Northern Cities /aI/
Dennis R. Preston
preston at MSU.EDU
Thu Dec 21 20:48:46 UTC 2006
LH, man of words that he is, has done a great service to the State
with Thumbelino/as. I am, however, still awaiting a reward from the
Governor's office for my designating those from Saginaw as
Saganista/os.
dInIs
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>-----------------------
>Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>Poster: Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
>Subject: Re: Northern Cities /aI/
>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>At 9:03 AM -0500 12/20/06, Dennis R. Preston wrote:
>>Paul,
>>
>>We haven't done Yoopers and Thumbers (Thumbs?) specifically.
>
>I nominate "Thumbelinos/as". If you live in Bad Axe or Pigeon, you
>wouldn't really object to being called Thumbelinos or Thumbelinas,
>would you?
>
>LH
>
>>Substrates loom especially large in the first as you well know. We
>>were simply interested that the phonetic conditioning of the classic
>>Canadian Raising rule didn't apply; not surprising of course.
>>
>>dInIs
>>
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>>>Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>Poster: "Paul A Johnston, Jr." <paul.johnston at WMICH.EDU>
>>>Subject: Re: Northern Cities /aI/
>>>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>
>>>Dennis,
>>>
>>>IIs it your experience that you get more of thiis Raising before
>>>voiced consonants in the Upper Midwest, where Canadian Raising as
>>>usually described is strong, or in the rest of the lower peninsula
>>>of MI, where there's a lot of variability before voiceless
>>>consonants. Seems like the first one to me, from observing my
>>>Yooper and Thumb students.
>>>
>>>Incidentally, the film "North Country" --set on the Mesabi Range-was
>>>on TV the other night, and the actors gave plenty of examples of
>>>this. How good was their dialect coach? Or were they just
>>>hyperdialectizing?
>>>
>>>Paul
>>>
>>>----- Original Message -----
>>>From: "Dennis R. Preston" <preston at MSU.EDU>
>>>Date: Wednesday, December 20, 2006 7:32 am
>>>Subject: Re: Northern Cities /aI/
>>>
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>>>> ------------
>>>> Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>> Poster: "Dennis R. Preston" <preston at MSU.EDU>
>>>> Subject: Re: Northern Cities /aI/
>>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> ------------
>>>>
>>>> Alice,
>>>>
>>>> Operating on the theory that others' vowels are often placed in a
>>>> peceptual position relative to our own and (and I apologize for
>>>> this), knowing your own linguistic background as I do, isn't it
>>>> possible that the probably backer and higher onset of your own /ay/
>>>> (or those you grew up with, even if you ahve eschewed it) would make
>>>> any lower and fronter one sound even more dramatically lower and
>>>> fronter?
>>>>
>>>> Just a thought.
>>>>
>>>> Remember too that Canadian Raising in the US borderlands often fails
>>>> to observe the voce-voiceless rule of the original, perhaps a related
>>>> fact. We have recent local (rural) MI evidence of this is /ay/
>>>> before /r/.
>>>>
>>>> dInIs
>>>>
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>>>> >Sender: American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
>>>> >Poster: Alice Faber <faber at HASKINS.YALE.EDU>
>>>> >Organization: Haskins Laboratories
>>>> >Subject: Northern Cities /aI/
>>>> >------------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> -------------
>>>> >
>>> > >I was listening to call-in radio on my way home this evening. A
>>> > caller>from Buffalo (oh, you should have heard the vowel in the
>>> > first syllable
>>> > >of Calgary!) pronounced "time" with an onset that I don't remember
>>>> >having noticed before. It was fronted and raised to the extent
>>>> that I at
> >>> >first thought he'd said "tame", until the context rescued me. Am
>>>> I just
>>>> >behind the curve noticing this?
>>>> >--
>>>> >======================================================================
>>>> >Alice Faber
>>>> faber at haskins.yale.edu>Haskins Laboratories
>>>> tel: (203) 865-6163 x258
>>>> >New Haven, CT 06511 USA fax (203) 865-
>>>> 8963>
>>>> >------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> >The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> It should be the chief aim of a university professor to exhibit
>>>> himself in his own true character - that is, as an ignorant man [sic]
>>>> thinking, actively utilizing his small share of knowledge. Alfred
>>>> North Whitehead
>>>>
>>>> There are many different religions in this world, but if you look at
>>>> them carefully, you'll see that they all have one thing in common:
>>>> They were invented by a giant, superintelligent slug named Dennis.
>>> > Homer Simpson
>>>>
>>>> Dennis R. Preston
>>>> University Distinguished Professor
>>>> Department of English
>>>> 15-C Morrill Hall
>>>> Michigan State University
>>>> East Lansing, MI 48824-1036
>>>> Phone: (517) 353-4736
>>>> Fax: (517) 353-3755
>>>> preston at msu.edu
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>>> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>>>
>>>
>>>------------------------------------------------------------
>>>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
>>--
>>It should be the chief aim of a university professor to exhibit
>>himself in his own true character - that is, as an ignorant man [sic]
>>thinking, actively utilizing his small share of knowledge. Alfred
>>North Whitehead
>>
>>There are many different religions in this world, but if you look at
>>them carefully, you'll see that they all have one thing in common:
>>They were invented by a giant, superintelligent slug named Dennis.
>>Homer Simpson
>>
>>Dennis R. Preston
>>University Distinguished Professor
>>Department of English
>>15-C Morrill Hall
>>Michigan State University
>>East Lansing, MI 48824-1036
>>Phone: (517) 353-4736
>>Fax: (517) 353-3755
>>preston at msu.edu
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------
>>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>
>------------------------------------------------------------
>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
--
Dennis R. Preston
University Distinguished Professor
Department of English
15C Morrill Hall
Michigan State University
East Lansing, MI 48824
517-353-4736
preston at msu.edu
------------------------------------------------------------
The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
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