<html><body><div style="color:#000; background-color:#fff; font-family:tahoma, new york, times, serif;font-size:12pt"><div><span>My only comment is that I hope all dictionary entries don't require a linguist to actually put them in or to find them. I have been excited about SignWriting because it has allowed me to write what I actually sign, not describe it in a spoken language for a third party. </span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: tahoma, 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span><br></span></div><div style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-size: 16px; font-family: tahoma, 'new york', times, serif; background-color: transparent; font-style: normal; "><span>That will become an impossible burden to lexicographers. Creating a search engine that can handle a bunch of parameters is fine, but who is going to go through every single sign and assign them all possible entries? The
burden becomes impossible, and is no longer useful to an actual user of SignWriting as a writing system, not a linguistic tool. </span></div><div></div><div> </div><div>Charles Butler<br>chazzer3332000@yahoo.com<br>240-764-5748<br>Clear writing moves business forward.</div><div><br></div> <div style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: tahoma, 'new york', times, serif; "> <div style="font-size: 12pt; font-family: 'times new roman', 'new york', times, serif; "> <div dir="ltr"> <hr size="1"> <font size="2" face="Arial"> <b><span style="font-weight:bold;">From:</span></b> Rachel Channon <rchannon1@VERIZON.NET><br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">To:</span></b> SW-L@LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU <br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Sent:</span></b> Wednesday, December 11, 2013 5:13 PM<br> <b><span style="font-weight: bold;">Subject:</span></b> Re: Design for SignPuddle 3: parts-of-speech and morphology of sign language<br> </font> </div>
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#yiv1624340549 </style><div><div class="yiv1624340549WordSection1"><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">That diagram is interesting.<span style=""> </span><span class="yiv1624340549GramE">hmm</span>.<span style=""> </span>A complete list of morphological characteristics might be hard – I don’t think it is as settled as parts of speech.</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">In my mind, morphology really translates to: some named characteristic of a group of signs or a group of morphemes.<span style=""> </span>Practically speaking, in most sign languages, a sign is almost the same thing as a morpheme – that is in most sign languages most simple signs are one morpheme.<span style=""> </span>(This is quite different from spoken languages where many word are made up of two or more morphemes as in <i style="">disinterested</i>
which has at least 3 morphemes: dis + interest + <span class="yiv1624340549GramE">ed</span>.)<span style=""> </span><span style=""> </span>However, this isn’t always true.<span style=""> </span>For example, ASL has a negative incorporation element of the hand twisting/rotating (as in DON’T-KNOW, DON’T-WANT) that is at the morpheme level. <span style=""> </span>Compounds are usually two morphemes. Furthermore, under some theories, classifiers can be considered to be bundles of many morphemes – the handshape is one or more morpheme, the location another set, the action another set, orientation…etc etc.<span style=""> </span></span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">So there are really at least four elements of this information:<span style=""> </span>1) How many morphemes are there in a sign (usually 1, sometimes 2, <span
class="yiv1624340549GramE">sometimes<span style=""> </span>many</span>, other choices less common). 2) <span class="yiv1624340549GramE">are</span> the morphemes simultaneous or sequential and 3) for each morpheme, what is its morpheme group, if any? <span class="yiv1624340549GramE">and</span> 4) is the sign as a whole in some morphological group?<span style=""> </span></span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">Examples:</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">DON’T-WANT: 2 simultaneous morphemes:<span style=""> </span>WANT + Negative incorporation</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">WOMAN: 2 sequential morphemes: GIRL + FINE.<span style=""> </span>The sign is a compound</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">J-B
(job): 2 sequential morphemes: J + B. <span style=""> </span>Each element is fingerspelling; the entire sign is a fingerspelled loan sign.</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">MOTHER: 1 morpheme</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">BAKE-ER: 2 sequential morphemes BAKE + ER (person affix).<span style=""> </span>Some people might classify this as a compound, some might call it an affixed form</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;"> </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;"> </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">Given this complexity, it might make sense to set up </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">1)
<span class="yiv1624340549GramE">a</span> simple set of choices that allow multiple choices, so that I could select for example classifier AND compound. An initial list:</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;"> </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal" style="margin-left:.5in;"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">Classifier, compound, fingerspelling – one handed, fingerspelling – two handed, fingerspelled loan sign, character sign, assimilated compound, compound, negative incorporation, clitic, affix, initialized sign, phrase, inflected verb, uninflected verb, locational verb, noun-verb pair, repeating or non-repeating signs, numbers, gestural, pantomimic, iconic. Classifiers are subdivided in many ways by different linguists, so some linguists might want to add to the list of classifiers – for example, classifiers for handling objects vs. motion vs. drawing-in-the-air
and so on.</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;"> </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">2) <span class="yiv1624340549GramE">a</span> second set of choices specifying number of morphemes that defaults to 1 and allows numeric write-ins plus the choices innumerable, uncertain, and many, </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">3) <span class="yiv1624340549GramE">a</span> fixed choice set for either simultaneous or sequential, </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span class="yiv1624340549GramE"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">and</span></span><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;"> 4) a free form area for additional information.</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">I hope that I haven’t forgotten
something utterly obvious.</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;">Rachel</span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;"> </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;"> </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;color:#1F497D;"> </span></div><div class="yiv1624340549yqt1735456864" id="yiv1624340549yqt62865"><div><div style="border:none;border-top:solid #E1E1E1 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in;"><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:11.0pt;"> SignWriting List: Read and Write Sign Languages [mailto:SW-L@LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Stephen E Slevinski Jr<br clear="none"><b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, December 11, 2013 11:33 AM<br clear="none"><b>To:</b>
SW-L@LISTSERV.VALENCIACOLLEGE.EDU<br clear="none"><b>Subject:</b> Design for SignPuddle 3: parts-of-speech and morphology of sign language</span></div></div></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"> </div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="">Hi SignWriting List,<br clear="none"><br clear="none">This has been a great year, but I'm woeful behind on several project. I appreciate all of the positive work people have been able to do with SignPuddle. The long awaited work on SignPuddle 3 continues. Next year will be a break out year for written sign language across the globe.<br clear="none"><br clear="none"></span><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="https://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Incubator:Test_wikis_of_sign_languages"><span style="">https://incubator.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Incubator:Test_wikis_of_sign_languages</span></a><span style=""><br clear="none"><br clear="none">I'm finalizing the
database for SignPuddle 3. I'm very impressed with MySQL Workbench and the diagramming tool in particular. (image below)<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Database design<br clear="none">--------------<br clear="none">For individual entries, I have designed the parts-of-speech solution, but not the morphology solution yet.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">For parts-of-speech, there is a small list of values for the most common choices. noun, verb, adjective, adverb, sentence, other. This list can be translated into other languages.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Additionally, each entry has a separate parts-of-speech text field, which can be used for a more accurate description or a value outside of the common list.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">I was considering a similar strategy for morphology. First, a new table with a static list of the most common and universal choices. Second, a freeform text field for each entry
for alternate descriptions and complex analysis.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Researching morphology, it appears there are several kinds of analysis, each with its own classifications and descriptions. Is a single list too simplistic to be helpful? I'd appreciate any discussion of the topic.<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Morphology list: monosyllable, compound, ... ?<br clear="none"><br clear="none">Thanks,<br clear="none">-Steve <br clear="none"><br clear="none">PS - Here is part of the working diagram for the database. I haven't added anything for morphology yet. <br clear="none"><span style=""><img id="yiv1624340549Picture_x0020_1" border="0" width="972" height="710" src="cid:1.1417045873@web163406.mail.gq1.yahoo.com" alt="cid:image001.png@01CEF683.43134C90"></span></span></div><div class="yiv1624340549MsoNormal"><span style="">________________________________________________ </span></div><div><span
style="color:windowtext;">SIGNWRITING LIST INFORMATION </span></div><div><span style="color:windowtext;">Valerie Sutton SignWriting List moderator </span><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:sutton@signwriting.org" target="_blank" href="mailto:sutton@signwriting.org">sutton@signwriting.org</a><span style="color:windowtext;"> </span></div><div><span style="color:windowtext;">Post Messages to the SignWriting List: </span><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" ymailto="mailto:sw-l@listserv.valenciacollege.edu" target="_blank" href="mailto:sw-l@listserv.valenciacollege.edu">sw-l@listserv.valenciacollege.edu</a><span style="color:windowtext;"> </span></div><div><span style="color:windowtext;">SignWriting List Archives & Home Page </span><a rel="nofollow" shape="rect" target="_blank" href="http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist">http://www.signwriting.org/forums/swlist</a><span style="color:windowtext;"> </span></div><div><span
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