Pussy Riot

[Ekaterina Mudalova]

Да пусть бунтуют, бляди-то.  Всего лишь блядский бунт.  Разве они
кому-нибудь мешают?

2012/3/18 Jamie Parsons <jlpars at umich.edu>

> Dear Vladimir Orlov,
>
>     Not to beat a dead horse, but the example you provided isn't
> significantly different from the one in Esaulov's original article; the
> country of the incident has merely been changed.
>
> "May I please provide the following example: wearing swastika and
> singing Nazi songs is not prohibited by the law in many countries.
> These include Engand, for instance.
> But does it say that you are alowed to make Nazi protest in an English
> synagogue interrupting the service, forced out by the security and
> escaping afterwards, without being prosecuted?
>
> I bet this whole story would have followed by the great lawsuit,
> irrespective that Nazi ideology is not illegal in this country -- and
> irrespective to what some people might think, even if they support
> these so-called 'liberal activists'."
>
>     Granted, display of swastikas and other Nazi symbols is not illegal in
> America or England, as it is in Germany.  (I'm not sure about the law in
> Israel.)  However, a neo-nazi (of Jewishness in general, I gather?) staged
> in a synagogue *would* constitute a hate crime under US law, and would
> indeed be subject to more that simple trespassing or "disturbance" laws,
> which would seem to correspond to the legislation you mention under
> "hooliganism."  A feminist protest, however tasteless, that was held in a
> synagogue or church would *not* constitute a hate crime under US law; at
> most, the protestors would be charged with trespassing or public
> disturbance, which would certainly not merit 7 years in prison.
>
> Regards,
>      Jamie L. Parsons
>
> 2012/3/18 Vladimir Orlov <v.orlov05 at googlemail.com>
>
> > Sorry Seelangers for appearing here too often,
> > but I have already made my bed and now I have to lie on it.
> >
> > Maybe because the beginning of this polemics was in Russian, the
> > following aspect is not obvious enough,
> > so let me please repeat it.
> >
> > 1) The accusing formulation of Pussy Riot is 'hooliganism'. You can
> > check it out. That is, no linkage to Bolshevism or to any form of
> > oppression against the church is provided by Russian justice. I mean
> > it.
> > Significantly, there IS a law article that sounds разжигание
> > религиозной вражды (fomentation of the religious strife, don't know if
> > my translation is exact or not), but this is NOT what activists of PR
> > are accused for. (Thankfully.) Indeed, the accuracy and the extent of
> > real justice demonstrated by the law in Russia awaits to be seen.
> > However, only the court decision could provide the valid argument in
> > the debate whether PR deserves to be defended, or not, in my opinion.
> >
> > NB: Yevgeniy had noted hat PR's collaborators will be accused by that
> > article. Lets see what will really happen.
> >
> > 2) Ivan Esaulov makes a direct link between Holocaust and the tragedy
> > of Orthodox church under Soviet regime. As seems, many people do not
> > share this view. But many people do.
> >
> > May I please provide the following example: wearing swastika and
> > singing Nazi songs is not prohibited by the law in many countries.
> > These include Engand, for instance.
> > But does it say that you are alowed to make Nazi protest in an English
> > synagogue interrupting the service, forced out by the security and
> > escaping afterwards, without being prosecuted?
> >
> > I bet this whole story would have followed by the great lawsuit,
> > irrespective that Nazi ideology is not illegal in this country -- and
> > irrespective to what some people might think, even if they support
> > these so-called 'liberal activists'.
> >
> > In conclusion I will say that many people (myself including) do not
> > see PR as 'liberal'. Liberalism is something different -- which,
> > sadly, does not exist in today's Russia. But this is a matter of a
> > different discussion.
> >
> > PS:
> > Re Svitlana Kobets.
> >
> > In my view, that is a very interesting observation. PR themselves,
> > however, do not associate themselves with this yurodivy tradition,
> > described by Likhachev. As many people in Russian media say, PR demand
> > Christian mercy, but they never asked for forgiveness. Nonetheless, it
> > would have been better for them to mention something like you showed,
> > indicating that the church has already undergone through these
> > practices without any special harm for it.
> >
> > PPS:
> > Re Yevgeniy Slivkin.
> >
> > Спасибо Вам за замечание,
> > я, разумеется, могу сообщить Вам много возражений. В первую очередь --
> > нельзя полностью доверять изданию грани.ру, спонсируемому Борисом
> > Абрамовичем (против которого возбуждены уголовные дела уже, кажется, в
> > пяти странах). Другие издания не дают информации о вовлечённости РПЦ
> > (что, конечно, вполне вероятно, я понимаю). В любом случае, я думаю,
> > надо дождаться сначала, кого в действительности арестуют по этой
> > статье, и потом уже делать выводы.
> >
> > Если нужно, я готов продолжить нашу дискуссию публично,
> > но я надеюсь, Вы согласитесь, что в этом нет необходимости (если её не
> > обозначат специально).
> > Разумеется, мне было важно и интересно услышать Ваше мнение.
> >
> > Regards,
> >
> > --
> > Dr. Vladimir Orlov
> > PhD in Musicology (Cantab)
> > http://cambridge.academia.edu/VladimirOrlov
> > Trustee of Cultural and Artistic Affairs, Russian Cambridge Foundation
> > www.russiancambridge.org
> > +7 8332 375760 (home)
> >
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