Sutton at signwriting.org

Thu Oct 20 21:07:45 UTC 2005

Charles
I just find it incredible to see the kind of message you send to the list
and the way you turn down Valerie and Stephen's work!
how dare you? couldn't you just ask what you need like anyone else does...
without trowing your angryness around...!
No one ever need such kind of messages!
thanks

Anny

De : "Charles Butler" <chazzer3332000 at YAHOO.COM>
Répondre à : sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
Date : Wed, 19 Oct 2005 18:10:22 -0700 (PDT)
À : sw-l at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
Objet : [sw-l] Sutton at signwriting.org

Valerie, I now feel that I am justifiably angry, and most of the anger is
not directed at you, but the programmer of Sign Puddle, who should be
ashamed of himself.

You are not a programmer, but you, by now, should know what programmer's are
capable of.

First of all, the following email is not a gentle email, it is pointed   Be
prepared.

Your ADVICE, Valerie.

The old sign should be
> deleted because that symbol is really not in the IMWA any
> longer....we are just seeing a picture of it...so you will need to re-
> load all the signs using that symbol to fix each one up...go into
> Dictionary editors and then start changing them...

You can find all 
> the signs that use that handshape by searching through the Symbol
> Frequency section of SignPuddle...
>
WHAT--- And I thought you said that the old 10 handshape was NOT going to be
removed from IMWA, because there are far too many of us from a prior
generation.

That is what you said in a prior email, both publicly and privately.  You
are now going back on your given WORD, Valerie, and that is WRONG.  Do I
have to find that old email and make you read it in public, apologize, and
do it RIGHT? I feel like an old school marm, holding a person to the task
that they said they were going to do.

1) First, I am an American, and we have been taught to speak our minds, and
not mince words, particularly when normal channels have been exhausted. Mine
have, both on private and public lines.

2) I have tried to softpedal this and have gotten nothing but stonewalling,
Valerie.  I honestly feel that you made a major programming mistake, not
simply an error, but a downright mistake that will now cost the SignPuddle
community 1,000s of hours in programming time that are simply NOT necessary
and that belong in your programmers' lap, no one else's, certainly not
YOURS.

Valerie, This direction is exactly what is WRONG with Sign Puddle.

I'm really annoyed, because this time you frankly have gone too far.  I'm
putting this on the public site, because that is where it belongs.

You, Valerie, and the chief programmer need to apologize for not working and
doing it for us, as a programmer has the responsiblity to do, even if
working as a volunteer, across the board.  That is not the way to do it, is
not appropriate at all.

Yes, we have a utility that can look at how many signs use that handshape
(which now no longer exists).  IS THAT NOT WHAT A COMPUTER IS FOR?  You tell
us to go to a utility to find those signs.  Why can that not been done by
computer? A keystroke, is a keystroke, is a keystroke, and it doesn't matter
whether I do it, or a computer code does it, it still gets done.

1) A Computer Macro can scan all documents for a handshape and an
orientation, what you are asking the editors to do, sign by sign, and
replace ALL of them at once to the correct handshape, orientation, and place
on the page.

2) A computer Macro CAN, and not piecemeal, by piecemeal, save each and
every one of those signs as a dummy file, change the dummy, change the old
title to a discarded title, and resave the new file in its place.  That's
what editing programming is for.  To do repetitive tasks.

3) To FORCE every one of us who have worked across this system to load
thousands of signs from programs which YOU yourself created, and then NOT
take the time to create a utility to move old data to the new IMWA before
you disseminate the new IMWA is just plain NOT good practice.

4) You DON'T have the time to do it yourself for hundreds of documents.  You
work 3 hours a day at the most, and I DON'T EXPECT YOU, as the inventor to
do the work alone, nor to do it AT ALL.

5) It honesly belongs on whoever created the Sign Puddle program.  He caused
the error, and is now demanding, by not doing it, 1,000 of hours of people
energy which is not necessary.

6) Do you honestly think that all the rest of us have any more time than you
do to do that work?

7) This is not cooperation.  This is bad planning, and bad programming.
.  

Charles Butler

Honza <honza at ruce.cz> wrote:
Hi Val,

thanks for picture Stefan.
10handshape is a little bit confusing.
Older handshape seems to be clearer, but it is not written in the same
way as other handhapes..

so I have to get used to new handshape.
thanks
Honza

Valerie Sutton wrote:

> SignWriting List
> October 19, 2005
>
> On Oct 19, 2005, at 1:09 PM, Honza wrote:
>
>> sure, yes I know this handshape has been improved.
>> I mean improved 10 handshape.
>> Thumb is not towards body, but up.
>
>
> I would write the Czech sign for ZITRA like zitra_2 ...see
> attached...the first one is the old sign and the second one is my re-
> writing which I just put in your SignPuddle...The old sign should be
> deleted because that symbol is really not in the IMWA any
> longer....we are j! ust seeing a picture of it...so you will need to re-
> load all the signs using that symbol to fix each one up...go into
> Dictionary editors and then start changing them...You can find all
> the signs that use that handshape by searching through the Symbol
> Frequency section of SignPuddle...
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>

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