wildflowers/poke sallit

[paulzjoh]

Here in Ar. folk lore says Poke must be cooked, a) to remove bitterness, b)
poke is poisonous if left uncooked
riginal Message -----
From: "James C Stalker" <stalker at MSU.EDU>
To: <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 9:23 PM
Subject: Re: wildflowers


> Sallit it is!
>
> Wilson Gray writes:
>
> > On May 19, 2005, at 9:45 PM, James C Stalker wrote:
> >
> >> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >> -----------------------
> >> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >> Poster:       James C Stalker <stalker at MSU.EDU>
> >> Subject:      Re: wildflowers
> >> -----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >> --------
> >>
> >> You question jogs my memory.  As a matter of fact, my mom called the
> >> collection of salad greens (aka weeds) poke salad, even though it was
> >> cooked, not served raw, and was a mixture of greens, not just pokeweed.
> >> (This hot cold thing is interesting as a side bar.  German/Dutch cole
> >> slaw,
> >> cabbage salad, can be hot or cold, at least in my wife's German
> >> heritage.)
> >> Back to my mom.  She did include young poke greens in the mix.  As
> >> these
> >> wild greens got older they became bitter or toxic.  Poke salad was a
> >> spring
> >> dish.
> >>
> >> Now, as for Tony Joe White.  I only heard the song and never saw the
> >> lyrics.
> >> I always assumed that I was hearing poke salad.  (As a matter of fact,
> >> I
> >> heard Tony Joe say "salat" rather than "salad.")  I just googled "Poke
> >> Salad
> >> Annie," and indeed the "official" title is Polk Salad Annie.  However,
> >> the
> >> transcriber of the lyrics that came up first left the title untouched,
> >> but
> >> changed almost all of the "polks" to "pokes."  The description of the
> >> greens
> >> in the lyrics fits with pokeweed.  Why "polk"?  Possibly a
> >> hypercorrection
> >> or an older spelling representing an older pronunciation.  In
> >> Appalachian
> >> English /l/ tends to be deleted before final stops.  You can hear the
> >> deletion in Patty Loveless's "You'll Never Leave Harlan Alive" where
> >> 'cold'
> >> becomes /cod/.  You also hear final /l/ deletion, 'coal' becomes /co/.
> >> The
> >> /l/ deletion is not unusual.  Dennis can no doubt fill in the details.
> >>   I
> >> don't know Louisiana dialects well enough, nor Tony Joe's origins, to
> >> know
> >> whether he assumed that "poke" had to have an /l/, just as non-rhotic
> >> folks
> >> are never sure where they are missing those /r/s that rhotic folk worry
> >> about so much, so he spelled it that way, or he was more poke/polk
> >> literate
> >> than I and spelled it right.  However, MW 11 does not list 'polk' as a
> >> variant spelling.
> >>
> >> Jim
> >>
> >
> > Until I bought the record, I likewise thought that the the title was
> > "_Poke_ Salad Annie" and I still feel that it ought to be, I also
> > thought that Tony Joe was black instead of White, until I saw him on
> > TV. He's from Goodwill, LA, which seems to be located just a few miles
> > beyond West Hell. My guess is that the spelling, "Polk..." is the
> > result of an assumption by someone unfamiliar with the spelling of
> > pokeweed, but who was familiar with the surname, "Polk." As for "salat"
> > v. "sallid," let's compromise on "sallit."
> >
> > -Wilson
> >
> >> Wilson Gray writes:
> >>
> >>> Jim, would you happen to know whether poke(weed) and poke/polk salad
> >>> are the same thing? I know what poke(weed) is, but I know the term,
> >>> "polk salad," only from a song. Do you recall a bit of blue-eyed soul
> >>> by one Tony Joe White from Louisiana? He had a one-hit wonder entitled
> >>> "Polk-Salad Annie," i.e. "Poke-Sallid Aynih," described as "a mean,
> >>> vicious, straight razor-totin' 'oman"?
> >>>
> >>> -Wilson
> >>>
> >>> On May 18, 2005, at 10:25 PM, James C Stalker wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >>>> -----------------------
> >>>> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >>>> Poster:       James C Stalker <stalker at MSU.EDU>
> >>>> Subject:      Re: wildflowers
> >>>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>> --
> >>>> --------
> >>>>
> >>>> In the spring, I used to follow my mother around our ex-urban
> >>>> neighborhood,
> >>>> in development but not developed, as she collected up greens for
> >>>> supper--dandelion, poke, and other stuff.  Even in the spring they
> >>>> were
> >>>> pretty strong tasting, but good.  My regret is twofold: as a
> >>>> linguist,
> >>>> I
> >>>> didn't pay attention to the names; as an eater, I can't replicate her
> >>>> search.
> >>>>
> >>>> Jim
> >>>>
> >>>> Arnold M. Zwicky writes:
> >>>>
> >>>>> On May 17, 2005, at 12:01 PM, sagehen wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> arnold writes:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>> and there are strains of some weedy
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>> wildflowers -- even dandelions! -- that are meant for cultivation,
> >>>>>> though i tend to be wary indeed of them.<
> >>>>>> ~~~~~~
> >>>>>> Those dandelions that are cultivated for food are usually not
> >>>>>> actually the
> >>>>>> same as the wild ones, /Taraxacum/, but are a variety of chicory,
> >>>>>> /Cicchorium/.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> i've seen both offered for sale.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Wild dandelions are a wonderful food plant. In our cool New
> >>>>>> England-
> >>>>>> like
> >>>>>> summers we can eat them from early spring until well after frost in
> >>>>>> the
> >>>>>> fall.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> yes indeed.  in my eastern pa. childhood, the beginning of spring
> >>>>> was
> >>>>> signaled by my pa. dutch grandmother going out and grubbing in the
> >>>>> snow for dandelion greens, which she'd prepare with "endive
> >>>>> dressing" ["endive" here = chicory], mostly curdled milk and bacon.
> >>>>> yum.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> arnold
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> James C. Stalker
> >>>> Department of English
> >>>> Michigan State University
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> James C. Stalker
> >> Department of English
> >> Michigan State University
> >>
> >
>
>
>
> James C. Stalker
> Department of English
> Michigan State University
>