Shrimp(s) and prawns

[Laurence Horn]

At 3:46 PM -0400 3/11/09, Joel S. Berson wrote:
>In addition to gamba, which I find translated as "shrimp" and
>"prawns" in one on-line dictionary, there also are "gambera", which
>come back as "shrimp" , "prawns", and "CRAYFISH".  A long time ago I
>received crayfish when I was expecting shrimp/prawn.  I must have
>missed a qualifier.
>
>Joel

And crayfish/crawfish have the added feature of a
tasty folk etymology--no historical "-fish" in
them there écrevisses.

LH

>
>At 3/11/2009 12:08 PM, Laurence Horn wrote:
>>Wow!  Non-definitive perhaps--but who knew we had such an
>>accomplished cephalopodologist on call?!  This is all consistent with
>>my encounters with squid/calamares~i/calmars/seppias/cuttlefish on
>>menus with various provenances, but with considerably more of the
>>blanks filled in (or should I say with much of the black ink
>>removed).   As they say, to the victor goes the squid!  Since I can't
>>offer you any calamares en su tinta, you'll have to settle for an
>>eggcorn:
>>
>>http://encyclopedia.farlex.com/Cuddlefish
>>http://encyclopedia2.thefreedictionary.com/Cuddlefish
>>http://www.redditall.com/2008/02/when-cuddlefish-attack.html
>>
>>LH
>>
>>At 4:46 AM -0400 3/11/09, Victor wrote:
>>>Not to compare them to pornography, but if you see these cephalopods
>>>side-by-side, the distinction is fairly obvious--the shape and body
>>>morphology are rather distinct. Generally, much confusion on the subject
>>>is created by Chinese culinary culture that uses both but in different
>>>ways and, for some reason, does not respect that difference when
>>>translating names into English. I've found Mediterranean terms,
>>>generally, to be less confused and confusing. Most European languages (I
>>>could not find the equivalent in German) distinguish between the two
>>>very clearly. French and Portugese have simple short words for each,
>>>apparently because both are used in cooking on the Atlantic Coast. You
>>>certainly won't be served cuttlefish when ordering "calamari", although
>>>similar dishes with cuttlefish do exist. Other than the three languages
>>>mentioned, most Western European languages (including Scandinavian) use
>>>variations on "sepia" to describe cuttlefish. Google suggests "zeekat"
>>>for cuttlefish in Dutch, although, during last year, whenever I saw
>>>cuttlefish fresh at the fish market in Groningen, it was always labeled
>>>"sepia" or "sepia inktvis". In contrast, all sizes and varieties of
>>>squid were labeled "inktvis". If you are wondering if there is any
>>>relationship between these animals and sepia dye, the answer is yes.
>>>
>>>About the only place you are going to find cuttlefish in the US (as
>>>food) is in dry goods section or dry snacks (next to beef jerky) in
>>>Chinese stores. So when you see "cuttlefish" on the menu in an
>>>Anglophone country, you can be 99+% sure that it's actually squid that
>>>is being served. (Chinese dishes with dried cuttlefish are rarely served
>>>to American customers--perhaps the situation is different in the UK.)
>>>One exception is Risoto al nero di Seppia, which should use cuttlefish,
>>>if properly prepared. You may also occasionally find cuttlefish "steak"
>>>in Japanese restaurants, particularly as sushi.
>>>
>>>I am not entirely sure of the source of the color in black pasta, but, I
>>>believe, it could be either one--both Italian and Spanish cuisine use
>>>them somewhat interchangeably, so it may depend on the manufacturer (or
>>>the chef, if made fresh). What you may find on the plate in Spain,
>>>Portugal, Italy, Croatia or Turkey (and the French Atlantic Coast) is
>>>another matter--you are on your own there.
>>>
>>>Cuttlefish are generally the more interesting animals of the two. They
>>>are roughly as intelligent as octopus (which is saying quite a bit),
>>>while squid are closer to lemmings--at least the smaller variety that
>>>usually finds itself on your plate--although the intelligence is still
>>>fairly high for invertebrates. Giant squid is an entirely different
>>>creature and I'll skip it for the moment. The same goes for colossal squid.
>>>
>>>Cuttlefish look more flat of the two, with distinct top and bottom sides
>>>and a continuous "fin" running along the body. Their arms and tentacles
>>>are somewhat differentiated and highly developed eyes are on the top
>>>side. In contrast, squid is generally conical, with rather larger dual
>>>fins at the tail end, with simple eyes clearly bilaterally opposed, two
>>>longer tentacles, and eight fairly undifferentiated "arms" (the "things"
>>>with suction rings on them--some species do not even differentiate
>>>between tentacles and arms, as all 10 look identical). Cuttlefish have
>>>a  porous buoyancy organ, usually referred to as "cuttlebone" (which is
>>>sold in pet stores as a nutrition/exercise source for parrots).  Squid
>>>does not have a cuttlebone, although both have soft cartilage that
>>>serves an entirely different purpose (rigidity), but is occasionally
>>>confused for cuttlebone (it's actual name is the pen).
>>>
>>>My description is fairly primitive and is not meant to be definitive.
>>>
>>>    VS-)
>>>
>>>Laurence Horn wrote:
>>>>But on the topic of seafood lumpers vs. splitters:  there's also the
>>>>squid vs. cuttlefish distinction that I've never quite understood,
>>>>but shows up in English translations of menus whose original is
>>>>Spanish, Italian, or various Asian languages, so I assume it's a real
>>>>distinction that I just neutralize.  Different species? Different
>>>>sizes?  It all tastes good to me, so it's not like I *really* care,
>>>>but I am curious.
>>>
>>>------------------------------------------------------------
>>>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>>
>>------------------------------------------------------------
>>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org
>
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>The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org

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The American Dialect Society - http://www.americandialect.org