Invariant innit, isn ´t it

[Jonathon Green]

Arnold M. Zwicky wrote:
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> Poster:       "Arnold M. Zwicky" <zwicky at CSLI.STANFORD.EDU>
> Subject:      =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Re:_Invariant_innit,_isn=B4t__it?=
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>
> On Sep 7, 2006, at 9:27 AM, Jonathon Green wrote:
>
>
>> The point about the current use of 'innit' in London and doubtless
>> across the (young, urban) UK is that while it _does_ indeed elide
>> 'isn't
>> it', it is not in fact used, as would be expected, after a question
>> (although this 'traditional' use is of course still as common as
>> ever),
>>
>
> a clarification: what these question tags attach to is not a question
> -- in the sense of an interrogative clause -- but a statement, that
> is, a declarative clause.  the tag *makes* the whole sentence a
> question.
>
>
>> but as a meaningless punctuation, following a statement.
>>
>
> not, i think, meaningless.  in the examples of the innovative use,
> like the one you cite below, "innit?" is clearly exclamatory.  (and
> in fact the exploitation of interrogative forms for exclamatory uses
> is all over the place, in language after language, english
> included.)  in some of the examples, it also seems to be inviting
> agreement.
>
> it's become a discourse particle, with a variety of functions.
>
>
>>   I recommend a
>> glance at the entry on urbandictionary.com , which gives, inter much
>> alia, the example "Yo look at my new car innit!", and suggests that
>> it's
>> primary use is 'in places where it would make no sense whatsoever if
>> expanded'. Urban Dict. contributors suggest that it was first
>> popularised either in the Asian community or among white working class
>> 'Chavs'. My own bet would be on the latter.
>>
>
> the urbandictionary suffers, of course, from the fact that the people
> who write the entries know only what they see about them; they have
> no sense of the history, or of the larger current picture (well, how
> could they?).  it does seem pretty clear that "innit?" is widely
> used, or perceived to be used, both in South Asian communities (among
> the young) and among young white working-class chavs/townies/pikies.
> (if you want to experience some vitriolic bandying of stereotypes,
> check out urbandictionary's enties for "chav", "pikey", and "townie"
> -- things like "A townie is a the label for a group of people who
> shit on the english language, wear crappy ripoff adidas clothes, have
> an I.Q. lower than than my nan's tits, and are as ugly as a hatfull
> of ass" are on the mild end of the scale.)
>
> but almost surely this "innit?" continues the earlier london working-
> class (esp. "cockney") tag, which has just expanded its functions.
>
> arnold (zwicky at csli.stanford.edu)
>
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I am no linguist and bow, as I should, to Arnold's expertise. If am
right in thinking that, for instance, that other piece of 'meaningless'
interrogation 'y'know', used without any real sense of asking 'do you
know' but as an otherwise empty punctuation qualifies similarly as a
'discourse particle' then I am sure he's right. And no doubt it is
indeed an expansion of the function of the London working-class 'innit'.
Nonetheless, and this of course lacks the slightest academic rigor, the
reason that 'innit' has become noticeable and widely commented upon in
the last few years is that its use does _seem_ meaningless, and
certainly not interrogatory..

As for the Urban Dictionary, while it is not wholly without merit, it
has all the vices of the absolute absence of expert modification that
informs, or more properly fails to inform its entries. There are
nuggets, but there is much, and for my purposes at least, far too much
dross. But in this case I felt its contributors had something pertinent
to say. And as for the stereotyping therein, perhaps Mr Blair's belief
that the UK is now a classless society is, like so many of Mr Blair's
beliefs, some way short of reality.

JG

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