<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">Thanks a lot, Bruce,</span></font><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">only now I know that I should've remembered _kizuzeca_, at least. Now, I found still another one: kimakxa (B.-M. "turn into soil, as anything rotten in the ground"). </span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">Alfred</span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">P.S. I wonder if kimimila (butterfly) has smth to do with this issue (mila??)</span></font></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div><br><div><div>Am 10.12.2007 um 13:47 schrieb shokooh Ingham:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">I know kimathathanka 'turn into a buffalo', kizuzeca 'turn into a snake', kiwitko 'go mad', kiwanice 'turn into nothing' and kiwe 'turn into blood'; a very useful prefix. You can also use ic'icag^a/mic'icag^e 'make oneself into', but I think that is more conscious, whereas the first is non-intentional perhaps.<br>Bruce<br><br><b><i>""Alfred W. Tüting"" <<a href="mailto:ti@fa-kuan.muc.de">ti@fa-kuan.muc.de</a>></i></b> wrote:<blockquote class="replbq" style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Times; font-size: 16px;">> Fascinating examples from Clive. The use of a- to mean 'more than' is an interesting one in Lakota. It seems to be not totally productive and is a bit illusive, but one sees examples of it. I have a feeling that it is more frequent in Dakota, but can't think on what basis I have this feeling. Does anyone else have this impression?<br>Bruce < </span><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Times" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 16px;"><br></span></font><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Times" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 16px;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></font></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Times; font-size: 16px;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">It's my impression that with regard to productiveness, it's maybe comparable to the use of ki- (in the sense of "become", "turn to") e.g. kiaguyapi (to turn into bread). Does anyone happen to know of other renderings like "turn into stone" (petrify) or such??</span></font></span></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></font></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Times; font-size: 16px;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">BTW, this a- in the sense of "more than" seems to express a "general idea" found also in other languages. E.g. think of Hungarian adessive -nál/-nél (at) also used as comparative (e.g. ennél jobb - better than this).</span></font></span></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></font></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Times; font-size: 16px;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">Alfred</span></font></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Times; font-size: 16px;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;"><br></span></font><br><b><i>""Alfred W. Tüting"" <<a href="mailto:ti@fa-kuan.muc.de">ti@fa-kuan.muc.de</a>></i></b> wrote:<blockquote class="replbq" style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: 'Marker Felt'; line-height: 20px;"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Courier; font-size: 13px; font-weight: bold; line-height: normal; white-space: pre;">> "LochiNpi kiN he iyes^ akhiphapi kta thawat'elyapi na iyoks^ica uNpi <br>> kiN he e athawat'elyapi s^ni kiN hecha."e<br><br>> [=As for themselves, they preferred facing hunger,<br> to living in <br>> sadness (i.e. loneliness) - such were their (feelings) or 'such was <br>> their situation'.]<br>> (lit. : they felt willing to face the prospect of hunger, and they <br>> did not feel a greater willingness to be living in desolation - <br>> that's the way it was).</span><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Courier; font-size: 13px; font-weight: bold; line-height: normal; white-space: pre;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Courier; font-size: 13px; font-weight: bold; line-height: normal; white-space: pre;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="line-height: normal; white-space: pre;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt"><font class="Apple-style-span" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">(LoÄ‹inpi kin he iyeṡ aḱip'a pi kta ṫawat'elya pi na<br> iyokiṡica un pi kin he e</span></font></font></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="line-height: normal; white-space: pre;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt"><font class="Apple-style-span" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">aṫawat'elya pi ṡni kin héċa.)</span></font></font></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: Courier; font-size: 13px; font-weight: bold; line-height: normal; white-space: pre;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: GentiumAlt; font-size: 18px; line-height: normal; white-space: pre;">(...)</span></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px; line-height: normal; white-space: pre;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px; line-height: normal; white-space: pre;">BTW, I like your reading of a-ṫawat'elyA <- a-waṡte (better than), it's very</span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px; line-height: normal; white-space: pre;">convincing.</span></font></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="line-height: normal; white-space: pre;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;"><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></span></font></span></div><div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="line-height: normal; white-space: pre;"><font class="Apple-style-span" face="GentiumAlt" size="5"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 18px;">Alfred</span></font></span></div></span></blockquote></span></div></div></blockquote><br><div> <br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><hr size="1"> Sent from <a href="http://us.rd.yahoo.com/mailuk/taglines/isp/control/*http://us.rd.yahoo.com/evt=51949/*http://uk.docs.yahoo.com/mail/winter07.html">Yahoo!</a> - a smarter inbox.</blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>