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Hi Val,<br>
<br>
Do we need to have the mouth shapes include the head outline? Perhaps
we could have the mouth shapes by themselves. <br>
<br>
Can we have larger head shapes? Bigger circles and ovals. That way we
could build more complicated facial expressions without worrying about
overlap and space limitations.<br>
<br>
-Steve<br>
<br>
Valerie Sutton wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:A2E34AD4-723A-4863-884E-1937065E9F3D@mac.com"
type="cite">SignWriting List
<br>
May 12, 2007
<br>
<br>
Sandy -
<br>
It is my understanding that the terms are this:
<br>
<br>
1. SignWriting Facial Expressions
<br>
Write the facial expressions and mouth movements of native signed
languages such as PAH and "po", "vee", "lum" &c of BSL
<br>
(needs more standardization of course ;-)
<br>
<br>
2. Mundbilder is "MouthingWriting" (writing mouthing of spoken language
words while signing)
<br>
<br>
3. Mundbildschrift is "German SpeechWriting" (writing the movements of
the mouth of German spoken language having NO connection to signing)
<br>
<br>
All three are using SignWriting symbols (with some new symbols that
extend the symbolset that Stefan developed)...
<br>
<br>
And yes...all could be written down...that is an interesting point...
<br>
<br>
I have one concern only...that if we cover up the eyebrows section of
the faces...then no other symbols but mouths could be seen...
<br>
<br>
but I believe for SpeechWriting that is no problem!
<br>
<br>
But for SignWriting Facial Expressions...it would be a problem because
I often write eyebrows combined with the mouth movements
<br>
<br>
I guess it depends on whether it is solely mouth movements, or also
other facial expressions, that are being written...
<br>
<br>
Other than that I think this vertical configuration looks interesting!
<br>
<br>
Fingerspelling is easy vertically, when we are writing vertically, so I
think you have a good point!
<br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
<hr size="4" width="90%"><br>
<center><img src="cid:part1.07070303.09060108@signpuddle.net"></center>
<p><br>
<br>
<br>
On May 12, 2007, at 8:38 AM, Sandy Fleming wrote:
<br>
<br>
</p>
<blockquote type="cite">On Sun, 2007-05-06 at 08:21 -0700, Charles
Butler wrote:
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">Sandy, Valerie, and others.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
<blockquote type="cite">The only drawback I see is the
Gaebardenschrift methodology for
<br>
full-mouth articulation as a multiple overlapping head would not
<br>
easily be possible using this method.
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
Charles, Val, Stefan,
<br>
<br>
As you all know, SignWriting was originally written horizontally, but
<br>
vertical SignWriting is now preferred. Fingerspelling seems to be going
<br>
the same way, with a recent suggestion of vertical fingerspelling on
the
<br>
list finding approval. After all, once you decide to write vertically,
<br>
anything that's written horizontally within the column is "going
against
<br>
the grain" and it should come as no surprise that writing it vertically
<br>
is an improvement.
<br>
<br>
I would suggest that Mundbildschrift could also better be written
<br>
vertically within vertical SignWriting (see attached diagram and excuse
<br>
the badly-drawn mouths!).
<br>
<br>
As I've said before, I prefer faces to be opaque so that any background
<br>
doesn't render the expression difficult to read. This seems to work
very
<br>
well with vertical Mundbildschrift, as the head circle doesn't
interfere
<br>
with any other part of the facial expression and, after the intial
<br>
expression which might contain eyes and nose, only the mouthings are
<br>
shown.
<br>
<br>
I understand that horizontal Mundbildschrift my be preferred in
<br>
educational texts aimed at helping Deaf children who are learning to
<br>
write in an oral language, but for normal SignWriting texts for
everyday
<br>
readers, this seems to me to be a very clear, natural and compact way
to
<br>
write Mundbildshrift, and no problems with it going against the grain
<br>
and right out of the column!
<br>
<br>
To me, MUndbildschrift isn't just an education concern, it's also
<br>
important for everyday SignWriting to show "native" sign language lip
<br>
patterns (such as the "po", "vee", "lum" &c of BSL).
<br>
<br>
Any thoughts?
<br>
<br>
Sandy
<br>
<br>
<vertical.png>
<br>
</blockquote>
<br>
</blockquote>
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