<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">SignWriting List<div>May 14, 2008</div><div><br></div><div>Hello Hasna!</div><div>Thank you for your kind words...</div><div><br></div><div>Yes...the SignSpelling Guidelines 2004 manual is quite out-of-date, but it is still online for download. Go to this web page:</div><div><br></div><div><b>Sutton's SymbolBank</b></div><div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><a href="http://www.movementwriting.org/symbolbank/">http://www.movementwriting.org/symbolbank/</a></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">and scroll down. Click on Number 1 to download the manual...</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">I hope it won't confuse you, since through experience we have learned that location comes later in the SignSpelling Sequence...Through working with people trying to find signs that are sorted by symbols, we found that they look for handshape first, and then movement, but location comes last, when searching for a group of signs...so the location is now moved to the end of the SignSpelling...that is the biggest difference between SignSpellings in 2004 and SignSpellings in 2008...the new 2008 manual will explain this...</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">meanwhile, the SignSpelling data that is produced in SignPuddle is just providing the sequence of the symbols, without grouping them into "syllables"...knowledge of syllables helps those who are trying to learn how to determine the SignSpelling for a sign, but it was never programmed in our SWML...</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">Just like in English...if you asked me..."What is the spelling of the world "INTERESTING" I would say:</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">I-N-T-E-R-E-S-T-I-N-G</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">I would not say IN-TER-EST-ING, unless I was trying to teach phonics of other kinds of reading techniques...</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">So technically syllables could be programmed someday...by asking the person who is entering the SignSpelling data to also tell the software where the break is, between syllables...but that is the future...</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">Why do you need this information? What is your project?</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">Val ;-)</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;"><br></span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><font class="Apple-style-span" face="Arial" size="4"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 14px;">--------------</span></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Helvetica; "><br></div></div><div><div><div>On May 14, 2008, at 6:01 PM, Hasna Hocini wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">Hello again!<br>Thank you very much for your answers and for all the information you gave me! <br>So much work to do! That's really very beautiful! <br>Can you tell me please if the SignSpelling Guidelines 2004 the last one available? <br>Thanks a lot!<br>Hasna<br><b><i>Valerie Sutton <<a href="mailto:signwriting@mac.com">signwriting@mac.com</a>></i></b> a écrit :<blockquote class="replbq" style="border-left: 2px solid rgb(16, 16, 255); margin-left: 5px; padding-left: 5px;"> SignWriting List<div>May 14, 2008</div><div><br><div><div>Hasna Hocini wrote:</div><blockquote type="cite">I need a file where I can have the SignSpelling Syllables. I found the sbml file. In this file we find: <Sequence>............ </Sequence> <br>it is I guess the signspelling sequence. But I can't find a file with the signspelling syllables. Can you help me with that please. Thank you very much and have a good night, Hasna Hocini</blockquote><br></div><div>Hello Hasna!</div><div>Thank you for this unusual question ;-)</div><div><br></div><div>It is unusual because we have never broken down the SignSpelling data into segments called "syllables". Not from a software point of view anyway...as far as i know ;-)</div><div><br></div><div>I just completed the International SignWriting Alphabet (ISWA 2008) last Friday. I delivered it to Steve Slevinski, who is developing the SignWriting Image Server and other software, that will bring the ISWA to the general public...</div><div><br></div><div>You'll probably be interested in the SignWriting Image Server (<a href="http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle/swis">http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle/swis</a>). Steve just released the beta. You can download the project if you want.<br><a href="http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle/swis.zip">http://www.signbank.org/signpuddle/swis.zip</a><br><br>Over the next few months, Steve will release more open source software for use, such as SignMaker and SignText.<br><br>Steve is currently rewriting SignPuddle to use the ISWA symbol set, rather than the older IMWA symbol set. It will be able to export data for use with the SignWriting Image Server.<br></div><div><br></div><div>Now that I have completed the ISWA 2008, I plan to do the following:</div><div><br></div><div>1. Write a new manual: "SignSpelling Guidelines 2008". This will provide you with important information on SignSpelling rules, including how to add SignSpellings into current SignPuddle software. I will address the issue of SignSyllables in the manual, but that will only be in the manual and not a part of SWML at this time...<br></div><div><br></div><div>2. I need to update our SignBank Desktop Database software to use the symbols in the new ISWA 2008...so that is a big job for me to update SignBank. Once that has been done, I will create a new download for SignBank users...</div><div><br></div><div>So I will keep you informed as to when the SignSpelling Guidelines 2008 is ready for download on the web...</div><div><br></div><div>If you want to ask me more questions, perhaps I can help you sign by sign...</div><div><br></div><div>Val ;-)</div></div><br><br><br>____________________________________________<br><br>SW-L SignWriting List<br><br>Post Message<br><a href="mailto:SW-L@majordomo.valenciacc.edu">SW-L@majordomo.valenciacc.edu</a><br><br>List Archives and Help<br>http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/<br><br>Change Email Settings<br>http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l</blockquote><br><p> __________________________________________________<br>Do You Yahoo!?<br>En finir avec le spam? Yahoo! Mail vous offre la meilleure protection possible contre les messages non sollicités <br><a href="http://mail.yahoo.fr">http://mail.yahoo.fr</a> Yahoo! Mail <br><br><br>____________________________________________<br><br>SW-L SignWriting List<br><br>Post Message<br><a href="mailto:SW-L@majordomo.valenciacc.edu">SW-L@majordomo.valenciacc.edu</a><br><br>List Archives and Help<br>http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/<br><br>Change Email Settings<br>http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l</p></blockquote></div><br><div apple-content-edited="true"> <span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-align: auto; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Val ;-)</span><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Arial; font-size: 14px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 14px/normal Arial; "><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; min-height: 14px; "><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">Valerie Sutton</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 240); "><span style="text-decoration: underline; "><a href="mailto:Sutton@SignWriting.org">Sutton@SignWriting.org</a></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">1. SignWriting</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">Read & Write Sign Languages</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 240); "><span style="text-decoration: underline; "><a href="http://www.SignWriting.org">http://www.SignWriting.org</a></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 240); min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">2. SignPuddle</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">Create SignWriting Documents Online</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 240); "><span style="text-decoration: underline; "><a href="http://www.SignBank.org/signpuddle">http://www.SignBank.org/signpuddle</a></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">3. SignBank</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">SignWriting Desktop Databases</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 240); "><span style="text-decoration: underline; "><a href="http://www.SignBank.org">http://www.SignBank.org</a></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">4. SignWriting List</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">Technical Support: Ask questions to the List </div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Geneva; color: rgb(0, 0, 240); "><span style="text-decoration: underline; "><a href="http://www.SignWriting.org/forums/swlist">http://www.SignWriting.org/forums/swlist</a></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">5. SignWriting Literature Project</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">Writing Literature in Sign Languages</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; color: rgb(0, 0, 240); "><span style="text-decoration: underline; "><a href="http://www.SignWriting.org/literature">http://www.SignWriting.org/literature</a></span></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; min-height: 14px; "><br></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">Deaf Action Committee For SignWriting</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">Center For Sutton Movement Writing</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">an educational nonprofit organization</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">P.O. Box 517, La Jolla, CA, 92038, USA</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">tel 858-456-0098 fax 858-456-0020</div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; font: normal normal normal 12px/normal Arial; ">Skype Name: valeriesutton</div></div></div></div></span></div></span></div></span></div></span></span></div></span></div></span> </div><br></div></body></html>