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<div style="direction: ltr;font-family: Arial;color: #000000;font-size: 14pt;"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size:15px">> Bob, I know you and John probably told me about this 20 years ago, but which Siouan language is <i>mitákopa</i> from? That
one's pretty blatant, since it's all over Algonquian and it has a clear etymology ("wood string") in that family.<br>
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<font size="4">That's Dakotan. But all the Mississippi Valley Siouan languages plus Tutelo have some version of this loan, probably from different Algonquian dialects. I think Hochunk is
</font></span><font size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse:separate; font-family:Helvetica; font-style:normal; font-variant:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; line-height:normal; orphans:2; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:2; word-spacing:0px"><i><span style="font-family:Arial">m±ègú
</span></i><span style="font-family:Arial">and may well be from Menomini. It is underlying
<font size="4">Hochunk </font></span></span></span></font><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size:15px"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse:separate; font-family:Helvetica; font-style:normal; font-variant:normal; font-weight:normal; letter-spacing:normal; line-height:normal; orphans:2; text-indent:0px; text-transform:none; white-space:normal; widows:2; word-spacing:0px"><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><font size="4">m±tkú.
</font></span></i><span style="font-family:Arial"><font size="4"><font size="4">I also talk about 'bow' in that
<i>Histories of Maize</i> paper.</font></font></span><i><span style="font-family:Arial"><br>
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<div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size:15px">I suspect that "nine" word is ultimately borrowed from Algonquian into Siouan (and not the other way around), but its etymology isn't totally clean in Algonquian, either. Rich and I took a stab at that
one in our paper for the Frank Siebert festscrift. <br>
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Yes, I read it. You and Rich may be right. Ives and I have gone back and forth over this. When I last talked with him about it he took the view that Algonquian borrowed it from Siouan and I took the opposite view. I guess neither family wants the poor orphan.</font><br>
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<div><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size:15px">> This is the first I've heard that Hochunk
<i>ní </i>for first person is from Algonquian -- what would the word be expected to be in Hochunk, based on Chiwere and Proto-Siouan?<br>
</span></div>
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<font face="Arial" size="4">Proto-Siouan for 1st sg.agentive was probably *<i>wa-</i>. It has allomorphs *<i>b-, p-, m-.
</i>and in Chiwere-Winnebago evolved into <i>*ha-.</i> In Dhegiha <i>*a-</i>. There is no trace of any 1st person
<i>ni-</i> in Siouan anywhere except in Hochunk (Winnebago). </font><br>
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> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size:15px">Also, wasn't Ojibwe <i>ogichidaa
</i>'warrior' borrowed into Dakotan?<br>
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<font face="Arial" size="4">In Kaw (Kansa) and other Dhegiha dialects it's <i>akkida</i>, so I'm guessing it's native to Siouan and borrowed by Ojibwe. Does it have an Algonquian etymology? If so, it's another shankka conundrum.<br>
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Bob</font><br>
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