"all the faster" (in Latin too)

[Laurence Horn]

At 10:12 AM -0700 6/28/05, Arnold M. Zwicky wrote:
>On Jun 27, 2005, at 6:35 PM, Larry Horn wrote:
>
>>... as to the claim that the non-comparative "all the Xer"
>>construction is limited to "bigger" and "faster", I think that's a
>>bit too strong a constraint.
>
>that was lise menn's claim.  i certainly accept some other As --
>"further"/"farther" for sure, and some others.
>
>>Here are some relevant google hits, all of which sound fine to me.
>
>LONGER
>
>>... that's all the longer it's ever lasted
>>
>>... is that all the longer it's been?
>>
>>is that all the longer you expect your ride to last?!
>>
>>Is that all the longer you would last?????
>
>OLDER
>
>>That's all the older she is
>>
>>... that's all the older he is going to get.
>>
>>If that's all the older it is,...
>>
>>Because that's all the older the earth is...
>>
>>That's all the older you are, Duck?
>
>BETTER
>
>>Is that all the better you think I can do??
>>
>>Is that all the better you can climb?
>>
>>Is that all the better of an argument you can put up?
>
>HIGHER
>
>>That's all the higher it needs to be.
>>
>>That's all the higher I expect it to play.
>
>TALLER
>
>>... and that's all the taller he was?
>
>(note preference for zero-relatives over "that"-relatives.  and how
>many of these examples are questions.)
>
>>and so on, of course all involving unmarked adjectives denoting the
>>positive quantitative scalar element (no, or at most very few, cases
>>of "all the lower", "all the younger", "all the shorter" in the
>>relevant sense).
>
>i think this is a necessary, but not sufficient, condition for
>occurrence in this construction.  that is, the maximum category is
>unmarked As denoting the positive quantitative scalar element, and
>there might be people who have the construction for all such As.  but
>i'm not such a person.  things like "is that all the clearer you can
>write?" and "is that all the clearer the weather gets around here?"

cf. "That's all the clearer the vision was, then. But it was like a
beacon, leading
me eagerly onward."  but only that one, and none for "Is that all the
clearer...?"

>and many others are all odd for me.  my guess is that the best As for
>this construction are those that are "semantically central" -- if
>your language has any As at all, they will denote such properties
>(cue reference to dixon)  -- and "everyday" (frequent, not technical
>or otherwise registrally/stylistically restricted, etc.).  there's a
>nice little research project for someone here, i think.
>
I think there's also a pragmatic element that can override the
lexical semantics.  If I'm lowering some shelf, or whatever, my
companion can ask me to lower it a bit more and I could reply (if I'm
a speaker of the relevant wider dialect) "That's all the lower it
will/can go".  Let me googlify this intuition...yup, here are a few,
some including pricing rather than literal height:

LOWER

Its more stable and I upload faster now,, which is great. Still drop
18 packets,
but that's all the lower it seems to go.

They were willing to give it up for $350, but that's all the lower
they would go.

Yea, I saw ur posted message [re Mastiff puppies] and is that all the
lower the prices are gonna be?

That's all the lower I will go because there are some in there that
are rare and
you can't find in stores,(examples: ChaiotZu, Cyborg Frieza, and Uub)

If the outside pressure is only > 28" then that's all the lower the guage
will read.

Larry