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<div style="direction: ltr;font-family: Arial;color: #000000;font-size: 14pt;">Hi Bruce,<br>
<br>
I think you must be catching up on a lot of back email. :-)<br>
<br>
As you get more up-to-date I think you'll find the answers to all your questions about these clusters. The back-and-forth went on for quite some time. I collected all vocabulary from Dakota, Omaha, Ponca, Osage, Kansa and Quapaw that has a reflex of Mississippi
Valley Siouan GL or BL. Accent in these words DOES in fact fall on the initial syllable in all but Dakotan, exactly as you predict it should. It's only Dakota that's changed.<br>
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Best,<br>
<br>
Bob<br>
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<div style="direction: ltr;" id="divRpF836974"><font color="#000000" face="Tahoma" size="2"><b>From:</b> Siouan Linguistics [SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu] on behalf of shokooh Ingham [shokoohbanou@YAHOO.CO.UK]<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, October 05, 2013 2:38 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Locatives and wa- problems.<br>
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<div><span>I don't get that. If gluha and bluha were three syllables, wouldn't the stress be glUha and blUha rather than gluhA and bluhA?</span></div>
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<span>Bruce</span></div>
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<font face="Arial" size="2"><b><span style="font-weight:bold">From:</span></b> "Rankin, Robert L." <rankin@KU.EDU><br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">To:</span></b> SIOUAN@listserv.unl.edu <br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Sent:</span></b> Monday, 9 September 2013, 16:15<br>
<b><span style="font-weight:bold">Subject:</span></b> Re: Locatives and wa- problems.<br>
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<div style="direction:ltr; font-family:Arial; color:rgb(0,0,0); font-size:14pt">I think you'd be wrong. By accent placement rules and by morphological analysis the GL and BL clusters count as two syllables. The little phonetic tics are immaterial. Fortunately
or unfortunately the Gs all go back to full syllables, mostly KI while the Bs of the BL clusters all go back to WA or WI. All were morphemes also. Ordinarily the prehistory of these things might not matter, but the accent rules still seem to be able to treat
the Gs and Bs as morae for purposes of assigning stress synchronically. This is especially true of Hochunk which, assuming Ken Miner was right, is a mora counting language. I'm guessing that Dakotan is too.
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> Phonetically, there is a schwa in there. But phonologically, I would count glV- as one syllable.<br clear="none">
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<font face="Arial" size="4">Actually, that's backwards. Phonetically BLV and GLV
<i>may</i> form single syllables but phonologically they count as two for the reasons cited above. \<br clear="none">
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<font size="4"><font size="4">It gets worse, of course. If the structure is CVgl<font size="4">V the syllabi<font size="4">fication rules for Siouan languages assign the /g/ phonetically to the second syllable along with the initial member of all other CC
clusters. I remember telling an Australian linguist that and being laugh<font size="4">ed at because he believed that syllable boundaries could be derived from a "universal." It's all very messy, but it's a fact that CL clusters can behave as two syllables
for various phonological purposes and per<font size="4">haps as single syllables for yet other purposes</font>.</font></font></font></font></font></font>
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