<HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; ">I mimicked what you said. While there is a slight rotation of the forearm to make the movement, I would also see it as a wrist flexing because of the movement is more like the movement in YES than the movement in AGREE. Just my 2 cents worth.<DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV><DIV>Thanks,</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>Stuart</DIV><DIV><BR><DIV><DIV>On 6 Jul 2007, at 19:01, Cherie Wren wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Gentium; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; -apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><DIV style="font-family:times new roman, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt; font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><DIV style="font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;; font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">The palm faces in to the body (with no change), but the fingertips rotate from horizontal to pointing down... the movement, as I watch my arm signing it, is entirely in the forearm. </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">cherie</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><DIV style="font-family: times new roman,new york,times,serif; font-size: 12pt;; font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">----- Original Message ----</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">From: Valerie Sutton <<A href="mailto:signwriting@MAC.COM">signwriting@MAC.COM</A>></SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">To: <A href="mailto:sw-l@majordomo.valenciacc.edu">sw-l@majordomo.valenciacc.edu</A></SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">Sent: Friday, July 6, 2007 6:58:01 PM</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">Subject: Re: [sw-l] wrist flex versus rotation</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><DIV style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">On Jul 6, 2007, at 3:25 PM, Cherie Wren wrote:</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> When I write the sign YES, there is a palm facing change, but it is </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> a wrist flex. Initially my palm is facing out, then my wrist bends </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> and my palm is now facing down, then repeat. CAN can be signed </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> with just a wrist flex, although you will more often see it with a </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> larger downward movement, but there is palm facing change. When I </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> sign this sign, which I gloss as WOW, the angle of the wrist is not </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> changing, it is at roughly a 90 degree angle to the forearm, that </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> angle stays roughly the same throughout. I think of (thought of) a </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> wrist flex as a change in that angle between hand and forearm...A </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> rotation I saw as that angle staying the same, but the forearm </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> twisting.</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">></SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">> cherie</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">Yes, that is correct. The sign for YES can be thought of as the back </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">of the hand palm facing change, but it is a Wrist Flex none-the- </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">less...you are right about that. So what i said before is not always </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">true either!</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">For me, these symbols are so easy that I obviously have trouble </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">explaining them.</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">And of course CAN can be a Wrist Flex as well. But both those signs </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">do not Rotate at the forearm, as you said above...</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">What are the palm facings of the beginning and ending position of the </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">sign we were discussing from Cat in the Hat 2? I had seen that as a </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">Wrist Flex, but if you feel it is a rotation, then what palm facing </SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">starts and what palm facing finishes?</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; ">Val ;-)</SPAN><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "></DIV></DIV><BR style="font-family: times new roman; font-size: 16px; "></DIV></DIV><BR><HR size="1">Building a website is a piece of cake.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN><BR>Yahoo! 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