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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:#1F497D">Dave et al:</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:#1F497D">It could have been borrowed on more than one occasion (we can never know whether M-I had it and lost it). Pam, I like the ‘expectant’ potential etymon of
the Choctaw/Chickasaw form and it makes a lot of sense; after all IE ‘nine’ may be connected with ‘new’.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:#1F497D">Bob, is the ‘big’ form in Dhegiha that you mention as coming from Spanish the everyday one? I ask because Joseph Casagrande pointed out that Comanche borrowed
a Spanish word for ‘good’ (and Comanche may have got a ‘bear’ word from Dhegiha).</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"; color:#1F497D">Anthony</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:11.0pt; font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> Siouan Linguistics [mailto:SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>David Costa<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 10 September 2013 02:44<br>
<b>To:</b> SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Borrowings.</span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">As I mentioned before, this "shankka" number for "nine" is also around in Algonquian. The word can be reconstructed as Proto-Algonquian *<i>ša·nka</i>, but there are lots of problems: the etymon is completely missing from all of Eastern
Algonquian, Miami-Illinois and Blackfoot; the Cree and Menominee forms don't have the proper reflexes for those languages and look like they're all borrowed from Ojibwe; and the Shawnee and Cheyenne forms inexplicably look like they derive from Proto-Algonquian
*<i>ča·nka</i>, not *<i>ša·nka</i>. If it's a loan into Algonquian, it was borrowed early on, but after Algonquian had already started to separate out into dialects.</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Dave</p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:#1F497D">> I recall John Koontz mentioning some other forms to me – items for ‘cucumber’ from French concombre, and also ttapuska ‘student, teacher’ which is shared
by Dhegiha and Pawnee. I don’t know about ‘hau’ but Comanche ‘aho’ (hello) is supposed to come from Kiowa.<br>
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Allan Taylor did a comprehensive "how" count at one point. I don't think he ever published results though. 'Cucumber' begins with<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>kko<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></i>the<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>PSI
root for 'gourd', so it may be a borrowing or it may be a coincidence again. 'Pig' is definitely from French.</span><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:#1F497D">> Shankka also has reflexes in Western Muskogean (Choctaw and Chickasaw)</span><span style="color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:#1F497D">Maybe. The word is</span><span class="apple-converted-space"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black"> </span></span><i><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black">čákkáàli</span></i><span class="apple-converted-space"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black"> </span></span><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black">and
-<i>ali</i><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>is an ending all right. It is borrowed into Biloxi as<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>čkane<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></i>I think. <span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span style="color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black">Note the Tutelo and Ofo terms.<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span style="font-size:14.0pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black">Tutelo
has<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>ḳasą́hka</i>, so it is definitely in the<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>shankka</i><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>zone. <span class="apple-converted-space"> </span></span><span style="color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black">Ofo<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>kíštatǝška<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Sw<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>kĭ´ctatạcga</i><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>—
nine;<span class="apple-converted-space"><i> </i></span>p. 325. Some words where<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>š</i><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>is expected turn up with<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>št</i><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>instead.
So this may contain some variant of<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>shankka</i>somehow. <span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>The prefix with<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span><i>k</i><span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>mirrors
Tutelo to an extent but the sound correspondences aren't quite right.</span><span style="color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black">So this peculiar term for '9' turns up in Chiwere, Dhegiha, Tutelo and maybe Ofo. There are partial look-alikes in<span class="apple-converted-space"> </span>Western
Muskogean and Biloxi. So it's not just around the Great Lakes region in Siouan, but there's no trace in the Northwest of Siouan.</span><span style="color:black"></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:13.5pt; font-family:"Arial","sans-serif"; color:black">Bob</span><span style="color:black"></span></p>
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