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<DIV><FONT color=#800080>Perhaps I missed it, as to this prefix "ki-" in
L/Dakota. Below, it is said that it's "in the sence of 'become'/
'turn to'". So then, is it an instrumental prefix or is it a reflexsive
element?? If a reflexive, which is the same element for reflexive in
IOM, I can see how it able to effect the meanings and conotations below.
If it is an instrumental, ....I'll further understanding, as the equivalent in
IOM is "gi-" indicating the action is accomplished by means of an
instrument.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT color=#800080>Jimm</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=shokoohbanou@yahoo.co.uk
href="mailto:shokoohbanou@yahoo.co.uk">shokooh Ingham</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=siouan@lists.colorado.edu
href="mailto:siouan@lists.colorado.edu">siouan@lists.colorado.edu</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Monday, December 10, 2007 6:47
AM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: FEELINGS (Abstract
Notions)</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>I know kimathathanka 'turn into a buffalo', kizuzeca 'turn into
a snake', kiwitko 'go mad', kiwanice 'turn into nothing' and kiwe 'turn into
blood'; a very useful prefix. You can also use ic'icag^a/mic'icag^e
'make oneself into', but I think that is more conscious, whereas the first is
non-intentional perhaps.<BR>Bruce<BR><BR><B><I>""Alfred W. Tüting"" <<A
href="mailto:ti@fa-kuan.muc.de">ti@fa-kuan.muc.de</A>></I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid"><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times">>
Fascinating examples from Clive. The use of a- to mean 'more than' is
an interesting one in Lakota. It seems to be not totally productive
and is a bit illusive, but one sees examples of it. I have a
feeling that it is more frequent in Dakota, but can't think on what basis I
have this feeling. Does anyone else have this impression?<BR>Bruce
< </SPAN>
<DIV><FONT class=Apple-style-span face=Times size=4><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span style="FONT-SIZE: 16px"><BR></SPAN></FONT>
<DIV><FONT class=Apple-style-span face=Times size=4><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span style="FONT-SIZE: 16px"><BR
class=webkit-block-placeholder></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times"><FONT class=Apple-style-span
face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px">It's my impression that with regard to
productiveness, it's maybe comparable to the use of ki- (in the sense of
"become", "turn to") e.g. kiaguyapi (to turn into bread). Does anyone happen
to know of other renderings like "turn into stone" (petrify) or
such??</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT class=Apple-style-span face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span style="FONT-SIZE: 18px"><BR
class=webkit-block-placeholder></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times"><FONT class=Apple-style-span
face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px">Alfred</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 16px; FONT-FAMILY: Times"><FONT class=Apple-style-span
face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px"><BR></SPAN></FONT><BR><B><I>""Alfred W. Tüting""
<<A
href="mailto:ti@fa-kuan.muc.de">ti@fa-kuan.muc.de</A>></I></B> wrote:
<BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid"><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span
style="LINE-HEIGHT: 20px; FONT-FAMILY: 'Marker Felt'"><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: Courier; WHITE-SPACE: pre">>
"LochiNpi kiN he iyes^ akhiphapi kta thawat'elyapi na iyoks^ica uNpi
<BR>> kiN he e athawat'elyapi s^ni kiN hecha."<BR><BR>> [=As for
themselves, they preferred facing hunger,<BR>to living in <BR>> sadness
(i.e. loneliness) - such were their (feelings) or 'such was <BR>> their
situation'.]<BR>> (lit. : they felt willing to face the prospect of
hunger, and they <BR>> did not feel a greater willingness to be living
in desolation - <BR>> that's the way it was).</SPAN>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: Courier; WHITE-SPACE: pre"><BR
class=webkit-block-placeholder></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: Courier; WHITE-SPACE: pre"><BR
class=webkit-block-placeholder></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="LINE-HEIGHT: normal; WHITE-SPACE: pre"><FONT class=Apple-style-span
face=GentiumAlt><FONT class=Apple-style-span size=5><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span style="FONT-SIZE: 18px">(Loċinpi kin he iyeṡ
aḱip'a pi kta ṫawat'elya pi na<BR>iyokiṡica un pi kin he
e</SPAN></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="LINE-HEIGHT: normal; WHITE-SPACE: pre"><FONT class=Apple-style-span
face=GentiumAlt><FONT class=Apple-style-span size=5><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span style="FONT-SIZE: 18px">aṫawat'elya pi ṡni kin
héċa.)</SPAN></FONT></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 13px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: Courier; WHITE-SPACE: pre"><BR
class=webkit-block-placeholder></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; FONT-FAMILY: GentiumAlt; WHITE-SPACE: pre">(...)</SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT class=Apple-style-span face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; WHITE-SPACE: pre"><BR
class=webkit-block-placeholder></SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT class=Apple-style-span face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; WHITE-SPACE: pre">BTW, I like
your reading of a-ṫawat'elyA <- a-waṡte (better than), it's
very</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT class=Apple-style-span face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN
class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px; LINE-HEIGHT: normal; WHITE-SPACE: pre">convincing.</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="LINE-HEIGHT: normal; WHITE-SPACE: pre"><FONT class=Apple-style-span
face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px"><BR
class=webkit-block-placeholder></SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="LINE-HEIGHT: normal; WHITE-SPACE: pre"><FONT class=Apple-style-span
face=GentiumAlt size=5><SPAN class=Apple-style-span
style="FONT-SIZE: 18px">Alfred</SPAN></FONT></SPAN></DIV></SPAN></BLOCKQUOTE></SPAN></DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR>
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