From rankin at ku.edu Sat Oct 1 20:13:55 2005 From: rankin at ku.edu (Rankin, Robert L) Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2005 15:13:55 -0500 Subject: FW: Siouan languages Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. Bob -----Original Message----- From: idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be [mailto:idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be] On Behalf Of idiatov Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 9:29 AM To: Rankin, Robert L Subject: Siouan languages Dear Robert (if I may), I am currently doing a typological study on the use of the interrogative pro-nouns meaning 'who?' and 'what?'. To my disappointment, information on the use of 'who?' and 'what?' is difficult to find in grammars and dictionaries. Therefore, I made up a small questionnaire of some 20 questions. May I ask you to answer the questions and translate the English sentences in the Siouan languages you are most familiar with? Even if you can do this only for a part of the questions, it will be of great use to me. Any comments you may have, are also welcome. No need to say that I will gratefully acknowledge your help when publishing or presenting the results. You may find the questionnaire attached as an a MS Word file. Kind regards, Dmitry Idiatov Center for Grammar, Cognition & Typology University of Antwerp (Belgium) PS: I presented some of the results of my research at the 6th biennial meeting of the Association for Linguistic Typology in Padang (Indonesia) this year. Please find the handout of my talk as an attachment. I left the maps out because they made the pdf-file to big. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Questionnaire WHO&WHAT L.doc Type: application/msword Size: 35328 bytes Desc: Questionnaire WHO&WHAT L.doc URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Idiatov ALT6 Handout.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 193473 bytes Desc: Idiatov ALT6 Handout.pdf URL: From John.Koontz at colorado.edu Mon Oct 3 06:24:51 2005 From: John.Koontz at colorado.edu (Koontz John E) Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2005 00:24:51 -0600 Subject: interrogative -indefinites In-Reply-To: <1128110476.433d998c2f4a1@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: All these interesting things about Dakotan that I was ignorant of! On Fri, 30 Sep 2005 lcumberl at indiana.edu wrote: > Lakota makes a realized/potential distinction, thus:'taku/ta'kul, as in: > 'taku icu he 'what did he take?' vs. ta'kul icukta he 'what will he take' This reminds me of the Dakota real vs. hypothetical vs. negative distinctions with the indefinite articles in Lakota, cf. Rood & Taylor, 1996:456. I don't think there's a parallel in Dhegiha, though this might be an area where I've been unobservant. The closest thing I have noticed is kki 'if' vs. kki=z^i, which looks like it should be 'if-not', but is not. But I do notice an Omaha-Ponca parallel for one aspect of these interrogative forms. The potential 'what' form in Lakota, takul, is an exact parallel for the Omaha-Ponca form agudi 'where'. INDEF yonder LOC *ta/(h)a *ku *tu La ta ku l 'what (unreal)' OP a gu di 'where' Only the WH-morpheme differs. I'm not sure what to make of it. (By way of a caution, I'm not sure everyone agrees with my etymologies after the wh-morpheme, on which all depends.) > Assiniboine doesn't have that distinction but makes a distinction between > non-specific-indefinite and specific-indefinite, thus: 'taku/ta'kux, as in > > 'taku eyaku he 'what did he take?' vs. ta'kux 'eyaku he 'what, specifically, > did he take?' ... > There are also the pairs, tuwe/tuwex and tukte/tuktex, but not tona: *tonax The -x reminds me of =xti. Does =x have any other functions? There's something similar with a different morphologies in Omaha-Ponca: edadaN eda'daN aNgaghe=tta=i 'what (specifically) should we do?' (asking for a course of action) iNdadaN iNda'daN=xti ed=ehe=tta 'what (indefinite) should I say?' (to self when put on the spot) e'be kki e'be gdhe ethedaN? 'which (of us) should go back home?' ebe' ebe'=di (s^)ne' a? 'who are you going to?' From dvklinguist2003 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 3 19:28:42 2005 From: dvklinguist2003 at yahoo.com (David Kaufman) Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2005 12:28:42 -0700 Subject: Dictionary update Message-ID: Bob & John, Just FYI--the Biloxi-English portion of the revised dictionary is basically done, but I do emphasize the word "basically." There is of course more tweeking and tinkering to do as more discoveries are made and cognates found. I have also not put in all of the affixes as those still need to be ironed out in conjunction with a future revised grammar. But at least it is basically easier to use I think than Dorsey's original. I have not added the references yet to the D-S dictionary, which I will do over time. (I'm not sure yet about including the actual D-S word or just the page and column reference numbers in the D-S dictionary.) If either or both of you would like a copy for your comparative files or whatever, I'll be more than happy to send it along as an email attachment. I can do the same once I have the English-Biloxi portion done as well, which I'll be begin working on soon. BTW Bob, are you willing to share what you have done so far on your revised Ofo dictionary? Dave __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pustetrm at yahoo.com Tue Oct 4 21:08:03 2005 From: pustetrm at yahoo.com (REGINA PUSTET) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 14:08:03 -0700 Subject: FW: Siouan languages In-Reply-To: Message-ID: >Dear Colleagues, >This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. >Bob I also got this message, and it looks like I'll be doing the Lakota part unless somebody else on the list intervenes -- I'm actually encouraging you guys to intervene because at the moment, my deadlines are killing me and this is not going to change until the end of this year. Regina "Rankin, Robert L" wrote:Dear Colleagues, This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. Bob -----Original Message----- From: idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be [mailto:idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be] On Behalf Of idiatov Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 9:29 AM To: Rankin, Robert L Subject: Siouan languages Dear Robert (if I may), I am currently doing a typological study on the use of the interrogative pro-nouns meaning 'who?' and 'what?'. To my disappointment, information on the use of 'who?' and 'what?' is difficult to find in grammars and dictionaries. Therefore, I made up a small questionnaire of some 20 questions. May I ask you to answer the questions and translate the English sentences in the Siouan languages you are most familiar with? Even if you can do this only for a part of the questions, it will be of great use to me. Any comments you may have, are also welcome. No need to say that I will gratefully acknowledge your help when publishing or presenting the results. You may find the questionnaire attached as an a MS Word file. Kind regards, Dmitry Idiatov Center for Grammar, Cognition & Typology University of Antwerp (Belgium) PS: I presented some of the results of my research at the 6th biennial meeting of the Association for Linguistic Typology in Padang (Indonesia) this year. Please find the handout of my talk as an attachment. I left the maps out because they made the pdf-file to big. --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rood at spot.Colorado.EDU Tue Oct 4 22:23:43 2005 From: rood at spot.Colorado.EDU (ROOD DAVID S) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 16:23:43 -0600 Subject: FW: Siouan languages In-Reply-To: <20051004210803.63203.qmail@web54611.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I am doing one of these for Wichita, and it's going to require some elicitation of forms I don't have. I don't want to do another one, so I'm not going to claim Lakota here. I do think it's a fascinating questionnaire, however. David David S. Rood Dept. of Linguistics Univ. of Colorado 295 UCB Boulder, CO 80309-0295 USA rood at colorado.edu On Tue, 4 Oct 2005, REGINA PUSTET wrote: > >Dear Colleagues, > > >This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. > > >Bob > > I also got this message, and it looks like I'll be doing the Lakota part > unless somebody else on the list intervenes -- I'm actually encouraging > you guys to intervene because at the moment, my deadlines are killing me > and this is not going to change until the end of this year. > > Regina > > > > "Rankin, Robert L" wrote:Dear Colleagues, > > This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. > > Bob > > -----Original Message----- > From: idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be [mailto:idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be] On Behalf Of > idiatov > Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 9:29 AM > To: Rankin, Robert L > Subject: Siouan languages > > > Dear Robert (if I may), > > I am currently doing a typological study on the use of the interrogative > pro-nouns meaning 'who?' and 'what?'. To my disappointment, information > on the use of 'who?' and 'what?' is difficult to find in grammars and > dictionaries. Therefore, I made up a small questionnaire of some 20 > questions. May I ask you to answer the questions and translate the > English sentences in the Siouan languages you are most familiar with? > Even if you can do this only for a part of the questions, it will be of > great use to me. Any comments you may have, are also welcome. No need to > say that I will gratefully acknowledge your help when publishing or > presenting the results. You may find the questionnaire attached as an a > MS Word file. > > Kind regards, > > Dmitry Idiatov > > Center for Grammar, Cognition & Typology > University of Antwerp (Belgium) > > PS: I presented some of the results of my research at the 6th biennial > meeting of the Association for Linguistic Typology in Padang (Indonesia) > this year. Please find the handout of my talk as an attachment. I left > the maps out because they made the pdf-file to big. > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. From jmcbride at kawnation.com Wed Oct 5 13:11:07 2005 From: jmcbride at kawnation.com (Justin McBride) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 08:11:07 -0500 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings Message-ID: Ho, zaaniN. Yesterday I received an email message from a book company asking us if we were interested in possibly publishing the proceedings of the Siouan conference from a few months ago. I personally don't care one way or the other, and Dr. Rankin says he's probably a little too busy. But he suggested I forward the message to the list. If there's a consensus on this from all the presenters, I suppose we all could brush up our papers and put a little proposal together. I've included the message below. Just let me know what you think, on or off board. WiblahaN. Justin T. McBride Language Director & acting Webmaster Kaw Nation Drawer 50 Kaw City, OK 74641 PH (580) 269-2552 ext 241 FX (580) 269-2204 attn Language/Web Dev jmcbride at kawnation.com www.kawnation.com/langhome.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dear Professor McBride, (hee, hee, hee -jm) I am writing to enquire whether you have any interest in submitting a proposal for the publication (perhaps as an edited collection of essays) of the proceedings for the 25th Annual Siouan and Caddoan Languages and Linguistics Conference, which was held on 17th to 19th June 2005. Cambridge Scholars Press is at the present expanding to include titles from linguistics, and the areas covered in your conference are of direct interest. Naturally, if you already have a publisher, or have no interest in converting the proceedings into a publication, please accept my apologies for this message. Amanda Millar Cambridge Scholars Press www.CambridgeScholarsPress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From daltshul at rci.rutgers.edu Wed Oct 5 13:20:12 2005 From: daltshul at rci.rutgers.edu (Daniel Altshuler) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 09:20:12 -0400 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: <000c01c5c9ae$3fc51420$3e01a8c0@Language> Message-ID: Hi Justin, On board. I think the conference was very interesting last year and I don't mind brushing up my paper a bit. Let me know. Best, Daniel > Yesterday I received an email message from a book company asking us if we > were interested in possibly publishing the proceedings of the Siouan > conference from a few months ago. I personally don't care one way or the > other, and Dr. Rankin says he's probably a little too busy. But he > suggested I forward the message to the list. If there's a consensus on > this from all the presenters, I suppose we all could brush up our papers > and put a little proposal together. I've included the message below. > Just let me know what you think, on or off board. > > WiblahaN. > > Justin T. McBride > Language Director & acting Webmaster > Kaw Nation > Drawer 50 > Kaw City, OK 74641 > PH (580) 269-2552 ext 241 > FX (580) 269-2204 attn Language/Web Dev > jmcbride at kawnation.com > www.kawnation.com/langhome.html > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Dear Professor McBride, (hee, hee, hee -jm) > > I am writing to enquire whether you have any interest in submitting a > proposal for the publication (perhaps as an edited collection of essays) > of > the proceedings for the 25th Annual Siouan and Caddoan Languages and > Linguistics Conference, which was held on 17th to 19th June 2005. > > Cambridge Scholars Press is at the present expanding to include titles > from > linguistics, and the areas covered in your conference are of direct > interest. > > Naturally, if you already have a publisher, or have no interest in > converting the proceedings into a publication, please accept my apologies > for this message. > > Amanda Millar > Cambridge Scholars Press > www.CambridgeScholarsPress.com > ================ Daniel Altshuler Department of Linguistics Rutgers University email: daltshul at rci.rutgers.edu web: http://www.rci.rutgers.edu/~daltshul ========================================= From shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk Wed Oct 5 20:50:28 2005 From: shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk (shokooh Ingham) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 21:50:28 +0100 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: <000c01c5c9ae$3fc51420$3e01a8c0@Language> Message-ID: Dear Justin I'm sure I could make my paper presentable, if it was decided to go ahead Yours Bruce Ingham --- Justin McBride wrote: > Ho, zaaniN. > > Yesterday I received an email message from a book > company asking us if we were interested in possibly > publishing the proceedings of the Siouan conference > from a few months ago. I personally don't care one > way or the other, and Dr. Rankin says he's probably > a little too busy. But he suggested I forward the > message to the list. If there's a consensus on this > from all the presenters, I suppose we all could > brush up our papers and put a little proposal > together. I've included the message below. Just > let me know what you think, on or off board. > > WiblahaN. > > Justin T. McBride > Language Director & acting Webmaster > Kaw Nation > Drawer 50 > Kaw City, OK 74641 > PH (580) 269-2552 ext 241 > FX (580) 269-2204 attn Language/Web Dev > jmcbride at kawnation.com > www.kawnation.com/langhome.html > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Dear Professor McBride, (hee, hee, hee -jm) > > I am writing to enquire whether you have any > interest in submitting a > proposal for the publication (perhaps as an edited > collection of essays) of > the proceedings for the 25th Annual Siouan and > Caddoan Languages and > Linguistics Conference, which was held on 17th to > 19th June 2005. > > Cambridge Scholars Press is at the present expanding > to include titles from > linguistics, and the areas covered in your > conference are of direct interest. > > Naturally, if you already have a publisher, or have > no interest in > converting the proceedings into a publication, > please accept my apologies > for this message. > > Amanda Millar > Cambridge Scholars Press > www.CambridgeScholarsPress.com > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From John.Koontz at colorado.edu Wed Oct 5 22:34:37 2005 From: John.Koontz at colorado.edu (Koontz John E) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 16:34:37 -0600 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: <000c01c5c9ae$3fc51420$3e01a8c0@Language> Message-ID: On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Justin McBride wrote: > Just let me know what you think, on or off board. I would be willing to participate, but I'm wondering what sort of arrangement Cambridge Scholars' Press anticipates. I hadn't heard of them before, and I'm wondering what their approach is. From rood at spot.Colorado.EDU Wed Oct 5 22:40:03 2005 From: rood at spot.Colorado.EDU (ROOD DAVID S) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 16:40:03 -0600 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Folks, I wasn't at the meeting, but I'll stick in my two cents anyway. Take a good look at the publisher before you plunge into a project like this. Academic publishing is like everything else that comes via email: some of it is legit, and some isn't. Ask for examples of other books these folks have published and decide whether you want to be part of something similar. Also ask about costs: in many fields, publishers charge authors per page. We don't do that in linguistics most of the time, but check on how this publisher thinks. David S. Rood Dept. of Linguistics Univ. of Colorado 295 UCB Boulder, CO 80309-0295 USA rood at colorado.edu On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Koontz John E wrote: > On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Justin McBride wrote: > > Just let me know what you think, on or off board. > > I would be willing to participate, but I'm wondering what sort of > arrangement Cambridge Scholars' Press anticipates. I hadn't heard of them > before, and I'm wondering what their approach is. > From shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk Mon Oct 10 11:26:59 2005 From: shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk (shokooh Ingham) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 12:26:59 +0100 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Siouanists, Following David's comment below, I have asked two contacts over here about Scholar's press, and although one of them, Probsthain's the Orientalist Bookshop, said they had heard of them, they couldn't bring any titles to mind. I've also heard of them, but can't think where. Still we may just be reading the wrong books. It would be interesting to know what they suggest. Bruce --- ROOD DAVID S wrote: > > Folks, I wasn't at the meeting, but I'll stick in my > two cents anyway. > Take a good look at the publisher before you plunge > into a project like > this. Academic publishing is like everything else > that comes via email: > some of it is legit, and some isn't. Ask for > examples of other books > these folks have published and decide whether you > want to be part of > something similar. Also ask about costs: in many > fields, publishers > charge authors per page. We don't do that in > linguistics most of the > time, but check on how this publisher thinks. > > David S. Rood > Dept. of Linguistics > Univ. of Colorado > 295 UCB > Boulder, CO 80309-0295 > USA > rood at colorado.edu > > On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Koontz John E wrote: > > > On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Justin McBride wrote: > > > Just let me know what you think, on or off > board. > > > > I would be willing to participate, but I'm > wondering what sort of > > arrangement Cambridge Scholars' Press anticipates. > I hadn't heard of them > > before, and I'm wondering what their approach is. > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com From okibjonathan at yahoo.com Tue Oct 11 15:22:25 2005 From: okibjonathan at yahoo.com (Jonathan Holmes) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 08:22:25 -0700 Subject: Lakota word for "bubble" ? Message-ID: I have been asked to find the ihunk ihanni or "the old way," of saying "bubble" in Lakota. The only way I have seen it translated is anahlohlo. Does anyone happen to know the difference between the modern way and the old way to translate this word? Be a friend... Help support the Lakota Communities on Pine Ridge, go to: http://FriendsofPineRidgeReservation.org --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ti at fa-kuan.muc.de Tue Oct 11 17:57:56 2005 From: ti at fa-kuan.muc.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Alfred_W=2E_T=FCting=22?=) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 19:57:56 +0200 Subject: Lakota word for "bubble" ? Message-ID: > I have been asked to find the ihunk ihanni or "the old way," of saying "bubble" in Lakota. The only way I have seen it translated is anahlohlo. << From your sample (anahlohlo, [ana'h^loh^lo]), I assume that you mean the verb "to bubble (up)". With this sense I also found: anapsapsa [ana'ps^aps^a] - Buechel: boil up, come up, as bubbles on the water (cf. psa [ps^a] - to sneeze, psapsa s'e - appearing disorderly), apablublu [apa'blublu] - to bubble up with many bubbles (cf. apablu - to crush to powder on anything, to belch, to bubble up, as air from the water; anablu - to kick dust or dirt on). anahlohlo - bubble up, as in boiling (cf. anahloka - to wear a hole(!) in, as in a moccasin, on smth.; hlohloka [h^loh^o'ka] - full of holes(!); hlokA - hollow, a hollow; hlogeca [h^loge'ca] - poor, thin, as a sick man, hollow, as a tree). So it seems to me that the ideas behind might be 'hole/hollow' (hlo), 'dust/dirt' i.e. little pieces (blu) and '(burst to) sneeze' (psa). There's also: tapsiza [txapsi'za] or tapsipsiza - to bubble up, come up, as bubbles on water; also: tapsija [txapsi'z^a] or anatapsiza [ana'txapsiz^a]; cf. psica [psi'ca] - jumping(!), psicala - flea, psipsicala [psipsi'cala] - grasshopper, psipsicala [psi'psicala] - the jumping mouse etc. So, in this case the meaning seems quite evident as also in Bavarian slang, soda pop is sometimes called 'hupfats Wossa' - 'hüpfendes Wasser' in High German -, which literally is 'jumping water' ;-) I'm ignorant whether or not there are still older ways in Lakota to give the idea of 'bubble'. Alfred From okibjonathan at yahoo.com Wed Oct 12 00:11:43 2005 From: okibjonathan at yahoo.com (Jonathan Holmes) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 17:11:43 -0700 Subject: Lakota word for "bubble" ? In-Reply-To: <434BFD24.2020107@fa-kuan.muc.de> Message-ID: Thanks for taking the time Alfred, this helps a great deal. Jonathan "Alfred W. Tüting" wrote: > I have been asked to find the ihunk ihanni or "the old way," of saying "bubble" in Lakota. The only way I have seen it translated is anahlohlo. << >>From your sample (anahlohlo, [ana'h^loh^lo]), I assume that you mean the verb "to bubble (up)". With this sense I also found: anapsapsa [ana'ps^aps^a] - Buechel: boil up, come up, as bubbles on the water (cf. psa [ps^a] - to sneeze, psapsa s'e - appearing disorderly), apablublu [apa'blublu] - to bubble up with many bubbles (cf. apablu - to crush to powder on anything, to belch, to bubble up, as air from the water; anablu - to kick dust or dirt on). anahlohlo - bubble up, as in boiling (cf. anahloka - to wear a hole(!) in, as in a moccasin, on smth.; hlohloka [h^loh^o'ka] - full of holes(!); hlokA - hollow, a hollow; hlogeca [h^loge'ca] - poor, thin, as a sick man, hollow, as a tree). So it seems to me that the ideas behind might be 'hole/hollow' (hlo), 'dust/dirt' i.e. little pieces (blu) and '(burst to) sneeze' (psa). There's also: tapsiza [txapsi'za] or tapsipsiza - to bubble up, come up, as bubbles on water; also: tapsija [txapsi'z^a] or anatapsiza [ana'txapsiz^a]; cf. psica [psi'ca] - jumping(!), psicala - flea, psipsicala [psipsi'cala] - grasshopper, psipsicala [psi'psicala] - the jumping mouse etc. So, in this case the meaning seems quite evident as also in Bavarian slang, soda pop is sometimes called 'hupfats Wossa' - 'hüpfendes Wasser' in High German -, which literally is 'jumping water' ;-) I'm ignorant whether or not there are still older ways in Lakota to give the idea of 'bubble'. Alfred Be a friend... Help support the Lakota Communities on Pine Ridge, go to: http://FriendsofPineRidgeReservation.org --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk Sat Oct 15 14:26:27 2005 From: shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk (shokooh Ingham) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2005 15:26:27 +0100 Subject: Lakota word for "bubble" ? In-Reply-To: <434BFD24.2020107@fa-kuan.muc.de> Message-ID: This is interesting. It seems to be another case of Lakota preferring verbs to nouns. In my pouring over Lakota texts, I don't think I ever saw a word equivalent to 'a bubble', but lots of words meaning 'to bubble, foam' like those mentioned by Alfred below. I would be grateful if any Lakota knows the old or new way to say 'I saw a bubble floating in the air'. It would solve a problem. Other words for foam are of course pig^a and thag^a or kathag^a. Also I remembber in the bible the storiy of the sick man by the pool at Gethsemene (if I've got the location right) when the word nas^kans^kan 'to move' was used for the water bubbling up Bruce -- "Alfred W. Tüting" wrote: > > I have been asked to find the ihunk ihanni or > "the old way," of saying > "bubble" in Lakota. > > The only way I have seen it translated is anahlohlo. > << > > > From your sample (anahlohlo, [ana'h^loh^lo]), I > assume that you mean > the verb "to bubble (up)". With this sense I also > found: > anapsapsa [ana'ps^aps^a] - Buechel: boil up, come > up, as bubbles on the > water (cf. psa [ps^a] - to sneeze, psapsa s'e - > appearing disorderly), > apablublu [apa'blublu] - to bubble up with many > bubbles (cf. apablu - to > crush to powder on anything, to belch, to bubble up, > as air from the > water; anablu - to kick dust or dirt on). > anahlohlo - bubble up, as in boiling (cf. anahloka - > to wear a hole(!) > in, as in a moccasin, on smth.; hlohloka > [h^loh^o'ka] - full of > holes(!); hlokA - hollow, a hollow; hlogeca > [h^loge'ca] - poor, thin, as > a sick man, hollow, as a tree). > So it seems to me that the ideas behind might be > 'hole/hollow' (hlo), > 'dust/dirt' i.e. little pieces (blu) and '(burst to) > sneeze' (psa). > > There's also: tapsiza [txapsi'za] or tapsipsiza - to > bubble up, come up, > as bubbles on water; also: tapsija [txapsi'z^a] or > anatapsiza > [ana'txapsiz^a]; cf. psica [psi'ca] - jumping(!), > psicala - flea, > psipsicala [psipsi'cala] - grasshopper, psipsicala > [psi'psicala] - the > jumping mouse etc. > So, in this case the meaning seems quite evident as > also in Bavarian > slang, soda pop is sometimes called 'hupfats Wossa' > - 'hüpfendes Wasser' > in High German -, which literally is 'jumping water' > ;-) > > I'm ignorant whether or not there are still older > ways in Lakota to give > the idea of 'bubble'. > Alfred ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com From jmcbride at kawnation.com Tue Oct 18 14:37:50 2005 From: jmcbride at kawnation.com (Justin McBride) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 09:37:50 -0500 Subject: Kaw Language Job Posting Message-ID: Ho, zaani! I certainly don't want to abuse the academic nature of this list by talking about my day-to-day business, but I think this might be of interest to one or more of you out there. My department here at the Kaw Nation is expanding (from one person to two, yea!) because of a new ANA grant, and we need a Project Coordinator position filled ASAP to begin work on a well-outlined Kaw language software project. If any of you or any of your students is looking for a job these days and is willing to move to windy ol' north central Oklahoma, this could be right up your alley. For more information, please visit http://www.kawnation.com/Programs/proghome.html, and click on Personnel (Jobs). I think it's the 11th job down on the list. By the way, this job will be very computer-intensive. We're looking specifically for someone with some database and design experience. Also, please feel free to forward this email to anyone else you know who may be in the market. Justin McBride Language Director & acting Webmaster Kaw Nation Drawer 50 Kaw City, OK 74641 PH (580) 269-2552 ext 241 FX (580) 269-2204 attn Language/Web Dev jmcbride at kawnation.com www.kawnation.com/langhome.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rankin at ku.edu Sat Oct 1 20:13:55 2005 From: rankin at ku.edu (Rankin, Robert L) Date: Sat, 1 Oct 2005 15:13:55 -0500 Subject: FW: Siouan languages Message-ID: Dear Colleagues, This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. Bob -----Original Message----- From: idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be [mailto:idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be] On Behalf Of idiatov Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 9:29 AM To: Rankin, Robert L Subject: Siouan languages Dear Robert (if I may), I am currently doing a typological study on the use of the interrogative pro-nouns meaning 'who?' and 'what?'. To my disappointment, information on the use of 'who?' and 'what?' is difficult to find in grammars and dictionaries. Therefore, I made up a small questionnaire of some 20 questions. May I ask you to answer the questions and translate the English sentences in the Siouan languages you are most familiar with? Even if you can do this only for a part of the questions, it will be of great use to me. Any comments you may have, are also welcome. No need to say that I will gratefully acknowledge your help when publishing or presenting the results. You may find the questionnaire attached as an a MS Word file. Kind regards, Dmitry Idiatov Center for Grammar, Cognition & Typology University of Antwerp (Belgium) PS: I presented some of the results of my research at the 6th biennial meeting of the Association for Linguistic Typology in Padang (Indonesia) this year. Please find the handout of my talk as an attachment. I left the maps out because they made the pdf-file to big. -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Questionnaire WHO&WHAT L.doc Type: application/msword Size: 35328 bytes Desc: Questionnaire WHO&WHAT L.doc URL: -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Idiatov ALT6 Handout.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 193473 bytes Desc: Idiatov ALT6 Handout.pdf URL: From John.Koontz at colorado.edu Mon Oct 3 06:24:51 2005 From: John.Koontz at colorado.edu (Koontz John E) Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2005 00:24:51 -0600 Subject: interrogative -indefinites In-Reply-To: <1128110476.433d998c2f4a1@webmail.iu.edu> Message-ID: All these interesting things about Dakotan that I was ignorant of! On Fri, 30 Sep 2005 lcumberl at indiana.edu wrote: > Lakota makes a realized/potential distinction, thus:'taku/ta'kul, as in: > 'taku icu he 'what did he take?' vs. ta'kul icukta he 'what will he take' This reminds me of the Dakota real vs. hypothetical vs. negative distinctions with the indefinite articles in Lakota, cf. Rood & Taylor, 1996:456. I don't think there's a parallel in Dhegiha, though this might be an area where I've been unobservant. The closest thing I have noticed is kki 'if' vs. kki=z^i, which looks like it should be 'if-not', but is not. But I do notice an Omaha-Ponca parallel for one aspect of these interrogative forms. The potential 'what' form in Lakota, takul, is an exact parallel for the Omaha-Ponca form agudi 'where'. INDEF yonder LOC *ta/(h)a *ku *tu La ta ku l 'what (unreal)' OP a gu di 'where' Only the WH-morpheme differs. I'm not sure what to make of it. (By way of a caution, I'm not sure everyone agrees with my etymologies after the wh-morpheme, on which all depends.) > Assiniboine doesn't have that distinction but makes a distinction between > non-specific-indefinite and specific-indefinite, thus: 'taku/ta'kux, as in > > 'taku eyaku he 'what did he take?' vs. ta'kux 'eyaku he 'what, specifically, > did he take?' ... > There are also the pairs, tuwe/tuwex and tukte/tuktex, but not tona: *tonax The -x reminds me of =xti. Does =x have any other functions? There's something similar with a different morphologies in Omaha-Ponca: edadaN eda'daN aNgaghe=tta=i 'what (specifically) should we do?' (asking for a course of action) iNdadaN iNda'daN=xti ed=ehe=tta 'what (indefinite) should I say?' (to self when put on the spot) e'be kki e'be gdhe ethedaN? 'which (of us) should go back home?' ebe' ebe'=di (s^)ne' a? 'who are you going to?' From dvklinguist2003 at yahoo.com Mon Oct 3 19:28:42 2005 From: dvklinguist2003 at yahoo.com (David Kaufman) Date: Mon, 3 Oct 2005 12:28:42 -0700 Subject: Dictionary update Message-ID: Bob & John, Just FYI--the Biloxi-English portion of the revised dictionary is basically done, but I do emphasize the word "basically." There is of course more tweeking and tinkering to do as more discoveries are made and cognates found. I have also not put in all of the affixes as those still need to be ironed out in conjunction with a future revised grammar. But at least it is basically easier to use I think than Dorsey's original. I have not added the references yet to the D-S dictionary, which I will do over time. (I'm not sure yet about including the actual D-S word or just the page and column reference numbers in the D-S dictionary.) If either or both of you would like a copy for your comparative files or whatever, I'll be more than happy to send it along as an email attachment. I can do the same once I have the English-Biloxi portion done as well, which I'll be begin working on soon. BTW Bob, are you willing to share what you have done so far on your revised Ofo dictionary? Dave __________________________________________________ Do You Yahoo!? Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around http://mail.yahoo.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From pustetrm at yahoo.com Tue Oct 4 21:08:03 2005 From: pustetrm at yahoo.com (REGINA PUSTET) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 14:08:03 -0700 Subject: FW: Siouan languages In-Reply-To: Message-ID: >Dear Colleagues, >This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. >Bob I also got this message, and it looks like I'll be doing the Lakota part unless somebody else on the list intervenes -- I'm actually encouraging you guys to intervene because at the moment, my deadlines are killing me and this is not going to change until the end of this year. Regina "Rankin, Robert L" wrote:Dear Colleagues, This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. Bob -----Original Message----- From: idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be [mailto:idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be] On Behalf Of idiatov Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 9:29 AM To: Rankin, Robert L Subject: Siouan languages Dear Robert (if I may), I am currently doing a typological study on the use of the interrogative pro-nouns meaning 'who?' and 'what?'. To my disappointment, information on the use of 'who?' and 'what?' is difficult to find in grammars and dictionaries. Therefore, I made up a small questionnaire of some 20 questions. May I ask you to answer the questions and translate the English sentences in the Siouan languages you are most familiar with? Even if you can do this only for a part of the questions, it will be of great use to me. Any comments you may have, are also welcome. No need to say that I will gratefully acknowledge your help when publishing or presenting the results. You may find the questionnaire attached as an a MS Word file. Kind regards, Dmitry Idiatov Center for Grammar, Cognition & Typology University of Antwerp (Belgium) PS: I presented some of the results of my research at the 6th biennial meeting of the Association for Linguistic Typology in Padang (Indonesia) this year. Please find the handout of my talk as an attachment. I left the maps out because they made the pdf-file to big. --------------------------------- Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From rood at spot.Colorado.EDU Tue Oct 4 22:23:43 2005 From: rood at spot.Colorado.EDU (ROOD DAVID S) Date: Tue, 4 Oct 2005 16:23:43 -0600 Subject: FW: Siouan languages In-Reply-To: <20051004210803.63203.qmail@web54611.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: I am doing one of these for Wichita, and it's going to require some elicitation of forms I don't have. I don't want to do another one, so I'm not going to claim Lakota here. I do think it's a fascinating questionnaire, however. David David S. Rood Dept. of Linguistics Univ. of Colorado 295 UCB Boulder, CO 80309-0295 USA rood at colorado.edu On Tue, 4 Oct 2005, REGINA PUSTET wrote: > >Dear Colleagues, > > >This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. > > >Bob > > I also got this message, and it looks like I'll be doing the Lakota part > unless somebody else on the list intervenes -- I'm actually encouraging > you guys to intervene because at the moment, my deadlines are killing me > and this is not going to change until the end of this year. > > Regina > > > > "Rankin, Robert L" wrote:Dear Colleagues, > > This arrived in my absence. Some of you may have received it also. > > Bob > > -----Original Message----- > From: idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be [mailto:idiatov at uia.ua.ac.be] On Behalf Of > idiatov > Sent: Tuesday, September 27, 2005 9:29 AM > To: Rankin, Robert L > Subject: Siouan languages > > > Dear Robert (if I may), > > I am currently doing a typological study on the use of the interrogative > pro-nouns meaning 'who?' and 'what?'. To my disappointment, information > on the use of 'who?' and 'what?' is difficult to find in grammars and > dictionaries. Therefore, I made up a small questionnaire of some 20 > questions. May I ask you to answer the questions and translate the > English sentences in the Siouan languages you are most familiar with? > Even if you can do this only for a part of the questions, it will be of > great use to me. Any comments you may have, are also welcome. No need to > say that I will gratefully acknowledge your help when publishing or > presenting the results. You may find the questionnaire attached as an a > MS Word file. > > Kind regards, > > Dmitry Idiatov > > Center for Grammar, Cognition & Typology > University of Antwerp (Belgium) > > PS: I presented some of the results of my research at the 6th biennial > meeting of the Association for Linguistic Typology in Padang (Indonesia) > this year. Please find the handout of my talk as an attachment. I left > the maps out because they made the pdf-file to big. > > > > --------------------------------- > Yahoo! for Good > Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. From jmcbride at kawnation.com Wed Oct 5 13:11:07 2005 From: jmcbride at kawnation.com (Justin McBride) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 08:11:07 -0500 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings Message-ID: Ho, zaaniN. Yesterday I received an email message from a book company asking us if we were interested in possibly publishing the proceedings of the Siouan conference from a few months ago. I personally don't care one way or the other, and Dr. Rankin says he's probably a little too busy. But he suggested I forward the message to the list. If there's a consensus on this from all the presenters, I suppose we all could brush up our papers and put a little proposal together. I've included the message below. Just let me know what you think, on or off board. WiblahaN. Justin T. McBride Language Director & acting Webmaster Kaw Nation Drawer 50 Kaw City, OK 74641 PH (580) 269-2552 ext 241 FX (580) 269-2204 attn Language/Web Dev jmcbride at kawnation.com www.kawnation.com/langhome.html -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Dear Professor McBride, (hee, hee, hee -jm) I am writing to enquire whether you have any interest in submitting a proposal for the publication (perhaps as an edited collection of essays) of the proceedings for the 25th Annual Siouan and Caddoan Languages and Linguistics Conference, which was held on 17th to 19th June 2005. Cambridge Scholars Press is at the present expanding to include titles from linguistics, and the areas covered in your conference are of direct interest. Naturally, if you already have a publisher, or have no interest in converting the proceedings into a publication, please accept my apologies for this message. Amanda Millar Cambridge Scholars Press www.CambridgeScholarsPress.com -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From daltshul at rci.rutgers.edu Wed Oct 5 13:20:12 2005 From: daltshul at rci.rutgers.edu (Daniel Altshuler) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 09:20:12 -0400 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: <000c01c5c9ae$3fc51420$3e01a8c0@Language> Message-ID: Hi Justin, On board. I think the conference was very interesting last year and I don't mind brushing up my paper a bit. Let me know. Best, Daniel > Yesterday I received an email message from a book company asking us if we > were interested in possibly publishing the proceedings of the Siouan > conference from a few months ago. I personally don't care one way or the > other, and Dr. Rankin says he's probably a little too busy. But he > suggested I forward the message to the list. If there's a consensus on > this from all the presenters, I suppose we all could brush up our papers > and put a little proposal together. I've included the message below. > Just let me know what you think, on or off board. > > WiblahaN. > > Justin T. McBride > Language Director & acting Webmaster > Kaw Nation > Drawer 50 > Kaw City, OK 74641 > PH (580) 269-2552 ext 241 > FX (580) 269-2204 attn Language/Web Dev > jmcbride at kawnation.com > www.kawnation.com/langhome.html > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Dear Professor McBride, (hee, hee, hee -jm) > > I am writing to enquire whether you have any interest in submitting a > proposal for the publication (perhaps as an edited collection of essays) > of > the proceedings for the 25th Annual Siouan and Caddoan Languages and > Linguistics Conference, which was held on 17th to 19th June 2005. > > Cambridge Scholars Press is at the present expanding to include titles > from > linguistics, and the areas covered in your conference are of direct > interest. > > Naturally, if you already have a publisher, or have no interest in > converting the proceedings into a publication, please accept my apologies > for this message. > > Amanda Millar > Cambridge Scholars Press > www.CambridgeScholarsPress.com > ================ Daniel Altshuler Department of Linguistics Rutgers University email: daltshul at rci.rutgers.edu web: http://www.rci.rutgers.edu/~daltshul ========================================= From shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk Wed Oct 5 20:50:28 2005 From: shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk (shokooh Ingham) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 21:50:28 +0100 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: <000c01c5c9ae$3fc51420$3e01a8c0@Language> Message-ID: Dear Justin I'm sure I could make my paper presentable, if it was decided to go ahead Yours Bruce Ingham --- Justin McBride wrote: > Ho, zaaniN. > > Yesterday I received an email message from a book > company asking us if we were interested in possibly > publishing the proceedings of the Siouan conference > from a few months ago. I personally don't care one > way or the other, and Dr. Rankin says he's probably > a little too busy. But he suggested I forward the > message to the list. If there's a consensus on this > from all the presenters, I suppose we all could > brush up our papers and put a little proposal > together. I've included the message below. Just > let me know what you think, on or off board. > > WiblahaN. > > Justin T. McBride > Language Director & acting Webmaster > Kaw Nation > Drawer 50 > Kaw City, OK 74641 > PH (580) 269-2552 ext 241 > FX (580) 269-2204 attn Language/Web Dev > jmcbride at kawnation.com > www.kawnation.com/langhome.html > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > Dear Professor McBride, (hee, hee, hee -jm) > > I am writing to enquire whether you have any > interest in submitting a > proposal for the publication (perhaps as an edited > collection of essays) of > the proceedings for the 25th Annual Siouan and > Caddoan Languages and > Linguistics Conference, which was held on 17th to > 19th June 2005. > > Cambridge Scholars Press is at the present expanding > to include titles from > linguistics, and the areas covered in your > conference are of direct interest. > > Naturally, if you already have a publisher, or have > no interest in > converting the proceedings into a publication, > please accept my apologies > for this message. > > Amanda Millar > Cambridge Scholars Press > www.CambridgeScholarsPress.com > ___________________________________________________________ Yahoo! Messenger - NEW crystal clear PC to PC calling worldwide with voicemail http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com From John.Koontz at colorado.edu Wed Oct 5 22:34:37 2005 From: John.Koontz at colorado.edu (Koontz John E) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 16:34:37 -0600 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: <000c01c5c9ae$3fc51420$3e01a8c0@Language> Message-ID: On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Justin McBride wrote: > Just let me know what you think, on or off board. I would be willing to participate, but I'm wondering what sort of arrangement Cambridge Scholars' Press anticipates. I hadn't heard of them before, and I'm wondering what their approach is. From rood at spot.Colorado.EDU Wed Oct 5 22:40:03 2005 From: rood at spot.Colorado.EDU (ROOD DAVID S) Date: Wed, 5 Oct 2005 16:40:03 -0600 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Folks, I wasn't at the meeting, but I'll stick in my two cents anyway. Take a good look at the publisher before you plunge into a project like this. Academic publishing is like everything else that comes via email: some of it is legit, and some isn't. Ask for examples of other books these folks have published and decide whether you want to be part of something similar. Also ask about costs: in many fields, publishers charge authors per page. We don't do that in linguistics most of the time, but check on how this publisher thinks. David S. Rood Dept. of Linguistics Univ. of Colorado 295 UCB Boulder, CO 80309-0295 USA rood at colorado.edu On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Koontz John E wrote: > On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Justin McBride wrote: > > Just let me know what you think, on or off board. > > I would be willing to participate, but I'm wondering what sort of > arrangement Cambridge Scholars' Press anticipates. I hadn't heard of them > before, and I'm wondering what their approach is. > From shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk Mon Oct 10 11:26:59 2005 From: shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk (shokooh Ingham) Date: Mon, 10 Oct 2005 12:26:59 +0100 Subject: Siouan Conference Proceedings In-Reply-To: Message-ID: Dear Siouanists, Following David's comment below, I have asked two contacts over here about Scholar's press, and although one of them, Probsthain's the Orientalist Bookshop, said they had heard of them, they couldn't bring any titles to mind. I've also heard of them, but can't think where. Still we may just be reading the wrong books. It would be interesting to know what they suggest. Bruce --- ROOD DAVID S wrote: > > Folks, I wasn't at the meeting, but I'll stick in my > two cents anyway. > Take a good look at the publisher before you plunge > into a project like > this. Academic publishing is like everything else > that comes via email: > some of it is legit, and some isn't. Ask for > examples of other books > these folks have published and decide whether you > want to be part of > something similar. Also ask about costs: in many > fields, publishers > charge authors per page. We don't do that in > linguistics most of the > time, but check on how this publisher thinks. > > David S. Rood > Dept. of Linguistics > Univ. of Colorado > 295 UCB > Boulder, CO 80309-0295 > USA > rood at colorado.edu > > On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Koontz John E wrote: > > > On Wed, 5 Oct 2005, Justin McBride wrote: > > > Just let me know what you think, on or off > board. > > > > I would be willing to participate, but I'm > wondering what sort of > > arrangement Cambridge Scholars' Press anticipates. > I hadn't heard of them > > before, and I'm wondering what their approach is. > > > ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com From okibjonathan at yahoo.com Tue Oct 11 15:22:25 2005 From: okibjonathan at yahoo.com (Jonathan Holmes) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 08:22:25 -0700 Subject: Lakota word for "bubble" ? Message-ID: I have been asked to find the ihunk ihanni or "the old way," of saying "bubble" in Lakota. The only way I have seen it translated is anahlohlo. Does anyone happen to know the difference between the modern way and the old way to translate this word? Be a friend... Help support the Lakota Communities on Pine Ridge, go to: http://FriendsofPineRidgeReservation.org --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From ti at fa-kuan.muc.de Tue Oct 11 17:57:56 2005 From: ti at fa-kuan.muc.de (=?ISO-8859-1?Q?=22Alfred_W=2E_T=FCting=22?=) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 19:57:56 +0200 Subject: Lakota word for "bubble" ? Message-ID: > I have been asked to find the ihunk ihanni or "the old way," of saying "bubble" in Lakota. The only way I have seen it translated is anahlohlo. << From your sample (anahlohlo, [ana'h^loh^lo]), I assume that you mean the verb "to bubble (up)". With this sense I also found: anapsapsa [ana'ps^aps^a] - Buechel: boil up, come up, as bubbles on the water (cf. psa [ps^a] - to sneeze, psapsa s'e - appearing disorderly), apablublu [apa'blublu] - to bubble up with many bubbles (cf. apablu - to crush to powder on anything, to belch, to bubble up, as air from the water; anablu - to kick dust or dirt on). anahlohlo - bubble up, as in boiling (cf. anahloka - to wear a hole(!) in, as in a moccasin, on smth.; hlohloka [h^loh^o'ka] - full of holes(!); hlokA - hollow, a hollow; hlogeca [h^loge'ca] - poor, thin, as a sick man, hollow, as a tree). So it seems to me that the ideas behind might be 'hole/hollow' (hlo), 'dust/dirt' i.e. little pieces (blu) and '(burst to) sneeze' (psa). There's also: tapsiza [txapsi'za] or tapsipsiza - to bubble up, come up, as bubbles on water; also: tapsija [txapsi'z^a] or anatapsiza [ana'txapsiz^a]; cf. psica [psi'ca] - jumping(!), psicala - flea, psipsicala [psipsi'cala] - grasshopper, psipsicala [psi'psicala] - the jumping mouse etc. So, in this case the meaning seems quite evident as also in Bavarian slang, soda pop is sometimes called 'hupfats Wossa' - 'h?pfendes Wasser' in High German -, which literally is 'jumping water' ;-) I'm ignorant whether or not there are still older ways in Lakota to give the idea of 'bubble'. Alfred From okibjonathan at yahoo.com Wed Oct 12 00:11:43 2005 From: okibjonathan at yahoo.com (Jonathan Holmes) Date: Tue, 11 Oct 2005 17:11:43 -0700 Subject: Lakota word for "bubble" ? In-Reply-To: <434BFD24.2020107@fa-kuan.muc.de> Message-ID: Thanks for taking the time Alfred, this helps a great deal. Jonathan "Alfred W. T?ting" wrote: > I have been asked to find the ihunk ihanni or "the old way," of saying "bubble" in Lakota. The only way I have seen it translated is anahlohlo. << >>From your sample (anahlohlo, [ana'h^loh^lo]), I assume that you mean the verb "to bubble (up)". With this sense I also found: anapsapsa [ana'ps^aps^a] - Buechel: boil up, come up, as bubbles on the water (cf. psa [ps^a] - to sneeze, psapsa s'e - appearing disorderly), apablublu [apa'blublu] - to bubble up with many bubbles (cf. apablu - to crush to powder on anything, to belch, to bubble up, as air from the water; anablu - to kick dust or dirt on). anahlohlo - bubble up, as in boiling (cf. anahloka - to wear a hole(!) in, as in a moccasin, on smth.; hlohloka [h^loh^o'ka] - full of holes(!); hlokA - hollow, a hollow; hlogeca [h^loge'ca] - poor, thin, as a sick man, hollow, as a tree). So it seems to me that the ideas behind might be 'hole/hollow' (hlo), 'dust/dirt' i.e. little pieces (blu) and '(burst to) sneeze' (psa). There's also: tapsiza [txapsi'za] or tapsipsiza - to bubble up, come up, as bubbles on water; also: tapsija [txapsi'z^a] or anatapsiza [ana'txapsiz^a]; cf. psica [psi'ca] - jumping(!), psicala - flea, psipsicala [psipsi'cala] - grasshopper, psipsicala [psi'psicala] - the jumping mouse etc. So, in this case the meaning seems quite evident as also in Bavarian slang, soda pop is sometimes called 'hupfats Wossa' - 'h?pfendes Wasser' in High German -, which literally is 'jumping water' ;-) I'm ignorant whether or not there are still older ways in Lakota to give the idea of 'bubble'. Alfred Be a friend... Help support the Lakota Communities on Pine Ridge, go to: http://FriendsofPineRidgeReservation.org --------------------------------- Yahoo! Music Unlimited - Access over 1 million songs. Try it free. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: From shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk Sat Oct 15 14:26:27 2005 From: shokoohbanou at yahoo.co.uk (shokooh Ingham) Date: Sat, 15 Oct 2005 15:26:27 +0100 Subject: Lakota word for "bubble" ? In-Reply-To: <434BFD24.2020107@fa-kuan.muc.de> Message-ID: This is interesting. It seems to be another case of Lakota preferring verbs to nouns. In my pouring over Lakota texts, I don't think I ever saw a word equivalent to 'a bubble', but lots of words meaning 'to bubble, foam' like those mentioned by Alfred below. I would be grateful if any Lakota knows the old or new way to say 'I saw a bubble floating in the air'. It would solve a problem. Other words for foam are of course pig^a and thag^a or kathag^a. Also I remembber in the bible the storiy of the sick man by the pool at Gethsemene (if I've got the location right) when the word nas^kans^kan 'to move' was used for the water bubbling up Bruce -- "Alfred W. T?ting" wrote: > > I have been asked to find the ihunk ihanni or > "the old way," of saying > "bubble" in Lakota. > > The only way I have seen it translated is anahlohlo. > << > > > From your sample (anahlohlo, [ana'h^loh^lo]), I > assume that you mean > the verb "to bubble (up)". With this sense I also > found: > anapsapsa [ana'ps^aps^a] - Buechel: boil up, come > up, as bubbles on the > water (cf. psa [ps^a] - to sneeze, psapsa s'e - > appearing disorderly), > apablublu [apa'blublu] - to bubble up with many > bubbles (cf. apablu - to > crush to powder on anything, to belch, to bubble up, > as air from the > water; anablu - to kick dust or dirt on). > anahlohlo - bubble up, as in boiling (cf. anahloka - > to wear a hole(!) > in, as in a moccasin, on smth.; hlohloka > [h^loh^o'ka] - full of > holes(!); hlokA - hollow, a hollow; hlogeca > [h^loge'ca] - poor, thin, as > a sick man, hollow, as a tree). > So it seems to me that the ideas behind might be > 'hole/hollow' (hlo), > 'dust/dirt' i.e. little pieces (blu) and '(burst to) > sneeze' (psa). > > There's also: tapsiza [txapsi'za] or tapsipsiza - to > bubble up, come up, > as bubbles on water; also: tapsija [txapsi'z^a] or > anatapsiza > [ana'txapsiz^a]; cf. psica [psi'ca] - jumping(!), > psicala - flea, > psipsicala [psipsi'cala] - grasshopper, psipsicala > [psi'psicala] - the > jumping mouse etc. > So, in this case the meaning seems quite evident as > also in Bavarian > slang, soda pop is sometimes called 'hupfats Wossa' > - 'h?pfendes Wasser' > in High German -, which literally is 'jumping water' > ;-) > > I'm ignorant whether or not there are still older > ways in Lakota to give > the idea of 'bubble'. > Alfred ___________________________________________________________ To help you stay safe and secure online, we've developed the all new Yahoo! Security Centre. http://uk.security.yahoo.com From jmcbride at kawnation.com Tue Oct 18 14:37:50 2005 From: jmcbride at kawnation.com (Justin McBride) Date: Tue, 18 Oct 2005 09:37:50 -0500 Subject: Kaw Language Job Posting Message-ID: Ho, zaani! I certainly don't want to abuse the academic nature of this list by talking about my day-to-day business, but I think this might be of interest to one or more of you out there. My department here at the Kaw Nation is expanding (from one person to two, yea!) because of a new ANA grant, and we need a Project Coordinator position filled ASAP to begin work on a well-outlined Kaw language software project. If any of you or any of your students is looking for a job these days and is willing to move to windy ol' north central Oklahoma, this could be right up your alley. For more information, please visit http://www.kawnation.com/Programs/proghome.html, and click on Personnel (Jobs). I think it's the 11th job down on the list. By the way, this job will be very computer-intensive. We're looking specifically for someone with some database and design experience. Also, please feel free to forward this email to anyone else you know who may be in the market. Justin McBride Language Director & acting Webmaster Kaw Nation Drawer 50 Kaw City, OK 74641 PH (580) 269-2552 ext 241 FX (580) 269-2204 attn Language/Web Dev jmcbride at kawnation.com www.kawnation.com/langhome.html -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: