AW: AW: Writing Non Manual Signals

Wed Apr 10 23:01:27 UTC 2013

I would agree with this spelling to show the progression of the sign outward as the mouth changes, but something seems awkward as I can't read the sign as you write it. I would tend to stack the heads or show the second head after the first pair of hands and before the final reverse hands. I read down in order. I don't like to see signs getting so wide they can't fit in a box. 

Charles Butler

chazzer3332000 at yahoo.com

240-764-5748

Clear writing moves business forward.

--- On Wed, 4/10/13, Stefan Wöhrmann <stefanwoehrmann at GEBAERDENSCHRIFT.DE> wrote:

From: Stefan Wöhrmann <stefanwoehrmann at GEBAERDENSCHRIFT.DE>
Subject: AW: AW: Writing Non Manual Signals
To: SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU
Date: Wednesday, April 10, 2013, 6:42 PM

Hi Cherie,  

well – in this case – no problem
you would not write „finish“ but „fsh“ 

All best  

Stefan 

Von: SignWriting
List: Read and Write Sign Languages [mailto:SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU] Im Auftrag von Cherie Wren

Gesendet: Donnerstag, 11. April
2013 00:34

An:
SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU

Betreff: Re: AW: Writing Non
Manual Signals 

In ASL
there is a specific lexical mouth morpheme that goes with the sign
FINISH.  It looks more like "fsh" than the full formal English
word.  ASL does not mouth the English words, it uses the mouth for other
grammatical purposes...

cherie 

From: Stefan Wöhrmann
<stefanwoehrmann at GEBAERDENSCHRIFT.DE>

To:
SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU 

Sent: Wednesday, April 10, 2013
6:15 PM

Subject: AW: Writing Non Manual
Signals 

Hi Natasha, Adam, Erika
and friends,  

well you know
that I am working for more than a decade on developing/inventing  a
symbolset to describe what the mouth, the lips, the tongue are doing while
performing movement as if somebody is speaking—I call this kind of symbols
“Mundbilder”  So this has nothing to do with sound but only with kind of
lipreading –  

The spelling
depends on your focus. If you want to really understand exactly what the mouth
is doing I would transcribe the complete set of Mundbilder that represents the
“pronouncing” of “finish”  

If you just
want to support the reader – who already knows what is going on looking at the
movement of the hands. And if you just want to give a hint that there is a
performance coming from the mouth as well – the informed reader will be
satisfied just to read the beginning ... 

In this case I
would write the sign “finish” this way  --   

Regards  

Stefan 

Von: SignWriting List: Read
and Write Sign Languages [mailto:SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU] Im Auftrag von Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway

Gesendet: Mittwoch, 10. April 2013
18:58

An:
SW-L at LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU

Betreff: Re: Writing Non Manual
Signals 

Yes, I'm sure
he'll chime in, but I'm sure Stefan will be able to provide some insight, as
someone who regularly writes signs with multiple mouth movements distributed
across linked head symbols. 

On Wed, Apr
10, 2013 at 12:54 PM, Adam Frost <frost at signwriting.org>
wrote: 

If that is
the writing that you were talking about, that is one possibility of how to
write it. I would find myself trying to make it so that the mouth movements be
written with one face, but I agree with you that that isn't really possible in
this case.  

If I were to
write this vertically, I would probably see what it looks like with the heads
stacked on top of each other because I find that vertically writing flows
better with vertical columns. Take fingerspelling for example. When the writing
is vertical, it flows better to have the fingerspelling vertical as well. 

Now if this
were just by itself or with horizontal writing, I might choice to write it as
you did. I think the only difference would be that I would overlap the face
circles more, creating a Venn Diagram feel. ;-) That is actually how Stefan
writes, which I think has a lot of merit to it. 

Adam 

On Apr 10,
2013, at 8:59 AM, Adam Frost wrote: 

I didn't see
an attachment, but I found this in SignPuddle. Is this what you meant? 

Adam 

On Apr 10,
2013, at 8:54 AM, Natasha Escalada-Westland wrote: 

Hi! I'm
working on a presentation about Non Manual Signals, particularly mouth
morphemes, and want to know if writing a mouth movement that changes during the
course of one sign as a series of connected heads is acceptable. I've attached
an example of the ASL sign for FINISH, as it appears in the phrase FINISH
EXPERIENCE (to have experienced a particular activity). Thanks, Natasha
Escalada-Westland  

-- 

Erika Hoffmann-Dilloway

Assistant Professor of Anthropology

Oberlin College  

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