Number 'nine' in Chiwere.

[Campbell, Sky]

I’ve come across a variant of “nine” that I’d seen a couple years ago but then forgot about it.  It is listed like this in two sources:

kjag-kæ (kshanke) – An Elementary Book of the Ioway Language (1843) by Hamilton and Irvin

Ek jdfk (ikshanke) – Wdtwhtl Wdwdklha Tva Eva Wdhonetl (1834) by Merrill

Merrill’s form follows the ordinal number pattern (IE “ninth” rather than “nine”) but the “k” is still present which is what has me curious.  To date, all other sources I’ve come across only have “sanke/shanke” (or something along those lines) with no “k”.  It has been mentioned here that “sanke” was borrowed from Algonquian.  Does the inclusion of “k” also fit with other Algonquian “nines”?  This extra “k” had me take another look at Iren’s information on the Hocąk nine:

hižąkicųšgųnį - hižą (ONE) - ki- cųųšgųnį (be.without)

But nothing has caught my eye there beyond the “ki” which had me think about the “minus one” or “less one” idea that some of you said is the theme behind many of the “nine” terms and has me tentatively wondering:

iyąnki – one

ksanke – nine (going with the “k” variant here…and trying to pronounce it sounds like “kisanke”)

And wondering about this possibility:

(iyąn)k(i)sanke

Does this sound familiar to anyone?  Our “iyąnki” looks to be very close to the above “hiząki” and that would fit in my idea but it would be a stretch to try to shoehorn in the rest.  Does “sanke” follow the pattern of “less one” in Algonquian?  It looks like if my idea was to hold any water, then the “sanke” part would have to somehow fill the “less one” role if that “k” is indeed a remnant of “iyąnki” at the front.

Thoughts?

Sky Campbell, B. A.
Language Director
Otoe-Missouria Tribe
580-723-4466 ext. 111
sky at omtribe.org

From: Siouan Linguistics [mailto:SIOUAN at listserv.unl.edu] On Behalf Of Rankin, Robert L.
Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2013 7:42 PM
To: SIOUAN at listserv.unl.edu
Subject: Re: Number 'nine' in Chiwere.

Every little bit is interesting and helpful.  Thanks Dave.  Bob
________________________________
From: Siouan Linguistics [SIOUAN at listserv.unl.edu] on behalf of David Costa [pankihtamwa at EARTHLINK.NET]
Sent: Wednesday, September 18, 2013 6:24 PM
To: SIOUAN at listserv.unl.edu<mailto:SIOUAN at listserv.unl.edu>
Subject: Re: Number 'nine' in Chiwere.
I know it's not all that important, but in the oldest Miami-Illinois records, "eight" is para·re. By the late 1700s, it's pala·ni in all dialects.

Dave

I need to add a little to my earlier comments on 'seven' and 'eight'.  Chiwere only shows the partial quinary traces in 'eight', not 'seven'.  And they seem to have borrowed it from Omaha.  Below is the comparative dictionary entry for 'eight', and it shows the Omaha influence.
GLOSS[ eight

CH[ gre•rá•brį RR


Proto-Dhegiha[ *hpe•-rá•wrį
OM[ ppeðábðį C
PN[ ppe•ðábðį RR
KS[ ppe•yá•blį
OS[ hpe•ðá•brį
QU[ ppedá•bnį


ProtoSE[ *pa-ra•nį


OF[ pạ́tạnĭ DS-328b
OF[ pA´tAnî Swanton 1909-485


TU[ pālán (N); palāni, palāli, palāniq H
TU[ pǎlan´ Hw
TU[ pelą̈ʹk‘ Sapir
TU[ balai´n Fracht
TU[ bilaæ:kh, bilæ̨:kh Mithun


OTHLGS[ Miami: palani (with variant forms recorded.)


COM[ The CH pattern is almost certainly borrowed from DH, as the basis for
this numeral is ‘three’, which, in CH, has undergone normal development to
{dá•ñį}, not {*ra•brį}. This term is probably not PSI in origin as it
occurs in the proper phonological form (*hpV + ‘three’) only in OVS and DH.
Its presence in Illinois Algonquian (Rankin, 1985) shows that it spread from
an OVS dialect. No actual PSI term for ‘eight’ is currently reconstructible.


Treatment of 'seven' follows in a separate message.

Bob



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