a few things...

Mon Nov 10 23:06:23 UTC 2008

Reagan got that name sign (from what they told me) because he was a  
cowboy in the movies and his name begins with 'R'. :)

Stuart
On Nov 10, 2008, at 16:54 , Adam Frost wrote:

> It could be because us crazy Americans can never agree on anything  
> until we have had many many years (even generations) of dispute on a  
> topic? ;-)
>
> I know that one for Bill Clinton which is related to his lying which  
> lead to his almost impeachment. I would still say that is an ad hoc  
> name sign for the very same reason that I have never seen that one  
> for Reagan (which is cool to see, by the way, but I wonder why it is  
> that). What I mean is that most of the younger Deaf generation who  
> have never had a reason to talk about these presidents will never  
> have known these signs. My younger Deaf brother didn't even know the  
> one for Clinton because he was still in diapers when Clinton was  
> president.
>
> Funny that you should mention about Bush. My Deaf brother in law  
> (yes, half my family is Deaf) has a sign for Bush, but that is  
> because he can't read English too well and fingerspelling goes over  
> his eyes.
>
> Adam
>
> On Nov 10, 2008, at 2:36 PM, Stuart Thiessen wrote:
>
>> I have seen that too. I wonder if there is another factor  
>> involved ... ASL seems to have a stronger use of fingerspelling  
>> compared to other countries. In the countries that I visited, they  
>> avoided fingerspelling as much as possible. If a new important name  
>> or concept came their way, they figured out a sign for it. People  
>> might have some disagreements about what the sign should be, but  
>> they would agree that they needed a sign and eventually find one  
>> they liked.
>>
>> My observations have been that, in the US, it seems that ASL rules  
>> say that anything "new" should be fingerspelled until there is at  
>> least regional consent on a sign. Some sign names might have  
>> regional consensus, but those are not considered standard ASL until  
>> it has more national consensus. I could be wrong. I haven't noticed  
>> anyone in my area use a namesign for Obama or McCain. Bush probably  
>> would not have gotten a namesign since his name only has 4 letters.
>>
>> I saw this
> <pastedGraphic.tiff>
>>
>> for Bill Clinton, and this
> <pastedGraphic.tiff>
>>
>> for Ronald Reagan, but I don't know if they are "final"  
>> namesigns. :)  (If you can't see the graphics, just look at Clinton  
>> and Reagan in the US SignPuddle.)
>>
>> Stuart
>>
>> On Nov 10, 2008, at 16:02 , Adam Frost wrote:
>>
>>> I had to step back for a minute a realize where this was coming  
>>> from because I was just having a discussion with another group  
>>> about this same topic. I am trying to figure out how to tell you  
>>> what the discussion on the TeachASL list was without sounding  
>>> harsh, so bear with me. ;-)
>>>
>>> First, lets take a look at name signs as they are used and giving  
>>> in the US in ASL. A name sign is only used when talking about a  
>>> person that has importance in the Deaf community that is not  
>>> present. Therefore, a name sign is not just given to anyone (this  
>>> also includes people who are in the Deaf community) and given with  
>>> great care. This is especially the case when you are dealing with  
>>> a name sign on a national level. You may be able to find local  
>>> examples that don't follow this, but that will not happen  
>>> nationally. These local example are usually "in house" discussions  
>>> of a particular person that goes into great length, so ad hoc name  
>>> signs are created so that fingerspelling doesn't have to be done  
>>> over and over for those people who don't like fingerspelling.
>>>
>>> Having said that, unless our president elect has done something  
>>> that has cause for the Deaf community to not only talk about him  
>>> in great length, but also has made a great impact on the  
>>> community, there will never be a "final" name sign for him. All of  
>>> these ad hoc name signs will disappear as soon as the discussion  
>>> of him disappear. Of course, the only other way for this to be  
>>> different would be for the Deaf community to become very involved  
>>> in politics overnight. And I mean every member of the community,  
>>> not just a few.
>>>
>>> If you look back at all of the past US presidents, only Lincoln  
>>> and Washington have name signs. Some say that is because  
>>> Washington is the founding father and Lincoln was the president  
>>> during the civil war that brought the nation back together.  
>>> Lincoln has his name sign because he was the president that made  
>>> it possible for Gallaudet University. I feel that Washington is a  
>>> rare ad hoc name sign by back translation from the state  
>>> Washington and capital Washington DC. It is only because there is  
>>> a state that has a sign as well as the same name as the president  
>>> that the ad hoc name sign is used nationally. (That and that his  
>>> name is very important in US history so every school has to talk  
>>> about him a lot.)
>>>
>>> Now, I know that it could be said that Barack Obama is a great  
>>> impact because he is the first African American to be elected.  
>>> True, but that doesn't impact the Deaf community, so that is why  
>>> he hasn't received a name sign. So I hope that answers your  
>>> question of there being a final name sign for him. And I hope that  
>>> I haven't sounded harsh, but it is a little pet peeve that I have  
>>> so it is hard not to seem angry even though I am not. :-)
>>>
>>> Adam
>>>
>>> On Nov 10, 2008, at 11:58 AM, Peter DeHaas wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Did anyone ever come up with a final sign name for our new  
>>>> president elect???
>>>>
>>>> Best,
>>>>
>>>> Peter DeHaas
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ____________________________________________
>>>>
>>>> SW-L SignWriting List
>>>>
>>>> Post Message
>>>> SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>>>>
>>>> List Archives and Help
>>>> http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/
>>>>
>>>> Change Email Settings
>>>> http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> ____________________________________________
>>>
>>> SW-L SignWriting List
>>>
>>> Post Message
>>> SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>>>
>>> List Archives and Help
>>> http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/
>>>
>>> Change Email Settings
>>> http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ____________________________________________
>>
>> SW-L SignWriting List
>>
>> Post Message
>> SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>>
>> List Archives and Help
>> http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/
>>
>> Change Email Settings
>> http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l
>
>
>
>
> ____________________________________________
>
> SW-L SignWriting List
>
> Post Message
> SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
>
> List Archives and Help
> http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/
>
> Change Email Settings
> http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l

____________________________________________

SW-L SignWriting List

Post Message
SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu

List Archives and Help
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/

Change Email Settings
http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l