Not even X, much more Y [was: re: gill (verb) = laugh]

[Douglas G. Wilson]

>  ... "not even x, much less y", though, I thought was
>a frozen collocation, like "let alone", even granting the recent
>tendency to "invert" the scales for the "much less" and "let alone"
>constructions.  It's not a confused meaning that's weird in the
>Parkins line as much as the form--do you have actual citations for
>"not even x much more y"?

I'm sure I've seen it several times in modern writing ... although of
course it's more likely when the expression is confusingly broken up with
modifiers.

Here is a bald example of the construction (without the "even"), taken from
the Web -- http://www.lib.cmich.edu/clarke/detroit/dodge1776.htm -- quoting
a 1903 book which apparently quotes in turn a journal from 1776:

<<... De Jeane came and told me to get up and walk to the dungeon from
whence I came. I told him I was unable: "Crawl then you damn'd rebel, or I
will make you." I told him he might do as he pleased, but I could not
stand, much more walk: On this he called a party of soldiers, who tossed me
into a cart and carried me to the dungeon ....>>

Here is an apparently recent Web example --
http://victorian.fortunecity.com/parkstreet/609/s1.html:

<<He sputtered, but he could not tear his gaze from the monster, much more,
speak.>>

----------

The confusion might arise in part from the converse (positive) expression
(of "not [even] X, much less Y") -- i.e., "[even] Y, much more X". This is
quite rare, at least in modern writing, I think, but I believe this is an
example -- from MoA (Michigan) -- from Cornelius Walker, "The life and
correspondence of Rev. William Sparrow, D.D." (1876):

<<Out of the abundance of the heart we act, much more speak.>>

And here's a Web example --
http://www.ldsworld.com/gems/150/display/0,2576,2106,00.html -- which is a
little different but again correct (I think) -- from 1848:

<<Before our halt at noon Archibald Williams drove his Wagon over a sick
Sheep. Both wheels passed over his body. Brother John Hughes picked it up,
laid hands on it, when it walked away apparently well. It was to me a
miracle to see it stand up, much more walk away.>>

-- Doug Wilson