"Whole nine yards" : some negative evidence [addendum]

[Douglas G. Wilson]

>".... And I would explain to them I never knew the number of rounds we
>carried, number of total rounds, but we did what always say that there
>were nine yards of ammunition in those belts, ...."

I think he's saying "we always said [during WW II] that there were 9 yards
of ammunition in a belt". It is possible that he's saying "I like to
present a fabrication or fable to the effect that we always said that there
were 9 yards of ammunition in a belt" but I think this interpretation is
less plausible. Anyway, somebody could contact Roberts and find out. He's a
well-known figure. Do you trust 50-year-old recollections anyway? I usually
don't. [But maybe he would say, "Why sure, that expression was used all the
time in our squadron newsletter back in the late 1940's; I think I've got
every issue right here; just let me take a look ...." (^_^)]

I don't present this stuff as evidence for this etymology hypothesis (on
which I don't have any strong opinion), but only as partial refutation of
one objection.

The objection here was that there are no first-person recollections of WW
II era use of "nine yards" in reference to ammo belts. The Roberts item and
at least one other on the Web are IMHO first-person recollections, whether
true or not. Even if they are convincingly corroborated, this is not
enough, or nearly enough, to establish the etymology, IMHO. As Dave Wilton
points out, Roberts does not claim to be certain about the etymological
connection; even if he did claim to be sure, I would not be convinced
without much better evidence.

Whether or not either of these recollections is correct, I am virtually
certain that somebody somewhere during the 1940's said something like "Each
ammo belt is [about] nine yards long." Because the belts were about that
long, or many of them were. I'm pretty sure somebody else somewhere else
said "Each of these pieces of cloth is nine yards long." Somebody else said
"This is a nine-yard truck." Somebody else said "My driveway required nine
yards of concrete." More interesting (in a way) are the documented
references to the purportedly traditional nine-yard shroud, the metaphoric
nine yards of calico, the notional nine yards of the human gut. The
etymology of the modern expression in question is still unknown (at least
to me).

Note that there has been a lot of casual discussion of this etymology story
on the Internet (as well as in print). It is true AFAIK that there are very
few cases where somebody says "I heard this back before 1960." But it is
also true AFAIK that there are very few cases where somebody says something
like "I was a USAF pilot from 1940 until 1960, and I never heard this
expression once in the whole time." The fact is that we have very little
input one way or the other from the persons who might recall (generally
elderly military men). When I have asked such persons directly (even with
respect to Vietnam era usage) the usual response is "Can't remember for
sure when I first heard that. Don't know where it came from." Sometimes one
of the popular stories is produced: IIRC, I have heard from USAF veterans
the ammo-belt story, the sailing-ship story, and the ironic football story,
all presented as speculation or as something heard or read somewhere.
Likely Wilton or Quinion has similar experience? Do the lexicographers
receive letters on such subjects?

-- Doug Wilson