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Steve, <br>
<br>
Drawing upon the idea of using polar coordinates, a path could be
traced from symbol to symbol. A collection of paths inherent in a
signed language along with different origin points could comprise a
separate alphabet in the same way that Hiragana in the Japanese
language provides pronunciation information for it's Kanji characters.
<br>
<br>
In this manner, starting with an origin point designation followed by a
path designation followed by a list of Signwriting symbols could be all
that would needed to establish a sequence that then places the symbols
in their positions within a sign.<br>
<br>
Bill<br>
<br>
<br>
On 5/27/2010 4:05 PM, Bill Reese wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:4BFED078.1080807@tampabay.rr.com" type="cite">
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Steve,<br>
The attachment point way you mention seems to be a polar coordinate
system rather than the cartesian coordinate system you're using right
now. It lacks the distance specification, which would need to be
related somehow to the symbol it's attached to. So I would agree that
using a different coordinate system to define attachment points is
probably not much different than defining symbol origin points using
cartesian coordinates. However, the one advantage it seems to have is
establishing a relationship between symbols. In theory, this would
allow you to place the first symbol in a sign spelling sequence at a
known origin point and then traversing through the polar coordinates
from one symbol to the next in a sequential manner.<br>
<br>
Bill<br>
<br>
<br>
On 5/27/2010 12:42 PM, Steve Slevinski wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:4BFEA112.8080901@signpuddle.net" type="cite">
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Charles Butler wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:848288.74548.qm@web58806.mail.re1.yahoo.com"
type="cite">
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style="font-family: arial,helvetica,sans-serif; font-size: 12pt;">
<div>How
is Hongul (Korean) encoded. I thought it was spacial characters merged
to look like graphics, not a corpus of words. There are only 20
letters in Korean, yet it does print looking like ideographs.</div>
<div> </div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
Hi Charles,<br>
<br>
There are 11172 different Hangul. These are created from 68 different
Jamo shapes. The Jamo shapes are listed sequentially and specific
constructions rules are used to create Hangul based on the sequential
order of the Jamo.<br>
<br>
This is a complicated exception to the idea of a character is a letter
or a pictograph. In the case of Hangul, a pictograph is represented by
a combination of characters. The same technique is used for accented
characters like "é", which can be a combination of the letter "e"
followed by the accent character.<br>
<br>
More information...<br>
<a moz-do-not-send="true" class="moz-txt-link-freetext"
href="http://www.kfunigraz.ac.at/%7Ekatzer/korean_hangul_unicode.html">http://www.kfunigraz.ac.at/~katzer/korean_hangul_unicode.html</a><br>
<br>
<br>
Charles Butler wrote:
<blockquote cite="mid:766589.60811.qm@web58804.mail.re1.yahoo.com"
type="cite">
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<div>I have just looked at the Wikipedia article on Hongul
rendering
using Unicode, and what the unicode font system has to do to assemble a
word (merging more than one character in a set square). If Hongul can
do it with a limited character set (around 240) then there is no reason
that SignWriting cannot define itself with a character rendering. </div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<br>
The reason is that Hangul uses construction rules and SignWriting uses
spatial position. When one Jamo is followed by another Jamo, there is
a specific rule that is applied. In SignWriting, if a hand symbol is
followed by a movement arrow and then a facial expression, there is no
specific rule that can be used to create the sign.<br>
<br>
<br>
The only possible way to get this to work would be with the idea of
attachment points, where an additional character is placed between 2
symbols to explicitly state how to symbols are joined. However, this
has the complication of terminal ends, such as when both hands are
involved.<br>
<br>
<br>
Let's take the example<br>
<img src="cid:part1.01040700.02070402@tampabay.rr.com" alt=""><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
To encode this with attachment points, it would look like this...<br>
<img src="cid:part2.06030409.01030400@tampabay.rr.com" alt="">,
attachment point 135 degrees, <img
src="cid:part3.09020607.07070101@tampabay.rr.com" alt="">, attachment
point 90 degrees, <img
src="cid:part4.07050805.00000307@tampabay.rr.com" alt="">, return to
center, attachment point 225 degrees, <img
src="cid:part5.06010709.05060508@tampabay.rr.com" alt="">, attachment
point 270 degrees, <img
src="cid:part6.00080107.02080804@tampabay.rr.com" alt=""><br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
I am convinced that the Hangul construction technique is inadequate for
SignWriting; however the Hangul technique may be a good starting place
for future development.<br>
<br>
I am convinced that we can not make assumptions of symbol placement
based on symbol order alone.<br>
<br>
I am unconvinced that the idea of attachment points will work or is
worth the effort.<br>
<br>
For what it's worth,<br>
-Steve<br>
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<br>
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