AW: [sw-l] New Czech sign...I wrote these in the Czech SignPuddle

Charles Butler chazzer3332000 at YAHOO.COM
Wed Jan 28 09:05:51 UTC 2009


Looking at the hands in either position below, they aren't clear at all.

If you have one hand edge on, and one vertical, that is actual position of the hands.  They both aren't horizontal, and they both aren't vertical.  Photographing the hands from one's own point of view shows one hand horizontal, and one vertical, not two flat hands. 

I think Sign Writing should be as close as possible to photographic so that you could literally lay the photo next to the Sign Writing and see the correspondence, else it's confusing. 

Then with the two hand positions shown you don't have to have the arrow at all, but you could to be clear.  


Honza <honza at ruce.cz> wrote: Hi, 

you mean this (see attached 2)
I agree, it would it better, because the left hand doesnot move, but I don't like this kind of spelling, where handshape positions are not the same as on the picture, but specified by additional symbols.
 
The best for me would be third version (attached 3) but some one can say it is not readable well.

thanks
Honza

On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 10:47 PM, Charles Butler <chazzer3332000 at yahoo.com> wrote:
 Val, Stefan, Honza 

I would change the first section the same as the second

X upright hand front of hand
 == flat hand

X upright back of hand
== flat hand

The horizontal hand doesn't change position.  In your jpg it looks like it moves.  


Honza <honza at ruce.cz> wrote:  Hi Val and Stefan,

actually it is not Czech, but Slovak sign, but that is not important ;), anyway it means PEAR.
I tried to use similar spelling inspired by Val.

I won't use any face expression, at least expression that should mean "B" - so the one Stefan supposed.
  
thanks for help
Honza

On Tue, Jan 27, 2009 at 9:39 PM, Valerie Sutton <sutton at signwriting.org> wrote:
  SignWriting List
 January 27, 2009
 

 Hi Stefan!
 
 That is fine! That mouth position can certainly be interpreted as tense lips...and if that is a"P" in Woehrmann's SpeechWriting that is fine...I don't know what the Czech word is for that sign..I don't even know what the sign means....so I agree if Honza agrees...
   
 The Tense lips can also be used slightly differently...in ASL we use the Tense lips for two lips pressing each other, like in the sign for possessives such as YOURS or HIS...and that is not quite a P position of the lips...so I guess there are some tiny variations for use for that symbol...and that is perfectly fine ;-)
   
 Even in our two spoken languages...German and English...we use the Roman alphabet differently...so this is to be expected...
 
 I will remember that P is the Tense Lips symbol in  SpeechWriting...
 
 Thank you for SpeechWriting! It is an important development and successful too...
 
 Val ;-)

 
 
 
 
 On Jan 27, 2009, at 11:40 AM, Stefan Wöhrmann wrote:
  
  Hi Val,
 
 thanks for your message. I always love to study your spellings ...
  
 In this case I would like to add one comment.
 
 I see, that you decided to add a facial expression - in Germany we say mouth-gesture to all kinds of mouth, lip, tongue movements that do not go along with soundless speaking ...
  
 The signer is moving the lips as if speaking - so speechwriting starting with the "P"-mouth   would be my suggestion.
 
 
  



   
 
 Stefan ;-)
 
 
 
 
 -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
 Von: sw-l-bounces at majordomo.valenciacc.edu [mailto:sw-l-bounces at majordomo.valenciacc.edu] Im Auftrag vonValerie Sutton
   Gesendet: Dienstag, 27. Januar 2009 18:51
 An: SignWriting List
 Cc: Adam Frost
 Betreff: [sw-l] New Czech sign...I wrote these in the Czech SignPuddle
 
 SignWriting List
 January 27, 2009
 
 Here are my attempts at writing this very difficult but interesting
  sign from the Czech Republic! See attached....
 
 Hope this helps....these examples are in your Czech SignPuddle
 dictionary, Honza, for you to play with...
 
 As you can see, this is a difficult sign to write, and I tried many
  avenues...I am not sure what is best myself, but sometimes, after  a
 long time, people start writing themselves, and one day, someone comes
 up with a great way to write the same sign that we were struggling
 with for years! So see this as a "first attempt" and then over time
  you will get feedback from others until you find a SignSpelling that
 works for your readers...
 
 I have to go to an appointment now, so I will be back later today -
 Val ;-)
 
 
 
 
 
 
  ____________________________________________
 
 SW-L SignWriting List
 
 Post Message
 SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
 
 List Archives and Help
  http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/
 
 Change Email Settings
 http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l
    
 

 
 
 ____________________________________________
 
 SW-L SignWriting List
 
 Post Message
 SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
  
 List Archives and Help
 http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/
 
 Change Email Settings
 http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l
 

 


____________________________________________

SW-L SignWriting List

Post Message
SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
 
List Archives and Help
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/

Change Email Settings
http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l 




 
 
 ____________________________________________
 
 SW-L SignWriting List
 
 Post Message
 SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu
 
 List Archives and Help
 http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/
 
 Change Email Settings
 http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l


 


____________________________________________

SW-L SignWriting List

Post Message
SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu

List Archives and Help
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/

Change Email Settings
http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://listserv.linguistlist.org/pipermail/sw-l/attachments/20090128/d574d11d/attachment.html>
-------------- next part --------------



____________________________________________

SW-L SignWriting List

Post Message
SW-L at majordomo.valenciacc.edu

List Archives and Help
http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/

Change Email Settings
http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l


More information about the Sw-l mailing list