Police as "pigs"

[Kathy Seal]

Wow, that's early on. Thank you.

Kathy
 ----- Original Message -----
From: "Wilson Gray" <wilson.gray at RCN.COM>

> >
> > Do you know when in the sixties college students, activists, etc.
> > started
> > referring to police as "pigs"?
> >
> >


>
> My guess is 1965. I *know* that it was before 1969, since, by then,
> local high-school all-stars had begun to play an annual flag-football
> game against the younger local cops in a game which was called the "Pig
> Bowl." This was in Sacramento, CA.
>
> -Wilson Gray
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Wilson Gray" <wilson.gray at RCN.COM>
> > To: <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> > Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 6:05 PM
> > Subject: Re: "di?nt" (with glottal stop)
> >
> >
> >> ---------------------- Information from the mail
> > header -----------------------
> >> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >> Poster:       Wilson Gray <wilson.gray at RCN.COM>
> >> Subject:      Re: "di?nt" (with glottal stop)
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> ----
> > -----
> >>
> >> On Nov 16, 2004, at 5:09 PM, Beverly Flanigan wrote:
> >>
> >>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >>> -----------------------
> >>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >>> Poster:       Beverly Flanigan <flanigan at OHIOU.EDU>
> >>> Subject:      Re: "di?nt" (with glottal stop)
> >>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>> --
> >>> --------
> >>>
> >>> As Wilson knows, I lived in St. Louis for 10 years (in the '60s), but
> >>> alas,
> >>> I was so cocooned by St. Louis U and Wash U (as we called it) that I
> >>> didn't
> >>> really tune into the local dialect(s).   But I do recall "No I never"
> >>> from
> >>> somewhere during that era.  I was struck by my distant cousins' use
> >>> of
> >>> "sody pop" on the other side of the river, in Collinsville
> >>
> >> During my four years of high school, the Collinsville High School
> >> Cahoks (rhymes with "Jayhawks," i.e. "Cayhawks"; people said that, if
> >> Collinsville had a heart, it would give up its team nickname to the
> >> Cahokia, IL, HS; Collinsville had no heart ) won every single
> >> basketball game that they played against us, at home or away.
> >>
> >> -Wilson
> >>
> >>>  but I don't
> >>> recall "youse" (though my Baltimore in-laws used it all the time).  A
> >>> colleague's wife here in Athens but originally from St. Louis has the
> >>> "for/far" homophony (or maybe reversal? I'll listen again).  Now
> >>> Labov
> >>> claims St. Louis is a "corridor" extending the Northern Cities Shift
> >>> southward (maybe to Cincinnati too), but it wasn't back in the old
> >>> days!
> >>>
> >>> At 04:02 PM 11/16/2004, you wrote:
> >>>> On Nov 16, 2004, at 3:13 PM, Beverly Flanigan wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >>>>> -----------------------
> >>>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >>>>> Poster:       Beverly Flanigan <flanigan at OHIOU.EDU>
> >>>>> Subject:      Re: "di?nt" (with glottal stop)
> >>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> --------
> >>>>>
> >>>>> This deleted tap [dInt]
> >>>>
> >>>> This pronunciation was used by white kids in St. Louis, back in the
> >>>> day. These kids would now, as is your humble correspondent, be
> >>>> approaching their 70's all too quickly. BTW, what about "no I
> >>>> never,"
> >>>> used by these same white no-longer-kids, as opposed to the "no I
> >>>> didn't" used by us coloreds? Is/was that widespread? And how about
> >>>> the
> >>>> use of "youse" by white kids in St. Louis in my day, when everyone
> >>>> claimed that this usage was peculiar to Brooklyn, NY? St. Louis is a
> >>>> kind of Rodney Dangerfield of dialectology. It don't get no respect.
> >>>>
> >>>> -Wilson Gray
> >>>>
> >>>>>  or [dIn?] is what I hear in my nieces in Minnesota,
> >>>>> and I assume it's widespread.  I glottalize intervocalically, as do
> >>>>> most
> >>>>> people I know here in Ohio.  Does anyone say [dIDnt] except perhaps
> >>>>> in
> >>>>> formal speech?  (D = flap, n is syllabic.)
> >>>>>
> >>>>> At 01:14 AM 11/16/2004, Zwicky wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> just a warning...  the spelling <di'nt> (or similar things) is
> >>>>>> often
> >>>>>> used to code a pronunciation in which the intervocalic voiced tap
> >>>>>> is
> >>>>>> simply deleted.  not the same thing as a pronunciation with an
> >>>>>> intervocalic glottalish bit.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> i suspect that ben zimmer's examples include some with an
> >>>>>> intervocalic
> >>>>>> glottal stop and some with no intervocalic consonant at all.  this
> >>>>>> is
> >>>>>> not to deny that some of them have glottal stops, possibly from a
> >>>>>> catchphrase.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> arnold
> >>>
> >