"Mince pies" in Cockney rhyming slang--possible insight from Barr...

[James A. Landau]

In a message dated 5/13/2003 9:45:49 PM Eastern Standard Time, gcohen at UMR.EDU
writes:

> >_Can she make mince pies, Billy boy, Billy boy?_
> >_Can she make mince pies, Billy boy?_
> >_Yes; she can make mince pies_
> >_Quick's a cat can wink its eyes;_
> >_But she's a young thing and cannot leave her mother._
>
>   Note the mention of eyes in these lyrics about mince pies.  Maybe
> this mention of eyes was the inspiration for coining "mince pies"
> (eyes) in Cockney rhyming slang.

One problem with this argument is that the first four lines of the song are
strict anapestic:

o-oh WHERE have you BEEN bill-y BOY bill-y BOy

and the word "mince" does not fit.  Mr/Ms <A HREF="mailto:self at TOWSE.COM">self at TOWSE.COM</A> gave us more
plausible lyrics

    Can she bake a cherry pie, Billy Boy, Billy Boy?

which are proper anapestic.  I have never heard "mince" pronounced as two
syllables, although MWCD10 says the word comes from the French verb "mincer"
whose past participle is mince/ with an acute accent over the e, pronounced
/min sei/.

My guess is that Gerald Cohen got hold of a badly-transcribed set of lyrics.
Perhaps the original was either "Can she make min-say pies?" or "Can she make
mincemeat pies?"

     - James A. Landau