old hat

[Wilson Gray]

Well, irregardless (What ever happened to that annoying word? And what about
"forMIDable'? Maybe there is a God!) of my long-ago pet peeve, "old hat"
because it's often felt is a good one! :-)

-Wilson

On 3/6/06, James Smith <jsmithjamessmith at yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       James Smith <jsmithjamessmith at YAHOO.COM>
> Subject:      Re: old hat
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> I pronounce them the same or differently, depending on
> emphasis and context.  Typical use is "y at r" for both,
> but "your" can be the same as "yore" and "you're"
> something like "you'@r" (almost not a contraction:
> maybe I'm not really using "you're" when I say this
> but  rather actually saying "you are", but were I to
> write what I think I say, I'd use the contraction).
>
>
> --- Jonathan Lighter <wuxxmupp2000 at YAHOO.COM> wrote:
>
> > You mean there's a difference ?  I don't understand
> > what you're driving at.
> >
> >   JL
> >
> > Wilson Gray <hwgray at GMAIL.COM> wrote:
> >   ---------------------- Information from the mail
> > header -----------------------
> > Sender: American Dialect Society
> > Poster: Wilson Gray
> > Subject: Re: old hat
> >
>
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > The use of "your" for "you're" and the use of
> > "you're" for "your" in writin=
> > g
> > are so common, in my experience, as hardly to be
> > worthy of mention. But I a=
> > m
> > surprised to see that this phenomenon is so old,
> > though.
> >
> > Likewise, there are people who pronounce "your" as
> > though it was spelled
> > "you're" and who pronounce "you're" as though it was
> > spelled "your." In my
> > experience, this is a peculiarity of some dialects
> > of White (American)
> > English. I didn't become aware of it until I joined
> > the Army in the late
> > '50's. I found - and find - this usage *extremely*
> > annoying, to the extent
> > that I once foolishly tried to get such speakers not
> > to use it. Needless to
> > say, I had no success whatsoever. They didn't even
> > understand what I was
> > driving at. So, I just had to learn to live with it.
> >
> > I'd like to think that the pronunciation influences
> > the spelling, but I hav=
> > e
> > no evidence for this beyond wishful thinking.
> >
> > -Wilson
> >
> >
> >
> > On 3/3/06, Jonathon Green wrote:
> > >
> > > ---------------------- Information from the mail
> > header
> > > -----------------------
> > > Sender: American Dialect Society
> > > Poster: Jonathon Green
> > > Subject: Re: old hat
> > >
> > >
> >
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------=
> > ------
> > >
> > > George Thompson wrote:
> > > > [...] I notice the nearly 100 year gap in the
> > OED's citations between
> > > 1796
> > > > and 1893, and that both these are from
> > dictionaries.
> > > Nice _NY Sporting Whip_ stuff, George. A couple
> > more mid-century
> > > 'free-range' examples:
> > >
> > > 1841 in _The Gentleman's Spicey Songster_ [song
> > title] 'Mother H's
> > > Knocking Shop; or, A Bit Of Old Hat!'
> > >
> > > c.1864 'The Female Auctioneer' in Anon. _The
> > Rakish Rhymer_ (1917) 137:
> > > And if your [sic] fond of nice=97 _old hat_, /
> > I've some that you can buy=
> > .
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > JG
> > >
> > >
> >
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> James D. SMITH                 |If history teaches anything
> South SLC, UT                  |it is that we will be sued
> jsmithjamessmith at yahoo.com     |whether we act quickly and decisively
>                                |or slowly and cautiously.
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