X marrying Y <> Y marrying X?

[Wilson Gray]

On 9/11/07, Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu> wrote:
> ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
> Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> Poster:       Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU>
> Subject:      Re: X marrying Y <> Y marrying X?
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> >I'm surprised by Monica's opinion of the BJ. I didn't know that she
> >also considered it not to be sex. However, I know what every good
> >Southerner knows, that unless a penis enters a vagina, it's NOT sex,
> >which is f***king and nothing else.
>
> well, that *would* have the nice side effect of making sodomy or
> same-sex "sex" harder to prosecute...
>
> >  (When I was young enough to have a
> >personal interest in the BJ, the average colored fellow was completely
> >unaware of the term "BJ" or of its expansion. We *were* aware of the
> >existence of the act, but only as a thing that someone could do, but
> >which no one would do. I heard the phrase, "polish knob," used by
> >black GI's, but that's it.)
>
> I first read that as an ethnic joke, but of course that would be a
> *P*olish knob

How does that work as an ethnic joke? I can't get either "polish knob"
or "Polish knob" as a joke. Or is the claim that such a joke exists
itself the joke? As John Redcorn has noted, the white man is devious.
>
> >  Starr, being a home boy / good ole boy
> >himself, would have known the same thing. Hence, I've always
> >considered him to be about a hypocritical melon farmer. Mutatis
> >mutandis, Starr would have testified exactly as Clinton did.
> >
>
> unlikely as he would have been to be either WJC's or ML's type...

You have to mutate the mutanda.

-Wilson

>
> LH
>
> >On 9/11/07, Benjamin Zimmer <bgzimmer at babel.ling.upenn.edu> wrote:
> >>  ---------------------- Information from the mail header
> >>-----------------------
> >>  Sender:       American Dialect Society <ADS-L at LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
> >>  Poster:       Benjamin Zimmer <bgzimmer at BABEL.LING.UPENN.EDU>
> >>  Subject:      Re: X marrying Y <> Y marrying X?
> >>
> >>-------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >>  On 9/11/07, Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at yale.edu> wrote:
> >>  > At 2:44 PM +0000 9/11/07, ronbutters at AOL.COM wrote:
> >>  > >One would think this would have applied to sodomy laws as well, but
> >>  > >I know of at least 2 cases of consentual sex in which the man was
> >>  > >found guilty and the woman was not.
> >>  >
> >>  > But as President Clinton taught us, "have sex with"--in at least one
> >>  > sodomy-relevant context--is not a symmetric predicate even if "marry"
> >>  > is.  After all, he explained, Monica Lewinsky had sex with him, but
> >>  > not vice versa.
> >>
> >>  Was that really how it all went down (so to speak)? My recollection
> >>  was that both parties tried to claim that the relevant acts didn't
> >>  constitute "having sex", so there was no asymmetry. Let's go to the
> >>  tape...
> >>
> >>  -----
> >>  http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/1998/10/03/archive/main19029.shtml
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: We didn't have sex, Linda.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Well, what do you call it?
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: We fooled around.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Oh.
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: Not sex.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Oh, I don't know. I think if you go to if you go to orgasm,
> >>  that's having sex.
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: No, it's not.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Yes it is.
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: No it's not. It's
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: It's not having
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: Having sex is having intercourse.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Oh, you've been around him too long. That's his
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: Nuh-uh.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: rationale.
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: That's well, that's my then I've had sex with a lot more people.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Oh? (Laughing).
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: Having sex is having intercourse. That's how most people would
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Oh, so (REDACTED) jobs and all of that don't count?
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: They don't count.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Oh? Well, see? You have to inform me
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: Those are guys that you just fool around with.
> >>
> >>  ... TRIPP: You mean it's less personal to give a (REDACTED) job than
> >>  to have intercourse?
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: No, not necessarily. Sometimes. It depends.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: I guess it depends.
> >>
> >>  LEWINSKY: It really depends.
> >>
> >>  TRIPP: Yeah, I'm getting an education late in life.
> >>  -----
>
> >>
> >>
> >>  ------------------------------------------------------------
> >>  The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
> >>
> >
> >
>
> >--
> >All say, "How hard it is that we have to die"---a strange complaint to
> >come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
> >-----
> >                                               -Sam'l Clemens
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------
> >The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>


--
All say, "How hard it is that we have to die"---a strange complaint to
come from the mouths of people who have had to live.
-----
                                              -Sam'l Clemens

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The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org