Jonathan Lighter wuxxmupp2000 at YAHOO.COM
Mon Sep 24 14:32:15 UTC 2007

Larry, the "only way" is not "up."  The genius of  English now allows you to be
  fucked around, about, up, over, and out.


Laurence Horn <laurence.horn at YALE.EDU> wrote:
  ---------------------- Information from the mail header -----------------------
Sender: American Dialect Society
Poster: Laurence Horn
Subject: Re: Finally!

At 12:56 PM +0000 9/24/07, ronbutters at wrote:
>What does "black enough" have to do with it?=20
>Surely "fuck over" is common English slang=20
>--without regard to race? There is nothing=20
>whatever remarkable about this expression that I=20
>can see. Cf. "look over" etc. Wilson seems=20
>merely to be reporting on his personal,=20
>idiosyncratic taste. Or is his "dialect" widely=20
>shared--and limited to AAVE?
>I have no trouble with, say, "They tried to fuck=20
>the government over." It may be that Wilson's=20
>example feels a little awkward because it is=20
>directly followed by a restrictive relative=20
>Moreover, it is in fact not only possible but=20
>actually obligatory to have "fuck NP over" where=20
>NP =3D a pronoun (as in "Don't fuck me over").

or, in the words of the poet [alternate version],

(Cy Coleman / Carolyn Leigh)

Recorded by: Louis Armstrong; Lucille Ball; Teresa Brewer;
Doc Cheatham; Rosemary Clooney; Cy Coleman; Bing Crosby;
Vic Dana; Kate Dimbleby; Judy Garland; Gene Krupa;
Lester Lanin; Peggy Lee; Karen Mason; Johnny Mathis;
Jessica Molaskey; Bobby Short; South Shore Concert Band;
Mel Torm=E9; Jerry Vale; Julie Wilson.

Don't fuck me over
Lend me an ear
=46resh out of clover
Mortgage up to here
But don't pass the plate folks
Don't pass the cup
I figure whenever you're down and out
The only way is up


>Wilson Gray wrote:
>Lest the point be missed, for those of us old=20
>enough (and/or black enough?), ... [fuck NP=20
>over] is absolutely *not* a viable or a=20
>alternative to [fuck over NP]. Unless, of course, you speak a
>different dialect.
>Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry
>The American Dialect Society -

The American Dialect Society -

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