<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><div>SignWriting List</div><div>December 8, 2008</div><div><br></div><div>Hello Andre -</div><div>In a SignWriting curriculum, for children, I would put learning SW Handwriting in the third year...</div><div><br></div><div>Just as it explains on these web pages:</div><div><br></div><div><a href="http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/cursive/curs003.html">http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/cursive/curs003.html</a></div><div><br></div><div>and</div><div><br></div><div><a href="http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/cursive/curs004.html">http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/cursive/curs004.html</a></div><div><br></div><div>In any written form, writing in a "faster cursive style" takes skill. Plus SignWriting does not have the documentation ready for teaching formal SW Handwriting...</div><div><br></div><div>Therefore, when we were young children learning to write English characters, we did not start by learning English cursive-handwriting...we started with hand-printing each English character carefully, writing them in rows and rows until we became skilled...</div><div><br></div><div>Then, after learning how to write in this perfect hand-printing style, after around the second grade...for me it was in the third grade...I started to learn to write real handwriting in school (for English)...so based on that experience, I suggest that SW handprinting should be taught the first two years of a SignWriting curriculum, and the SW handwriting starts around the third year in school...</div><div><br></div><div>Stefan has some experience with this...His student, Eduard, who is writing in the picture on the front page of our web site, is a skilled SignWriting student, having been in Stefan's classroom for several years...so he started the handwriting later, after getting familiar with SW in general...</div><div><br></div><div>So that is my advice...Your students and teachers are beginners or at least, in their first year of learning and using SW, so maybe the handwriting should wait until next year?</div><div><br></div><div>But they could try some of these Handprinting techniques right now:</div><div><br></div><div><a href="http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/cursive/curs011.html">http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/cursive/curs011.html</a></div><div><br></div><div>Val ;-)</div><div><br></div><div>----------</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div><br></font><div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">On Dec 8, 2008, at 8:05 AM, Gagnon et Thibeault wrote:</font></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></font><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; font-family: Arial; font-size: 16px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; orphans: 2; text-indent: 0px; text-transform: none; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-horizontal-spacing: 0px; -webkit-border-vertical-spacing: 0px; -webkit-text-decorations-in-effect: none; -webkit-text-size-adjust: auto; -webkit-text-stroke-width: 0px; "><div bgcolor="#000000" style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Hi Val, Anne-Claude and everyone,</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font><font><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Anny, I don't ask that you translate</font></font><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> a SW handwriting's web pages. You translate only two words : handprinting and handwriting.</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> I mean that I need only a section "Quick dailly writing". I am writing a LSQ curriculum for a SW writing. I understand that you need to write new books. No problem. I am trying better to describe a SW handwriting (quick daily writing).</font></font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> I believe that Deaf students write a SW handprinting because teachers don't know about SW handwriting norms (Quick daily writing).</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> Hand waving</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> André</font></font></strong></div><blockquote dir="ltr" style="padding-right: 0px; padding-left: 5px; margin-left: 5px; border-left-color: rgb(255, 255, 0); border-left-width: 2px; border-left-style: solid; margin-right: 0px; "><div style="font: normal normal normal 10pt/normal arial; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">----- Original Message -----</font></div><div style="background-image: initial; background-repeat: initial; background-attachment: initial; -webkit-background-clip: initial; -webkit-background-origin: initial; background-color: rgb(228, 228, 228); font: normal normal normal 10pt/normal arial; background-position: initial initial; "><b><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">From:</font></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><a title="signwriting@mac.com" href="mailto:signwriting@mac.com"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Valerie Sutton</font></a></div><div style="font: normal normal normal 10pt/normal arial; "><b><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">To:</font></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><a title="sw-l@majordomo.valenciacc.edu" href="mailto:sw-l@majordomo.valenciacc.edu"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">SignWriting List</font></a></div><div style="font: normal normal normal 10pt/normal arial; "><b><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Cc:</font></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><a title="atg@videotron.ca" href="mailto:atg@videotron.ca"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Gagnon et Thibeault</font></a></div><div style="font: normal normal normal 10pt/normal arial; "><b><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Sent:</font></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Monday, December 08, 2008 10:12 AM</font></div><div style="font: normal normal normal 10pt/normal arial; "><b><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Subject:</font></b><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Re: [sw-l] Handwriting</font></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">SignWriting List</font><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">December 8, 2008</font></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Hello Andre and Anny -</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">There is no document to translate...smile...but there are web pages.</font></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">If you follow all the links on this web page:</font></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">SignWriting Handwriting</font></div><div><a href="http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/cursive/"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">http://www.signwriting.org/lessons/cursive/</font></a></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">There are six sections and each section has several web pages...I do not know if Andre really needs a translation of those web pages into French?</font></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">I have nothing else to give you right now, Andre...More books on Handwriting will have to wait for awhile, since I am so behind on other books that need to be updated...</font></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Have you seen the front page of our web site? Stefan's Deaf student Eduard is quite an artist with SW calligraphy, don't you think?</font></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">SignWriting HomePage</font></div><div><a href="http://www.SignWriting.org"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">http://www.SignWriting.org</font></a></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Stefan will be sending us more photos of the finished art later...i look forward to seeing them!</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">And I believe that Kim from Boston has also done some SW calligraphy...</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Kim's work</font></div><div><a href="http://www.signwriting.org/usa/massachusetts/"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">http://www.signwriting.org/usa/massachusetts/</font></a></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Val ;-)</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">-----------</font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font><div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">On Dec 8, 2008, at 6:55 AM, Anne-Claude Prélaz Girod wrote:</font></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></font><blockquote type="cite"><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><font class="Apple-style-span" size="6"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 24px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">andré</font></span></font><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="6"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 24px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="6"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 24px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">what kind of document do you need to get translated from english into french ?!?!?!</font></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="6"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 24px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="6"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 24px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">let me know</font></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="6"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 24px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" size="6"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="font-size: 24px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Anny</font></span></font></div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font><div><div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Le 8 déc. 08 à 15:43, Gagnon et Thibeault a écrit :</font></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></font><blockquote type="cite"><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Hi Anne-Claude, Val and everyone,</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> Anny, I would like you to translate a handprinting and a handwriting</font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">from English to French?</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> Val, I am writing a LSQ curriculum from grade 7th to 8th including SW reading and SW writing now. But, I don't know about handwriting</font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font><span class="Apple-converted-space"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">norms. I would like you to explain me handwriting norms in general. You remember that you gave a handwriting course to some participants one year ago. I love learning it. I don't mean that participants do their homework but they read only instructions. Would you give us general explanations or instructions of handwriting norms which help me write and explain a LSQ curriculum including SW writing ? You don't need an explanation of the handprinting.</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> Best regards,</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> André</font></font></strong></div><div><strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><font face="Arial" size="6"></font></font></strong><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></div><div><strong><font face="Arial" size="6"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"> </font></font></strong></div><div style="min-height: 14px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div style="min-height: 14px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div style="min-height: 14px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">____________________________________________</font></div><div style="min-height: 14px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">SW-L SignWriting List</font></div><div style="min-height: 14px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Post Message</font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><a href="mailto:SW-L@majordomo.valenciacc.edu"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">SW-L@majordomo.valenciacc.edu</font></a></div><div style="min-height: 14px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">List Archives and Help</font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><a href="http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/</font></a></div><div style="min-height: 14px; margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">Change Email Settings</font></div><div style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><a href="http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l</font></a></div></blockquote></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br><br><br>____________________________________________<br><br>SW-L SignWriting List<br><br>Post Message<br></font><a href="mailto:SW-L@majordomo.valenciacc.edu"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">SW-L@majordomo.valenciacc.edu</font></a><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br><br>List Archives and Help<br></font><a href="http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist/</font></a><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br><br>Change Email Settings<br></font><a href="http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l"><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000">http://majordomo.valenciacc.edu/mailman/listinfo/sw-l</font></a></blockquote></div><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br></font></div></blockquote></div></span><font class="Apple-style-span" color="#000000"><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"></font></blockquote></div><br></body></html>