Matrushka; Hryvna

[Dennis R. Preston]

No, in Polish the [u] is phonemically tense (close), not an allophone
of /u/ being influenced by /w/.

dInIs

>For a while during college I took Polish lessons privately from a
>woman from Lodz.  She pronounced it [wudzh] as I perceived it.  I
>suspect the final affricate may actually be devoiced but lenis, so
>that I interpreted it as still voiced.  I remember the vowel as
>close rather than open (under the influence of the preceding [w-]?).
>I didn't hear any difference in the
>pronunciation of the name by our guide on a tour in Poland two years ago.
>
>I HEARD somewhere that while the Poles pronounce it [wudzh], its
>Yiddish-speaking inhabitants pronounced it [l)dz} (with )=open o),
>though
>I've never actually heard a Yiddish speaker mention the city.  My
>Polish teacher had lived in the Lodz ghetto and done forced labor in
>a factory there during the war, but I don't know whether she was
>actually Jewish, or whether she spoke Yiddish.
>
>Peter Mc.
>
>--On Friday, July 19, 2002 10:54 AM -0400 Laurence Horn
><laurence.horn at YALE.EDU> wrote:
>
>>At 10:32 AM -0400 7/19/02, Alice Faber wrote:
>>>Laurence Horn said:
>>>>I thought it [pronunciation of Lodz] was /wUdzh/, with the wowel,
>>>>er, vowel of "look" and a
>>>>voiced final affricate.  But then they [my grandparents]'d have
>>>>spoken Yiddish and
>>>>pronounced it god knows how.
>>>>
>>>
>>>Well, most varieties of Yiddish lost final devoicing lo these many
>>>years. And therein hangs a tale, actually, many tales. (It was
>>>subsequently reacquired in some varieties of Polish Yiddish.)
>>>
>>>Alice
>>>
>>Well, yes, but my point was that virtually none of the Polish city
>>names sounded anything like that in Yiddish.  The Yiddish names
>>tended to be much closer to the German names for the relevant cities,
>>and perhaps (does anyone here know?) the German/Yiddish take on Lwów
>>bears as much relation to either [wUdzh] or [wutsh] as Lwów [lvuf]
>>does to Lemberg.  Or maybe not--it could have just been something
>>like [lOdz], the way "Lodz" would come out in German minus final
>>devoicink, with O = open o.  These are, however, stabs in the dark.
>>
>>larry
>
>
>
>****************************************************************************
>                               Peter A. McGraw
>                   Linfield College   *   McMinnville, OR
>                            pmcgraw at linfield.edu