (or written!) any > > theoretical work discussing it as a term or concept? I saw in > one > > semiotic paper - it was mentioned in passing. > > > > How to translate it? > > Trying to translate it, I came up with "antiword" (like > > antiworld), or > > "counterword" (like counter-culture). I saw "counterword" used > in > > an > > article in an journal on aesthetics simply as "vozrazhenie." It > is > > also > > interesting what both (or any other possible) translations would > > connote > > in English. > > > > Antiword is part of the software engineering vocabulary. > > Counterword is > > translated in Multitran - definitely far from what Bakhtin > meant. > > See below: > > > > Counterword > > ??????????????????? ????? > > ; ???????????? > > ?????????? > > ????? ?? ??????? ?????????-?????????? ????????? > > > > > > 1) a desemantized word, 2) an emotionally colored word with > faded > > [objective-logical] meaning > > > > This will be something fossilized - exactly the opposite to what > > was > > meant by Bakhtin, as "I am feeling" :-) > > Bakhtin was rarely interested in anything "stertoe," but rather > of > > the > > the things that "stick out." > > > > Slovo provokes protivoslovo in his context. This would be more > > along the > > lines of passionate counterargument. Something polyarnoe in a > > dialoical > > context, coming out of opposition or provocation and stimulated > by > > debate. > > Any thoughts? > > > > Thanks you. > > > > Lily Alexander > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > ------ > > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the > SEELANGS > > Web Interface at: > > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > ------ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Sat May 26 14:23:57 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 10:23:57 -0400 Subject: Protivoslovo In-Reply-To: <465802CC.80600@utoronto.ca> Message-ID: Lily Alexander wrote: > Dear Colleagues, > > Rereading yesterday Bakhtin, I ran into "protivoslovo." > > I am surprised that I did not come across any attempts of its theorization. > Of course Bakhtin invented many words, but this one may have slipped > through undiscussed. It is used in his "Marxism and the Philosophy of > Language." > > As with all of his invented words (or reinvented), it is more than what > just meets the eye. It certainly will be more than just "vozrazhenie," > counter argument, etc. > Slovo also connotes tale, myth, even epos, so it might have an extended > meaning beyond "word." But of course, for starters, "word" and > "utterance" would be the subject of his discussion. > ... > > Slovo provokes protivoslovo in his context. This would be more along the > lines of passionate counterargument. Something polyarnoe in a dialoical > context, coming out of opposition or provocation and stimulated by debate. > > Any thoughts? "Word/antiword" doesn't really work for me because it's too narrow, too specific, so my immediate reaction was to look for something broader, something that would denote an activity or practice rather than a small piece of the result. And of course I thought immediately of "speech," recalling the phrase "свобода слова." Then "speech/counterspeech" could work. I'm sympathetic to the "discourse/counterdiscourse" suggestion, but it strikes me initially as esoteric or even arcane (is that what you're aiming for?) But I'm no philosopher or Bakhtin expert, so take this with a grain of salt. -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Sat May 26 15:57:13 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 08:57:13 -0700 Subject: Protivoslovo Message-ID: Why I think counter-discourse may work: It is really important to be aware of Bakhtin's meanings: his words are his own sets of terminology by which he means something very specific. This is the reason that protivoslovo will never be the same as vozrazhenie: vozrazhenie is a rejoinder in a chronologically laid-out discussion or argument, or even a fight. Protivoslovo is quoting a vozrazhenie in your own vozrazhenie to it--a world of difference. Similarly, dialogue in our sense of the word is a consecutive sequence of rejoinders, while in Bakhtin's sense, it is a bunch of voices embedded in the same speech and often simultaneously. That is the reason counterdiscourse may sound appropriate: discourse seems more embedded and less consecutively arranged than word. Incidentally, in 19th C. Russian. vozrazhenie just meant a rejoinder, not necessarily an objection or anything of the sort. Counterdiscourse is no more arcane than discourse, and as of today, both are no longer the same as speech or word: more idiosyncratic than the former and broader than the latter. Neither are they even the same as either langue or parole. Bakhtin's case is as complex as any in translation: on top of knowing the language (Russian), of knowing the idiolect of the author as compared to the sociolect at large, of being apt and flexible in the target language (English), the translator also has to understand and intellectually respect what the author actually means. English is not my native language, but as for Russain, I can vouch that vozrazhenie and protivoslovo are nothing alike. Just as Bakhtinian dialogue is not the same as Socratic or a dialogue in a play or in the pedestrian use of the word. This I know as a Bakhtin specialist, when it comes to Bakhtin's relevance for Dostoevsky. Caryl Emerson is not bad with equivalents but sometimes those of us who know both Russian and Bakhtin must address such problems without her help, and that is not her fault but results from the nature of trendy words in English. They begin to be used pretensiously and "trendily" but ultimately, in their pedestrian meaning. For exam ple, when a non-Bakhtinian hears the words "Dialogic imagination", s/he may believe that the meaning of these words is obvious--an imagination that presents verbal reality as a series of rejoinders in what one sees as a dialogue, say, in a play. I have seen such terminological abuse often enough to suggest that Caryl is right in sometimes trying to invent a relatively arcane term in English to avoid the wrong associations. To me. the greatest analogy to protivoslovo is a counter-force, what we call a kontr-fors in architecture, or a podpruzhnaia arka: these things counter the main force AS AND WHEN it is in operation, not afterwards. That is why I think counter-discourse may actually work. Side from which, chuzhoe slovo in Bakhtin is very similar to chuzhaia rach', and in English both are often rendered as double-/pseudo-indirect DISCOURSE, as they are, incidentally, in French. In German, it is erlebte Rede (more analogous to rech'/speech) but still close enough to recognize as a related phenomenon to a literary theorist and even perhaps a linguist. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul B. Gallagher" Date: Saturday, May 26, 2007 7:23 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Protivoslovo > Lily Alexander wrote: > > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > Rereading yesterday Bakhtin, I ran into "protivoslovo." > > > > I am surprised that I did not come across any attempts of its > theorization.> Of course Bakhtin invented many words, but this one > may have slipped > > through undiscussed. It is used in his "Marxism and the > Philosophy of > > Language." > > > > As with all of his invented words (or reinvented), it is more > than what > > just meets the eye. It certainly will be more than just > "vozrazhenie," > > counter argument, etc. > > Slovo also connotes tale, myth, even epos, so it might have an > extended > > meaning beyond "word." But of course, for starters, "word" and > > "utterance" would be the subject of his discussion. > > ... > > > > Slovo provokes protivoslovo in his context. This would be more > along the > > lines of passionate counterargument. Something polyarnoe in a > dialoical > > context, coming out of opposition or provocation and stimulated > by debate. > > > > Any thoughts? > > "Word/antiword" doesn't really work for me because it's too > narrow, too > specific, so my immediate reaction was to look for something > broader, > something that would denote an activity or practice rather than a > small > piece of the result. And of course I thought immediately of > "speech," > recalling the phrase "??????? ?????." Then "speech/counterspeech" > could > work. I'm sympathetic to the "discourse/counterdiscourse" > suggestion, > but it strikes me initially as esoteric or even arcane (is that > what > you're aiming for?) > > But I'm no philosopher or Bakhtin expert, so take this with a > grain of salt. > > -- > War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. > -- > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From w2mukher at YAHOO.COM Sat May 26 17:36:14 2007 From: w2mukher at YAHOO.COM (Ani Mukherji) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 12:36:14 -0500 Subject: Seeking Apartment in Moscow, 1 July 2007-June 2008 Message-ID: I am seeking a 1-bedroom furnished apartment in Moscow for twelve months, from 1 July 2007 until next June. If anyone knows of an apartment opening up, please contact me off-list at w2mukher at yahoo.com. I am also willing to consider apartments for shorter periods (though no less than three months--I don't want to move too often!) if a good sublet situation is available. Many thanks, Ani Ani Mukherji Department of American Civilization Brown University ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Philippe.FRISON at COE.INT Sat May 26 18:13:13 2007 From: Philippe.FRISON at COE.INT (FRISON Philippe) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 20:13:13 +0200 Subject: RE: [SEELANGS] Protivoslovo Message-ID: Would it be possible to get the word "protivoslovo' in a Bakhtin' context ? (quote please) Would the latin expression 'a contrario' be of any use in this context? Philippe Frison (Strasbourg, France) ________________________________ De: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list de la part de Olga Meerson Date: sam. 26/05/2007 17:57 À: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Objet : Re: [SEELANGS] Protivoslovo Why I think counter-discourse may work: It is really important to be aware of Bakhtin's meanings: his words are his own sets of terminology by which he means something very specific. This is the reason that protivoslovo will never be the same as vozrazhenie: vozrazhenie is a rejoinder in a chronologically laid-out discussion or argument, or even a fight. Protivoslovo is quoting a vozrazhenie in your own vozrazhenie to it--a world of difference. Similarly, dialogue in our sense of the word is a consecutive sequence of rejoinders, while in Bakhtin's sense, it is a bunch of voices embedded in the same speech and often simultaneously. That is the reason counterdiscourse may sound appropriate: discourse seems more embedded and less consecutively arranged than word. Incidentally, in 19th C. Russian. vozrazhenie just meant a rejoinder, not necessarily an objection or anything of the sort. Counterdiscourse is no more arcane than discourse, and as of today, both are no longer the same as speech or word: more idiosyncratic than the former and broader than the latter. Neither are they even the same as either langue or parole. Bakhtin's case is as complex as any in translation: on top of knowing the language (Russian), of knowing the idiolect of the author as compared to the sociolect at large, of being apt and flexible in the target language (English), the translator also has to understand and intellectually respect what the author actually means. English is not my native language, but as for Russain, I can vouch that vozrazhenie and protivoslovo are nothing alike. Just as Bakhtinian dialogue is not the same as Socratic or a dialogue in a play or in the pedestrian use of the word. This I know as a Bakhtin specialist, when it comes to Bakhtin's relevance for Dostoevsky. Caryl Emerson is not bad with equivalents but sometimes those of us who know both Russian and Bakhtin must address such problems without her help, and that is not her fault but results from the nature of trendy words in English. They begin to be used pretensiously and "trendily" but ultimately, in their pedestrian meaning. For exam ple, when a non-Bakhtinian hears the words "Dialogic imagination", s/he may believe that the meaning of these words is obvious--an imagination that presents verbal reality as a series of rejoinders in what one sees as a dialogue, say, in a play. I have seen such terminological abuse often enough to suggest that Caryl is right in sometimes trying to invent a relatively arcane term in English to avoid the wrong associations. To me. the greatest analogy to protivoslovo is a counter-force, what we call a kontr-fors in architecture, or a podpruzhnaia arka: these things counter the main force AS AND WHEN it is in operation, not afterwards. That is why I think counter-discourse may actually work. Side from which, chuzhoe slovo in Bakhtin is very similar to chuzhaia rach', and in English both are often rendered as double-/pseudo-indirect DISCOURSE, as they are, incidentally, in French. In German, it is erlebte Rede (more analogous to rech'/speech) but still close enough to recognize as a related phenomenon to a literary theorist and even perhaps a linguist. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: "Paul B. Gallagher" Date: Saturday, May 26, 2007 7:23 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] Protivoslovo > Lily Alexander wrote: > > > Dear Colleagues, > > > > Rereading yesterday Bakhtin, I ran into "protivoslovo." > > > > I am surprised that I did not come across any attempts of its > theorization.> Of course Bakhtin invented many words, but this one > may have slipped > > through undiscussed. It is used in his "Marxism and the > Philosophy of > > Language." > > > > As with all of his invented words (or reinvented), it is more > than what > > just meets the eye. It certainly will be more than just > "vozrazhenie," > > counter argument, etc. > > Slovo also connotes tale, myth, even epos, so it might have an > extended > > meaning beyond "word." But of course, for starters, "word" and > > "utterance" would be the subject of his discussion. > > ... > > > > Slovo provokes protivoslovo in his context. This would be more > along the > > lines of passionate counterargument. Something polyarnoe in a > dialoical > > context, coming out of opposition or provocation and stimulated > by debate. > > > > Any thoughts? > > "Word/antiword" doesn't really work for me because it's too > narrow, too > specific, so my immediate reaction was to look for something > broader, > something that would denote an activity or practice rather than a > small > piece of the result. And of course I thought immediately of > "speech," > recalling the phrase "??????? ?????." Then "speech/counterspeech" > could > work. I'm sympathetic to the "discourse/counterdiscourse" > suggestion, > but it strikes me initially as esoteric or even arcane (is that > what > you're aiming for?) > > But I'm no philosopher or Bakhtin expert, so take this with a > grain of salt. > > -- > War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. > -- > Paul B. Gallagher > pbg translations, inc. > "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" > http://pbg-translations.com > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ameliede at EARTHLINK.NET Sun May 27 05:21:44 2007 From: ameliede at EARTHLINK.NET (Jules Levin) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 22:21:44 -0700 Subject: of -ovich, et al. Message-ID: Dear colleagues, A question has again come up on another list, and I need to inform myself re the following questions: 1. When did the use of -(ov)ich/-ovna with patronymics become a) conventional, b) legally required for all ethnic Russians? 2. When, if different, did it become required for non-Russians of the Empire? 3. Was the use of -ov/-ova specifically as the patronymic EVER sanctioned/tolerated/found occasionally...in the "modern" Empire? 4. If you saw such a form in the hand-written "otchestvo" column of a local late 9th Century provincial tally of some sort, of ethnic non-Russians (Poles, Lithuanians, Jews, all identified as such), would your first assumption be a) actual use of -ov as a genuine patronymic, b) scribal confusion/error, c) other??? Thank you for any enlightenment on this topic. Jules Levin ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ameliede at EARTHLINK.NET Sun May 27 05:26:57 2007 From: ameliede at EARTHLINK.NET (Jules Levin) Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 22:26:57 -0700 Subject: of -ovich, et al. Correction In-Reply-To: Message-ID: At 10:21 PM 5/26/2007, I wrote: >4. If you saw such a form in the hand-written "otchestvo" column of >a local late 9th Century provincial tally of some sort, of ethnic >non-Russians (Poles, Lithuanians, Jews, all identified as such), >would your first assumption be a) actual use of -ov as a genuine >patronymic, b) scribal confusion/error, c) other??? Of course I intended to write "19th Century". sorry Jules Levin ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jacob.edmond at OTAGO.AC.NZ Sun May 27 22:44:33 2007 From: jacob.edmond at OTAGO.AC.NZ (Jacob Edmond) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 10:44:33 +1200 Subject: Russia issue of Landfall (New Zealand) In-Reply-To: Message-ID: New Zealand's longest running and best known journal of literature, arts and culture, Landfall, has just published a special issue devoted to Russia, which I have co-edited with Gregory O'Brien, Evgeny Pavlov and Ian Wedde. The issue includes previously un-translated poems by major Russian poets, and new essays and interviews by Russian writers relating to contemporary Russian literary culture. The Blue Noses (recently a topic of discussion on this list) also appear prominently in the issue. An announcement about the issue and details on how to order a copy appear below. Best wishes, Jacob Edmond Landfall 213: the 'Russia' issue A Russian anthology of New Zealand poetry, Land of Seas, was published in Moscow in 2005. Now New Zealand is reciprocating with a special issue of Landfall that includes contemporary Russian writing and art. Edited by Jacob Edmond, Gregory O'Brien, Evgeny Pavlov and Ian Wedde, the 'Russia' issue features a selection of previously untranslated works by contemporary Russian poets: Arkadii Dragomoshchenko, Anna Glazova, Dmitry Golynko, Alexei Parshchikov, Olga Sedakova, Alexandr Skidan, Viktor Sosnora. Many of these translations have been created by leading New Zealand poets working in collaboration with Edmond and Pavlov. The issue also features a wide range of writing on contemporary Russian literary and art cultures, economies and diasporas. As well as bringing Russian literature and art to New Zealand readers, the issue surveys the ways in which New Zealand writers have engaged-as travellers, readers and scholars-with Russia and its people. Landfall 213 also includes an account by the curator Marcus Williams of the Blue Noses, whose comic video satires were a highlight of the 2005 Venice Biennale and whose work is substantially represented here. Publication details Landfall 213 - Russia Editors: Jacob Edmond, Gregory O'Brien, Evgeny Pavlov, Ian Wedde Release: 24 May 2007. United Kingdom (RRP 14.50 pounds) Gazelle Book Services Limited White Cross Mills, High Town Lancaster. LA1 4XS. United Kingdom Ph: 0152468765 Fax: 0152463232 Email: Sales at gazellebooks.co.uk Website: www.gazellebooks.co.uk New Zealand and the Rest of the World (RRP $29.95 [NZ dollars]) Otago University Press P.O. Box 56, Dunedin Phone: 64 3 479 8807 Fax 64 3 479 8385 Email: university.press at otago.ac.nz Website: www.otago.ac.nz/press ________________________ Dr Jacob Edmond Senior Lecturer Department of English University of Otago PO Box 56, Dunedin 9054, New Zealand Office and street address: 1S3, 1st Floor, Arts Building, Albany St, Dunedin 9016, New Zealand Phone: +64 3 479 7969 Fax: +64 3 479 8558 jacob.edmond at otago.ac.nz http://www.otago.ac.nz/english/staff/edmond.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM Mon May 28 04:47:36 2007 From: kcf19 at DIAL.PIPEX.COM (Robert Chandler) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 05:47:36 +0100 Subject: Russia issue of Landfall (New Zealand) In-Reply-To: <000001c7a0b0$986cbda0$6466508b@jacobedmond> Message-ID: Dear Jacob Edmond, I live in the UK and would like to order 2 copies. What will that cost? Congratulations on what looks like something very interesting indeed! Yours, Robert Chandler > New Zealand's longest running and best known journal of literature, arts and > culture, Landfall, has just published a special issue devoted to Russia, > which I have co-edited with Gregory O'Brien, Evgeny Pavlov and Ian Wedde. > The issue includes previously un-translated poems by major Russian poets, > and new essays and interviews by Russian writers relating to contemporary > Russian literary culture. The Blue Noses (recently a topic of discussion on > this list) also appear prominently in the issue. An announcement about the > issue and details on how to order a copy appear below. > Best wishes, > Jacob Edmond > > Landfall 213: the 'Russia' issue > > A Russian anthology of New Zealand poetry, Land of Seas, was published in > Moscow in 2005. Now New Zealand is reciprocating with a special issue of > Landfall that includes contemporary Russian writing and art. > > Edited by Jacob Edmond, Gregory O'Brien, Evgeny Pavlov and Ian Wedde, the > 'Russia' issue features a selection of previously untranslated works by > contemporary Russian poets: Arkadii Dragomoshchenko, Anna Glazova, Dmitry > Golynko, Alexei Parshchikov, Olga Sedakova, Alexandr Skidan, Viktor Sosnora. > Many of these translations have been created by leading New Zealand poets > working in collaboration with Edmond and Pavlov. The issue also features a > wide range of writing on contemporary Russian literary and art cultures, > economies and diasporas. > > As well as bringing Russian literature and art to New Zealand readers, the > issue surveys the ways in which New Zealand writers have engaged-as > travellers, readers and scholars-with Russia and its people. > > Landfall 213 also includes an account by the curator Marcus Williams of the > Blue Noses, whose comic video satires were a highlight of the 2005 Venice > Biennale and whose work is substantially represented here. > > Publication details > Landfall 213 - Russia > Editors: Jacob Edmond, Gregory O'Brien, Evgeny Pavlov, Ian Wedde > Release: 24 May 2007. > > United Kingdom (RRP 14.50 pounds) > Gazelle Book Services Limited > White Cross Mills, High Town > Lancaster. LA1 4XS. United Kingdom > Ph: 0152468765 > Fax: 0152463232 > Email: Sales at gazellebooks.co.uk > Website: www.gazellebooks.co.uk > > New Zealand and the Rest of the World (RRP $29.95 [NZ dollars]) > Otago University Press > P.O. Box 56, Dunedin > Phone: 64 3 479 8807 > Fax 64 3 479 8385 > Email: university.press at otago.ac.nz > Website: www.otago.ac.nz/press > > > ________________________ > > Dr Jacob Edmond > Senior Lecturer > Department of English > University of Otago > PO Box 56, Dunedin 9054, New Zealand > Office and street address: 1S3, 1st Floor, Arts Building, Albany St, Dunedin > 9016, New Zealand > Phone: +64 3 479 7969 > Fax: +64 3 479 8558 > jacob.edmond at otago.ac.nz > http://www.otago.ac.nz/english/staff/edmond.html > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From J.Dunn at SLAVONIC.ARTS.GLA.AC.UK Mon May 28 08:42:09 2007 From: J.Dunn at SLAVONIC.ARTS.GLA.AC.UK (John Dunn) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 10:42:09 +0200 Subject: of -ovich, et al. Message-ID: There is a partial answer to be found in L.M Shchetinin, Imena i nazvanija, Rostov-on-Don, 1968, pp. 98-100. He claims that the universal use of the patronymic in -(ov)ich was not established until after the October revolution. He also notes that Catherine the Great issued instructions about who was entitled to the full patronymic and that from Catherine's reign up to the revolution only those who held one of the one first five ranks in the tabel' o rangax were entitled to the full patronymic; ranks 6-8 got the 'short' patronymic in -ov and the rest were referred to by name and surname alone. Presumably that applied to official documents only (cf. Akakij Akakievich), but Shchetinin quotes from some late nineteenth-century knigi obyskov brachnyx, in which the officiating priest writes down names using the -ov patronymic, but which the participants sign using the full patronymic. This suggests that the answer to question 3 is 'yes' and to question 4 is (a). John Dunn. ,-----Original Message----- From: Jules Levin To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Date: Sat, 26 May 2007 22:21:44 -0700 Subject: [SEELANGS] of -ovich, et al. Dear colleagues, A question has again come up on another list, and I need to inform myself re the following questions: 1. When did the use of -(ov)ich/-ovna with patronymics become a) conventional, b) legally required for all ethnic Russians? 2. When, if different, did it become required for non-Russians of the Empire? 3. Was the use of -ov/-ova specifically as the patronymic EVER sanctioned/tolerated/found occasionally...in the "modern" Empire? 4. If you saw such a form in the hand-written "otchestvo" column of a local late 9th Century provincial tally of some sort, of ethnic non-Russians (Poles, Lithuanians, Jews, all identified as such), would your first assumption be a) actual use of -ov as a genuine patronymic, b) scribal confusion/error, c) other??? Thank you for any enlightenment on this topic. Jules Levin ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- John Dunn Honorary Research Fellow, SMLC (Slavonic Studies) University of Glasgow, Scotland Address: Via Carolina Coronedi Berti 6 40137 Bologna Italy Tel.: +39 051/1889 8661 e-mail: J.Dunn at slavonic.arts.gla.ac.uk johnanthony.dunn at fastwebnet.it ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM Mon May 28 11:10:41 2007 From: sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM (Benjamin Sher) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 07:10:41 -0400 Subject: Zhabotinsky's "Bednaia Sharlotta" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear friends: I've been searching in vain for a copy of Zhabotinsky's poema "Bednaia Sharlotta". I spent a good two hours searching in Russian on the Internet. Came across a lot of fascinating articles on Zhabotinsky and a few fragments from the poema, but I would like to find the complete work. The Moshkov library (www.lib.ru) has Zhabotinsky's prose works but not his poems. Can you help? Also any other poems by him. According to my findings, "Bednaia Sharlotta" was written originally in Russian (and not, e.g. in Yiddish or Hebrew) and was originally published, I think, in the St. Petersburg journal "Evreiskaia Zhizn'"of the early 1900's. Can you point me to a web site that might have a copy of these texts? Or, if you have access to it otherwise, would you consider sending me a copy by US Mail or by email attachment? Thank you. Benjamin -- Sher's Russian Web http://www.websher.net Benjamin Sher sher07 at mindspring.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From O.F.Boele at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL Mon May 28 11:20:40 2007 From: O.F.Boele at LET.LEIDENUNIV.NL (Boele, O.F.) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 13:20:40 +0200 Subject: Russian poetry and Rembrandt: Thanks! Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Many thanks to all of you who responded to my question about Rembrandt in Russian poetry. I have received many wonderful suggestions and references for which I'm truly grateful. I knew there must more than Brodsky, but the outcome of this query has surpassed all my expectations. Thanks once again for your interest and support! Otto Boele ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From gfowler at INDIANA.EDU Mon May 28 13:36:01 2007 From: gfowler at INDIANA.EDU (George Fowler) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 09:36:01 -0400 Subject: Call for Papers: volume on Viktor Pelevin Message-ID: I am posting this at the request of a colleague who is not a member of SEELangs. If you're interested, please reply to him directly, not to me and not to the list. George Fowler >Date: Sun, 27 May 2007 14:06:35 -0400 >From: "Nankov, Nikita Dimitrov" >To: gfowler at indiana.edu >Subject: please help with SEELNGS > >Dear Colleagues, > >As a co-editor of a book-length collection of articles and opinions on >the Russian postmodern writer Viktor Pelevin I’d like to invite you to >submit your materials to me. The collection is sponsored by several >Croatian institutions and will be published in Croatia, in Croatian >translation, in late 2007 or 2008. > >The materials we are looking for vary from strictly scholarly articles >to less formal reader's opinions and notes on Pelevin's writings. The >scholarly articles will be published in the book collection, and also >in Croatia's leading journal of literary and cultural criticism, >KNJIZEVNA SMOTRA. In this way, the articles will count as professional >publications as well. > >We don't have a set deadline at this point. However, as you know, the >sooner we receive your materials, the better. > >Please send your materials or questions to Nikita Nankov, >nnankov at indiana.edu or nnankov at auburn.edu. > >Sincerely, >Nikita Nankov >Auburn University ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From wfr at SAS.AC.UK Mon May 28 14:14:31 2007 From: wfr at SAS.AC.UK (William Ryan) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 15:14:31 +0100 Subject: of -ovich, et al. In-Reply-To: Message-ID: For a very useful exposition of the history of this see B. O. Unbegaun, Russian Surnames, Oxford, 1972, pt 1, ch. I, ii Patronymics, iii Patronymic surnames. Will Ryan Jules Levin wrote: > Dear colleagues, > A question has again come up on another list, and I need to inform > myself re the following questions: > > 1. When did the use of -(ov)ich/-ovna with patronymics become a) > conventional, b) legally required for all ethnic Russians? > > 2. When, if different, did it become required for non-Russians of the > Empire? > > 3. Was the use of -ov/-ova specifically as the patronymic EVER > sanctioned/tolerated/found occasionally...in the "modern" Empire? > > 4. If you saw such a form in the hand-written "otchestvo" column of a > local late 9th Century provincial tally of some sort, of ethnic > non-Russians (Poles, Lithuanians, Jews, all identified as such), would > your first assumption be a) actual use of -ov as a genuine patronymic, > b) scribal confusion/error, c) other??? > > Thank you for any enlightenment on this topic. > Jules Levin > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Emeritus Professor W. F. Ryan FBA, FSA Warburg Institute (School of Advanced Study, University of London) Woburn Square LONDON WC1H 0AB All postal, fax and telephone messages to: 120 Ridge Langley, South Croydon, Surrey, CR2 0AS telephone and fax: 020 8405 6610 from outside UK +44 20 8405 6610 ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From wm6 at UCHICAGO.EDU Mon May 28 14:42:11 2007 From: wm6 at UCHICAGO.EDU (w martin) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 09:42:11 -0500 Subject: UK Guardian: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia Message-ID: Apologies for the topical nature of this posting, but this may well be of concern to academics in Russia and has not been reported so far in major US newspapers: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia · Police watch as neo-Nazis attack protesters · MEPs among 30 detained by police as aggressors go free http://www.guardian.co.uk/russia/article/0,,2089413,00.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From shevelenko at MAIL.LANCK.NET Mon May 28 16:28:33 2007 From: shevelenko at MAIL.LANCK.NET (Irina Shevelenko) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 20:28:33 +0400 Subject: Assistant Program Manager, Smolny College Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, I post this job description in the hope that some of the list members may know potential candidates who might want to apply for this position. I would greatly appreciate your forwarding this posting to whoever you feel might be interested. Informal inquiries at billings at smolny.org (Bryan Billings, Program Manager). Irina Shevelenko Associate Dean of International Students, Smolny College, St. Petersburg ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ http://www.bard.edu/about/employment/employment/popup.php?listing_id=949732 Bard College Assistant Program Manager, Smolny College Employer Website: http://www.smolny.org/ The Assistant Program Manager for the Bard-Smolny Program is based at Smolny College of Liberal Arts in St. Petersburg, Russia and is employed by Bard College in Annandale, NY. The Assistant Program Manager (APM), under the supervision of the Program Manager based at Smolny, will actively contribute to the day-to-day administration of the North American student exchange programs run by The Institute for International Liberal Education at Bard College and Smolny College. The programs include academic study-abroad programs in the fall semester (late August - early January), spring semester (late January - early June), or entire academic year; as well as a summer language immersion program (mid-June through early August). The APM will be a full-time employee, expected to work normal business hours as well as some evenings and weekends The Bard-Smolny Assistant Program Manager's main duties and responsibilities will include: · Organizing and executing a cultural program to run parallel to the academic terms · Managing the host-family databank and assisting in the placement, coordination, and family relations aspects of student housing and home-stays; management of the housing of students in SPSU dormitories · Advising North American students on student activities and opportunities within Smolny; coordinating volunteer opportunities and internship resources · Managing the logistical aspects of program orientation three times each year · Assisting to help integrate students into life in St. Petersburg and at Smolny College; counseling students on various issues related to cultural differences and attending to student crises and sharing on-call duties with the Program Manager while students are in-country · Acting as a liaison between students, health-care professionals, and health insurance agents · Other duties and responsibilities as assigned by the Program Manager Requirements The ideal candidate will be a native Russian speaker who has studied for at least one year at a US college or university. A diplom (or B.A.) is required, as is a demonstrated understanding of and commitment to the ideals of a liberal arts education and the benefits of cross-cultural exchange. 1-2 years program administration experience is highly desired. Applicants should be very familiar with the city of St. Petersburg and prior work with tour groups is highly desirable. The incumbent should be able to travel to the US once each year for consultations with Bard staff. Application Process To apply for this position please forward cover letter, resume and the names and contact information of three references to: hr at bard.edu. Review of applications will begin immediately; start date is July 2, 2007. AA/EOE ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Kathleen.Evans-Romaine at ASU.EDU Mon May 28 20:51:40 2007 From: Kathleen.Evans-Romaine at ASU.EDU (Kathleen Evans-Romaine) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 13:51:40 -0700 Subject: Mead ladles Message-ID: Dear Colleagues: Below is a request we (and perhaps you too) recently received for information on mead ladles. If you have any leads for this person, please contact me off list and I will forward them. Thank you, Kathleen Evans-Romaine Research Administrator The Melikian Center: Russian, Eurasian, & East European Studies at Arizona State University Tempe, AZ 85287-4202 Tel. 480-965-5128; Fax 480-965-1700 http://melikian.asu.edu -- "I am interested at Slavic and Eastern European drinking vessels, or bowls in general, with the shape of a swimming bird or a boat. I am mainly interested at Slavic and Eastern European boat-shaped and swimming bird-shaped drinking vessels from the 1th century to 15th century, approximately. And, in relation to this subject, I have found some references which could be interesting for me: I have read that there is a type of Russian drinking vessels named Kovsh. In some places I have read that this object has the shape of a boat, and, in other places, the shape of a swimming bird. There are some images of this type of objects at the WEB Page http://www.novgorod.ru/city/history/ve/pattern_eng.php3?number=25. According to these images the Kovsh have the shape of a boat. But, by other hand, in the article "The Peasant House and Its Furnishings: Decorative Principles in Russian Folk Art", by Alison Hilton, I have read that the Kovshy are receptacles with the shape of a swimming bird, with the head and tail forming handles. I think that, anyway, these affirmations are not contradictory among them. By other hand, in a forum at the Web Page http://www.smpub.com/ubb/Forum7/HTML/000302.html I have read that "special names came into use for the different sorts of kovsh. There were piti, drinking kovshi, one to each guest; vynosny, larger kovshi for several persons; khoromnye, which belonged to the Imperial Court and bore an appropriate inscription. But the most important and best-known form of kovshi were the zhalovannye, or presentation kovshi which from the 16th century onwards were given by tsars and emperors for services rendered". In relation to the names I also have read that ". The types of kovshi varied from region to region and had various names (korets, nalevka, skopkar')". (But actually I am a little confused in relation to this subject because, first, I have not been able to find any reference to the terms piti, vynosny, khoromnyw, zhalovannye, korets, nalevka. And, secondly, in some places I have read that the skobkar is a bird-shaped bowl too but different to the Kovsh, and, in other places, I have read that the skobkar and the Kovsh are the same type of object...). I am very interested at these boat-shaped and/ or bird-shaped objects but, unfortunately, the references which I have been able to find until now, after a long time of research, are very brief. I think that, perhaps, my searches are not well orientated, and, by this reason, I beg your help with the hope of being able to clarify these doubts about these types of objects. I know that any word from you will be very important and enlightening for me, included a negative answer from you could help me. Please would you be so kind to say to me what you think about these objects?, please could you say to me if you know this type of drinking vessels and / or if you know any bibliographic reference about them? I have read that, in some Scandinavian rituals of Drinking a large bowl where bird-vessels floated was sometimes utilised. This ceremonial, generally in relation to the Ale Ritual, usually was celebrated in Funeral celebrations. I think that, also in East European medieval culture there was an extensive use of mead and ale as a religious ceremonial. Please would you be so kind to say to me if you know if this type of Slavic and Eastern European bird-shaped vessels were utilised in some ritual drinking similar to this Scandinavian ritual?. I think that it would not improbable because to the connections among the Slavic and Eastern European culture and Scandinavian culture in these centuries, but I have not been able to find any bibliographic reference about the Ritual Drinking in Slavic and East European during the medieval centuries. Please would you be so kind to say to me if you know any document or bibliographic reference about the use of boat-shaped and bird-shaped vessels in Slavic and Easter European countries during medieval centuries, or about medieval Rituals of Drink where these types of objects were utilised, or about Slavic and Eastern European medieval Rituals of Drink in general?. Please would you be so kind to say to me if you know any specialist in these subjects, or any Centre of Research, Institute, Academy or University where I could find any help in relation to that?. I have written to State Hermitage but I have not received any answer." ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From avs2120 at COLUMBIA.EDU Mon May 28 21:19:24 2007 From: avs2120 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Andrey Shcherbenok) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 01:19:24 +0400 Subject: UK Guardian: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia In-Reply-To: <20070528094211.ANM85363@m4500-03.uchicago.edu> Message-ID: I believe a certain reservation is needed here. What this Guardian article fails to take into account is that there is a fundamental difference in Russia between being gay (and socialize as gay) and having a gay pride parade in the center of Moscow. Just as the described events took place in Moscow, in St. Petersburg there was a festival of lesbian lyric poetry, widely advertised in popular magazines like "Time Out", and there was not a single problem with it (of course, Guardian is not going to report on that -- that does not support their idiosyncratic doctrine of Russia as prison). A lot of Russian public figures, especially in pop culture, are openly gay as well. What the violent anti-gay groups, whom the Guardian for some reason likes to indiscriminately call neo-Nazis (most of them were actually religious groups) object to is what they consider public display of obscenity and propaganda of homosexuality, not the fact of somebody being gay. One may consider that not quite enlightened position from the point of view of the cultures that are prepared to celebrate any identity as long as it is not really subversive, but it is still a far cry from calling Russia a scary place for somebody who is gay. Which, of course, does not excuse the police. Andrey Shcherbenok -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of w martin Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 6:42 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] UK Guardian: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia Apologies for the topical nature of this posting, but this may well be of concern to academics in Russia and has not been reported so far in major US newspapers: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia . Police watch as neo-Nazis attack protesters . MEPs among 30 detained by police as aggressors go free http://www.guardian.co.uk/russia/article/0,,2089413,00.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU Mon May 28 23:36:13 2007 From: Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU (Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 18:36:13 -0500 Subject: AATSEEL 2007 In-Reply-To: <1275.71.226.239.232.1175721366.squirrel@swatmail.swarthmore.edu> Message-ID: Dear Marina, I was wondering if you have heard from the AATSEEL about the proposed panel. Thanks. Yevgeny Slivkin ----- Original Message ----- From: mrojavi1 at SWARTHMORE.EDU Date: Wednesday, April 4, 2007 4:16 pm Subject: [SEELANGS] AATSEEL 2007 To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Dear ALL, > > I'm organizing a panel for AATSEEL 2007 in Chicago (Dec. 27- > 30) entitled “Grammatical gender as a source of > metaphorical thinking.” > > Here is the Panel Description: This panel will discuss the > significance of grammatical gender in the formation of > aesthetic perceptions. As a formal category, grammatical > gender in Slavic languages can be a source of metaphor in > poetry and folklore; it can also be a starting point for > lingua-cultural stereotypes, myths, and idols, etc. > > If someone is intersted in participation at this panel, > please send me your abstracts and I will submit them by > April 15. Please, let me know if you would like to > participate in this panel but can't submit an abstract by > this date. We can do it in August, however, I need to know > who will be participanting. > > Send you emails and abstracts to Marina Rojavin > > mrojavin at temple.edu > > With warm regards, > Marina > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From mrojavi1 at SWARTHMORE.EDU Tue May 29 00:14:43 2007 From: mrojavi1 at SWARTHMORE.EDU (mrojavi1 at SWARTHMORE.EDU) Date: Mon, 28 May 2007 20:14:43 -0400 Subject: AATSEEL 2007 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Yevgeniy, I was only notified that my abstract was accepted. They wrote that final panel assignments would be completed in early September--these are official words. I will ask them about the whole panel. Best, Marina On Mon, May 28, 2007 19:36, Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU wrote: > Dear Marina, > > I was wondering if you have heard from the AATSEEL about the proposed panel. > Thanks. > > Yevgeny Slivkin > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: mrojavi1 at SWARTHMORE.EDU > Date: Wednesday, April 4, 2007 4:16 pm > Subject: [SEELANGS] AATSEEL 2007 > To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > > >> Dear ALL, >> I'm organizing a panel for AATSEEL 2007 in Chicago (Dec. 27- >> 30) entitled “Grammatical gender as a source of >> metaphorical thinking.” >> Here is the Panel Description: This panel will discuss the >> significance of grammatical gender in the formation of >> aesthetic perceptions. As a formal category, grammatical >> gender in Slavic languages can be a source of metaphor in >> poetry and folklore; it can also be a starting point for >> lingua-cultural stereotypes, myths, and idols, etc. >> If someone is intersted in participation at this panel, >> please send me your abstracts and I will submit them by >> April 15. Please, let me know if you would like to >> participate in this panel but can't submit an abstract by >> this date. We can do it in August, however, I need to know >> who will be participanting. >> Send you emails and abstracts to Marina Rojavin >> mrojavin at temple.edu >> With warm regards, >> Marina >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- >> Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription >> options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: >> ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From padunov at PITT.EDU Tue May 29 08:03:20 2007 From: padunov at PITT.EDU (Padunov, Vladimir) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 04:03:20 -0400 Subject: KinoKultura: Romanian Issue Message-ID: After the victory of two Romanian feature films in the Cannes IFF on 27 May--Mungiu's 4 Months, 3 Days and 2 Hours taking the Golden Palm and Cristian Nemescu's California Dreamin receiving the award in the Certain Regard sidebar--KinoKultura proudly announces the launch of a special issue devoted to Romanian cinema, guest edited by Christina Stojanova and Dana Duma: http://www.kinokultura.com/specials/6/romanian.shtml The issue includes: Articles: Christina Stojanova and Dana Duma: The New Romanian Cinema: Editorial Remarks Calin Caliman: The New Waves of Romanian Cinema Mihai Chirilov: You Can Run, But You Cannot Hide: New Romanian Cinema Elena Dulgheru: Two Insights into the Romanian GULAG Dana Duma: Are We Still Laughing When Breaking With the Past? Petre Rado: A Little Bit of Patience Dominique Nasta: The Tough Road to Minimalism Adina Bradeanu: 'Death' and Documentary: Memory and Film Practice in Post-communist Romania Christina Stojanova: My Romanian Cinema Reviews: Andrei Cretulescu: Corneliu Porumboiu's 12:08 East of Bucharest and Alexandru Solomon's The Great Communist Bank Robbery Dana Duma: Cristi Puiu's The Death of Mr. Lazarescu Iulia Blaga: Radu Muntean's The Paper Will Be Blue Mihai Chirilov: Tudor Giurgiu's Love Sick Mihai Fulger: Tudor Giurgiu's Love Sick Birgit Beumers, University of Bristol Vladimir Padunov, University of Pittsburgh _________________________________________ Vladimir Padunov Associate Director, Film Studies Program Department of Slavic Languages and Literatures 427 Cathedral of Learning voice: 1-412-624-5713 University of Pittsburgh FAX: 1-412-624-9714 Pittsburgh, PA 15260 padunov at pitt.edu Russian Film Symposium http://www.rusfilm.pitt.edu KinoKultura http://www.kinokultura.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From kdianina at YAHOO.COM Tue May 29 10:13:28 2007 From: kdianina at YAHOO.COM (Katia Dianina) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 03:13:28 -0700 Subject: Moscow apartment or room needed Fall 07 In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Comrades, I'd like to rent a cheap apartment or room in Moscow for September through mid November. I don't smoke (but also don't take offense) and really don't require anything aside from the Soviet standard. Please contact me with any leads off list at . Thank you. Cheers, David Brandenberger ================== We are moving (again)! Please note new address, effective July 1, 2006: Katia Dianina dianina at post.harvard.edu 103 Village Court Charlottesville, VA 22903 434 293-9157 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From birgitbeumers at YAHOO.CO.UK Tue May 29 11:41:36 2007 From: birgitbeumers at YAHOO.CO.UK (Birgit Beumers) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 12:41:36 +0100 Subject: Kinokultura Special Issue on Romanian Cinema Message-ID: After the victory of two Romanian feature films in the Cannes IFF - Mungiu's Four Months, Three Days and Two Hours taking the Golden Palm and Cristian Nemescu's California Dreamin receiving the award in the Certain Regard sidebar, KinoKultura proudly announces the launch of a special issue devoted to Romanian cinema, guest edited by Christina Stojanova and Dana Duma The issue includes: Articles: Christina Stojanova and Dana Duma: The New Romanian Cinema: Editorial Remarks Calin Caliman: The New Waves of Romanian Cinema Mihai Chirilov: You Can Run, But You Cannot Hide: New Romanian Cinema Elena Dulgheru: Two Insights into the Romanian GULAG Dana Duma: Are We Still Laughing When Breaking With the Past? Petre Rado: A Little Bit of Patience Dominique Nasta: The Tough Road to Minimalism Adina Bradeanu: 'Death' and Documentary: Memory and Film Practice in Post-communist Romania Christina Stojanova: My Romanian Cinema Reviews: Andrei Cretulescu: Corneliu Porumboiu's 12:08 East of Bucharest and Alexandru Solomon's The Great Communist Bank Robbery Dana Duma: Cristi Puiu's The Death of Mr. Lazarescu Iulia Blaga: Radu Muntean's The Paper Will Be Blue Mihai Chirilov: Tudor Giurgiu's Love Sick Mihai Fulger: Tudor Giurgiu's Love Sick KiKu Editors Vladimir Padunov and Birgit Beumers Dr Birgit Beumers Department of Russian Studies University of Bristol 17 Woodland Road Bristol BS8 1TE United Kingdom Tel +44 117 928 7596 Editor, www.kinokultura.com Editor, Studies in Russian and Soviet Cinema --------------------------------- New Yahoo! Mail is the ultimate force in competitive emailing. Find out more at the Yahoo! Mail Championships. Plus: play games and win prizes. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From ah69 at COLUMBIA.EDU Tue May 29 15:12:00 2007 From: ah69 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Andy Hicks) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 10:12:00 -0500 Subject: Primary/Secondary School Reading Lists Message-ID: I would be grateful for any leads on the works of Russian/global literature that are currently assigned to pupils in Russian and Ukrainian schools. Please respond off list; I will post a summary of the responses later in the week. Best regards, Andy Hicks ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From trubikhina at AOL.COM Tue May 29 15:16:48 2007 From: trubikhina at AOL.COM (trubikhina at AOL.COM) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 11:16:48 -0400 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear colleagues, I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an undergraduate course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of our situation is that this is the only way at present time that we can quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women Studies and English). Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women studies component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th-century Russian Literature.  Women can be both authors (I am certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier to include the most important 20th-century male authors. I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work’s center, like, e.g., Blok’s Russia=eternal femininity concept). b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling such a dual purpose could use. I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, on or off the list, Julia ------------------- Julia Trubikhina Assistant Professor of Russian Russian Program Coordinator Department of Modern Languages and Literatures Montclair State University Dickson Hall, Room 138 Montclair, NJ 07043 ________________________________________________________________________ AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From nikma77 at MAIL.RU Tue May 29 16:06:02 2007 From: nikma77 at MAIL.RU (Nicole Mathys) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 18:06:02 +0200 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" Message-ID: Dear Julia, I'd suggest Nina Berberovas autobiography "Kursiv moi". There, she has big portrets about important writers 20th centuary, with which she met: Gor'kij, Bunin, Nabokov, Gipius, Cvetaeva, Akhmatova, Khodasevich, Belyj, Blok, Gumelev, and more else. Best wishes Nicole ----- Original Message ----- From: To: Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 5:16 PM Subject: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" Dear colleagues, I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an undergraduate course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of our situation is that this is the only way at present time that we can quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women Studies and English). Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women studies component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th-century Russian Literature.. Women can be both authors (I am certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier to include the most important 20th-century male authors. I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work’s center, like, e.g., Blok’s Russia=eternal femininity concept). b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling such a dual purpose could use. I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, on or off the list, Julia ------------------- Julia Trubikhina Assistant Professor of Russian Russian Program Coordinator Department of Modern Languages and Literatures Montclair State University Dickson Hall, Room 138 Montclair, NJ 07043 ________________________________________________________________________ AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rjs19 at COLUMBIA.EDU Tue May 29 16:25:32 2007 From: rjs19 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Rebecca Jane Stanton) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 12:25:32 -0400 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" In-Reply-To: <8C9701B83284F7A-122C-7B27@MBLK-M31.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Dear Julia, I'll throw my hat into the ring with some very, very perfunctory thoughts to which I'm sure others will add and which they may wish to debate or elaborate upon... First, about the "theoretical perspective," by which I imagine you mean an idea that nominally unifies the syllabus for the purposes of describing it in, say, a course catalogue: 20th-century Russia lends itself particularly nicely to this kind of inquiry because a "conscious" reconfiguration of gender roles was such an important part of official Soviet aesthetics, i.e. Socialist Realism, and literature worked actively on this problem of what the role (or roles) of women in modern life would/should look like. It seems to me that you can -- without throwing around too much heavy theory too early on in the game -- pitch the course as a literary investigation into this ongoing conversation about how the Revolution, and the subsequently evolving society, changed, was supposed to change, or might have changed, the lives of women. The recent "Art and Propaganda" exhibition at the German Historical Museum in Berlin had a room devoted to "The Individual and Society" that was replete with images and sculptures richly illustrating the "place" envisioned for women in interwar Russian, German, Italian and American society -- quicktime virtual-reality panorama here: http://www.dhm.de/pano/showpano.php?p=kunst-und-propaganda/Mensch01 (The index page for the whole exhibition, which I can't recommend highly enough, is here: http://www.dhm.de/ausstellungen/kunst-und-propaganda/english/einleitung.html ) Second, about specific works; again, this is very off-the-cuff but perhaps will serve as fuel for further discussion/ elaboration. And of course it all depends what you want to emphasize -- aesthetics, politics, history, one period versus another, etc. -- in addition to the female authors you already mentioned, how about Akhmadulina, Tolstaya, Petrushevskaya, Ulitskaya? (For some reason the first names that come to mind for me are primarily either poets or late-/post-Soviet writers.) -- if you plan to subject the students to Socialist Realism or its early models, Gladkov's "Cement" is particularly rich in female characters who force the "normative" male character, Gleb, to reconfigure his worldview quite radically. That is, there's a lot of active, if not necessarily productive, thinking about what the heck women are supposed to be or "mean" in the society that postcedes the Civil War. -- no survey of 20th-century Russian lit. is complete without some example of camp literature, and you could use (all or parts of) Evgeniia Ginzburg's "Krutoi marshrut" for this. (You could even juxtapose it with "Ivan Denisovich" if you need the "draw" of Solzhenitsyn's name for craven marketing purposes, and there is some intellectual value to this proposition as well since the all-male universe Solzhenitsyn depicts is a deeply problematic one -- not just for that reason, of course.) -- finally, the female characters in Bulgakov's "Master and Margarita" and Pasternak's "Doctor Zhivago" serve as active and busy counterparts to passive, rather helpless male heroes, and both novels also happen to be somewhat radical rewritings of the eternal 19th-century "adulteress" plot, as well as monuments of 20th-century Russian literature in their own right. I would definitely include those. all the best, RJS -- Rebecca Stanton Assistant Professor of Russian Dept. of Slavic Languages Barnard College, Columbia University 3009 Broadway New York, NY 10027 (212) 854-3133 http://www.columbia.edu/~rjs19 trubikhina at AOL.COM wrote: > Dear colleagues, > >I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an undergraduate course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of our situation is that this is the only way at present time that we can quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women Studies and English). >Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women studies component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th-century Russian Literature. Women can be both authors (I am certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier to include the most important 20th-century male authors. > >I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions >a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work’s center, like, e.g., Blok’s Russia=eternal femininity concept). >b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling such a dual purpose could use. > >I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, on or off the list, > >Julia > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Tue May 29 16:27:32 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 09:27:32 -0700 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" Message-ID: Woman's points of view in a male author: Detstvo Liuvers, Women writers of prose: Evgeniia Ginzburg's and Nadezhda Mandel'stam's memoirs. More later. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: trubikhina at AOL.COM Date: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 8:16 am Subject: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > Dear colleagues, > > I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful > suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an undergraduate > course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of our > situation is that this is the only way at present time that we can > quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we > sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on > the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women Studies > and English). > Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women studies > component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th- > century Russian Literature.  Women can be both authors (I am > certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) > and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier to > include the most important 20th-century male authors. > > I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions > a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three > women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights > of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women > characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work’s > center, like, e.g., Blok’s Russia=eternal femininity concept). > b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling > such a dual purpose could use. > > I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, on > or off the list, > > Julia > > > > > > > > ------------------- > Julia Trubikhina > > Assistant Professor of Russian > Russian Program Coordinator > Department of Modern Languages and Literatures > Montclair State University > Dickson Hall, Room 138 > Montclair, NJ 07043 > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's > free from AOL at AOL.com. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From laura.osterman at COLORADO.EDU Tue May 29 17:47:39 2007 From: laura.osterman at COLORADO.EDU (Laura Osterman) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 11:47:39 -0600 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" In-Reply-To: <21660920f733.20f733216609@imap.georgetown.edu> Message-ID: In addition to what others have recommended: For the poets, working in translation is always a problem. I use Akhmatova's "Requiem" and Tsvetaeva's "My Mother and Music," both of which work well in translation (of course with explanations in class of what does not come across in the translation). Natalia Baranskaya's "A Week Like Any Other" works well for the Brezhnev period. Students appreciate the text's immediacy and the way it hints at what many American students consider a feminist perspective. I also spotlight prostitution in the glasnost period, using Galina Scherbakova's "The Three Loves of Masha Peredreeva" and the film Intergirl. Earlier in the semester we have read Kollontai's "Sisters" so that becomes a theme linking NEP and glasnost. In connection with prostitution we discuss women's agency, the link between sexuality and identity, and the marketplace/capitalism. For a historical perspective Barbara Engel's book Women in Russia works well read alongside the literature. Good luck! --Laura Laura Olson Osterman Associate Professor of Russian Dept. of Germanic and Slavic Univ. of Colorado 276 UCB, McKenna 129 Boulder, CO 80309-0276 (303) 492-7729 dept. (303) 492-7404 fax (303) 492-5376 -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Olga Meerson Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:28 AM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" Woman's points of view in a male author: Detstvo Liuvers, Women writers of prose: Evgeniia Ginzburg's and Nadezhda Mandel'stam's memoirs. More later. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: trubikhina at AOL.COM Date: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 8:16 am Subject: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > Dear colleagues, > > I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful > suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an undergraduate > course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of our > situation is that this is the only way at present time that we can > quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we > sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on > the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women Studies > and English). > Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women studies > component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th- > century Russian Literature. Women can be both authors (I am > certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) > and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier to > include the most important 20th-century male authors. > > I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions > a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three > women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights > of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women > characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work's > center, like, e.g., Blok's Russia=eternal femininity concept). > b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling > such a dual purpose could use. > > I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, on > or off the list, > > Julia > > > > > > > > ------------------- > Julia Trubikhina > > Assistant Professor of Russian > Russian Program Coordinator > Department of Modern Languages and Literatures > Montclair State University > Dickson Hall, Room 138 > Montclair, NJ 07043 > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________ > AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's > free from AOL at AOL.com. > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Tue May 29 17:53:13 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 13:53:13 -0400 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" In-Reply-To: <8C9701B83284F7A-122C-7B27@MBLK-M31.sysops.aol.com> Message-ID: Maybe I missed it, and it was already mentioned: Helena Goscilo has edited a number of books on Russian women writers; the books and the preface are worth looking at as a starting point for anyone working in the are. Another book/person is Catriona Kelly. She has a long list of names and works, and it would help anyone to create their own perspective on the subject. And while I am at it, let me add my three favorite (women) writers, at least one of whom has been neglected in the West: Ulickaja, Katerli and Shcherbakova. Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From iamlearningenglish at GMAIL.COM Tue May 29 18:34:46 2007 From: iamlearningenglish at GMAIL.COM (Dustin Hosseini) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 13:34:46 -0500 Subject: UK Guardian: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia Message-ID: I believe it is difficult to merit those public figures who say that they are gay when most of them do nothing to advance the gay movement here. Entertainment figures have a reasonable "excuse" to be gay, but the average Vova doesn't necessarily have that right or priveledge to be himself, gay or bisexual, and be open about it without facing certain pressures. However, there is hope... according to one news source, the city of Ufa, the capital of Bashkiriya, has given the green light to hold a parade in October 2007. We'll see what happens. As far as the latest failed gay pride parade, those anti-parade protesters not only included religious groups - i.e. the Russian Orthodox Church - but also, according to one newsite, Caucasian people, skinheads, and nationalists. Doesn't this seem a bit strange? Skinheads and Caucasian people standing side by side, trying to defend Moscow from gay people? Luzhkov has gone a bit far by saying that as long as he's in office, he'll never let there be a gay parade. But to bring these thugs from afar to counteract the gays' parade... I don't have the facts to back that comment up, but I am sure if someone dug deep enough, they'd find the facts, and then be thrown into that grave with them... What strikes me as strange is that these protesters, especially the religious ones, find it perverse and satanic to have a gay parade and "advertise" it. But what about Russia's old issue with alcoholism? Why isn't it concidered perverse, satanic, and destructive to advertise beer, sell beer and vodka in every store and nearly every kiosk, and even to sell such items to underagers? My point? I think Russia has a lot more problems and issues to attend to, especially Moscow, than to focus its attention on the gays and their demands. While these people certainly deserve the same rights as anyone, Luzhkov and Moscow shouldn't waste their time trying to terrorize these people, thus stopping the parades. Why can't Luzhkov focus on other problems? Why waste so many resources on such a small problem? I suppose time will only tell. http://www.gazeta.ru/2007/05/15/oa_239183.shtml http://www.gazeta.ru/news/lastnews/2007/05/26/n_1073845.shtml http://www.gazeta.ru/2007/05/28/oa_240226.shtml =========== =========== =========== =========== I believe a certain reservation is needed here. What this Guardian article fails to take into account is that there is a fundamental difference in Russia between being gay (and socialize as gay) and having a gay pride parade in the center of Moscow. Just as the described events took place in Moscow, in St. Petersburg there was a festival of lesbian lyric poetry, widely advertised in popular magazines like "Time Out", and there was not a single problem with it (of course, Guardian is not going to report on that -- that does not support their idiosyncratic doctrine of Russia as prison). A lot of Russian public figures, especially in pop culture, are openly gay as well. What the violent anti-gay groups, whom the Guardian for some reason likes to indiscriminately call neo-Nazis (most of them were actually religious groups) object to is what they consider public display of obscenity and propaganda of homosexuality, not the fact of somebody being gay. One may consider that not quite enlightened position from the point of view of the cultures that are prepared to celebrate any identity as long as it is not really subversive, but it is still a far cry from calling Russia a scary place for somebody who is gay. Which, of course, does not excuse the police. Andrey Shcherbenok ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jwilson at SRAS.ORG Tue May 29 18:56:34 2007 From: jwilson at SRAS.ORG (Josh Wilson) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 22:56:34 +0400 Subject: UK Guardian: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia In-Reply-To: Message-ID: While this discussion is fascinating, I would also like to just interject that it is very much off-topic for this listserve. For those who would like to continue this conversation, may I invite you over to a wonderful discussion currently in progress involving educated (and not so educated) Russians and Westerners in a very useful Internet forum. http://www.redtape.ru/forum/showthread.php?t=2655 I'm currently there myself, taking part. Best, Josh Wilson Asst. Director The School of Russian and Asian Studies Editor-in-Chief Vestnik, The Journal of Russian and Asian Studies www.sras.org jwilson at sras.org -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of Dustin Hosseini Sent: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 10:35 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] UK Guardian: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia I believe it is difficult to merit those public figures who say that they are gay when most of them do nothing to advance the gay movement here. Entertainment figures have a reasonable "excuse" to be gay, but the average Vova doesn't necessarily have that right or priveledge to be himself, gay or bisexual, and be open about it without facing certain pressures. However, there is hope... according to one news source, the city of Ufa, the capital of Bashkiriya, has given the green light to hold a parade in October 2007. We'll see what happens. As far as the latest failed gay pride parade, those anti-parade protesters not only included religious groups - i.e. the Russian Orthodox Church - but also, according to one newsite, Caucasian people, skinheads, and nationalists. Doesn't this seem a bit strange? Skinheads and Caucasian people standing side by side, trying to defend Moscow from gay people? Luzhkov has gone a bit far by saying that as long as he's in office, he'll never let there be a gay parade. But to bring these thugs from afar to counteract the gays' parade... I don't have the facts to back that comment up, but I am sure if someone dug deep enough, they'd find the facts, and then be thrown into that grave with them... What strikes me as strange is that these protesters, especially the religious ones, find it perverse and satanic to have a gay parade and "advertise" it. But what about Russia's old issue with alcoholism? Why isn't it concidered perverse, satanic, and destructive to advertise beer, sell beer and vodka in every store and nearly every kiosk, and even to sell such items to underagers? My point? I think Russia has a lot more problems and issues to attend to, especially Moscow, than to focus its attention on the gays and their demands. While these people certainly deserve the same rights as anyone, Luzhkov and Moscow shouldn't waste their time trying to terrorize these people, thus stopping the parades. Why can't Luzhkov focus on other problems? Why waste so many resources on such a small problem? I suppose time will only tell. http://www.gazeta.ru/2007/05/15/oa_239183.shtml http://www.gazeta.ru/news/lastnews/2007/05/26/n_1073845.shtml http://www.gazeta.ru/2007/05/28/oa_240226.shtml =========== =========== =========== =========== I believe a certain reservation is needed here. What this Guardian article fails to take into account is that there is a fundamental difference in Russia between being gay (and socialize as gay) and having a gay pride parade in the center of Moscow. Just as the described events took place in Moscow, in St. Petersburg there was a festival of lesbian lyric poetry, widely advertised in popular magazines like "Time Out", and there was not a single problem with it (of course, Guardian is not going to report on that -- that does not support their idiosyncratic doctrine of Russia as prison). A lot of Russian public figures, especially in pop culture, are openly gay as well. What the violent anti-gay groups, whom the Guardian for some reason likes to indiscriminately call neo-Nazis (most of them were actually religious groups) object to is what they consider public display of obscenity and propaganda of homosexuality, not the fact of somebody being gay. One may consider that not quite enlightened position from the point of view of the cultures that are prepared to celebrate any identity as long as it is not really subversive, but it is still a far cry from calling Russia a scary place for somebody who is gay. Which, of course, does not excuse the police. Andrey Shcherbenok ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From yfurman at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU Wed May 30 05:07:48 2007 From: yfurman at HUMNET.UCLA.EDU (Furman, Yelena) Date: Tue, 29 May 2007 22:07:48 -0700 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" Message-ID: I second Alina Israeli's suggestion re: Helena Goscilo's work in this regard. I particularly recommend looking at her Dehexing Sex: Russian Womanhood During and After Glasnost' and her edited collection, Fruits of Her Plume. Both are invaluable resources and discuss a lot of specific Russian women writers. In my 20th century course - a general course with a women writers component - we are reading Petrushevskaia's Time: Night and short stories by Ulitskaia. In my contemporary Russian women's fiction course, which obviously goes more in-depth on this subject, we also read Valeriia Narbikova, Yuliya Voznesenskaia, Marina Palei, and Svetlana Vasilenko. All of these are obviously glasnost'/post-Soviet writers; given that this period witnessed a veritable explosion of women's writing, it seems fitting that so many suggestions for readings come from this time. If you want further suggestions, I would be more than happy to discuss them off list (yfurman at humnet.ucla.edu). Best, Lena ________________________________ From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list on behalf of trubikhina at AOL.COM Sent: Tue 5/29/2007 8:16 AM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" Dear colleagues, I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an undergraduate course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of our situation is that this is the only way at present time that we can quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women Studies and English). Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women studies component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th-century Russian Literature. Women can be both authors (I am certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier to include the most important 20th-century male authors. I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work's center, like, e.g., Blok's Russia=eternal femininity concept). b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling such a dual purpose could use. I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, on or off the list, Julia ------------------- Julia Trubikhina Assistant Professor of Russian Russian Program Coordinator Department of Modern Languages and Literatures Montclair State University Dickson Hall, Room 138 Montclair, NJ 07043 ________________________________________________________________________ AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rjs19 at COLUMBIA.EDU Wed May 30 12:50:22 2007 From: rjs19 at COLUMBIA.EDU (Rebecca Jane Stanton) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 08:50:22 -0400 Subject: Query: history of Ukr. and Cz. orthography Message-ID: Dear SEELANGtsy, a colleague (in Yiddish) asks: > Can you recommend a reading about the history of Ukrainian > orthography, preferably in a Latin-lettered language? I want to know > something about early 20th century debates about language > standardization in order to compare the case with Yiddish. If you can > happen to be able to recommend something about Czech too, I'd be much > obliged. Not being a linguist, I thought I'd turn to the SEELANGS hive mind for suggestions. Any ideas? (By Latin-lettered language, he means English, French, or German, but Russian would also work in a pinch.) many thanks, RJS ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From E.F.Lygo at EXETER.AC.UK Wed May 30 12:56:50 2007 From: E.F.Lygo at EXETER.AC.UK (Emily Lygo) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 13:56:50 +0100 Subject: Call for Papers Message-ID: Call for papers: Pushkin's Post-horses. A Conference on Literary Translation in Russian Culture 14-15 April 2008 at the University of Exeter, Devon, UK In 1830 Pushkin described literary translators as the 'post-horses of enlightenment' - an image of unacknowledged toilers in the service of bringing to Russia education and culture from the rest of the world. Translation has consistently provided a channel for the introduction to Russia of new ideas and trends in literature and the arts. In Russia, translators have pursued their profession for myriad reasons: from a belief in the transformation and westernisation of Russian culture, to an avoidance of the overtly political agenda of Soviet literary publishing, to the market incentives provided by translating potboilers and pulp fiction in post-Soviet Russia. This conference will examine the position and significance of translation and translators across Russian and Soviet history. Topics might concern but are not confined to the following areas: The impact of translation on Russian literature in any period The politics of translation within Russia and/or the USSR Theories of translation in Russia Translation and censorship Translation from a particular language or region into Russian Individual translators' lives and work All enquiries or abstracts should be addressed to Emily Lygo (E.F.Lygo at ex.ac.uk) no later than 1st October 2007 Dr Emily Lygo Lecturer in Russian University of Exeter The Queen's Building The Queen's Drive Exeter EX4 4QH UK 01392 264311 ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rar at SLAVIC.UMASS.EDU Wed May 30 13:54:17 2007 From: rar at SLAVIC.UMASS.EDU (Robert A. Rothstein) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 09:54:17 -0400 Subject: Query: history of Ukr. and Cz. orthography In-Reply-To: <465D730E.9060807@columbia.edu> Message-ID: Rebecca Jane Stanton wrote: > Dear SEELANGtsy, > > a colleague (in Yiddish) asks: > >> Can you recommend a reading about the history of Ukrainian >> orthography, preferably in a Latin-lettered language? I want to know >> something about early 20th century debates about language >> standardization in order to compare the case with Yiddish. If you can >> happen to be able to recommend something about Czech too, I'd be much >> obliged. > If your colleague can find someone to translate a few pages of Czech (also a Latin-lettered language!), there is relevant information on both Ukrainian and Czech, as well as the other Slavic languages, in _Slovanske spisovne jazyky v dobe pritomne_ (diacritics omitted), edited by Milos Weingart (Prague: Melantrich, 1937). If Polish is of any interest, there's also a paper of mine, “Spelling and Society: the Polish Orthographic Controversy of the 1930's,” in _Papers in Slavic Philology_ 1, ed. Benjamin A. Stolz (Ann Arbor: Michigan Slavic Publications, 1977), pp. 225-36. Bob Rothstein ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Wed May 30 14:40:40 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 07:40:40 -0700 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" Message-ID: Iulechka, another thing: I have not suggested any later Russian women writers because I felt they were a fixture. Others' suggestiosn have confirmed. A particular story by Ulitskaia can also be good for a complex representation of a woman's vision in Russia: "Pikovaia dama". Her long novel Kazus Kukotskogo is important for both all of Soviet History AND the key feminist issues, e.g., abortion, contraseprives, childbirth, sore spots surrounding those within a family framework, etc. The movie was even better than the book--a bit less repetitive and stylistically purer. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Olga Meerson Date: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 9:27 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > Woman's points of view in a male author: Detstvo Liuvers, > Women writers of prose: Evgeniia Ginzburg's and Nadezhda > Mandel'stam's memoirs. More later. > o.m. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: trubikhina at AOL.COM > Date: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 8:16 am > Subject: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > > > Dear colleagues, > > > > I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful > > suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an > undergraduate > > course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of > our > > situation is that this is the only way at present time that we > can > > quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we > > sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on > > the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women > Studies > > and English). > > Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women > studies > > component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th- > > century Russian Literature.  Women can be both authors (I am > > certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) > > and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier > to > > include the most important 20th-century male authors. > > > > I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions > > a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three > > women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights > > of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women > > characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work’s > > center, like, e.g., Blok’s Russia=eternal femininity concept). > > b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling > > such a dual purpose could use. > > > > I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, > on > > or off the list, > > > > Julia > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------- > > Julia Trubikhina > > > > Assistant Professor of Russian > > Russian Program Coordinator > > Department of Modern Languages and Literatures > > Montclair State University > > Dickson Hall, Room 138 > > Montclair, NJ 07043 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________> AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's > > free from AOL at AOL.com. > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > ------ > > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the > SEELANGS > > Web Interface at: > > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > ------ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From msaskova-pierce1 at UNLNOTES.UNL.EDU Wed May 30 14:42:40 2007 From: msaskova-pierce1 at UNLNOTES.UNL.EDU (Miluse Saskova-Pierce) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 09:42:40 -0500 Subject: Miluse Saskova-Pierce/Lang/UNL/UNEBR is out of the office. Message-ID: I will be out of the office starting Wed 05/30/2007 and will not return until Tue 06/19/2007. I will respond to your message when I return. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU Wed May 30 15:26:13 2007 From: Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU (Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 10:26:13 -0500 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" In-Reply-To: <24d156253f19.253f1924d156@imap.georgetown.edu> Message-ID: Iulia, Just one suggestion following Olga Meerson's mentioning of "Pikovaya dama": I taught contemporary Russian prose last semester and a comparative analysis of the figure of a strong-willed matriarch in Ulitskaya's "Pikovaya dama' and Petrushevskaya's "Svoi krug" worked really well for the students. Best, Yevgeny Slivkin Department of Languages, Literatures, and Linguistics University of Oklahoma ----- Original Message ----- From: Olga Meerson Date: Wednesday, May 30, 2007 9:41 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Iulechka, another thing: I have not suggested any later Russian women > writers because I felt they were a fixture. Others' suggestiosn have > confirmed. A particular story by Ulitskaia can also be good for a > complex representation of a woman's vision in Russia: "Pikovaia dama". > Her long novel Kazus Kukotskogo is important for both all of Soviet > History AND the key feminist issues, e.g., abortion, contraseprives, > childbirth, sore spots surrounding those within a family framework, > etc. The movie was even better than the book--a bit less repetitive > and stylistically purer. > o.m. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Olga Meerson > Date: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 9:27 am > Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > > > Woman's points of view in a male author: Detstvo Liuvers, > > Women writers of prose: Evgeniia Ginzburg's and Nadezhda > > Mandel'stam's memoirs. More later. > > o.m. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: trubikhina at AOL.COM > > Date: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 8:16 am > > Subject: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > > > > > Dear colleagues, > > > > > > I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful > > > suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an > > undergraduate > > > course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of > > our > > > situation is that this is the only way at present time that we > > can > > > quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we > > > sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on > > > the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women > > Studies > > > and English). > > > Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women > > studies > > > component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th- > > > century Russian Literature.  Women can be both authors (I am > > > certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) > > > > and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier > > to > > > include the most important 20th-century male authors. > > > > > > I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions > > > a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three > > > > women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights > > > > of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women > > > characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work’s > > > center, like, e.g., Blok’s Russia=eternal femininity concept). > > > b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling > > > such a dual purpose could use. > > > > > > I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, > > on > > > or off the list, > > > > > > Julia > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------- > > > Julia Trubikhina > > > > > > Assistant Professor of Russian > > > Russian Program Coordinator > > > Department of Modern Languages and Literatures > > > Montclair State University > > > Dickson Hall, Room 138 > > > Montclair, NJ 07043 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________> > AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's > > > free from AOL at AOL.com. > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > -- > > > ------ > > > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > > > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the > > SEELANGS > > > Web Interface at: > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > -- > > > ------ > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------ > > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > > Web Interface at: > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From Elena_Baraban at UMANITOBA.CA Wed May 30 21:07:02 2007 From: Elena_Baraban at UMANITOBA.CA (Elena_Baraban at UMANITOBA.CA) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 16:07:02 -0500 Subject: Milan Kundera In-Reply-To: <21660920f733.20f733216609@imap.georgetown.edu> Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, Does anyone know 1) if Milan Kundera speaks fluent English or at least speaks English well; 2) how to get in touch with him? It would also help to know how big Kundera's honoraria are for public lectures. Please contact me off list: Elena_Baraban at umanitoba.ca Thank you, Elena -- Elena Baraban, Ph.D. Assistant Professor of Russian Room 325, Fletcher Argue Bldg. German and Slavic Studies University of Manitoba Winnipeg, MB Canada R3T 2N2 Tel.: (204)474-9735 ------------------------------------------------- This mail sent through IMP: http://horde.org/imp/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM Thu May 31 00:33:33 2007 From: sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM (Benjamin Sher) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 20:33:33 -0400 Subject: Pre-Revolutionary Russian texts Message-ID: Dear friends: I have a Russian poem (Zhabotinsky's "Bednaia Sharlotta") in PDF format which uses pre-Revolutionary orthography. It was originally published in 1902 and republished in 1930, the text from which the copy I have was scanned by the secretary at the Zhabotinsky Institute of Tel Aviv. I have no problem reading the text but I would like to have it in HTML format for my web site. What do others do in this case? There is no way to convert the PDF file to Doc or HTML or Text. I have tried using the best tools available. That is because the issue is ultimately the orthography itself. Is there a special Cyrillic code for pre-Revolutionary Russian orthography? I own a program called Character Set Converter and have written to the authors (fingertipsoft.com) asking for their technical advice and help. I'd imagine that there are tens or hundreds of thousands of Russian documents in the old orthography extant and this would be a serious problem for libraries and museums and scholars. In fact, I understand that Russian texts continued to be published in the old orthography by Russian emigree publishers all the way up to and perhaps even beyond World War II. Have any of you run into this problem? If so, how do you deal with it? Thank you all. Benjamin -- Sher's Russian Web http://www.websher.net Benjamin Sher sher07 at mindspring.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM Thu May 31 01:42:23 2007 From: paulbg at PBG-TRANSLATIONS.COM (Paul B. Gallagher) Date: Wed, 30 May 2007 21:42:23 -0400 Subject: Pre-Revolutionary Russian texts In-Reply-To: <465E17DD.3020609@mindspring.com> Message-ID: [Redirecting my reply to the list as others may be interested:] Benjamin Sher wrote: > I have a Russian poem (Zhabotinsky's "Bednaia Sharlotta") in PDF format > which uses pre-Revolutionary orthography. It was originally published in > 1902 and republished in 1930, the text from which the copy I have was > scanned by the secretary at the Zhabotinsky Institute of Tel Aviv. I > have no problem reading the text but I would like to have it in HTML > format for my web site. What do others do in this case? There is no way > to convert the PDF file to Doc or HTML or Text. Sure, there are several options. The easiest way is to post the PDF itself or convert the relevant part to JPEG. This is platform- and font-independent. The slowest and clumsiest way is to retype it by hand, and then use standard techniques to convert to HTML. Assuming you're a very accurate typist and editor, the risk is that the visitor may not have the relevant font(s) installed. A third way is to use an OCR program to convert to editable text (same risk as above). I happen to use ABBYY FineReader (), which is perfectly capable of reading and analyzing text in a variety of graphical formats, including (since version 7) PDF. I haven't tried it on pre-Revolutionary texts, but since the designers are Russian, it wouldn't surprise me a bit to find it can handle them (if you like, email it to me and I'll give it a quick run-through to see). If not, write them and ask; they may have a solution that doesn't come in the standard bundle. And of course you could download the thing in modern orthography and edit it back. But of course you have to be very careful and have a good eye to prevent modern errors from creeping in... As for the obsolete characters, they are still available in Unicode, which all modern software uses anyway. If you're on a Windows system, it has a nifty little applet called "Character Map" (probably under System Tools) that will show you a table of all the characters and also give you the Unicode numbers as well. Here are most of them: Ѡѡ -- Omega -- U+0460, U+0461 Ѣѣ -- Yat' -- U+0462, U+0463 Ѥѥ -- Iotov E -- U+0464, U+0465 Ѧѧ -- Yus malyy -- U+0466, U+0467 Ѩѩ -- Iotov yus malyy -- U+0468, U+0469 Ѫѫ -- Yus bol'shoy -- U+046A, U+046B Ѭѭ -- Iotov yus bol'shoy -- U+046C, U+046D Ѯѯ -- Ksi -- U+046E, U+046F Ѱѱ -- Psi -- U+0470, U+0471 Ѳѳ -- Fita -- U+0472, U+0473 Ѵѵ -- Izhitsa -- U+0474, U+0475 Ѷѷ -- Izhitsa w/double grave accent -- U+0476, U+0477 Ѹѹ -- Uk -- U+0478, U+0479 Ѻѻ -- Omega kruglaya -- U+047A, -- U+047B Ѽѽ -- Omega/titlo -- U+047C, U+047D Ѿѿ -- Ot -- U+047E, U+047F Ҁҁ -- Koppa -- U+0480, U+0481 ҂ -- thousands mark -- U+0482 For HTML entities, see: (basic table) (advice for webmasters) -- War doesn't determine who's right, just who's left. -- Paul B. Gallagher pbg translations, inc. "Russian Translations That Read Like Originals" http://pbg-translations.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From trubikhina at AOL.COM Thu May 31 04:00:42 2007 From: trubikhina at AOL.COM (trubikhina at AOL.COM) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 00:00:42 -0400 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear all, thank you very much for your suggestions and the generosity of your help. Julia ------------------- Julia Trubikhina Assistant Professor of Russian Russian Program Coordinator Department of Modern Languages and Literatures Montclair State University Dickson Hall, Room 138 Montclair, NJ 07043 -----Original Message----- From: Yevgeniy.A.Slivkin-1 at OU.EDU To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Sent: Wed, 30 May 2007 11:26 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" Iulia, Just one suggestion following Olga Meerson's mentioning of "Pikovaya dama": I taught contemporary Russian prose last semester and a comparative analysis of the figure of a strong-willed matriarch in Ulitskaya's "Pikovaya dama' and Petrushevskaya's "Svoi krug" worked really well for the students. Best, Yevgeny Slivkin Department of Languages, Literatures, and Linguistics University of Oklahoma ----- Original Message ----- From: Olga Meerson Date: Wednesday, May 30, 2007 9:41 am Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU > Iulechka, another thing: I have not suggested any later Russian women > writers because I felt they were a fixture. Others' suggestiosn have > confirmed. A particular story by Ulitskaia can also be good for a > complex representation of a woman's vision in Russia: "Pikovaia dama". > Her long novel Kazus Kukotskogo is important for both all of Soviet > History AND the key feminist issues, e.g., abortion, contraseprives, > childbirth, sore spots surrounding those within a family framework, > etc. The movie was even better than the book--a bit less repetitive > and stylistically purer. > o.m. > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Olga Meerson > Date: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 9:27 am > Subject: Re: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > > > Woman's points of view in a male author: Detstvo Liuvers, > > Women writers of prose: Evgeniia Ginzburg's and Nadezhda > > Mandel'stam's memoirs. More later. > > o.m. > > > > ----- Original Message ----- > > From: trubikhina at AOL.COM > > Date: Tuesday, May 29, 2007 8:16 am > > Subject: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > > > > > Dear colleagues, > > > > > > I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful > > > suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an > > undergraduate > > > course called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of > > our > > > situation is that this is the only way at present time that we > > can > > > quickly get a course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we > > > sorely need through curriculum committees (it already exists on > > > the books) and also enroll it (by cross-listing with Women > > Studies > > > and English). > > > Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women > > studies > > > component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th- > > > century Russian Literature.  Women can be both authors (I am > > > certainly planning to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) > > > > and characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier > > to > > > include the most important 20th-century male authors. > > > > > > I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions > > > a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three > > > > women authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights > > > > of 20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women > > > characters/protagonists (OR concept of femininity at the work’s > > > center, like, e.g., Blok’s Russia=eternal femininity concept). > > > b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling > > > such a dual purpose could use. > > > > > > I will be grateful for and looking forward to all suggestions, > > on > > > or off the list, > > > > > > Julia > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ------------------- > > > Julia Trubikhina > > > > > > Assistant Professor of Russian > > > Russian Program Coordinator > > > Department of Modern Languages and Literatures > > > Montclair State University > > > Dickson Hall, Room 138 > > > Montclair, NJ 07043 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ________________________________________________________________________> > AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's > > > free from AOL at AOL.com. > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > -- > > > ------ > > > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > > > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the > > SEELANGS > > > Web Interface at: > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------- > > -- > > > ------ > > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------ > > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > > Web Interface at: > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > > ------ > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription > options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ________________________________________________________________________ AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at AOL.com. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From alaix at YAHOO.COM Thu May 31 08:19:59 2007 From: alaix at YAHOO.COM (Alexei Kokin) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 01:19:59 -0700 Subject: UK Guardian: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia In-Reply-To: <200705282119.l4SLJCKN011686@brinza.cc.columbia.edu> Message-ID: I have stumbled across the blog of a young man who took part in the anti-gay protests, got arrested by the police, and was threatened with assault charges by an investigator (äîçíàâàòåëü), who offered a lenient sentence in exchange for a confession. Earlier, Peter Tatchell, the gay rights activist who got beaten, failed to identify him as the assaulter. It turned out that two riot policemen had filed reports implicating the young man. (No, he is NOT the assailant in the Guardian photograph.) I would recommend reading the blog, http://peter-lemenkov.livejournal.com, for more details. Ironically, Petr Lemenkov (the protester) was driven to the precinct in the same van as Tatchell, who tried to have a conversation with him. It is the police that seems to have played the ugliest part in the story. I am not sure if Lemenkov, a programmer by trade, can be called a Nazi or a Neo-Nazi but he makes strong claims on his other blog (which you can find via yandex.ru) that sound unpleasantly anti-immigrant, anti-minority and sometimes racist (though not extraordinarily so when compared to a host of Russian bloggers). He comes through as a sort of a "white nationalist," all in all. He is also decidedly anti-Putin, though his criticism seems largely ethnonationalistic -- in his view, Putin's policies lead to the dying out, degeneration and marginalization of ethnic Russians, while empowing aggressive minorities. Note however that outside of LiveJournal with its anti-"hate speech" censorship, many Russians tend to write in a deliberately offensive, hyperbolically un-PC style, which should be considered more of a literary device than a political statement. By his own admission, Lemenkov is strongly against gay parades; he is indifferent to homosexuality as far as it is restricted to private space. My two cents. Alexei Kokin http://therussiandilettante.blogspot.com Andrey Shcherbenok wrote: I believe a certain reservation is needed here. What this Guardian article fails to take into account is that there is a fundamental difference in Russia between being gay (and socialize as gay) and having a gay pride parade in the center of Moscow. Just as the described events took place in Moscow, in St. Petersburg there was a festival of lesbian lyric poetry, widely advertised in popular magazines like "Time Out", and there was not a single problem with it (of course, Guardian is not going to report on that -- that does not support their idiosyncratic doctrine of Russia as prison). A lot of Russian public figures, especially in pop culture, are openly gay as well. What the violent anti-gay groups, whom the Guardian for some reason likes to indiscriminately call neo-Nazis (most of them were actually religious groups) object to is what they consider public display of obscenity and propaganda of homosexuality, not the fact of somebody being gay. One may consider that not quite enlightened position from the point of view of the cultures that are prepared to celebrate any identity as long as it is not really subversive, but it is still a far cry from calling Russia a scary place for somebody who is gay. Which, of course, does not excuse the police. Andrey Shcherbenok -----Original Message----- From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list [mailto:SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU] On Behalf Of w martin Sent: Monday, May 28, 2007 6:42 PM To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU Subject: [SEELANGS] UK Guardian: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia Apologies for the topical nature of this posting, but this may well be of concern to academics in Russia and has not been reported so far in major US newspapers: Gay activists beaten and arrested in Russia . Police watch as neo-Nazis attack protesters . MEPs among 30 detained by police as aggressors go free http://www.guardian.co.uk/russia/article/0,,2089413,00.html ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- --------------------------------- Shape Yahoo! in your own image. Join our Network Research Panel today! ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From j.m.andrew at LANG.KEELE.AC.UK Thu May 31 09:01:17 2007 From: j.m.andrew at LANG.KEELE.AC.UK (Joe Andrew) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 10:01:17 +0100 Subject: Share Certificates In-Reply-To: <195958.12175.qm@web53009.mail.re2.yahoo.com> Message-ID: Dear SEELANGERS I have received from an aunt some share certificates for 'Russo-Asiatic Consolidated Limited' issued to my grandfather in Glasgow in 1941. Does anyone know whether these would be of any value, either in terms of their actual value, or as historical documents; or where I could find this out? Best Joe ---------------------- Joe Andrew j.m.andrew at lang.keele.ac.uk ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From jwilson at SRAS.ORG Thu May 31 10:07:57 2007 From: jwilson at SRAS.ORG (Josh Wilson) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 14:07:57 +0400 Subject: Internet resource Message-ID: Stumbled on this today: http://www.rosconcert.com/ It's a surprisingly large list of Russia-related cultural events being held in the US. Even has a function for online ticket purchase for many of them. Only downside is that it appears to be a weird hodge-podge of Russian and English language info, with the interface mostly in Russian. Enjoy! Josh Wilson Asst. Director The School of Russian and Asian Studies Editor-in-Chief Vestnik, The Journal of Russian and Asian Studies www.sras.org jwilson at sras.org ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Thu May 31 11:21:52 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 04:21:52 -0700 Subject: Share Certificates Message-ID: Of historical value, definitely, perhaps immense. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Joe Andrew Date: Thursday, May 31, 2007 2:01 am Subject: [SEELANGS] Share Certificates > Dear SEELANGERS > > I have received from an aunt some share certificates for 'Russo- > Asiatic > Consolidated Limited' issued to my grandfather in Glasgow in 1941. > > Does anyone know whether these would be of any value, either in > terms of > their actual value, or as historical documents; or where I could > find this > out? > > Best > > Joe > > > > ---------------------- > Joe Andrew > j.m.andrew at lang.keele.ac.uk > > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > Use your web browser to search the archives, control your > subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS > Web Interface at: > http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ > ------------------------------------------------------------------- > ------ > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lino59 at AMERITECH.NET Thu May 31 13:53:27 2007 From: lino59 at AMERITECH.NET (Deborah Hoffman) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 06:53:27 -0700 Subject: 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" In-Reply-To: Message-ID: You could try Petrushevskaia's Svoi krug, trans. Helena Goscilo or Vremia noch' trans. Sally Laird. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ >From: SEELANGS: Slavic & East European Languages and Literatures list on = >behalf of trubikhina at AOL.COM >Sent: Tue 5/29/2007 8:16 AM >To: SEELANGS at BAMA.UA.EDU >Subject: [SEELANGS] 20th cent. Lit course "Women in Russian Lit" > >Dear colleagues, > >I am wondering if you could offer me some pragmatic and helpful = >suggestions. This summer I am working to develop an undergraduate course = >called "Women in Russian Literature." The specifics of our situation is = >that this is the only way at present time that we can quickly get a = >course in 20th-century Russian Literature that we sorely need through = >curriculum committees (it already exists on the books) >and also enroll = >it (by cross-listing with Women Studies and English). >Therefore, we have a double goal: there should be a women studies = >component to it BUT PRIMARILY it should be a course in 20th-century = >Russian Literature. Women can be both authors (I am certainly planning = >to include Tsvetaeva, Akhmatova, and Gippius) and = >characters/subject/conceptual focus, which makes it easier to include = >the most important 20th-century male authors. > >I was wondering if you could help me by offering suggestions >a) about the specific texts/authors to use (other than the three women = >authors mentioned above) that would be both the highlights of = >20th-century R.Lit. and/or have important women characters/protagonists = >(OR concept of femininity at the work's center, like, e.g., Blok's = >Russia=3Deternal femininity concept). >b) a theoretical perspective that a course aimed at fulfilling such a = >dual purpose could use. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From vbelyanin at GMAIL.COM Thu May 31 16:17:47 2007 From: vbelyanin at GMAIL.COM (Valery Belyanin) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 12:17:47 -0400 Subject: russkogovojrschije and russkojazychnyje Message-ID: Hello, Russian speakers and Russian non-speakers :) russkogovojrschije and russkojazychnyje русскоговорящие и русскоязычные http://www.rambler.ru/news/culture/socialproblems/10469966.html New terminology I was trying (but failed) to understand... -- Valery Belyanin, UPitt SLI 2007 From dobrunov at YAHOO.COM Thu May 31 18:12:31 2007 From: dobrunov at YAHOO.COM (Olga Dobrunova) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 11:12:31 -0700 Subject: russkogovojrschije and russkojazychnyje In-Reply-To: <6e5389890705310917p3d13ac0cs1d028a369fdf0f69@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: I suppose it comes from the European linguistic tradition started by Ferdinand de Saussure and very common among Russian linguists to distinguish “speech” (as oral variant) and “language”(as a system of words, grammar rules etc). It is a very rough explanation. I understand the meaning of “russkogovoryaschie” as an equivalent to what we call “heritage students” – people who can speak every-day Russian, but alliterate, not educated in Russian enough. “Russkoyazychnye” – who knows grammar and rules, and can speak and write in Russian on all possible topics correctly according to the Russian language standards and stylistics. I think so, Olga Dobrunova Valery Belyanin wrote: Hello, Russian speakers and Russian non-speakers :) russkogovojrschije and russkojazychnyje ðóññêîãîâîðÿùèå è ðóññêîÿçû÷íûå http://www.rambler.ru/news/culture/socialproblems/10469966.html New terminology I was trying (but failed) to understand... -- Valery Belyanin, UPitt SLI 2007 --------------------------------- The fish are biting. Get more visitors on your site using Yahoo! Search Marketing. ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From lypark at UIUC.EDU Thu May 31 19:01:23 2007 From: lypark at UIUC.EDU (Lynda Park) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 14:01:23 -0500 Subject: Conf: Solzhenitsyn as Writer, Myth-Maker, Public Figure, U Illinois Message-ID: Conference Announcement “Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn as Writer, Myth-Maker and Public Figure" Ralph and Ruth Fisher Forum June 14-16, 2007 University of Illinois, Urbana-Champaign 314 Illini Union 1401 W. Green St, Urbana http://www.reec.uiuc.edu/events/fisher.html Keynote Address Mrs. Natalia Solzhenitsyn "Another Time, Another Burden: Solzhenitsyn after His Return to Russia" Thursday, June 14 6:30pm, 314 Illini Union Conference Participants Mrs. Natalia Solzhenitsyn Ignat Solzhenitsyn Stephan Solzhenitsyn Patricia Burak, Director, Slutzker Center for International Services, Syracuse University Edward Ericson, Professor Emeritus, English Department, Calvin College Michael Finke, Professor, Department of Slavic Languages and Literatures, University of Illinois Mikhail Golubkov, Professor, Philological Faculty, Moscow State University Ekaterina Ivanova, Senior Fellow, Maxim Gorky Institute of World Literature, Moscow Alexis Klimoff, Head and Professor, Russian Department, Vassar College Victor Levenstein, GULag survivor; retired mining engineer, Columbus, Ohio Nadezhda Levitskaia, Bibliographer, Russian Social Fund Daniel Mahoney, Professor, Department of Politics, Assumption College Harriet Murav, Head and Professor, Department of Slavic Languages and Literatures, University of Illinois Michael Nicholson, Fellow in Russian and Dean of University College, Oxford University Georges Nivat, Professeur Honoraire, Université de Genève Michael Palencia-Roth, Professor, Program in Comparative and World Literature, University of Illinois James Pontuso, Patterson Professor of Political Science, Hampden-Sydney College Liudmila Saraskina, Fellow of the Institute of Artistic Education, Moscow Svetlana Sheshunova, Associate Professor, Department of Linguistics, International University, Dubna Pavel Spiwakowky, Associate Professor, Department of Russian Literature, A. S. Pushkin State Institute of the Russian Language, Moscow Mark Steinberg, Professor, Department of History, University of Illinois; Editor, Slavic Review Nikita Struve, Professeur, Université Paris X-Nanterre Richard Tempest, Associate Professor and Acting Head, Depart of Slavic Languages and Literatures, University of Illinois Aleksandr Urmanov, Professor, Department of Russian Literature, Blagoveshchensk State Pedagogical University Faculty Organizer Richard Tempest, Department of Slavic Languages and Literatures, University of Illinois Organizer Russian, East European, and Eurasian Center, University of Illinois UI Cosponsors Ralph and Ruth Fisher Endowment Fund International Programs and Studies College of Liberal Arts and Sciences Department of Slavic Languages and Literatures School of Literatures, Cultures and Linguistics Lynda Y. Park, Associate Director Russian, East European, and Eurasian Center University of Illinois 104 International Studies Building, MC-487 910 South Fifth Street Champaign, IL 61820 (217) 333-6022, 333-1244; fax (217) 333-1582 lypark at uiuc.edu http://www.reec.uiuc.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU Thu May 31 19:52:49 2007 From: meersono at GEORGETOWN.EDU (Olga Meerson) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 12:52:49 -0700 Subject: russkogovojrschije and russkojazychnyje Message-ID: The basic difference is simple: russkogovoriashchie are people who speak Russian but don't read or write in it and have had no, or have been deprived of, education in Russian, books, papers, all the works. Simply illiterate heritage speakers. Eusskoiazychnye are literates. o.m. ----- Original Message ----- From: Valery Belyanin Date: Thursday, May 31, 2007 9:17 am Subject: [SEELANGS] russkogovojrschije and russkojazychnyje > Hello, Russian speakers and Russian non-speakers :) > > russkogovojrschije and russkojazychnyje > ??????????????? ? ????????????? > http://www.rambler.ru/news/culture/socialproblems/10469966.html > New terminology I was trying (but failed) to understand... > > -- > Valery Belyanin, UPitt SLI 2007 > ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU Thu May 31 20:21:14 2007 From: aisrael at AMERICAN.EDU (Alina Israeli) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 16:21:14 -0400 Subject: russkogovojrschije and russkojazychnyje In-Reply-To: <2e621e2ea30a.2ea30a2e621e@imap.georgetown.edu> Message-ID: I would like to somewhat disagree (which does not mean that I am correct). I think this is an attempt to make a calque from French (whether he knows it or not) where they distinguish Francophone and Francofile, those who speak it natively vs. those who are not native but fluent and certainly not a Francophobe. So, I think they want to make sure that there are a lot more Russophone, i.e. educated native speakers, not just speakers of kitchen Russian, and against their assimilation into other cultures. On May 31, 2007, at 3:52 PM, Olga Meerson wrote: > The basic difference is simple: russkogovoriashchie are people who > speak Russian but don't read or write in it and have had no, or > have been deprived of, education in Russian, books, papers, all the > works. Simply illiterate heritage speakers. Eusskoiazychnye are > literates. > o.m. > Alina Israeli LFS, American University 4400 Massachusetts Ave., NW Washington DC. 20016 (202) 885-2387 fax (202) 885-1076 aisrael at american.edu ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. Visit and bookmark the SEELANGS Web Interface at: http://seelangs.home.comcast.net/ ------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM Thu May 31 22:10:49 2007 From: sher07 at MINDSPRING.COM (Benjamin Sher) Date: Thu, 31 May 2007 18:10:49 -0400 Subject: Conversion code for Vremya font Message-ID: Dear friends: If anyone needs to AUTOMATICALLY convert earlier documents typed with Vremya font, contact me and I'll be happy to give you our Vremya code, which works beautifully with Fingertip's Character Set Converter (cost: $29). We used it to convert Cyrillic in Vremya to a more standard Cyrillic code. Just write me and I'll explain the procedure. Benjamin -- Sher's Russian Web http://www.websher.net Benjamin Sher sher07 at mindspring.com ------------------------------------------------------------------------- Use your web browser to search the archives, control your subscription options, and more. 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