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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Nice idea! If that works, I like it! :)<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Rory<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif""> Siouan Linguistics [mailto:SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Rankin, Robert L.<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, September 12, 2013 3:34 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> SIOUAN@LISTSERV.UNL.EDU<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Number 'nine' in Chiwere.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">Hmm, speculatively, you don't suppose that the "other" phonetic form of
<i>nanye</i>, namely </span><i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">nąŋe</span></i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">, could be related to 'sit' in Ioway in the same sense that
<i>yųka</i> and <i>wąka</i></span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> are ‘to lie’ in Lakota? The positional would describe the last bent finger in finger counting from 1 to 10.<br>
<br>
Ok, I'll shut up now.<br>
<br>
Bob<br>
<br>
<o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black"> Siouan Linguistics [SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu]
on behalf of Rory Larson [rlarson1@UNL.EDU]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, September 12, 2013 3:22 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu">SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Number 'nine' in Chiwere.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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<p class="MsoListParagraph" style="text-indent:-.25in"><span style="font-family:Wingdings;color:black">Ø</span><span style="font-size:7.0pt;color:black">
</span><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">I think perhaps the Dakotan term relates to counting in sign language where 'nine' leaves one finger bent over, i.e., "lying", in the palm of the hand.
</span><i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">napcóka</span></i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> is 'palm' and</span><span style="color:black">
</span><i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black">yųka</span></i><span style="font-size:13.5pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> and
<i>wąka</i></span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black"> are ‘to lie’ in Lakota and the so-called D-dialects respectively, so I don't think Sky's term is related to the
<i>napci</i>- part of the Dakotan term, although I'm afraid I don't have anything better to offer except the obvious fact that it looks like English 'nine', [nayn] with a metathesis of the
<i>y</i> and <i>n</i>. </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoListParagraph"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">You’re probably right; that was a long shot. I understand from the old Otoe-Iowa Indian Language Book I that was put out in 1977 that there is a regular difference
in certain endings between Otoe and Iowa. Where one ends in -nge the other ends in -nye. I’ve never been quite sure about how the first was pronounced, whether that is supposed to be an eng or a nasal vowel + /g/.
<i>nanye</i> ought to belong to the -nye dialect, but checking the booklet that turns out to be Iowa, so I’m somewhat confused here. It sometimes seems to equate to Omaha nasal vowel + /g/, but I wasn’t sure if it was the only thing that ending could relate
to.</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">It’s still an interesting find, even if it does turn out to be English ‘nine’. In this case, it would be a true borrowing, because it is thoroughly incorporated
into an Otoe numerical sequence. Also, that metathesis of y and n shows that the word was forced into an Otoe phonological structure, rather than leaving it in plain English. Perhaps both the cumbersome, analytic terms used for ‘nine’ in so many North American
languages, and the tendency to borrow the term, say something about how irregular the usage of it was?</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D"> </span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D">Rory</span><span style="color:black"><o:p></o:p></span></p>
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